Can you help? Am I ENFp or INFp?

[ToTheMoon]

Meh, I'm back to square one again, of course. I had already forgotten why I chose SLI and I came here to remember and I almost convinced myself reading my explanation post. Almost. It felt kind of confirmation biased. I got suspicious and skeptical about it. It's too easy to explain different behaviours with functions. I still can't see myself and still feel like too many functions apply to my experience of being myself, whatever that self is because I can't tell anymore (if I was ever able to). Le sigh.

Anyone give me a link to a good, honest and scientific description of functions, please? No psychological/behavioral mumbo-jumbo, please, if at all possible.

[ooo]

sweety, not sure that's possible :/

but have you read Jung's descriptions of the functions? https://psychclassics.yorku.ca/Jung/types.htm

most people in here give most credit to his descriptions, just keep in mind that that stuff was written 100 years ago... and that socionics has developed from that point on, with new descriptions of the functions and the types.

and here's the founder of the socion with an essay, The Dual Nature of Man, where she gives some practical descriptions, how the types look like and other little things. I don't really find her text very useful, for many reasons, but it's one of the best attempts at "objectivity", for sure.


here's a little fav of mine instead, easy and nice http://www.the16types.info/info/index.htm

[Sol]

most people in here give most credit to his descriptions

most people here "give most credit" to Socionics functions descriptions which are more correct and wider than outdated, muddy and partly wrong expanded Jung's texts about functions. what is interesting at Jung - the core terms about functions only, but not his incompetent thinking about consequences of own core theory which he could not even to understand good as mistyped himself and have misleaded by his texts alike you to think yourself as EII while having opposite quadra type IEI - it's much due to the mess about functions his texts do

[ooo]

if even Jung fails about typology.. what do you expect out of every goddamn mortal, Soli?

I'm just human : )

[ToTheMoon]

@ooo
thanks for the links! Good reads. I did read me some Jung recently, and decided to stick to just the function descriptions. Not really sure I follow all of his writings but it is the core, right? I like to think that it's good to know the source of all sources.
@Sol
I find that descriptions vary from author to author. Likely because authors themselves being just one type perceive the other types from their personal bias, no matter how much they try to remain objective. That's the curse of being human. I relate to way too many type descriptions, that's also the curse of being human. That's why I want to look into basics, ie. functions, I believe they would be less muddied by biases than types.

[Sol]

I find that descriptions vary from author to author.

There are 2 authors the core theory of which you should take into account. Jung and Augustinavichiute. The more core the theory is and closer to Jung - the more trust it has.
Anything other - you should not trust and to use until will get the typing and watching people experience (takes years) in types where will see it may be correct, or better when will see objective experiments to proof that sometimes.

What you may read at other authors is interesting only in borders of the said by those 2 above. More in borders of core basics, core definitions said by them.
Those other authors may say the same by better words and without redundant "water" (Jung and Augustinavichiute have weird language), without much of doubtful (Augustinavichiute's texts, partly Jung). You read their popular Socionics books and texts to get the core theory by easier way. All other authors have the same, similar part - it mostly fits to Jung and Augustinavichiute core theory. And the more often you meet something what is similar - the more trust to that you should to have.

So instead of paying attention on differences between authors - you should find and do this for similarities.
It's what I did and this allows me to see the core theory working as should. In general, as nontypes factors are significant and may distort to some degree a behavior. Alike was with me, when my surface behavior since some painful events (and because of LSI father influence) got many traits common for introverts and so I got in tests more often introvertion, had significant and some monthes of doubts about E/I in myself.

You'll can understand own type by IR effects sometimes. Only the correct type may fit to what you'll get. To irrational impressions which people inspire in you. In case you'll be typing people IRL.
SLI is not your type.

[ooo]

@ooo
thanks for the links! Good reads. I did read me some Jung recently, and decided to stick to just the function descriptions. Not really sure I follow all of his writings but it is the core, right? I like to think that it's good to know the source of all sources.

agreed

also, I place functions descriptions before anything else, functions + model A actually. the descriptions of the types, as you've said yourself, tend to be super confusing, I recognize myself in at least 4 profiles (depending on who writes the articles - as you've said yourself, again-), so yeah, if you play within the rules functions + model, you can come close to addressing the right type... I think all the rest is just stereotypes.

good luck in finding out what your socion type is ~

[ToTheMoon]

Okay, so I've decided to go it the long way: step by step, bit by bit, fuction by function. If anyone would be willing to dive deep with me and try to make sense of what I'm about to write, I'd really appreciate it.

