Why I don’t believe Si egos or sensors without Ti as a general rule of thumb make very good typists..

[Braingel]

A lot of Si types will not be very apt at typing beyond their own concrete, sensory experience.. Si egos rely on their own subjective sensory interpretation to type, which often involves physical details of a person, or very concrete, surface qualities of a person relative to their experience.. You see this on the forum in Qaz and formerly in Sol.. You also can see this on Juan Sandoval, but with Juan, he will be slightly more accurate in his systemic making of a sensory-based system, because he has had a broader context to type people than of the former two.

Since these types of sensors rely on concrete experience, they if they do not have a broad enough pool of experience, are very, very prone to mistyping a person, because they literally look for patterns relative to their own experience of physical traits, or surface qualities like tone.. They aren’t able to rawly grasp the patterns of a person’s overall cognitive patterns, and mistake their experience of superficial qualities or physical characteristics as being a type.


I realize that this has its own advantage for certain topics… But when it comes to psychology, or topics where assumptions do not do well, it leads to a great deal of confirmative bias, and as well as the halo effect.. This set of processing can be very good in something like general, non complex medicine, or with some aesthetician-related career.. I am not calling this stupid, or of not having its place in existence.. But it just really doesn’t work well with something as abstract as human psychology.

Sensors without Ti often alter definitions and arbitrate typology to a sort of industrial way of psychology, that looks at a half-baked archetype, that sweeps on the surface traits of psychology.. Kiersy would’ve been a good exemplar of this.. In classical socionics, Viktor Gulenko would actually be an ESI, with a Ti-Ne super ego.. He does this quite a lot in his whole “type image” way of typing. Yes, Gulenko is an INTP by most modern typological systems, because of his areas of focus, and whatnot, but these miss the essence of how info focuses, and of why something averts upon.

LSI’s can be too rigid in how they view things, as they’ve polr Ne, but they do tends more toward a looking at someone’s inner working..

[Braingel]

Especially when something isn’t defined, is evolving significantly, and it is based on the interpretation of one’s own model, it is very disadvantageous to have Si in this midst of typing..

It is human nature to base on experience to some extent or another. Even intuitive functions pool from this ultimately; you can’t intuit things you aren’t exposed to, as the mind is going to synthesize what it has been exposed to in something more abstract and thus “new”.. (And you wouldn’t even be able to type directly using Jung’s interpretation of functions if you weren’t ever exposed to them)… Unless you have developed clairvoyant means… It’s just that for every single thing that an Si ego looks at, is 100% based on their own concrete, personal experience. There is no extrapolation or other way to look at, until maybe the weaker intuitive functions are developed.. Again, I am not saying this way of outlook is “wrong” for every single thing in life, it is quite beneficial in many facets of “reality”, but for the abstract realm, as typology, it isn’t something that is as accurate to go by.

So whilst intuitive still will base on experience as well, it is just that more possibilities are looked into, and deeper dynamics are uncovered and seen.. Unless perhaps the intuitive is in a gripped or shadow state… In meyers, INFP and INTP can be very prone under stress to this, if they loop into Si.. This is what I believe is the case with Alive.

[Braingel]

Especially when something isn’t defined, is evolving significantly, and it is based on the interpretation of one’s own model, it is very disadvantageous to have Si in this midst of typing..

It is human nature to base on experience to some extent or another. Even intuitive functions pool from this ultimately; you can’t intuit things you aren’t exposed to, as the mind is going to synthesize what it has been exposed to in something more abstract and thus “new”.. (And you wouldn’t even be able to type directly using Jung’s interpretation of functions if you weren’t ever exposed to them)… Unless you have developed clairvoyant means… It’s just that for every single thing that an Si ego looks at, is 100% based on their own concrete, personal experience. There is no extrapolation or other way to look at, until maybe the weaker intuitive functions are developed.. Again, I am not saying this way of outlook is “wrong” for every single thing in life, it is quite beneficial in many facets of “reality”, but for the abstract realm, as typology, it isn’t something that is as accurate to go by.

