Why Trump is Terrifying

[Adam Strange]

What is amazing is how you have projected such vicious attitudes into his post, and then attempted to mask it with a passive-aggressive back-handed compliment. The new person a right to express his views, let him speak without your underhanded toxicity.

@silke, I agree that @Wulzirik has a right to say what he wants. But so does @Kim.

I work with four Russians who all immigrated to the States in the past 20 years, and they all have an interesting characteristic. If you get them alone and ask them about politics, you can find a lot of racist stuff (against Jews, particularly) and admiration for strong politicians, xenophobia, and homophobia. One guy really admires Stalin. When I asked him, What about the millions he killed?, he said They needed to die. Lol.

What I get from this is that Russians experienced controlled news, provincialism, and political suppression during the days of the Soviet Union, but things were stable. When the USSR broke up, things became unstable, and that scared many people to their cores. They preferred repression and stability to freedom and instability. I can't blame them for feeling this way because I've never had my country disappear on me, to be replaced by, What? Nor do I live on an open plain that has been invaded repeatedly by most of their neighbors, with population losses in the tens of millions. So, xenophobia? Understandable. Group identity politics? Also understandable.

On the other hand, if people can be truly safe to express their views, if their world isn't threatened, and if they can have access to all kinds of information and experiences, then even the most Authoritarian of them can become more open-minded.

If it seems like Americans can do that more than native Russians, I credit the Atlantic and Pacific oceans, not any real difference in human natures. We really all want the same things.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=th7euZ30wDE

[Singu]

Well, it looks like the Trump administration will end soon, or even if it lasts for 4 years, he won't be able to do much. What he was up against was simply too strong and powerful and out of his depth("Deep State"/neocons etc).

I don't think that the left should be cheering on. They're essentially looking at what's to come if a real leftist reformer steps up to the challenge. They, too, will be charged with bogus scandals (perhaps "Russian scandals") and phony "investigations". It doesn't matter if they will never find any evidence for their charges. The media has already decided him guilty for the very fact that he is the President. The same thing will happen to Bernie Sanders, Jill Stein, whomever. What's to come is at least a decade or more of political turmoil and confusion for America. Either you will have Presidents after Presidents going down again and again due to bogus scandals and mass hysteria in the media, or you will have someone like Hillary who is smiling and saying "No to Wall Street! I will protect minority rights!" while shaking hands with the Wall Street while destroying minority rights (especially in foreign countries), and even saying "Yes to war! Yes to more military spending!" (whatever happened to anti-war Americans?). America will be going down until it collapses, and at worst, there will be a war with Russia. That, or the entire American population needs to wake up and fight against this take-over of the US government and sort of start a people's revolution.

This is a nice history lesson:

The "Soft Coup" Under Way In Washington - http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/47310.htm

But that’s not happening because the man is clueless about what he is doing in the White House and is being advised by a cacophonous coterie of amateurs and nincompoops. So he has no action plan except to impulsively reach for his Twitter account.

Exactly four years ago in June 2013, no one was seriously demonizing Putin or Russia. In fact, the slicksters of CNN were still snickering about Mitt Romney’s silly claim during the 2012 election campaign that Russia was the greatest security threat facing America.

[Kim]

What is amazing is how you have projected such vicious attitudes into his post, and then attempted to mask it with a passive-aggressive back-handed compliment. The new person a right to express his views, let him speak without your underhanded toxicity.

There is no compliment in there, nor is anything underhanded. But for you literal people, here is a translation: "wow, you are a deluded homophobic xenophobic racist. You are revolting and so are people who think like you."

i would also include people who attack people who attack the hateful douchebag, personally.

[Kim]

And that's all I have to say. If you don't see the hate in those posts, I can't help you.

[Adam Strange]

I actually see more fear than hate in those posts.

Some of the other stuff I find very interesting, mainly because it doesn't threaten my world but it does provide an alternate viewpoint that I rarely if ever get to see. Not that I agree with all of it, but it is good to hear what people are thinking. You can't change a person's mind if you reject the person.

I do agree that capitalism is the greatest destroyer of cultures that the world has ever seen, but I mostly view that as being a positive thing. Not perfect, but usually better than what existed before (like the Middle Ages). No culture on earth can stand against McDonald's franchises. People want to be conquered by them and by popular consumer culture. Go figure.