I thought, let's go by functions. Okay? Okay.

*I'm using this site: http://www.the16types.info/info/functions.htmasthe source of the definitions of functions and I'm adhering to these descriptions when writing about my experiences so please keep that in mind when reading, and, possibly, read the definitions as well as my personal experiences recounted.


**Head to the end of this post for a short summary that I wrote after I saw what a monster this post turned out to be.

This is my understanding of myself as of today, based on the way I understand the theory of socionics as of today.

Si
Definition: Recalling past experiences, remembering detailed data and what it is linkedto. Physical relationships between processes taking place at same time and place -how they affect one’s inner state; physical sensations (sound,smell, etc.), how one feels, health, aesthetics
My experience: I have a bad memory in general, I don't really remember stuff that happened to me a month ago, much less 10 or 20 years ago; I usually dislike dwelling on the past, unless I'm depressed and want to get depressed even more by remembering bad stuff. I'd say I'm aesthetically inclined --I used to work as a graphic designer, I'm also a photographer. I dress well and with a strong personal flavor. My house has a nice interior design. I'm not very creative when it comes to this part, though. I can easily 'get inspired' and copy what others are doing, adjusting the idea to means available to me. I havea hard time imagining what something will look like before it takes its form. I have to see it in reality to be able to judge if it's right or wrong for the situation (think about redecorating a room as an example: I have to move furniture around to see what it will look like before I decide which arrangement is right). I don't pay a lot of attention to my body needs/pysical sensations/health --I'm not worried about these things at all. Where a lot of my (mostly female) friends are concerned with their health and bodily comfort, it doesn't influence me much if I'm wearing uncomfortable clothes or if I feel sick, as long as the discomfort doesn't overpower my mind and the ability to do the things I want to do. Example: I'm about to undergo a double jaw surgery (this means breaking and re-setting my mandible and maxilla and months of healing from it) for my underbite and I'm pretty chill about it.

Se
Definition: Experiencing and noticing the physical world, scanning for visible reactions and relevant data. Outward traits of object - shape, old vs. young, worth or cost, appearance, energy of object, strength, readiness, willpower, mobilization
My experience: I'm not a great observer of qualities and details. Example: I tend to have a hard time distinguishing between two people who look of similar age and build, have similar hair colour andlength and, say, they're both wearing glasses. Unless I have a large amount of time to figure out all their differences, I have to ask someone to tell me if these people are twins or not. Very awkward. I have a hard time being spontaneous or ready to jump to anything on a moment's notice. I find I enojoy just doing things, though, when I give them a chance. When the mood is right and I get invited to go somewhere, do something like hiking or walking around town in good company, I'm all for it and it relaxes me greatly. I have a hard time starting these things on my own, though.

Ni
Definition: Foreseeing implications, conceptualizing, and having images of the future or profound meaning. Relationships between processes (events, actions) separated in time and space -availability of time, length of processes, abstract description of processes, patterns of events, sense of timing, history, sense of when things could happen, sense of danger or safety in future
My experience: Talking about this makes me feel funny and awkward. I don't like to talk about it much because I know it makes me look haughty while I'm not, I just relay my experiences. I used to do astrology and tarot readings professionally and for friends. People came back with stories and would look at me weird, asking where I knew things from–and I didn't really know anything, it was just there. When I gained enough proficiency in my readings, I started to feel uneasy with the level of power they gave me over people's minds so I stopped doing them. I didn't want people to feel controlled by cards or charts (or me!), and they easily do (as do I). Now all of this is to say that I don't believe I'm clairvoyant or a medium or anything remotely like that. I just read people really well on the spot. To the extent that I get some insights and realizations without knowing or really consciously perceiving anything (because low Se). I treat all of this as a sort of organic logic of time and that's how I rationalize it. I also can totally overdo it and miss the point. Or get stuck on the negative way things will play out instead of seeing other possibilities. All in all, I don't know whether I relay on this day to day but it is a large part of my life and has been ever since I was a kid.

Ne
Definition: Inferring relationships, noticing threads of meaning, and scanning for what could be. Potentiality of object - inherent possibilities, purpose, abilities, talents, structure, construction, diagram or internal map of object
My experience: I see potential in people more than in objects, I guess, although with my experience in handicrafts of all kinds, maybe that plays out too? I do see the 'threads of meaning' and constantly keep looking for something beneath the surface: underlaying structures, talents, unused potential waiting to be exploded. I want to help people improve themselves by understanding themselves better. I'm more drawn to depth than to novelty. I see novelty as a means of lightening the mood. I don't currently dislike novelty but it's an attitude I had to learn. I used to be very opposed to different points of view, believing there was only one that was correct. I feared other points of view would destroy my worldview. Now I like to remind myself that they can only expand it and I can decide not to take them with me if I don't like them.