So whilst intuitive still will base on experience as well, it is just that more possibilities are looked into, and deeper dynamics are uncovered and seen.. Unless perhaps the intuitive is in a gripped or shadow state… In meyers, INFP and INTP can be very prone under stress to this, if they loop into Si.. This is what I believe is the case with Alive.

And the very words most people speak also stem from experience, with exception to the very first few, who would’ve had to have been intuitive types, who made human language.

[Braingel]

Every change that even happens in a physical manifestation, happens from an inward means, of the interplaying between energy dynamics that erupt into the outer, to reflect this change that it can express that represents its own set up… In this way, intuition is a primal life force.. Everything was imagined before it reflected out into this illusion of reality.. When you are trying to understand a why behind something, you can’t merely look at physical traits or just.. Or surface qualities. When I’ve been very unhealthy and from a meyers Briggs lens, looped into Fi-Si, I had a bit of this, but still based on broad, imagined patterns as well…

You can’t rely on how someone looks, or of how someone writes, as in a quality of being literal, or writing long, or short.. You’ve to actually look at the dynamics between things, are the things theming an intense focus of the self, are the focuses outside of the world, in sensory observations, in large, generalizing patterns that are distant from imagination, are they a bunch of imaginative stimulus… You’ve to look at the actual content in the writing, not just the characteristics of the writing.. That’s how you mistype a person, and this is something sensors are highly prone as to.

[Braingel]

A lot of Si types will not be very apt at typing beyond their own concrete, sensory experience.. Si egos rely on their own subjective sensory interpretation to type, which often involves physical details of a person, or very concrete, surface qualities of a person relative to their experience.. You see this on the forum in Qaz and formerly in Sol.. You also can see this on Juan Sandoval, but with Juan, he will be slightly more accurate in his systemic making of a sensory-based system, because he has had a broader context to type people than of the former two.

Since these types of sensors rely on concrete experience, they if they do not have a broad enough pool of experience, are very, very prone to mistyping a person, because they literally look for patterns relative to their own experience of physical traits, or surface qualities like tone.. They aren’t able to rawly grasp the patterns of a person’s overall cognitive patterns, and mistake their experience of superficial qualities or physical characteristics as being a type.


I realize that this has its own advantage for certain topics… But when it comes to psychology, or topics where assumptions do not do well, it leads to a great deal of confirmative bias, and as well as the halo effect.. This set of processing can be very good in something like general, non complex medicine, or with some aesthetician-related career.. I am not calling this stupid, or of not having its place in existence.. But it just really doesn’t work well with something as abstract as human psychology.

Sensors without Ti often alter definitions and arbitrate typology to a sort of industrial way of psychology, that looks at a half-baked archetype, that sweeps on the surface traits of psychology.. Kiersy would’ve been a good exemplar of this.. In classical socionics, Viktor Gulenko would actually be an ESI, with a Ti-Ne super ego.. He does this quite a lot in his whole “type image” way of typing. Yes, Gulenko is an INTP by most modern typological systems, because of his areas of focus, and whatnot, but these miss the essence of how info focuses, and of why something averts upon.

LSI’s can be too rigid in how they view things, as they’ve polr Ne, but they do tends more toward a looking at someone’s inner working..

In the case of V. Gulenko, I know I will get a lot of criticism either inside of peoples’ thoughts, or in comments, but.. Allow me to explain.. Gulenko is really not adept with logical inference and consistency in structure.. His system takes concepts and makes them unmatching of how a type is supposed be, like making the suggestive function a 3D-like placement.. He has defined the system to look like he can be Ti in most places, and meyers Briggs is taken too far as an archetype. In cognitive function-based systems, Gulenko is definitely an Si-Te or an Fi-Se. In classical aushura, an ESI before with Ti-and super ego, with how he focuses and rotates on this, without being good at Ti, and being very rigid in his Ne use and insistent, and making static archetypes of type images, in spite of trying make a dynamic shift of accentuation and type shifts… His archetypes are concrete, superficial qualities, that doing go deep into the way of processing of a person, and assume the process based on outer characteristics, which is very Se ish on many models..

