Taylor Swift

[Ikite iru]

@Bethanyclaire: I personally think that almost all artistcally creative people are intuitives. It just makes the most sense from a theoretical perspective.

https://youtu.be/K-a8s8OLBSE?si=ytubJK0x2nok42ek

Look at her video for her song cardigan. She steps into her piano to enter a fantasy world that is probably based on her imagination. Vivid daydreams are a regular symbolism for her. I think beta NF makes more sense for her than Alpha. I also have serious doubts that Travis Kelce has extroverted sensing as weakness. I am non-competitive and have a very difficult time paying attention to external reality. Meanwhile he plays in a super competitive, physical sport in which you have to be constantly aware of your surroundings and confrontational. I think Kelce is an IEI-D. I could see them getting serious but both seem very emotional to me, and I personally don't analyze relationships all that much.

[chriscorey]

greatest artist since Shakespeare and Van Gogh

[chriscorey]

I don't like Taylor Swift on a personal level. I haven't listened to more than one of her songs, but I've seen her on stage with other performers, and she seems entirely self-interested to me.
I don't think she's healthy, because it seems to me that she needs to be loved by strangers, and keeps kicking her boyfriend de jure to the curb once she's gotten what she wants from him (which is attention from her adolescent fans). "Let me pretend to fall in love this week with a football player who is playing in the Superbowl, so I can kiss him on the biggest show of the year and be seen by more people than anyone in the world." A month from now, he'll be gone.

I think she's unhealthy, just as Trump is not a healthy SEE. In Trump's case, you can see the SEE under there, but you also see the overwhelming narcissism, which is not in the Socionics descriptions of any type. In Taylor's case, she needs attention from strangers, which is Fe carried to the nth degree. She also has an extremely high level of Si, which shows up in her control over her voice and her body motions, and in the costumes that she wears.

When a person is unhealthy, they become harder to type because the personality is obscured by insanity, but personally, I think that Taylor Swift is SEI, even though she looks 100% extroverted. She looks exactly like an SEI whom I worked with for twelve years, but the SEI with whom I worked was healthy and was actually nice to be around. An extroverted SEI is an ESE, but I don't think she is ESE. Swift's face is thinner and sharper than a typical ESE's face. Therefore, the extroversion she exhibits is an act, designed to win the adulation that she unhealthily craves.

On the other hand, I'm grateful for the fact that she's a liberal democrat (small "d" - Alpha Quadra), and her efforts to get her fans to register to vote are admirable.

thanks Adam

[rizz]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/KNWF9l3cTXI


My boy JV making waves

https://firstsportz.com/nba-news-tra...uper-bowl-win/

[rizz]

@chriscorey you will enjoy this one





State of Art All time fave

[FDG]

Clear SEE. I know more than one person who looks similar, and they are all married to rich ILIs.

[FDG]

I don't like Taylor Swift on a personal level. I haven't listened to more than one of her songs, but I've seen her on stage with other performers, and she seems entirely self-interested to me.
I don't think she's healthy, because it seems to me that she needs to be loved by strangers, and keeps kicking her boyfriend de jure to the curb once she's gotten what she wants from him (which is attention from her adolescent fans). "Let me pretend to fall in love this week with a football player who is playing in the Superbowl, so I can kiss him on the biggest show of the year and be seen by more people than anyone in the world." A month from now, he'll be gone.

I think she's unhealthy, just as Trump is not a healthy SEE. In Trump's case, you can see the SEE under there, but you also see the overwhelming narcissism, which is not in the Socionics descriptions of any type. In Taylor's case, she needs attention from strangers, which is Fe carried to the nth degree. She also has an extremely high level of Si, which shows up in her control over her voice and her body motions, and in the costumes that she wears.

When a person is unhealthy, they become harder to type because the personality is obscured by insanity, but personally, I think that Taylor Swift is SEI, even though she looks 100% extroverted. She looks exactly like an SEI whom I worked with for twelve years, but the SEI with whom I worked was healthy and was actually nice to be around. An extroverted SEI is an ESE, but I don't think she is ESE. Swift's face is thinner and sharper than a typical ESE's face. Therefore, the extroversion she exhibits is an act, designed to win the adulation that she unhealthily craves.