Fi
Definition: Evaluating importance and maintaining congruence. Subjective emotional relationships between objects - attraction vs. repulsion, like vs. dislike, need of each other, love, friendship, antipathy, ethical norms, morals, qualitative properties, subjective judgments.
My experience: As much as I am a people person, it's a risky thing for me to speak out my personal preferences because it can disrupt the general atmosphere of calm with people around me. I've been called cold or lukewarm and like nothing influences me emotionally –which is untrue because I have a lot of emotional response to what's happening outside, I just choose not to act or speak on it. I often view myself as, well, sort of inauthentic: I will bend my personal rules so that harmony is retained within a situation. It doesn't bother me too much, though, because I view it as working for a greater good.
Side note: I've recently rewatched the video I posted in my OP and had an 'aha' moment at the point where I'm answering the question about my values. I spoke a lot about valuing myself being a value in itself because it lets me stay grounded in myself instead of blending in with others --and some of you noticed it and accurately pointed it out as relevant. And it is, with one stipulation that needs explaining. The 'aha' is that I failed to mention in the video that this valuing myself is a very new concept to me and something I learned during my therapy in the last year. I try to adhere to that principle but it's truly hard. My natural inclination is to lose myself in relations with others. I am well aware that this needs balancing because I do this to an unhealthy degree, creating codependent relationships. But still, that bit I said, which sounded so very Fi, is something new to me and something I'm trying to add to my personality. Honestly, the question about my values was super hard for me to answer and I just went for something that sounded good in the situation (and I didn't want to make people wait any longer before I answer). I don't really have a firm hold on what I believe to be my values as they are pretty changeable.

Fe
Definition: Considering others and responding to them. Internal activity of object -internal processes in object, emotional arousal and arousability of object, emotional life, moods, subjective emotional content.
My experience: I see other people and their needs and wants well and instinctively know how to please them. I sort of mold myself to others. It was a big thing during my therapy. I know how to act around people to gain what I want, which 99% of the time is harmony and peace. I do literally everything to avoid conflict: sometimes I will withdraw, other times I will lead (others seem to respond well to my leadership even though I'm not keen on imposing it) but most of all I will choose to neglect my own feelings. It is my natural inclination to look at others first when deciding what should be done. I often forego myself in the process, only to find much later that I actually didn't like my own decision because it made me lose out on something in favor of not shaking the boat and maintaining harmony. Using Fe energizes me and drains me at the same time. If I see my activities bring result and improve others (their mood or their understanding of something), it brings great satisfaction. Aimless socializing can be exhausting unless some conditions are satisfied (like let's hang out and not talk, each does their own thing).

Ti
Definition: Analyzing, categorizing, and figuring out how something works. Objective, outwardly measurable relationships between objects - laws, regulations, rules, categories, quantifiable properties, logic, analysis, belonging, authorship, hierarchy, subordination, objective judgments
My experience: I like to do this. I like to dwell on theories, research different approaches, look for relationships between objects. I think I'm pretty good at this, although, on the other hand, I don't think I could ever come up with my own theory and I'm often way too impatient to come to any conclusions. When researching a theory, I tend to keep things open-ended because I need to see the full picture first in order to decide where something (or I) fit within it. It can be tiring, though, not being able to find closure because the picture just keeps getting bigger and bigger. I can get overwhelmed by it and go away for a certain time to let it sink in and crystallize in me.
I think my process here on the forum is very Ti in nature. I go backand forth, leaving when I get too confused and coming back when curiosity strikes. I like the feeling of closure, though. I like the feeling that I understand how the whole picture looks and where all the pieces of the puzzle fit.

Te
Definition: Organizing, segmenting, sorting, and applying logic and criteria. External activity of object - actions, events (what, how, where), facts, activity or work, algorithms, procedures, logic of objects’ measurable outward behavior
My experience: Not good at this at all. I get totally lost in procedures and the way things should work according to some external rules. I usually intuit everything around me from snippets of data but I can't do that with rules because they defy my intuition. Rules are these huge glass walls around me that I keep bumping into because I can't see them and that makes me look and feel awkward and helpless. I can't intuit the rules, I have to learn them and that's boring –at the same time not knowing them is scary because if I break a rule, it can damage harmony.