[Braingel]

In the case of V. Gulenko, I know I will get a lot of criticism either inside of peoples’ thoughts, or in comments, but.. Allow me to explain.. Gulenko is really not adept with logical inference and consistency in structure.. His system takes concepts and makes them unmatching of how a type is supposed be, like making the suggestive function a 3D-like placement.. He has defined the system to look like he can be Ti in most places, and meyers Briggs is taken too far as an archetype. In cognitive function-based systems, Gulenko is definitely an Si-Te or an Fi-Se. In classical aushura, an ESI before with Ti-and super ego, with how he focuses and rotates on this, without being good at Ti, and being very rigid in his Ne use and insistent, and making static archetypes of type images, in spite of trying make a dynamic shift of accentuation and type shifts… His archetypes are concrete, superficial qualities, that doing go deep into the way of processing of a person, and assume the process based on outer characteristics, which is very Se ish on many models..

He isn’t Te ignoring, really, he gathers data and facts, even on his website, he tries keep this up to science, almost as if he seeks this.. I believe maybe his own making of holographic panoramic and what that entails, can make him look pseudo Ne.. Again, I am not typing Gulenko an ESI by most models.. I am primarily going by original Aushura, with vital/mental and ego block emphasis, where the super ego functions are quite conscious and are used everyday…

[Braingel]

Rotates should be fixates

[Braingel]

In WSS and in G, Gulenko is an LII, because of the social mission ordeal and the whole valued concepts in WSS.. But in classic aushura, the super ego is very aligned with a “social mission” concept.. And his is Ti-Ne, yes (not Ti Ni as how it would be in his own). But even how Gulenko types others and formed his system is very concrete and sensory, and focusing on very surface qualities of a person. People would say it’s result type, but.. How he made his system and types others isn’t even very intuitive.

In classic aushura, the super ego is what you compare society as to mostly, and he does just this with his entire model… The ego is infused in everyday, and for others as well, but it’s not as grossly (as in overall) compared towards others.

[Braingel]

So my typing of Gulenko is
Real/classic socionics ESI
MBTI ISTJ
WSS LII
His own model G LII
Kiersy INTP..

enneagram all systems: 6 core

[Expansion]

I have a hard time with weak functions in any type, in being a paradigm shifter, where their pioneer work is innovative, more or less, but not exhausting of where it lies most of the time.

Like Jung ILI or LII like i see here on the forum or elsewhere.

And typing Jordan Peterson ENTP or ENTJ in type communities. Someone challenged in ethics, but making it a messianic passion & role in life. Does.not.flow.

IMO.

Re: Si, yes i like your take and analysis, of their analyses and the aforementioned ''loop'' in being trapped.

[Braingel]

The reason most the world doesn’t take typology vastly serious is because people can’t see the underlying dynamics of things, being models sensory types, and Si being common, people make their own subjective sensory experience spins on typology, and then Ne users or super egos redefine new models and end in an infinite web of this all..

[youfloweryourfeast]

Could Guelnko be ILI or is his intuition poor?

[Braingel]

Could Guelnko be ILI or is his intuition poor?

I personally believe he has poor intuition, and he has very developed sensory skills.. I’d even talked with my bf.. (bf is SLE-Se)

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...1ac0b19b3f731&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...8ce40d5df6568&
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1213841629371306004/1226371896409591880

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...fa4818f2a826d&
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...6693c01612db5&

My BF is correct Se base would be more objective with it, which is why I didn’t call SLE a shitty typist; they ignore Si, and they also have ok Ne and still good Ti.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...f387532fdc877&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...13415d7f495f2&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...13415d7f495f2&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...c64083b1404ba&

[youfloweryourfeast]

I don't think Gulenko Ne that good either not horrible but was thinking LSI, ESI for him
Like for instance he doesn't want to change his typing method I believe so? I was speaking to my friend and she said he seems to have a bad grasp of ne-fi and thinks he's LSI, he says that EIIs are little angels who don't get mad and IEEs just want to be people's friends. To me that doesn't really align with how fi can behave morally. Where as vera who is ESI often exaggerates betas and EIEs to make it seem like she is clearly not beta or even delta as she talks negatively abt IEEs. Also, Gulenko completely eliminates that deltas can be interested in socionics, which I personally disagree with and sometimes he wants to completely eliminate typings for deltas. I can see this being an obvious occurrence but you're just just eliminating so many factors whole quadra.
And his cognitive style theory is interesting but it seems he prefers to understand things from categories and dichotomies which could instead be Ne polr. I agree tho how also he maps types, spends time describing a look of a "type" out could be more style of se and si than intuition.