[silke]

Oh I do see plenty of both hate and fear in those posts, as well as xenophobia. Towards myself, my country and my family, who happen to be Russian.

It's virtually that you have to reduce great countries and cultures to cram your values down their throats, and then attempt to pin the blame on them. Completely unbridled shameless narcissism, which is becoming more and more clear from these posts.

[Kim]

My comment had nothing to with Russia and all to do with "******s", "race and gender wars," and the desire to keep things white and Christian. I have reacted the same way to Americans expressing these views around here.

I am German and if someone attacked a German for racist homophobic views, I wouldn't be offended because this is not about nationality. It's about ideology.

[silke]

My comment had nothing to with Russia and all to do with "******s", "race and gender wars," and the desire to keep things white and Christian. I have reacted the same way to Americans expressing these views around here.

I am German and if someone attacked a German for racist homophobic views, I wouldn't be offended because this is not about nationality. It's about ideology.

There was nothing "white and Christian" about that post. It's just sickening how you always make up these accusations. It's like what is the need? What is this need to accuse others of the things they have never said or did, that you have invented out of some sick projection?

Also "Russian mafiya" lol what is this Goodfellas or something. This is a JOKE you idiots. And its what your deep state "investigation" is pushing.

Into the man your public wants to represent them. Trump has tried to "drain the swamp" of globalists to save the American worker. He fights outsourcing every day. This is a LEFTIST ISSUE. But your leftists don't care because you're not real left. You're rich liberal girls and queers, you abandon working men who are pro-Trump. You just want to fight the community. Fight the police. Fight the family. Fight the traditions. Fight anything upholding society. Fight anything against materialist degrading. Fight anything for the nation's spiritual health

All this talk of "legislature" too. WTF is that. Legislature represents the regions, not the nation. You need a firm hand as said to have the people together as one will. Otherwise there are many wills. The country can't unify as one to great projects then

Only "blackmail" is deep state blackmail. The globalist media says "you will be a hero, you will be loved." When Trump goes along with the Clinton/neocon agenda. When he disregards Russia. When he makes these calls for Assad and "criminal charges." Like how they railroaded Milosevich's dream of stable unified, non-Islamist Balkans. This is to pressure him into becoming something against the workers. Something against how he ran for. You liberal fucking freaks are how they do it

Your left is Jewed and will not fight for workers. But Trump will fight. I want him to drain the swamp. I want him to take down every deep state bastard and old cuck in the (((Congress))) fighting him. Learn from Lenin. Democratic centralism is how great things get done

VIVA TRUMP

[Pallas]

The Russian post mostly came off like some sort of alt-right douchebaggery by American standards, and I can't say it entirely isn't, but it's coming from a rather different place than Americans saying the same things. Think about a time you've personally been in an unstable position. If you can at all, now imagine that on a national scale. It's a really serious place to be, and there's no way a whole country can survive that at once. If you legitimately see the alternatives as societal collapse including the ruin of your entire life, and yelling a few "slurs" and holding questionable views on various things to try to bring stability, it's really a no-brainer what to pick. People who are in a precarious position generally have a harder time thinking about things too, since fear and distress and to a lesser extent isolation can really mess with your thought processes. People who aren't very political or philosophical or whatever in the first place are just going to take the easiest thing available that works for them. And if America is the one beating up Russia, of course they're going to hate any sort of American ideology.

I generally hate American ideologies as well because I think capitalism ruins culture and culture is what makes people strong, gives them purpose, and basically makes them human, and capitalism is slowly turning people into lesser animals in a lot of ways that I can explain elsewhere if you'd like and that bothers me the most of all. The Humanity Bubble is bursting. The most ridiculous part is, look at capitalism. It can only sustain itself as long as it expands. And what's the most prominent disease after capitalism rose? Cancer, which also can only sustain itself as long as it expands. They are the same. The modern sickness. Bleh. I don't think Putin is an ideal alternative in the slightest, but it's better than this faux American cancer ideology of consumerism and forced "democracy". What I'd consider the real American ideology died around the time of the first World War. I don't know how this can be considered the same country. Make America Again.

[strangeling]

I find Liberals annoying because they want to cram their version of society down other people's throats; they focus on differences and throw it in people's faces, which gets really old and really annoying fast.

But republicans are equally annoying for being close-minded conservative pricks about anything that threatens their supposed values; all they care about is securing a traditional world-view that protects their status and egos.