**Okay, this was super long, so tl;dr: here are my attempts to categorize how I experience each of the functions.


Strong (strongest to weakest): Fe, Ne/Ni, Ti (?)
Weak (weakest to strongest): Te, Se/Si, Fi


Believe I'm good at it while I actually aren't: Ti
Believe I'm bad at this while I actually aren't: Fi, Si


Strong but wish I was a bit less so: Fe
Wish I was more like this: Fi, Se


Strong (?) but akward about it: Ni
Actually useful but kind of meh: Ne


Dislike when others do this: Fi, Ni
Like when others do this: Se, Ti


Enjoyable and fun: Ti
Risky and exciting: Se
Scary and harsh:Te
Boring and tiresome: Si


Duty: Fe
Relax: Ti, sometimes Se


Used on other people and brings me pleasure: Si, Ni, Fe (I'm everybody's stylist and psychologist)
Used on myself and brings me pleasure: Ti, Si/Se (I spend my days researching stuff without end; when gone bad, I indulge myself with food)

Hard to activate but nice when I do: Se
Hard to activate and dislike when I have to: Te
Easy to activate and nice when I do: Ti, Ni
Easy to activate and can be meh when I do: Fe, Ne


No matter if you read the short or the long version of the post, I would very much appreciate if you could help me make sense of it. Thank you!

[ToTheMoon]

@Sol
sounds reasonable. I'll try to acquaint myself with more descriptions and look for similarities. I always try to get the gestalt of what something is so it can sink in and I can make sense of it. It can take a bit of time with large and complex theories, though.

Btw, I get what you're saying with the I/E confusion. I started seeing that in people recently and it was eye opening.
@ooo
I agree about stereotypes. We're not that and it can be hard to see ourselves in them. We're all pretty complicated creatures. Also thanks!

[Beautiful sky]

@Sol
sounds reasonable. I'll try to acquaint myself with more descriptions and look for similarities. I always try to get the gestalt of what something is so it can sink in and I can make sense of it. It can take a bit of time with large and complex theories, though.

Btw, I get what you're saying with the I/E confusion. I started seeing that in people recently and it was eye opening.
@ooo
I agree about stereotypes. We're not that and it can be hard to see ourselves in them. We're all pretty complicated creatures. Also thanks!

Can you recall the sensations that you’ve experienced in your mind after you’ve physically experienced them? Like eating chips ice cream sex

[ToTheMoon]

Can you recall the sensations that you’ve experienced in your mind after you’ve physically experienced them? Like eating chips ice cream sex

I'm not sure I get your question. Are you asking whether I can recall in my mind *the physical sensations* or if I recall *sensations in my mind that happened after I had the physical sensation*?
It's hard to answer either way. If it's the former question, then I kind of can recall the physical sensation if I concentrate. I can vaguely remember what vanilla ice cream tastes and smells like. If it's the latter question, I can also remember that eating it is pleasant so I know I will have it again in the future when the mood strikes.

Does that say anything, though?

[Beautiful sky]

I'm not sure I get your question. Are you asking whether I can recall in my mind *the physical sensations* or if I recall *sensations in my mind that happened after I had the physical sensation*?
It's hard to answer either way. If it's the former question, then I kind of can recall the physical sensation if I concentrate. I can vaguely remember what vanilla ice cream tastes and smells like. If it's the latter question, I can also remember that eating it is pleasant so I know I will have it again in the future when the mood strikes.

Does that say anything, though?

Si is one’s own personal sensory impressions. It’s like looking at a painting and not being able to absorb real qualities of that painting but just what made an impression or feeling on you and you alone.. in your own mind’s eye.

[ToTheMoon]

Si is one’s own personal sensory impressions. It’s like looking at a painting and not being able to absorb real qualities of that painting but just what made an impression or feeling on you and you alone.. in your own mind’s eye.

Ah, okay. I thought you were hinting at that. Isn't it about competence and frequency of use of a function when it comes to socionics/mbti, though?

[ToTheMoon]

@Sol
what do you make of this guy? I kinda low key fell for him in an instant .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HIZAkDbC5g&t=1186s

[ooo]

sorry Moon, I thought through this but got confused...

I'd say that Ne and Si are valued functions for you, and by your discourses I've always thought you could be a F > T.

This would leave us with either a gamma SF, or a delta NF. I haven't watched your video again, I don't remember if you've expressed your approach to your surrounding, or the things that set you in motion, I mean, I have a hard time figuring if you're an Extro or Intro-vert.