[Braingel]

I don't think Gulenko Ne that good either not horrible but was thinking LSI, ESI for him
Like for instance he doesn't want to change his typing method I believe so? I was speaking to my ILE friend and she said he seems to have a bad grasp of ne-fi and thinks he's LSI, he says that EIIs are little angels who don't get mad and IEEs just want to be people's friends. To me that doesn't really align with how fi can behave morally. Where as vera who is ESI often exaggerates betas and EIEs to make it seem like she is clearly not beta or even delta as she talks negatively abt IEEs. Also Gulenko completely eliminates that deltas can be interested in socionics, which I personally disagree with and sometimes he wants to completely eliminate typings for deltas. I can see this being an obvious occurrence but you're just just eliminating so many factors whole quadra. I could see him being intp still though as maybe he has problems with fully integrating things due to his Ne.
How ever, his cognitive style theory is interesting but it seems he prefers to understand things from categories and dichotomies which could instead be Ne polr. I agree tho how also he maps types, spends time describing a look of a "type" out could be more style of se and si than intuition.

I agree that he describes way more than he actually gets into the essence of a type. This is the creative function (Se) compensating a polr Ne. Every reason that I have made for Gulenko being an ESI in classic is my own reasoning. But Aushura had actually typed Gulenko as an ESI her own self.

It is easy to type Gulenko as an intuitive logical type if you focus on what he presents and focuses on, without even looking at *why* he does.

[Braingel]

And as I had explained, my typing of him as an ESI is exclusively for classical socionics. Which is ultimately on my opinion, the best and most accurate system.. It isn’t made by some type image stereotype or the “food” one consumes like WSS; it’s the actual digestion of. In other models, he is an LII. May be LSI by his own. I disagree with the other guy typing him ILI, he doesn’t fit polr Fe in modern conceptions, and he doesn’t fit gamma values by most models either, other than classic.

[Braingel]

I know I will receive a lot of disagreement for typing G as a sensor, but.. I’ve my reasons, the ones I’d given.. And I still do type him intuitive in the “food” based systems, where what one chooses to eat is how the typing ensues.. By digestion, that is no intuitive breakdown, and is a wishing and trying strain the system of himself, to be intuitive..

My boyfriend was not even convinced, but I made him more open to seeing G as a sensor, and he now thinks it is quite viable, with the help of given him in looking at the dynamics beneath his presentation; his actual processing.

[Braingel]

And as I had explained, my typing of him as an ESI is exclusively for classical socionics. Which is ultimately on my opinion, the best and most accurate system.. It isn’t made by some type image stereotype or the “food” one consumes like WSS; it’s the actual digestion of. In other models, he is an LII. May be LSI by his own. I disagree with the other guy typing him ILI, he doesn’t fit polr Fe in modern conceptions, and he doesn’t fit gamma values by most models either, other than classic.

Which I don’t like typing by isolated means or Quadra’s, but this is how the majority of systems type by, because they’re very sensory set up..

[Expansion]

It would be an interesting test if the ESI of the world would find any type resonance with Gulenko, via a read of his biography and his ideas to see if there would be an attraction to, or a repulsion away to the notion in a type resonance, like ''yeah, we are of the same or similar stripe.''

I have a hunch, intellectual or not, his way of processing and output, would create quite a disparity by way of ESI types.

Giraffes know other giraffes, lions are like lions, etc.

[Braingel]

I agree that he describes way more than he actually gets into the essence of a type. This is the creative function (Se) compensating a polr Ne. Every reason that I have made for Gulenko being an ESI in classic is my own reasoning. But Aushura had actually typed Gulenko as an ESI her own self.

It is easy to type Gulenko as an intuitive logical type if you focus on what he presents and focuses on, without even looking at *why* he does.