Where and what are the people that hate both groups? Why do they never seem to have a voice?

[Bertrand]

sounds like an IEE who contextualizes everyone's ethics away as totally subjective as a means to feel superior to both camps; your place is in a van down by the river. you don't have a voice because the dialectical progression of society is founded on these two conflicting voices which you have "transcended" and thus alienated yourself from

[Raver]

I find Liberals annoying because they want to cram their version of society down other people's throats; they focus on differences and throw it in people's faces, which gets really old and really annoying fast.

But republicans are equally annoying for being close-minded conservative pricks about anything that threatens their supposed values; all they care about is securing a traditional world-view that protects their status and egos.

Where and what are the people that hate both groups? Why do they never seem to have a voice?

The politically disillusioned are hated by the majority for failing to pick a team, they're perceived as obnoxious elitists for rejecting everything. Once they realize that both teams are similar on issues that matter and different on issues that don't matter, the disillusionment begins. Politics becomes nihilistic in a sense, on a set course to shape the future as the wealthy and powerful see fit. Elections resemble a sideshow with theatrics and little substance.

Politicians being used as either clueless or willing pawns to fulfill their plans. That's when the outsiders give up and become indifferent, too many people are blinded by the dogma for any true change to occur. They are not alone, but they're in the minority so they are unable to voice their opinion. There is too much wasted anger and passion towards an incompetent and ineffective politician that will eventually be replaced by an empty suit that will become a clueless or willing pawn.

The domino chips have been set to fall and the plan has been set. The future has already been decided by those behind the scenes, the pawns will ensure it happens and the majority will cheer and celebrate the decay as it happens. After all, the dogma they have been continuously fed is coming to fruition.

The outsiders will stay on the sidelines indifferent and powerless, but unsurprised as the events slowly unfold. By the time all the dominos have fallen, the following generations will have no clue how things once were because they weren't around. Those that were around and remember how things once were would be long gone and forgotten.

[End]

If your government "representative" doesn't vote the way you want (if 95% of the population thinks we should be out of Afghanistan, why are we still in Afghanistan? If most of the population wants single-payer health care, why do we not have it?), then just ask yourself how much you've contributed to his re-election campaign fund. If the answer to that question is "nothing", well, why should he listen to you?

Hahaha. Well now, you seem to grasp the fundamental problem Adam! The masses lack the cohesive resources to compel the ruling elite to actually address the fundamental problems the society faces up until it hits the inversion point of the more rebellious patrician class ingrates suddenly finding out that there's an army of underclass ghetto dwellers more than willing to fight a war against the bourgeois in the hopes of a better tomorrow.

They/We won't get that as, well, humans are pretty fucking vile and god help us all if the "left" actually wins out. Pinochet was the best case scenario if you catch my meaning. If Mao or Stalin had been reborn there, well, say hello to yet another 50 million dead innocents...

[Kim]

If my objection is more sickening than this and if you don't see the racist white supremacy in this, you are either in denial or might share this view of a "pure, natural, white, Christian society." I am not projecting a damn thing.

lol @ the russophobia in this thread

What you must understand is that anti-Trump is anti-Russia. The Western (((media))) just wants him gone because he wants to talk with us. They are ginning up this war frenzy among the Americans to go to war against "great ****** Putin" as if that ****** is not the USA's own actions around the world for decades. You did it against us too, do not kid yourself kids. You destroyed our country in Wall Street shekel boys funding the Bolsheviks. And then once we Russified Bolshevism you tore us down again with the globalist backed Gorbachev treason

I don't care about your "liberal values" or whatever pretentious bullshit you talk about. These are not Russian values or even any non-USA values, you have no right to force us into an (((open society))) only wanted by George Soros and ******s. Wage war on our Christian heritage and European racial identity. Spread to us the same racial wars and gender dysfunction you have in America. NO THANKS we want a society that is strong, healthy, and natural but you don't know anything about that. No rootedness in America, all immigrants from somewhere else. No wonder your country fails. Quit spreading your bullshit to us

But I half hope your deep state and Clinton machine succeed. It'd expose what a farce American "democracy" really is. Honestly I'd love to see your shitty country blotted from the world forever so it doesn't spread the (((liberal))) cancer you celebrate. Just try to "press charges" on Assad like the travesty against Milosevich. You'll see how hard Russia fights, EVERY MAN fought against the Nazis which you are the modern version of. I'd love to see your joke of a country blotted out forever