For the way you look, your self containment and general manners, I'd say you could be an Introvert.. but perhaps an IEE can be similarly "quiet".

The Psychologist is an archetype fitting both Delta NFs, sure, everyone can be, my ENTp cousin is a psychologist too, as was Aushra, and many other ESI or NFs or whatever, everyone can be everything.. but, if you have that kind of attitude, perhaps that fits to the general idea of the NF, who likes to help people out rather practically.

I don't want to push a type upon you, but I wanted to say since the scratch that you look just like one of my mbti INFJ besties, I have no idea how to convert her into socionics, I think she's in between j/p.

[ToTheMoon]

@ooo

No worries! If I don't get what I am, how are others supposed to know? I'm glad you want to talk to me, though, and thank you for that. I find asking and being asked questions help me see myself a bit better.

So yeah, about valued functions, I have a question: how does one say which ones they value? Is this based on Fi-type feeling of attraction or repulsion towards a function? Or should we look at how it plays out in the open?
I'm asking this because I'm not sure how you got Ne and Si as my valued functions from my description. Maybe I'm simply misunderstanding the term? Or maybe I was too subtle in trying to say that I pretty much dislike Si and Ne is troublesome for me.

I agree about being F after all. I don't even know how I thought I was Te creative. I'm literally the least Te-competent person I know. I can't even buy train tickets without feeling anxious. I'm never fully prepared for such a difficult task...! How do I talk to the lady in the window? What mood is she in? What if I make a mistake and say the wrong hour? What if I forget mid-sentence the name of the place I'm supposed to go (really happens to me, not funny at all)? Ah, the horrifying rules devoid of human touch...

As for being a psychologist --my likely ENTj mother is a professional psychologist, so you're right, anyone can be one with correct education steps taken . Anyway, I kinda always feel pushed into that role. When it works, it's nice and invigorating. But when people just want to come and complain, I wanna sign out. When I'm unable to make people see themselves better and work on improving themselves, I'm brought down to this polite listener role which I don't find fitting at all.

At the same time, when I am in a company where I feel familiar and safe, and I don't currently play the 'psychologist' or 'teacher', I tend to be very lighthearted and goofy, I laugh all the time, I try to make people happy with my positive attitude. I don't think people see me as introverted because I can be quite energetic, especially when I am around people who are confident and decisive --it's as if I'm drawing energy from them and can transform it into fun and unusual ideas. I can be a sort of a funnel through which new ideas emerge and get realized in real life. I am well aware I can't realize many of them on my own but with a good company, anything is possible.

During a typical week, I will spend time by myself or see my boyfriend two or three times. I live alone now and am really happy with it. If I see people three days in a row, I'm exhausted. Recently I noticed that depending on the quality of conversation, I can be tired to the point physically having to rest for a day or I can be uplifted and energized. Last week, I spent a day with my friends, discussing MBTI in a very Ti manner (they were trying to type themselves and I was helping by explaining the theory) and that was great, made me feel energized. On the other hand, when I met with a couple of other friends recently and they started talking Si stuff: literally about how they bought new vacuums and now used them routinely and even got their boyfriends to use them, I wanted to shoot myself. I have no way of relating to that. I got irritated on the inside and jokingly mentioned that I only vacuumed, like, once a month if I remembered, which created a moment of awkward silence where we all wished I hadn't just said that.

So maybe that answers the question whether I'm I or E lead. Or not!

[ToTheMoon]

Oh, and one more thing came to mind! Almost all my relationships to date were with introverts. In the beginning, I create that image of myself that's energetic and lively. It's something I can't keep up with for longer periods of time though. When you see me in passing, during random meetings, I may appear bouncy and lively but the reality of day to day life is so different. I have a lot of energy but not enough for 2 people to live off of. So as my relationships went on, they ended up in a place where we were both just sitting on the sofa, playing video games, which is fine, by the way, but I've always longed for a partner who would pull me out of the sofa when I sink in too deep rather than sink in with me. Never got that person, I guess because I never show that passive and fragile part of myself in the stage when people assess each other, so I come off much more energetic than I really am.

[Adam Strange]

Oh, and one more thing came to mind! Almost all my relationships to date were with introverts. In the beginning, I create that image of myself that's energetic and lively. It's something I can't keep up with for longer periods of time though. When you see me in passing, during random meetings, I may appear bouncy and lively but the reality of day to day life is so different. I have a lot of energy but not enough for 2 people to live off of. So as my relationships went on, they ended up in a place where we were both just sitting on the sofa, playing video games, which is fine, by the way, but I've always longed for a partner who would pull me out of the sofa when I sink in too deep rather than sink in with me. Never got that person, I guess because I never show that passive and fragile part of myself in the stage when people assess each other, so I come off much more energetic than I really am.