The creative function covers your own deficit. Like, I use my Fe ability to express to evade work or tasks concerning efficiency, and use my emotions to evade concrete data.. But in classical aushura, I would be an EII, because I have a TiSe super ego there, and my Si is super Id. I also fit mental Fi and Ne and vital Ni. An EII doesn’t really care much about Te at all, in classic aushura. It actually blames its super ID for a lot of issues.. The super ego also can as well happen with this. It appreciates a lot of help with its Te.. But yeah, I have mostly skimmed a few aushura things, not deep study, and have intuited it..

[Braingel]

It would be an interesting test if the ESI of the world would find any type resonance with Gulenko, via a read of his biography and his ideas to see if there would an attraction to, or a repulsion away to the notion in a type resonance, like ''yeah, we are of the same or similar stripe.''

I have a hunch, intellectual or not, his way of processing and output, would create quite a disparity by way of ESI types.

Giraffes know other giraffes, lions are like lions, etc.

Modern ESI’s wouldn’t at all resonate with G, but a TiNe super ego in classical socionics, would definitely probably hit home for him and others would recognize it there.. A lot of classical ESI’s wouldn’t uphold to other model ESI’s… It is so clear, that G operates from a TiNe super ego. That’s why he focuses so much on it, in spite these things not being overly competent in. And people confuse his focus on these things for him being LII, because the systems they type from avert on output of most frequency and what’s of most importance to someone.

[Braingel]

The creative function covers your own deficit. Like, I use my Fe ability to express to evade work or tasks concerning efficiency, and use my emotions to evade concrete data.. But in classical aushura, I would be an EII, because I have a TiSe super ego there, and my Si is super Id. I also fit mental Fi and Ne and vital Ni. An EII doesn’t really care much about Te at all, in classic aushura. It actually blames its super ID for a lot of issues.. The super ego also can as well happen with this. It appreciates a lot of help with its Te.. But yeah, I have mostly skimmed a few aushura things, not deep study, and have intuited it..

You approach your polr from your creative function. Creative function is most adaptive function, it is why it’s called the creative, it can be used in many ways.. You see a lot of Se creatives like G, who try and describe surface traits and images of a person’s essence and hidden qualities within them (Ne, and also some aspects of Ni too, but it’s more Ne, because it’s looking outside and into something, with the inherent potentiality of traits, I feel).. This is how they compensate their inability to perceive someone’s deep, underlying qualities and dynamics… As you can possible see from me writing this, I am the reverse of this, where I use my ability to perceive essence, to avoid the surface.

[Expansion]

Modern ESI’s wouldn’t at all resonate with G, but a TiNe super ego in classical socionics, would definitely probably hit home for him and others would recognize it there.. A lot of classical ESI’s wouldn’t uphold to other model ESI’s… It is so clear, that G operates from a TiNe super ego. That’s why he focuses so much on it, in spite these things not being overly competent in. And people confuse his focus on these things for him being LII, because the systems they type from avert on output of most frequency and what’s of most importance to someone.

I disagree with weak functions focus, in the frame of higher order output, because it is learned behavior. I have a hunch at a young age he had the same disposition in high openness to close off the unknown via his current way.

[Braingel]

Heck in aushura— the only system I’d be an EII in and not an IEI (classical is very, very different, and an EII there is more of a modern iei, as it has vital/unconscious Te, and its Ne focus of essence taps into modern Ni) , you would call this probably a Kindred, I am literally critiquing G’s way of applying his own Fi, from his super ego functions. I dislike his polr Ne.

[Braingel]

I disagree with weak functions focus, in the frame of higher order output, because it is learned behavior. I have a hunch at a young age he had the same disposition in high openness to close off the unknown via his current way.

I just honestly don’t see vastly good Ne and Ti out of G.. The way he describes types is very concrete and a superficial quality image of it. Se is about the surface, and describing these things in a vast detail. I know on his site he claims have had a lot of social challenges, but why can’t a very serious Quadra type, who has ignored Fe also have these vast challenges.. I would say he focuses on TiNe to compensate his own insecurity in those areas.. He made a system that doesn’t even make much sense, and isn’t logically coherent at all, or looking at possibilities in an intellectual intuitive way, as much as he is a sensory, detailed, surface level quality way.. Yes, typology is intellectual, but he has made the system very concrete, relative to “type images” and immense VI. My boyfriend when I showed him this forum I’d written, had even said, he is the ultimate VI-er, intense sensory details, that I really don’t believe an intuitive could ever have that focus on such thing to write in that much observation..