Putin is a liberal BTW, Russian nationalists only support him b/c he supports Russian elite liberals rather than treasonous global/EUphile elite liberals. He is "liberal nationalist" which is really cucked nationalist when you get down to it. Capitalism destroys the nation inherently with mass migration. It is the biggest culture destroyer known to man. But b/c of Gorbachev our communists are even more pro-globalist than the Putinists so real anti-capitalists are forced into alliance with Putin

Look into National Bolshevism. It explains a lot of how the world works

Also "Russian mafiya" lol what is this Goodfellas or something. This is a JOKE you idiots. And its what your deep state "investigation" is pushing.

Into the man your public wants to represent them. Trump has tried to "drain the swamp" of globalists to save the American worker. He fights outsourcing every day. This is a LEFTIST ISSUE. But your leftists don't care because you're not real left. You're rich liberal girls and queers, you abandon working men who are pro-Trump. You just want to fight the community. Fight the police. Fight the family. Fight the traditions. Fight anything upholding society. Fight anything against materialist degrading. Fight anything for the nation's spiritual health

All this talk of "legislature" too. WTF is that. Legislature represents the regions, not the nation. You need a firm hand as said to have the people together as one will. Otherwise there are many wills. The country can't unify as one to great projects then

Only "blackmail" is deep state blackmail. The globalist media says "you will be a hero, you will be loved." When Trump goes along with the Clinton/neocon agenda. When he disregards Russia. When he makes these calls for Assad and "criminal charges." Like how they railroaded Milosevich's dream of stable unified, non-Islamist Balkans. This is to pressure him into becoming something against the workers. Something against how he ran for. You liberal fucking freaks are how they do it

Your left is Jewed and will not fight for workers. But Trump will fight. I want him to drain the swamp. I want him to take down every deep state bastard and old cuck in the (((Congress))) fighting him. Learn from Lenin. Democratic centralism is how great things get done

VIVA TRUMP

[Singu]

Edward Snowden talking about the "Deep State". This is exactly what I mean:

Generally, when we’re talking about the Deep State, what we’re talking about is a mass of government that survives beyond administrations, but that is not responding to the politics of the people. This belongs not to a particular political party, but it serves across parties. Across administrations.

It’s becoming more commonplace now for people to realize that the average congressman doesn’t call the shots, but there’s a force out there called the deep state and they’re the ones calling the shots.

It raises the question: Who really has the most power in our society? Is it the voter, or at least in theory the politicians who are supposed to be carrying out their will, or is it this larger group, this constellation of influential actors who are able to subvert and shape the decisions of these Congressmen or even Presidents.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...se-super-state

“These people are from private war-making industries... defense contractors, intelligence contractors... these are people at think tanks,” he said. “It raises the question of who really has the most power in our society.”

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/ed-...rol-2017-06-21

He knows what's up. He used to work for these people.

The "bureaucratization" of America has started. The only thing that will stop this may be losing to a war, or a complete political revolution.

[Adam Strange]

The "bureaucratization" of America has started. The only thing that will stop this may be losing to a war, or a complete political revolution.

@Singu, I've studied revolutions since college. (I wanted to overthrow my parent's rule over me, but I accidentally learned something in the process.)

There are only two classes in society which matter. The class with the money and the class with the power. When these two classes are the same people, society is stable. No revolutions.
When the class with money and the class with power are different, there is a revolution to restore the coincidence of the two classes.

Revolution in the US is growing more unlikely, despite the increasing misery of more and more people, because the class with money is getting more and more power, and the class with power is getting more and more money.

Marxist writer David Harvey notes that even Warren Buffett acknowledges the neoliberal era is marked by a one-sided class war, waged only by the capitalists. (“Sure there is class war, and it is my class, the rich, who are making it and we are winning,” Buffett has said.)
-https://thebaffler.com/outbursts/all-worked-up-nowhere-to-go-frost

There are many historical examples of this as a cause of revolutions, and no counter-examples that I know of.

If you want a revolution, either take away power from the rich (being conquered by an external power will do this) or take away money from the powerful (economic and natural disasters do this, but in the last good opportunity for this, the banking crisis of 2007, Obama used taxpayer money to restore the wealth of the financial institutions - he was already subverted -, so it may be too late for this to happen without major, major upheavals.)