On the other hand, I'm grateful for the fact that she's a liberal democrat (small "d" - Alpha Quadra), and her efforts to get her fans to register to vote are admirable.

False. You should meet my best ILI buddy´s SEE-Fi wife (they even divorced and got married again....typical gamma irration). She is basically the clone of Taylor Swift. When you see it you can´t unsee it. I´d say you are a bit too harsh on her. She´s surely no angel, but she didn´t kill anyone. The SEI you worked with for 12 years was SEE: if you are LIE, you would have not been able to work with your conflictor for such a large amount of time, 2-3 months are you are done.

Listen to what she says in some of her most famous songs...."I go on too many dates...but I can´t make them stay...that´s what people say"...typical Fi creative. If you disagree, you are wrong (yes, the old FDG from 10 years ago is finally back, thank god...).

[Ikite iru]

Her new album is called The Tortured Poets Department. Do you guys really not see intuition in her? I don't understand

[Bethanyclaire]

I just think she is a well-balanced person with well-developed ni. Rebelondeck called the polr 'soft underbelly' of a person..if it's developed well it can be a strength.

I think she was born in the right place, at the right time. I think she had a good childhood, despite lamenting about feeling like she didn't fit it, I think she is very aware of how fortunate she is. She just knew she had observations that people would relate to..she seems to absorb culture and then create something new..whilst being an excellent observer of human behaviour.

[Bethanyclaire]

arguably, you could say we all have a sort of 'second type', a type which we resemble or identify with, for Taylor I would probably say that was IEI as well..for myself IEE lol.

[kuno]

Her new album is called The Tortured Poets Department. Do you guys really not see intuition in her? I don't understand

I do see the intuition, but I think Taylor is EIE, not IEI. Her Fe is clearly dominant as she is invigorated by the crowds and the love of her fans (and the world). Her visions for her career and influence extend beyond the here and now, which is how she has managed to create such an empire for herself filled with fame and glory, all around the world. I see plenty of Fe + Ni, but she is no introvert, and I don’t care what anyone says about that, tbh. Even if Taylor occasionally describes herself as an introvert, it makes no difference to me. No introvert is as outwardly-oriented and tuned into how others feel/what others want than she is. I also believe Taylor is probably a social 2w3 in the Enneagram, but I’m not entirely sure about her Enneagram type + instincts yet.

[kuno]

I also think ESE is another good option for Taylor Swift. Obviously Fe base, either way. But I’m leaning slightly more towards EIE. The thing about Taylor is that it’s hard to really guess what her actual personality is since her public persona is so carefully crafted to win others’ admiration and support. I like T Swift, but she’s no angel…

[qaz00]

Taylor Swift - DN-IEI-Fe
Travis Kelce - DH-SLE-Se>EIE

[godslave]

There is a basic principle that I got from Dr.G and that I consider true and reliable :

Extroverts behave and resemble Introverts in the private sphere (close psychological distance)

Introverts behave and resemble Extroverts in the private sphere (close psychological distance)

That's a basic truth of the human condition, however the degree with which that phenomenon occurs depends on various factors pertaining to the individual's own development. That said, it's always noticeable. One can experience that state of fact throughout one's life, in family members, siblings, classmate, friends etc..

If you hesitate between typing someone as Introvert or Extrovert you can contrast and compare that individual's demeanor in public and in private.

Taylor Swift is like a Super Extrovert (I mean it as conscious orientation) I wouldn't be surprised if her demeanor is more like the "shy" person in private. If one has some material on her behavior in private one could verify it. I suspect that she is just like those Extroverts who consider themselves as Introverts or "ambiverts" (which everybody is to a certain degree). Michael Jackson, Hilter, Chaplin, Freddie Mercury were good example of EIE in whom the phenomenon was clearly demonstrated.

