SEI EIE interaction

[Mephisto]

I'm doing a project in the university with a guy I think is EIE. We are friends, I like his person and his charisma.

He had the idea, he keeps having many good ideas and he motivates the group. I see in him some Ti suggestive, because he pretends he is very good with math, computers and programming.

When it comes to tasks, even simple ones, he doesn't want to do anything. He is the leader of the group, he motivates us, tell us what to do, he can present the project, but he can't just sit in front of a computer and get his hands dirty.

In the beginning he didn't use to delegate tasks (weak Se?); he always said "we will do", so I started asking "who" and delegating tasks. Besides, he can't press people, so I am the one to do it (I even had to remove one guy from the group).

I already tried asking him to do some tasks, but he doesn't accept it (at least he is sincere; an IEI would lie and say "ok", from my experience). So I decided I will accept his contribution as it is now.

In a first moment I found he was a bit arrogant, but now I think he is in a bad position. He depends on me and on the rest of the group to finish the project. If I don't want to, I don't need to do things in the way he wants, so maybe things won't end up as he expects. Because I do most everything, I have the power to decide whether I want to collaborate or not.

One situation: he used to insist something was possible in the computer, while I claimed it was not because the data wasn't in the appropriate shape. Should he only have opened the spreadsheet, he would have realized it wasn't. He only accepted it after asking guys of IT section (Ti suggestive?).

I'd feel bad if I had to depend on others in order to reach my goals.

[GuavaDrunk]

He sounds lazy tbh - it's bad form to play at leadership without doing the work. He could also be impulsively brainstorming and expecting other people to sift through his ideas for him.

[Number 9 large]

One situation: he used to insist something was possible in the computer, while I claimed it was not because the data wasn't in the appropriate shape. Should he only have opened the spreadsheet, he would have realized it wasn't. He only accepted it after asking guys of IT section (Ti suggestive?).

Sounds more Te suggestive than Ti suggestive to me (authority of the source of information carrying more weight than the ''making sense part'' of it.)
It might also be 1D Ti, possibly polr, because of the high amount of brainstorming and motivating (Ne lead + demonstrative Fe).
The spreadsheet made only sense to him (1 dimensional), and he wouldn't budge to your explanation, only finally accepting it when some figure of authority agreed with you.

The brainstorming thing seems rather Ne than Ni. (Ne is very good generating ideas at a rapid fire rate)
I guess the motivating part could be Fe, but IEE (ENFp) also has good Fe, so i don't know

[Pallas]

Supervise him harda. there's nothing he can do anyways

I'd ask if you happen to be Bob Ross and/or ****** but Mephisto is both anyways

I'd feel bad if I had to depend on others in order to reach my goals.

*to a Tom Lehrer tune* You're a helpless baby without your dual! That's socionix!

[Sol]

I'd feel bad if I had to depend on others in order to reach my goals.

if you deal with others then you depend on them

[powerrainbowcrystal]

EIE/LSI have a much harder time with vulnerability than IEI/SLE. Maybe see him as a kind of poor man's ILE so you know how to handle him. EIEs are often arrogant yeah it's to hide feeling vulnerable.

lmao Betas in general suck at university compared to alphas. It's not big deal to us to be dependent in the way it would bother you.... university is too alpha anyway that's why I dropped out.

Alphas naturally run society better anyway, betas are meant to kind of troll society via colorful art, point out what's wrong with it/the hypocrisy - be rebellious teenagers. I think it's silly when some geeky ile takes college too seriously tbh.

[Kalinoche buenanoche]

have you explained to him this situation, they way you presented it in your post? why or why not?

how do you appreciate his vision for the project? do you feel you would be better off with a different kind of a big picture, or lack thereof?

is the task distribution taking a toll on you? do you have a hard time figuring out how to do the work? do you have the data you need? do you know what data you need? do you need an ILE to tell you what data you need and how to structure it? maybe structuring it is more into LII territory?

do you think that this perceived inequality in task distribution can be evened out in future common projects which will require less excel work? what about past projects?