This is exactly the problem with Introvert-Introvert relationships.

*EDIT* I've seen two ESI-ILI relationships closely. One couple is married, the other is not. The ESI in the unmarried couple told me that the problem with his relationship was that both he and the ILI would sit in a room and wait for the other to start something, which they just never did.

The married ESI-ILI couple invites me to visit them for a week or two at a time, because when I'm there, everyone is doing something and going somewhere. I've been friends with the ILI for thirty years, and his wife, of course, is my dual and so is basically perfectly easy to hang around with for almost any amount of time.

[ToTheMoon]

That's what I thought. Thanks for confirming.

[ToTheMoon]

Yo. I've remembered that in the mean time I recorded two videos where I'm talking with another person. Since this was suggested to me way back in this thread, I thought I'd post them. They were intended for a group about another typology that my friend and I both moderate. Sort of an educational material. Explaining stuff to people is something I feel good in so this should show me in a pretty natural and neutral state, as opposed to the previous videos which were recorded soon after my dear Grandma's death. I was at a very low point at that time and it could have influenced the way I talked.

This is part one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JO9-WdUNipw

And this is part two:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S289jfMIH-k

Please note that my underbite and facial asymmetry is now very pronounced due to orthodontic treatment and this state influences the way my mouth works and looks to a significant degree..

[myresearch]

Yo. I've remembered that in the mean time I recorded two videos where I'm talking with another person. Since this was suggested to me way back in this thread, I thought I'd post them. They were intended for a group about another typology that my friend and I both moderate. Sort of an educational material. Explaining stuff to people is something I feel good in so this should show me in a pretty natural and neutral state, as opposed to the previous videos which were recorded soon after my dear Grandma's death. I was at a very low point at that time and it could have influenced the way I talked.

This is part one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JO9-WdUNipw

And this is part two:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S289jfMIH-k

Please note that my underbite and facial asymmetry is now very pronounced due to orthodontic treatment and this state influences the way my mouth works and looks to a significant degree..

IEE or IEI. This is definitely not the most helpful comment considering the title of your thread, back to square one, tak! I think IEE> IEI at the moment, I will watch your videos again to see if I would change my mind and explain my reasoning later.

[ToTheMoon]

Summon @Sol
Who else thinks they're good at VI?

[ToTheMoon]

Hey, thanks @myresearch! Back to square one is what it is. Although maybe it's square 1.5 becasue nowadays I'd go for another introverted type to pick from instead of IEE. Perhaps SEI or LII. The more I read and analyze and try to get out of my head to see myself more clearly, the I'm more and more certain I'm xI dom rather than xE dom.

It would be great if you had the time to check back again and share your ideas. Thanks again.

[Adam Strange]

Since I forget everything, I revisited this thread and rewatched your video.

I’ve already said you are introverted from the way you dive deep inside your head when searching for answers. I will add that I think your avatar picture is very Si. It seems to personify calmness, isolation, and order.

This Si might be why I ventured SEI earlier, but now I don’t think so.

While watching your video, I thought “Not Beta, not Gamma.” Sometimes your face would fall into expressions that I’ve seen on LSE’s faces, and since I think you are intuitive rather than a sensor and your vintage clothing line points to a preoccupation with a more formal and floral past, I now think you are EII. I also think you might be an enneagram 9.

*EDIT*
Whoops. I just saw in your signature that you are e9. That’s what I get for not paying close attention.

[ToTheMoon]

Since I forget everything, I revisited this thread and rewatched your video.

You mean the old one? Gosh, that thing was recorded when I was so low. Did you see the newer ones I posted a couple of posts above?

I’ve already said you are introverted from the way you dive deep inside your head when searching for answers. I will add that I think your avatar picture is very Si. It seems to personify calmness, isolation, and order. This Si might be why I ventured SEI earlier, but now I don’t think so.

Ah, that username and avatar are completely random. I normally take some time to think about these things when registering on forums but this time it was like, oh, this is a pretty picture I have laying around on my desktop, let's use it. I do like it though. It's not really a good representation of myself, sadly. I wish I was so zen.

While watching your video, I thought “Not Beta, not Gamma.” Sometimes your face would fall into expressions that I’ve seen on LSE’s faces ...

