Derail - from Enneagram question to various typologies

[aisa]

derail about various typologies from this thread

@aisa seems I still need some practice typing in NPA theory then. You got health issues indicative of N, NP, - or = subtype of A-trait type, or just being really battered by the environment (harsh, protracted bullying, poisoning, etc). Explosive rage could be N type - the description mentions that. Subjectivist is also a socionics term (not synonymous with MOTIV subjectivist) which is synonymous with merry aka Fe/Ti valuing. If you're truly SEI, then in MOTIV you should be SCE??, assuming perfect MOTIV-socionics correlation. Lets dissect the rest of your post...

Xenophobia is possibly more common perfectionism-trait-ers. Go to bottom of this page and search "xeno" without quotation marks. Anyway, do you see how vague and forer-effect inducing statements like "does not love to be complemented" can be?

This and your dislike of bullies indicates anti-aggression-trait. Maybe anti-Withholding (MOTIV). Maybe anti-Ni/Se as they're stereotypically hateful and ruthless (-Fi, in hitta's definitions).

Various topics for you to chew on in regards to the validity, worth and greatness of the enneagram. Keep in mind there's real money to be made with enneagram. Same can't currently be said for various other typologies.

[aisa]

@aisa seems I still need some practice typing in NPA theory then. You got health issues indicative of N, NP, - or = subtype of A-trait type, or just being really battered by the environment (harsh, protracted bullying, poisoning, etc). Explosive rage could be N type - the description mentions that.

ok, so you actually got me interested and will probably read and browse through the rest of the links you provided. I'll refer to this part of your above post for the time being.
At first I thought this theory would be difficult to apply as I couldn't find myself in the descriptions... but, no. This actually does seem to make some sense.

For now with regard to NPA, I have to say that you might have actually not been that far off with your typing. I've read most of the descriptions and I think NP-A fits best so far.
I've been subject to harsh protracted bullying - to quote your words, but I bounced back successfully.
(Also, I don't think primary school aged children are cunning and/or psychopatic enough to actually try and poison someone, so that enlisted made me raise my eyebrows at what you're writing.)
High school was a great time with varied activities, friends and belonging to various hobby-related groups without being forced to "shed" my identity to please smn (which I wouldn't do).

At first whilst reading the descriptions I couldn't really see the NPA in me, but I suppose it might be more difficult to spot in women due to social expectations. If I was indeed NPA in early adulthood, then what actually made me go from NPA to NP-A was the aforementioned unhealthy relationship. It did change me. Observing corporate politics a few years later from close up also added to my current stance.
The description states the NP-A state is resigned - it's interesting as it very well describes my attitudes although I always thought it was more a state of maturity than resignation. Admittedly, a while back I started to get more energetic and more like "the old me" (my family and friends actually noticed), so I'm curious if I am inbetween NP-A and NPA at the moment. Curious if the process is "reversible". Thing is I don't think I want to go NPA (if it's even that correlated with "will"... as going from NPA to NP-A was more circumstantial than will-induced...).
Hmmm... You've captured my attention.

[InvisibleJim]

We should vote on who is most NPA on the forum.

[aisa]

hahahah, that'd be interesting

[kopyk]

Resigned might relate to taking too much damage.

(Also, I don't think primary school aged children are cunning and/or psychopatic enough to actually try and poison someone, so that enlisted made me raise my eyebrows at what you're writing.)

http://npatraits.homestead.com/patype.html http://members.boardhost.com/npatheo...369791616.html
http://members.boardhost.com/npatheo...360977536.html

also I'm a paranoid mofo, but wasn't suggesting you were secretly poisoned.

This and your dislike of bullies indicates anti-aggression-trait.

Seems this wasn't so final after all then, considering you went with NPA after all. Aggression =/= evil, but aggression leads to sadism, which is but one type of evil.

Also I'm unsure what exactly you wish to accomplish with this topic.

[InvisibleJim]

Evil eh?

[aisa]

Resigned might relate to taking too much damage.

possibly

http://npatraits.homestead.com/patype.html http://members.boardhost.com/npatheo...369791616.html
http://members.boardhost.com/npatheo...360977536.html

the links are disturbing, but pls note that I was referring to primary school aged kids, not teenagers in their late teens

also I'm a paranoid mofo, but wasn't suggesting you were secretly poisoned.

re the first part - if you say so but yeah, that's not how I understood your intent in the first place - I think you either transcribed directly one part of a type description (I remember reading those phrases in the same sequence in one of the types' summaries)
and/or
you tried to check if I am paranoid, lol

Seems this wasn't so final after all then, considering you went with NPA after all. Aggression =/= evil, but aggression leads to sadism, which is but one type of evil.

generalising much? anger/aggression might just also be energy used up in sports or various hobbies/endeavours and not acted upon neither in a sadistic and/or evil ways. Yeah, I noticed the "=/=" sign, but still the flow of thought went so easily from that point to sadism and evil...