*EDIT* Lest anyone think I have a party agenda, let me recount this convo I had yesterday with an SLI friend, who was explaining my character to his wife:
"With Adam, you can't really figure out which box he belongs in, because for him, there are no boxes. He is completely outside the boxes."
I'm interested in what works, not in ideology.

[Raver]

sounds like an IEE who contextualizes everyone's ethics away as totally subjective as a means to feel superior to both camps; your place is in a van down by the river. you don't have a voice because the dialectical progression of society is founded on these two conflicting voices which you have "transcended" and thus alienated yourself from

It's not that their ethics are subjective, but rather incomplete. The false dichotomy is obsolete and a distraction when both camps differ only on issues that lack impact and similar on issues that matter. In the modern age, one must first find out what issues matter most and which ones are insignificant.

Then pick the candidate that fulfills this and if he or she doesn't exist or has failed to advance then one must be willing to reject both candidates until the right one comes along rather than pick the same camp repeatedly irrespective of who is representing it. One's ethics must be expanded beyond the prescribed templates.

[strangeling]

sounds like an IEE who contextualizes everyone's ethics away as totally subjective as a means to feel superior to both camps; your place is in a van down by the river. you don't have a voice because the dialectical progression of society is founded on these two conflicting voices which you have "transcended" and thus alienated yourself from

It's funny how someone that sees the flaws in both and seeks a middle ground is also seen as trying to be superior to both sides and disregarded. It doesn't get any more elitist than that.

Raver seems to get it though.



eh alright,,,I guess I come off as trying to be a smarty pants or something for doing that, but it's just honestly how I feel without any other considerations or ego, so whatever. I mean it's like Raver says (in my own words), both sides just fight endlessly about their own cause, amplifying differences, when there is so much they could or do agree on. I don't think it's too much to ask that politics have a middle ground as well.

[Bertrand]

you guys should run for office

[Raver]

you guys should run for office

Run for office to find out that I have limited power and have to answer to others? No thanks!

[Rebelondeck]

Ants can construct quite elaborate structures and societies even though individual ants have miniscule intelligence, if any at all. Governments don't seem to need a lot of intelligence, and we consistently elect those who are popular over those who are competent. Every now and then we, by accident, elect a competent one who is able to do some good and we're so amazed that we erect statues. The one thing that government needs to provide is stability (even if it means constipation) so that the population can function; people don't want to be in an ant hill that's constantly waging war on other hills. A majority of politicians seem to have diplomacy as a common trait (usually needed to get elected) which is also necessary to prevent wars. Trump worries me because he's not diplomatic; I wouldn't care if he were retarded so long as he were capable of ironing out more wrinkles than he causes.

a.k.a. I/O

[Singu]

I think the main problem is people don't quite know what to direct their anger on, because most people don't know what goes on behind the scenes. People don't usually get angry at bureaucrats, because they have no idea what they're even doing, they're mostly faceless people that work under the radar that people have never even heard of. Politicians may get all the credits for their work, but they also get all the blame. Bureaucrats may be thankless workers but they also don't get blamed for their mistakes, at least not from the public. This allows them to never be held accountable for what they do.

So I think that the only way to solve this is for the politicians to take back all the power. So if the politicians make gross mistakes, then people will see that and they will get angry and vote out the politicians that they don't like. But this also requires opposition politicians who can do a better job and do things differently. It's easy for people to become apathetic and say that "there are no alternatives" because "they're all the same", but that's only because the politicians have no actual power and so they have no ability to affect anything.

[Raver]

JFK tried to warn us about those who influence America behind the scenes and paid for it with his life, the last true president IMO:



Eisenhower made a similar speech prior to him on his farewell address:



It's interesting how JFK was a Democrat and Eisenhower was Republican, but shared similar views on what needed to be done to improve the country.

[Pallas]

I'm pretty sure society has just tanked because no one can communicate any more. People tune out the environment in order to survive, but they can't do that without tuning out parts of themselves, since there isn't any "inner" and "outer" human being, just things moving from in to out and out to in in various combinations. So people need to get off the Internet, stop driving cars everywhere (start by taking out the stupid cupholders so it's less like living in a house) and everything will be awesome. Sickness is the absence of health, not the other way. Go in the forest and just sit and contemplate it like the Japanese apparently traditionally do. If people could talk, we wouldn't need CNN or BBC or Wikileaks or whatever telling us what's true. The Internet is lies anyways.