[Braingel]

I just honestly don’t see vastly good Ne and Ti out of G.. The way he describes types is very concrete and a superficial quality image of it. Se is about the surface, and describing these things in a vast detail. I know on his site he claims have had a lot of social challenges, but why can’t a very serious Quadra type, who has ignored Fe also have these vast challenges.. I would say he focuses on TiNe to compensate his own insecurity in those areas.. He made a system that doesn’t even make much sense, and isn’t logically coherent at all, or looking at possibilities in an intellectual intuitive way, as much as he is a sensory, detailed, surface level quality way.. Yes, typology is intellectual, but he has made the system very concrete, relative to “type images” and immense VI. My boyfriend when I showed him this forum I’d written, had even said, he is the ultimate VI-er, intense sensory details, that I really don’t believe an intuitive could ever have that focus on such thing to write in that much observation..

By his system not making much sense, I mean that he made the suggestive function as being 3D, I mean that some of his ascribing to cognitive styles contradict the functionality of types, unless they’re tweaked by that whole weird placement switch.. The polr is 2D in his system, the ignoring 1D… And then dcnh he claims is ultimate introversion/extroversion dictating.. When how one receives output and internalizes it in is how energy loses or gains..

[Braingel]

He apparently formed his system from observing a lot of his clients or whatever.. The Fi relational dynamic with those people could argue towards Fi..

[Braingel]

The thing is, I believe both Se and Ne expand and explore things.. It’s stereotypically put to Ne, that wanting to explore a lot of things is an Ne endeavor. I would put Se as just as much wanting do this, but rather than focus on hidden potentials and qualities you’ve to seek to explore, it is about exploring what is there in the present, what’s concretely observable. Yes, Gulenko made a big ass potentiality of combinations and stuff with his model, but they’re all mostly of pragmatic, observable things that aren’t abstract or hidden. He has quite literally made his system an oasis for sensory types— which is probably why so many LSI’s intrigue it by.. Looking at a superficial presentation of qualities, never going deep into the inner dynamics of how someone absorbs and digests energy, and of why they focus on things.

[Braingel]

I just honestly don’t see vastly good Ne and Ti out of G.. The way he describes types is very concrete and a superficial quality image of it. Se is about the surface, and describing these things in a vast detail. I know on his site he claims have had a lot of social challenges, but why can’t a very serious Quadra type, who has ignored Fe also have these vast challenges.. I would say he focuses on TiNe to compensate his own insecurity in those areas.. He made a system that doesn’t even make much sense, and isn’t logically coherent at all, or looking at possibilities in an intellectual intuitive way, as much as he is a sensory, detailed, surface level quality way.. Yes, typology is intellectual, but he has made the system very concrete, relative to “type images” and immense VI. My boyfriend when I showed him this forum I’d written, had even said, he is the ultimate VI-er, intense sensory details, that I really don’t believe an intuitive could ever have that focus on such thing to write in that much observation..

I am not trashing Se. I love my Se base boyfriend.. I also had dated an SEE as well.. I love how they can notice so many things I miss, they’d help me a lot from running into walls, they were the only people that could notice my nose injury aside from an LSI.. They’re very attentive to detail, they’d make the best visual artists and fashion designers, Se egos would.. I am struggling to become a drawer with all that intense detail focus, I am only wish I’d that ability. I certainly like Se egos.. and need them around me to complete my own deficits.

[Braingel]

Reason why I’m not typing him ILI, is there’s no SiFe super ego. There is no mental Te.. His Te is a super Id fantasy.. And of something he can’t easily take responsibility for, but isn’t closed off either.

[Expansion]

I just honestly don’t see vastly good Ne and Ti out of G.. The way he describes types is very concrete and a superficial quality image of it. Se is about the surface, and describing these things in a vast detail. I know on his site he claims have had a lot of social challenges, but why can’t a very serious Quadra type, who has ignored Fe also have these vast challenges.. I would say he focuses on TiNe to compensate his own insecurity in those areas.. He made a system that doesn’t even make much sense, and isn’t logically coherent at all, or looking at possibilities in an intellectual intuitive way, as much as he is a sensory, detailed, surface level quality way.. Yes, typology is intellectual, but he has made the system very concrete, relative to “type images” and immense VI. My boyfriend when I showed him this forum I’d written, had even said, he is the ultimate VI-er, intense sensory details, that I really don’t believe an intuitive could ever have that focus on such thing to write in that much observation..