You're very observant, Adam Strange, I like you. My face sometimes scares me in the way it can appear, it's usually out of my control. My asymmetry is visible enough that I make different expressions with each side of my face. I have learned to face people with my better half but when two halves are still attached to me, it can prove difficult . On a good day, the flat side looks like a hawk with severe judgment in its eyes and the 'normal' side looks like a fluffy kitten wanting to play. (Side note: I have also learned how to smile so that it looks pretty or prettier anyway. Before I started writing a style blog, my expressions were a bit different --I had to learn to do something with that face because I moslty looked dumbfounded and angry at the same time in the photos.) Add braces and currently pronounced underbite to this whole amalgam and some days when I look at myself, all I see is my LSI friend.

Photo for proof. From a random shoot for my shop, this is no hand-picked 'the best' vs 'the worst' angle. The left is what I identify with. The right is my underbite. I think it influences the way I appear to others but reflects poorly on what I am on the inside.

IMG_8329-2dbl.jpg

Side note. I wonder if talking about two sides of my face as of two different entities means I don't accept half of myself and as a result, don't see myself as a whole. If in objective reality I don't accept half of myself while btw., I honestly feel like I accept the whole of myself, how much of a denial am I living in? How much do we not know about ourselves? gosh

I also now wonder if having two different sides of a face could mean a person was born with one type but nurtured to be another.
jk
(Not really, I will wonder about this but probably won't find any resources to back this up.)

and since I think you are intuitive rather than a sensor and your vintage clothing line points to a preoccupation with a more formal and floral past, I now think you are EII. I also think you might be an enneagram 9.

Also thanks for checking out my store! I try to include as many quirky items I find but vintage in Poland is hard to come by so I usually just include what I find that is both vintage and pretty in general. My personal aesthetic would be this board. Btw, if we're talking about aesthetics, this is my blog.

*EDIT*
Whoops. I just saw in your signature that you are e9. That’s what I get for not paying close attention.

Enneagram was so easy to figure out. Why aren't cognitive functions? I have so much better access to my motivations (enneagram) than to whatever cognitive functions are. What are they, really? Which part of the psyche do they describe? I still don't think I fully get it.

[Sol]

among F types you associate with E*FP ones

P.S. I should to have relatives in Poland. father of my grandfather by father migrated there after 1917. they may to keep my sirname

[ToTheMoon]

among F types you associate with E*FP ones

Oh-kay! And do you have a fave for me among non F types?

P.S. I should to have relatives in Poland. father of my grandfather by father migrated there after 1917. they may to keep my sirname

What does it say about me when I internally get an 'oh boy, here he comes' moment and roll my eyes each time someone gets excited to tell me about their ancestry?
Like, SNORE. Yes, we have roots in different countries and our ancestors migrated and we're related to many different ethnicities, so what?
That's not directed at you, btw, it's just a recount of what I would think but would never share irl. IRL, I will listen to your stories with a smile on my face and bore myself to internal tears but your excitement is worth it. Also I'll forget everything you told me.

[Sol]

And do you have a fave for me among non F types?

ENTP. this is close to LII assumed before
for ESTP you are not weird enough

> What does it say about me when I internally get an 'oh boy, here he comes' moment and roll my eyes each time someone gets excited to tell me about their ancestry?

probably you have problematic relations with your family
or do not care what happens with other people, in general, though surfacely relations mb normal

"Likes ToTheMoon liked this post"
ooo's type is IEI, so her emotionality style should be attractive for you in case Ti type

[ooo]

lol

[ToTheMoon]

I took the shortened version of Talanov test for the first time today and I got IEI and I don't get it.
The results say I'm way more Ne than Ni and almost the same Fi as Fe. It says my Ne is way up high and my Ni is lower than the average IEI. But it still says IEI. Is it because my Fe is through the roof while my Fi is mediocre for average IEI? I presume if I'd answered more valuing toward Si while keeping the rest as it is, I'd be SEI, is that right? ETA: and if I answered more Fi valuing, I'd probably test as IEE, my second possible type. Interesting.

talanov-1.jpgtalanov-2.jpg

Now would someone please yell at me and tell me to go to work instead of wasting my time on stupid and unnecessary things like socionics?

[ToTheMoon]

Oh Sol, you just don't, listen, do you <3
You hard-headed goof!

[Sol]

You hard-headed goof!

To do not like critique and to be inadequate in Fi is expected for ILE.
In case you'd did IR test as was recommended mb this type would be more clear.

be lesser touchy, soft-headed one

As far as V.I. goes I think you definitely look Delta NF.