[Adam Strange]

Summary of the US health care bill.

http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-dru...lth-care-bill/

[rat200Turbo]

A childish summary of things.

This video is hilarious-

I honestly can't believe some of you people take these news agencies seriously, and you cite them as if they have credibility.

[Adam Strange]

One view of Trump's possible reason's for being Trump:

http://www.3quarksdaily.com/3quarksd...ded-devil.html

[Suz]

Nope ****** didn't happen in a cultural context. We've learnt about our country's past in school and basically everywhere in Germany for years, so most Germans have a very good and reflective view on why things happened the way they happen, while having an overview of the whole history of Germany before and after ****** and which events eventually lead to him climbing to the position he did. The thing is ****** did use the sentiments of depression and chaos in Germany after WW1 to make people believe he would bring change. A strategy that works with humans all over the world, since most humans will feel drawn towards outstanding, maybe even extreme characters in a world where most people are wishy-washy, especially in politics.

The cultural context you might be speaking of is the German precision with which people carried out these horrifying tasks, where other countries might've slacked off a bit more.

To believe that things like these could never happen in another part of the world is very naive and shows that there is not much awareness for the human nature. To even think that Americans couldn't be that way is also very naive. The whole 'blood' thing and racism existed since the dawn of modern white America, if one looks at the perspective of the African American and Native American people. The impact of genocide and brutality easily matched Nazi Germany's cruelty.
The thing is that most people and nations in the world do not have much of an awareness of their own country's cruelty in a reflective way, since Germany was forced to reflect on it (which eventually is one of the best things that could happen in a modern human world) so that we are very aware of what we are doing and in a way we are also very cautious. What happened in Germany is an example of how to NOT DO things and should be taken into consideration when voting/electing a new head of state, with no exceptions for any nation. Also if one studies more of world history then one will be able to see there have been many cases of genocide and cruelty and even similar dictatorships that happened before, the reason why Germany got famous is because of 1. the German exceptional precision in execution of this cruelty (the actual cultural thing), 2. losing the war in the Western World -> thus being known around the world because of the immense Western influence, being forced to reflect and pay reparations and used as example for other nations to learn and not do the same mistake.
Most countries in this world do not have this specific shame/ability of reflection I am talking about (if you ever visit Germany or spend some period of time with natives you will kow what I am talking about).
No situation is of course ever the same, yet humans usually work pretty similarly.. not matter the culture.

Fully agree. This is how I see it as well.

[Suz]

JFK tried to warn us about those who influence America behind the scenes and paid for it with his life, the last true president IMO:



Eisenhower made a similar speech prior to him on his farewell address:



It's interesting how JFK was a Democrat and Eisenhower was Republican, but shared similar views on what needed to be done to improve the country.

Interesting how JFK and Eisenhower were doing the opposite of what DT is doing. They were imploring the press to report any and all things, and encouraging them to pursue leaks.

[rat200Turbo]

Well that's because the press wasn't completely corrupted and openly brainwashing its viewers back then... did you consider that possibility?
Of course ****** happened in a cultural context... What do you think Germany is? It's a culture. How can you possibly say ****** did not happen within a cultural context? This is completely asinine.
We're so far away from a pre national socialist culture right now that we probably could not get further away - literally we're on the polar opposite end of the spectrum... society is falling apart due to lawlessness, people have given up participating in society, we're in a massive debt bubble... infact we desperately need a move back in the direction of order, there's far too much disorder. A civil war will happen long before a national socialist party ever takes over. Have you ever examined the cultures of the 1940s? They were extremely strict and patriotic. Pretty much the complete opposite of the lax, depraved hedonism you see now. For example, they would beat you in school for not walking in line properly in the 1940s...
The culture is the complete polar opposite in its current chaotic form compared with the excessively strict and ordered 1940s culture, you couldn't be any more off the mark in your analysis. Complete idiocy.
Our culture is in a pre-civil war form at the moment - breakdown of the currency and government, massive division and class conflict.
This pseudo intellectual hysteria has gone way too far, you people need to stop thinking immediately.

[Raver]

Interesting how JFK and Eisenhower were doing the opposite of what DT is doing. They were imploring the press to report any and all things, and encouraging them to pursue leaks.