Kara, i appreciate the Ni Ti ladder you have, Ti types make true false distinctions in a matrix, and go with that as first-line over any Te datum. I def. get it. Ti makes its own world and house of cards with a lot of conditionalities, entrained by its own skepticism. It is a hidden generator of world view truths all under the surface. It reduces Te down, and/or ignores any external fitment.

I get a different take on it and him, though. Ne stands in the way of that agenda, and any PoLR is usually in a sentiment of disdain for it. Just like here on the forum, people compensate for the PoLR by domain shifting, and look for ways around, and not use it, overall.

INFP types avoid Se like a plague in the land of MBTI.

[Braingel]

I definitely understand how people would have a hard time seeing G as an esi, because classical aushura isn’t very known, and the whole mental v vital has extricated from the conscious of alive socionics.. But in classic, you have mental and vital functions. Ego and super ego are mental, and the Id and it’s super, vital. You are the most conscious of your polr, role, creative and ego, in classical.. So, and ESI is basically conscious of Fi, Se, Ti and Ne. These functions are the most deliberately thought about functions throughout a day in this module of socio.. An esi would be using its Se to replace its crappy Ne use, and would try and “master” Ne via an Se lens, and mistake itself as good for this.. They would be absorbing Ti like no other, meaning they’d in end, really like TiNe ways of going about things, but would end in making this module a very Se way of it…

You don’t avoid your polr at all, in this model… You deliberately try master it and are conscious… Mental is virtually conscious and vital, unconscious.

[Braingel]

I myself barely know of the model, I just intuitively grasp things very fast.. I for instance, figured mental is conscious and vital unconscious, basically.. When I have shown my understandings of things to scs students, they were impressed by how I just grasped the model so quickly, with very little intensive study..

[Braingel]

It is certainly impossible for G to be an esi in other models, where the polr and role function aren’t hyper-fixated on and made the basis of everyday life, the ego placements and especially creative trying focus on this a lot.. Yes, other models have it so where you actually avoid your polr.

This is why I was telling that ILI self-typed guy the other day, you can’t always translate types. Some things dramatically shift, this is one of many things that are different.. How the functions define is slightly different too. No, my take of Se wasn’t scs’s, it was my own, my own figuring that Se also would be explorative as a Pe energy..

[Braingel]

It is certainly impossible for G to be an esi in other models, where the polr and role function aren’t hyper-fixated on and made the basis of everyday life, the ego placements and especially creative trying focus on this a lot.. Yes, other models have it so where you actually avoid your polr.

This is why I was telling that ILI self-typed guy the other day, you can’t always translate types. Some things dramatically shift, this is one of many things that are different.. How the functions define is slightly different too. No, my take of Se wasn’t scs’s, it was my own, my own figuring that Se also would be explorative as a Pe energy..

I’m not even an IEI in classic; I am an EII. I am iei everywhere else. I don’t care about Te at all. A classical iei really cares about Te, and tries replace it with Fe, would probably mean using social gathering and communication for problem solving and action.. I care a fuck ton about Se, in spite of absolutely sucking at it. This is aligned with a classical eii more, who has mental super ego Se. I replace it with their definition of Ne—essence and exploring hidden potentials and gifts to perfect things.. This is some of Ni in modern socio.. I have mental Fi, my Ni is more unconscious on how it is there, defined.

[Braingel]

It’s probably way more common for a classical IEI to be a modern EII, and for the EII there to be IEI (me).