F type is very doubtful to name people as "environment". Delta F types have better maneurs.
Also she prefered F types in IR test, - Fe ones mostly.

EII... I suspect some betas just tend to put any weird persons to my holly duals. No way!

[ooo]

maybe you IEI moony : ) play with it, see how it fits you?

[ToTheMoon]

I would but I fear the forum won't let me!

Not good enough for IEI.

[Bento]

I would but I fear the forum won't let me!

Not good enough for IEI.

No one who matters gives a shit. Everyone knows better, don't they?

Don't let them squeeze you into a box and don't do it to yourself either. Like ooo said, play with it. See if it works with your intertype relations and your perspective. If it doesn't fit move on. That's part of the learning curve imo

[ToTheMoon]

No one who matters gives a shit. Everyone knows better, don't they?

Don't let them squeeze you into a box and don't do it to yourself either. Like ooo said, play with it. See if it works with your intertype relations and your perspective. If it doesn't fit move on. That's part of the learning curve imo

Heheh, I was kinda jk with the previous post. I've been in a playful and teasing mood these past few days. Thanks for your encouragment, tho! It's a nice perspective and not a common one here, I think.
I did what you're suggesting with SLI a month ago or two. Took it in and tested it out. It didn't work. Sooo didn't work. That's why I'm back. I'll play the game again.

Also thanks for the honest look on what's happening around here. After all my experiences with boards like this (and on so many different topics too!), it's amazingly naive of me that I keep seeking out places like this and getting into the same situations time after time. I should know better but alas! I'm a believer in humans and always hope the next place will be *the one*.

[Bento]

Heheh, I was kinda jk with the previous post. I've been in a playful and teasing mood these past few days.

lol I'm too dumb for jokes today

Also thanks for the honest look on what's happening around here. After all my experiences with boards like this (and on so many different topics too!), it's amazingly naive of me that I keep seeking out places like this and getting into the same situations time after time. I should know better but alas! I'm a believer in humans and always hope the next place will be *the one*.

Same. I keep coming back...
You're welcome :')

[flames]

As far as V.I. goes I think you definitely look Delta NF.

I was sold on IEE at first but after seeing the video and reading your backstory with your mom I’m thinking EII. I can’t think of any IEE that would deal with it -your mom- so passively. IMO that seems more on par with EII and Se PoLR.

Anyways, you seem like a really nice person.

[ToTheMoon]

Thanks @Vice! I have nothing against being any type, really, so delta nf is fine by me! That said, I keep being confused at where so many of you are seeing either Base or Creative Fi. I have a hard time accessing this function internally and that's why it weirds me out when I hear it is so pronounced in my expressions. I'd appreciate it if you could share what it is that made you think Fi dom for me. Thanks!

[flames]

Thanks @Vice! I have nothing against being any type, really, so delta nf is fine by me! That said, I keep being confused at where so many of you are seeing either Base or Creative Fi. I have a hard time accessing this function internally and that's why it weirds me out when I hear it is so pronounced in my expressions. I'd appreciate it if you could share what it is that made you think Fi dom for me. Thanks!

Sorry for the late reply. I’ve had a long week of working, partying, and partying so hard I landed in the hospital. LOL. (Thus goes my crazy meat bag mixture of creative Fi, PoLR Ti, and Ep... or beta values if I’m a beta, who knows. See we all have our issues with getting our types. )

Well to me it seems you sort of lack the flexibility (and fickleness) of creative Fi and have more of the inner stability of base Fi. In your answers and video you seem to be pulling from inside yourself more than I would expect from an extravert. ENFp and ESFp also put situational relationships ahead of what makes logical sense (and often health, for Si ignoring SEE - like me) and you don’t seem to do that from what I’ve seen. That’s probably the biggest stand out of creative Fi to me.

Base Fi is more sure of what it won’t do for relationships, especially ESI. At least that’s my interpretation. You seem more sure of where your relationships stand to begin with. Creative Fi is more wishy washy or unsure, or sure one minute and not the next. You vibe more secure in Fi. I also doubt any T type as you’ve made the NF part clear. Doing taxes doesn’t make you any less so in the same way that your mom not doing it doesn’t make her not LSE. Which is another thing - YOU CAN HAVE ISSUES WITH YOUR DUAL. Duals are two very different people in the same way that conflict is two very different people; not to mention health levels of both.

You also seem easy to push and pressure so we know low Se is confirmed - I think Se PoLR or suggestive is a lot more clear than Se role. Let the Beta STs do the explainin’ there.

I hope that helped somewhat, but my low Ti ass probably made it more confusing.