[Rebelondeck]

@Mephisto, if the professor has his stuff together, the objectives of university class projects are primarily to exercise and assess team-member abilities to work with others in a productive manner; the outcome of the project is likely secondary and I would hope that the professor and or a TA would have a finger on individual contributions. The EIE not accepting your direction reflects as much on you as it does him. Note that the impetus or inertia of a team is as important of a product as is a chunk of code.
a.k.a. I/O

[Stellafera]

lmao Betas in general suck at university compared to alphas. It's not big deal to us to be dependent in the way it would bother you.... university is too alpha anyway that's why I dropped out.

Alphas naturally run society better anyway, betas are meant to kind of troll society via colorful art, point out what's wrong with it/the hypocrisy - be rebellious teenagers. I think it's silly when some geeky ile takes college too seriously tbh.

By this definition I would be an Alpha. I do have bad tendencies to be dependent in the way OP describes but I don't consider those tendencies admirable.

----

What OP describes sounds reminiscent of me at my laziest in group work. Coming up with end results is incredibly easy. Filling in the "how" and the details takes effort.

Do what @kalinoche says.

Explain to him that you feel that you are expending much more effort to work out the details of his vision than he is expending in generating the core concepts. He thinks he can't contribute with Excel? Ask him why that is--does he feel that the rest of the team is more competent in that area? If he's a great broad ideas guy, maybe he should hover over the work of the rest of the team and edit it/provide suggestions. It will forcibly teach him about what you're actually doing and might get his idea motor working to good use.

[Alomoes]

Heh. You guys sound like you're dealing with me. Pretty close, but I'd be first to say show me the problem. I'd probably still insist it is fine though, until someone of perceived value or knowledge told me otherwise.

So the thing is, he REALLY likes glory. Like he wants it all. He doesn't like working. That's just normal. Only time he does a full job is when he can't fudge out something that works, IE, he's under full examination. Not an issue of skill or what. I've seen it happen, numerous times. Comparatively, I'll do what I feel is an equivalent amount of work, but it'll be not useful for the purpose involved. It'll be my perceived thing that is more important or valuable. Like an essay about your favorite season? Here, have a novel on people doing things in a particular season I chose. Sometimes, I'll get claps for the work, but then a bad grade, because I didn't answer the question or such. Lot less common with math, because how do you screw up the task of adding, multiplying and such. Proofs were harder though. My discrete math teacher set me straighter though. I swear, he was possibly a gamma or something, maybe even an INTp himself. Would pretty much have been a first for me. Probably ISFj if anything though, his terminology and pattern of speech was not equivalent to my expectations of how I myself look.

As for the question of who would run society best, I say that all people think they are most qualified for the position. Those who don't are wrong.

For terms of success and failure rates though, I don't know. Good question. Depends on the amount of risk you are comfortable with. As risk goes down, profit goes down. As risk goes up, profit goes up. Also, as risk goes up, chance of incurring an event goes up. The inverse is also true Some people would rather be farmers, who can't go near technology for fear of it tainting their souls. Similarly, some people are fine with running red lights, while drunk, with police after them. So if you invest in one company, your odds of losing all the money goes up, but if that company makes a profit, then you are more likely to make a profit. If you invest in a bunch of companies, your risk is hedged. It is lower.

As such, different people have different risk expectations. Personally, all I need is for everyone to be secure, and for there to be no problems. Currently, that's not happening. Like North Korea and South Sudan exist, so there is a problem out in the world. The Earth can sustain like 12 billion people, yet a portion of 7 billion falls through the cracks of society, and lacks essential services, such as healthcare, food, water, so on and so forth. Obviously, I don't feel comfortable with that kind of a world, so I'd set out to change it. Well, we'll see how that goes, nothing has happened with it yet.

Hey, yeah the university thing is probably right, but where I'm at, it feels like more an extension of high school with more specialized teachers. Like my Visual Basic teacher is an Adjunct who actually goes out and does this stuff for a living. Taking his advice for sure, and learning as many languages as possible.