[Braingel]

I definitely understand how people would have a hard time seeing G as an esi, because classical aushura isn’t very known, and the whole mental v vital has extricated from the conscious of alive socionics.. But in classic, you have mental and vital functions. Ego and super ego are mental, and the Id and it’s super, vital. You are the most conscious of your polr, role, creative and ego, in classical.. So, and ESI is basically conscious of Fi, Se, Ti and Ne. These functions are the most deliberately thought about functions throughout a day in this module of socio.. An esi would be using its Se to replace its crappy Ne use, and would try and “master” Ne via an Se lens, and mistake itself as good for this.. They would be absorbing Ti like no other, meaning they’d in end, really like TiNe ways of going about things, but would end in making this module a very Se way of it…

You don’t avoid your polr at all, in this model… You deliberately try master it and are conscious… Mental is virtually conscious and vital, unconscious.

Because you don’t avoid your polr or role, or care overly in many ways, about your suggestive function, it is very unlikely you will retain your modern socio type in classical..

[Braingel]

Mental v vital did away with in all of modern socionics.. It’s not in Filatova or WSS, assume not in Strat or Talanov, not in G. It’s one of the most important dichotomies in my opinion..

[qaz00]

Ghoulenko, the ultimate socionics scammer - IxE-Ne

[Braingel]

Ghoulenko, the ultimate socionics scammer - IxE-Ne

If you think Gulenko is an IXE and I am an SEE, you don’t know socionics, but that’s expected, you wouldn’t know classical socionics, and you rely on the “food” one eats and not the actual digestive process of the system.. The way you type is shallow and looks at surface quality, like being literal or reactive, behavioral things, that have minuscule to do with actual cognition and synthesizing of info, or of why someone does as they do. These are surface, blanket qualities, that can have a million reasons for being of cause that aren’t related to functions. Your “understandings” are all based on incorrect subjective sensory impressions. And an assumption that specific qualities speak to being a type, even when those things are caused by pathology unrelated to type (cptsd in my case for reactivity, autism spectrum for me having some literal communication styles, even though my inner world is all a metaphor and I am good at making literary metaphors).

When I’d shown and complained about how bad your typing is of me, people said the same exact things that I had told you
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...a5340d3faeb3e&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...e1a2eab72f712&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...fd5b8f09abdd4&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...3ca38efbf2d29&

And I don’t even type myself as an infj in mbti. I’m infp there. you can’t translate that functions over, they change definition, and mbti isn’t even 8 model.

In short, the way you type is exceedingly sensory, and it is based on subjective sensory impressions from your Si ego. And I am here to critique that, since I know, with my own functions and pattern recognition, that you cannot type in the broader scheme of possibilities, and how people develop overtime, qualities that aren’t inherent to them on their surface, a person based on their presentation of traits and qualities, assume they are related to where you believe they are. This is how you even assume an abuse victim is “abusive” and an “angry person”, merely because they’ve outbursts, when their aggression has an underlying cause of having been moved to survive and hijacks their amygdala. Or that a paranoid person has psychosis or schizophrenia. When maybe they’re sleep deprived. People who don’t evolve their process as yourself in this way, are the most prone to confirmation bias and the halo effect, and to have wrong impressions of a person and falsely ascribe, relative to their own experience of deeply firm and held sensory experiences that they can’t imagine past.

If you can’t evolve past that and assume your own sensory experiences and views of a person are of how a person is, you will always make gross assumptions of a person. Your way of processing has its place in something like general medicine, aesthetical means, preserving artifacts and history, but has no place when it comes to understanding human psychology, beyond your own experience or confirmed patterns that develop from wayyyyyy more experience than you have, since you literally learn by direct, physical experience, and would have to expose to every possibility manually.

You don’t have the ability to grasp the essence and overall dynamic and interworkings of a person. You can’t even see that the way I process things is deeply from a place of my own emotions, and of general patterns, and seeing underlying means beneath the surface, and that I’m cognizant of hidden potentials that aren’t in the horizon of sight— anti sensory. You don’t have the ability to see Gulenko with his whole “expansion” and openness focuses on concrete, surface qualities in the horizon that can observe—- sensory type, and specifically Se. You probably wouldn’t even be able to tell this entire writing to you, is aristocratic> democratic dichotomy, which a gamma doesn’t even possess.

You direly need the help of an Ne ego dual, or to broaden your experience if you can’t attain that, or else you’ll have like, maybe a 40% accuracy rate of interpreting people, and not even merely for typology.