[tenebrae]

I don't like her. I don't think she's IEI. She's so middle of the road, her songs are often full of descriptions of her own experiences, she's not too universal for me... she's a great songwriter - I'm not taking that away from her - but she always fails to convey important topics that society (American society especially) are dealing with. She also never says anything about those people who paint her as an "Aryan goddess" or the face of Republican female population. I'd rather think she's ESE.

And for her new album title - I don't like how you are painting the poetic aesthetic as a thing only Ni types do. It's not what it's named, it's about the motivation. She's simply hopping on the trend of being a deep, thoughtful poet. That's literally it.

And that title sucks, by the way. Sometimes you gotta be a bit more subtle!

[Distance]

I don't get the push pull energy of extraversion in interviews. If you push out energy, you lose it and tire, there is no gain. Extraversion is being lit in real-time and you gain in a pulling in dynamic. I don't see it.

Another way to look at E vs I is reserved or assertive behaviors. Both types are both, but it is where you start at.

Introversion is heavily coupled to "I" and you translate experiences through yourself subjectively relating to the outer world. Is it the royal I or the royal we?

I get more reservedness out of her, than the other way. Plus, i don't see the ESE EJ in the 1/16 type.

[tenebrae]

I might support an introtim type for her though. But IDK, I just don't like her. She's boring.

[Bethanyclaire]

nah ESE!

ESE and IEI can really love each other. (Like she is besties with Selena Gomez and Blake Lively).

I noticed it with SEI/EIE too. (Paul Mescal/Andrew Scott). How dare SEIs like EIEs more than me

[Salty]

EII. Contact me for phone number for further research.

[ren aeger]

I don't think Taylor leads with extroverted feeling. It looks like it though, but I think that's apart of her brand. Her main form of confrontation is guilting; manipulating the narrative through her music, her style and her interviews, mobilizing and swaying peoples' emotions to get into their good graces, or at least, on her side. She was only (for a moment) outdone by a similarly overly dramatic SEE, Kanye West himself. Even that situation, she used to further herself. She directly confronted Katy Perry when Perry was the bigger pop girl and weaved together a good enough strategy to knock her off the top spot. She has admitted, in her music, to fear losing her high position to the next big pop girl. Taylor is most certainly a modestly dressed SEE with good management and lawyers, excellent PR and (perhaps overly-involved) stage parents who also have incredible backgrounds themselves.

As a side-note, I think Selena Gomez is an ESI.

[loopyclouds]

EIE-Ni
The way she handles and manipulates her crowds is very Fe-dominant.
Not a sensor, definitely intuitive.

[Tallmo]

I don't think Taylor leads with extroverted feeling. It looks like it though, but I think that's apart of her brand. Her main form of confrontation is guilting; manipulating the narrative through her music, her style and her interviews, mobilizing and swaying peoples' emotions to get into their good graces, or at least, on her side. She was only (for a moment) outdone by a similarly overly dramatic SEE, Kanye West himself. Even that situation, she used to further herself. She directly confronted Katy Perry when Perry was the bigger pop girl and weaved together a good enough strategy to knock her off the top spot. She has admitted, in her music, to fear losing her high position to the next big pop girl. Taylor is most certainly a modestly dressed SEE with good management and lawyers, excellent PR and (perhaps overly-involved) stage parents who also have incredible backgrounds themselves.

As a side-note, I think Selena Gomez is an ESI.

The bold part sounds very much like Fe, advanced Fe. Are you saying it's not? Fe is about social adaptation, about being socially relevant, but it can be used in a myriad of creative ways when people are good at it. Meeting people's unconscious expectations for example (when combined with Ni), and using this for one's own benefit. Fe is common in popular culture and fashion.

[youfloweryourfeast]

I don't think she is ESE due to I think she has beta values and I don't really get how she's si creative, and seems to use se a lot. ​She also uses a lot of metaphors but I don't think her ni is that strong for beta nf, she also knows well how to use se and why I think LSI.
Ni polr ESE just doesn't really fit for her tbh. I can see how people think she is Fe lead but I don't think this is her main portrayal...nor does anything mean she has to be an extrovert.