Also I'm unsure what exactly you wish to accomplish with this topic.

tbh I wasn't sure what you wished to accomplish when you provided all the info in the previous thread, but since I found it interesting, I played along and used the info you've so far provided to learn sth new (i.e. a bit about NPA) and pass the time as today due to various circumstances I have too much of it on my hands
So basically - I was not trying to accomplish anything other than entertainment and looking into other people's insights. If you do not wish to continue this exchange, that's fair enough. It might actually be boring from your perspective if you're not interested in my personal insights related to your links - and that's understandable.

oh, I almost forgot - I also wanted to simply separate these ponderings from the initial Enneagram-focused thread where I'm navel-gazing using only one typology

[kopyk]

I barged into your topic to fight enneagram which I see as BS. There are tons of other worthwhile typologies so its popularity is arbitrarily huge, so much that its suspicious. I'm starting to wonder whether big proponents of enneagram on here like @silke were secretly hired by enneagramists to promote their system and make more money. What the hell was @hkkmr thinking letting her in here, probably didn't even do a thorough background check.... How naive. She never posted ANYTHING negative about the enneagram, I think.... She joined when hkkmr was newly in charge was probably just waiting for when the time was right to manipulate some gullible newcomer admin.

Edit: hkkmr, LEMME HAVE A GODDAMN CUSTOM AVATAR YOU JERKASS PUNK!!

I also wanted some NPA theory typing practice and argue against The Foundation's nondualism, which I see as an invariably wrong approach to reality. Anyways I'm pursuing a typology investigation. Since you're interested I'll send you a bunch of tests + some info some day...

generalising much? anger/aggression might just also be energy used up in sports or various hobbies/endeavours and not acted upon neither in a sadistic and/or evil ways. Yeah, I noticed the "=/=" sign, but still the flow of thought went so easily from that point to sadism and evil...

Inevitably, sth that is intrinsically linked to sadism will turn to it. A lot of bullies are aggressives.

[aisa]

I barged into your topic to fight enneagram which I see as BS. There are tons of other worthwhile typologies so its popularity is arbitrarily huge, so much that its suspicious. I'm starting to wonder whether big proponents of enneagram on here like @silke were secretly hired by enneagramists to promote their system and make more money. What the hell was @hkkmr thinking letting her in here, probably didn't even do a thorough background check.... How naive. She never posted ANYTHING negative about the enneagram, I think.... She joined when hkkmr was newly in charge was probably just waiting for when the time was right to manipulate some gullible newcomer admin.

It's a public forum and I don't mind people writing about any and all personality theories. It's like watching the news - one needs an open mind and critical thinking to filter what one believes to be true, what one's doubting and what one's interested in investigating some more. At least that's my stance. I don't really see how could anyone sell me anything "type related" here tbh, regardless the typology and it being sneakily "advertised" or not.
Maybe there are some naive people here being targeted as Enneagram "buyers" (but - what would they be buying exactly...?), and maybe not. You might be completely right, partially right or just paranoid. I guess I'm just not bothered by this issue's existence or non-existence to care as much as you seem to...

I also wanted some NPA theory typing practice

That you got and you actually showed me sth interesting, which (even though it wasn't anticipated) is actually appreciated.

and argue against The Foundation's nondualism, which I see as an invariably wrong approach to reality. Anyways I'm pursuing a typology investigation. Since you're interested I'll send you a bunch of tests + some info some day...

Yeah, this part just seemed completely thrown into that thread without much link to anything that was being discussed whatsoever. It felt more like sth you two could discuss either in a separate thread or in PM tbh.

Inevitably, sth that is intrinsically linked to sadism will turn to it.

I think I have a more optimistic outlook on humanity, so let's agree to disagree.
If one were to read literally into everything written in the NPA descriptions you linked to, then it'd be easy to assume everyone's driven almost only by basic desires. Luckily enough, although it is visible in society to some extent, I also have enough opposing - positive experiences with other people.
Therefore, I consider those descriptions to be biased towards showing as much "filth" as possible, focusing on possible ways of displaying unhealthy behaviours and using this to make divisions into types pretty much.

A lot of bullies are aggressives.

While this is true, this linked with your previous sentence seemed like you to assume it to be a rule, which is sth I don't agree with. In my experience bullying was not only by aggressives and I was also sometimes protected from bullying by other aggressives (who were in general non-bullies) so it's a two-sided coin.

[kopyk]

Regarding selling enneagram stuff. Enneagram has a big web presence with EIDB, 9types, etc. There's also all the books on the enneagram, and courses (?). The Fauvres just invented tritypes 15 years ago or so IIRC.

Regarding sadism I meant it as the law of averages + enough time means aggression leading to sadism, which history shows it has. As for non-aggressive bullies... Here's a topic saying narcissism can lead to selfishness, makes sense as its about focus on the self.