Good point and like Rat just mentioned, the media of the 1960s was very different and far more honest than the media of today.

[Wulzirik]

USA's media has never been honest. They lied and said Stalin was genocidal for fighting effete Ukrainian, really a country of self-hating Nazi-collaborating Russians, scum who hoarded grain. To justify long term military industrial build up your President Eisenhower mentioned and Kennedy was killed for

Even something YOU fuckers can accept show they lied then. Johnson's Gulf of Tonkin lies to take you to war to fight Democratic Republic of Vietnam. And then you went in the other direction. You divided idiots listened to Walter Cronkite when he lied and said the Tet Offensive failed. When it succeeded! You lost Vietnam b/c of that! These are even MAINSTREAM (lamestream) HISTORY BOOKS facts! LOL, cant keep your stories as a country straight. But they don't say the real truth. The Tet lies were to take down Nixon like your deep state and Jews in the Washington Post wanted b/c of his deal with China, his tapes are really interesting to hear and show this. That's what happens when you're all immigrants, no unity. No spiritual vigor

America is a scum country. Go away from the world forever. Stop stifling Russian unity with Ukraine, kill yourselves. We have one "baw baw I'm a butthurt girly liberal snowflake" person in this thread already, any others?

[Suz]

@silke, I agree that @Wulzirik has a right to say what he wants. But so does @Kim.

I work with four Russians who all immigrated to the States in the past 20 years, and they all have an interesting characteristic. If you get them alone and ask them about politics, you can find a lot of racist stuff (against Jews, particularly) and admiration for strong politicians, xenophobia, and homophobia. One guy really admires Stalin. When I asked him, What about the millions he killed?, he said They needed to die. Lol.

What I get from this is that Russians experienced controlled news, provincialism, and political suppression during the days of the Soviet Union, but things were stable. When the USSR broke up, things became unstable, and that scared many people to their cores. They preferred repression and stability to freedom and instability. I can't blame them for feeling this way because I've never had my country disappear on me, to be replaced by, What? Nor do I live on an open plain that has been invaded repeatedly by most of their neighbors, with population losses in the tens of millions. So, xenophobia? Understandable. Group identity politics? Also understandable.

On the other hand, if people can be truly safe to express their views, if their world isn't threatened, and if they can have access to all kinds of information and experiences, then even the most Authoritarian of them can become more open-minded.

If it seems like Americans can do that more than native Russians, I credit the Atlantic and Pacific oceans, not any real difference in human natures. We really all want the same things.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=th7euZ30wDE

Even Jews from the former soviet union revered Stalin, because he is perceived as having saved them from ****** (and hey, he did. More than the US did.)

The average person in the Stalin-era soviet union didn't know about his murderousness, as typically happens in a totalitarian society.

[Grendel]

What is amazing is how you have projected such vicious attitudes into his post, and then attempted to mask it with a passive-aggressive back-handed compliment. The new person a right to express his views, let him speak without your underhanded toxicity.

Medieval superstitions have no place in a modern political landscape, and anyone who advocates blaming (((witches))) for orchestrating his country's instability has forfeit the right to be heard. Frankly fuck the rights of "people" like this to say whatever the hell they want without consequence.


"Boo hoo, I just wanted an ultraconservative shithole where gays are gassed and society's needs bulldoze individual rights because might makes right, unless it's (((liberal))) capitalist foreigners telling us what our rights are, then it's not okay."

I generally hate American ideologies as well because I think capitalism ruins culture and culture is what makes people strong, gives them purpose, and basically makes them human, and capitalism is slowly turning people into lesser animals in a lot of ways that I can explain elsewhere if you'd like and that bothers me the most of all. The Humanity Bubble is bursting. The most ridiculous part is, look at capitalism. It can only sustain itself as long as it expands. And what's the most prominent disease after capitalism rose? Cancer, which also can only sustain itself as long as it expands. They are the same. The modern sickness. Bleh. I don't think Putin is an ideal alternative in the slightest, but it's better than this faux American cancer ideology of consumerism and forced "democracy". What I'd consider the real American ideology died around the time of the first World War. I don't know how this can be considered the same country. Make America Again.

Over all, Capitalism has actually increased the quality of life and equalized economic classes more than any other comparable force in modern history. The erosion of governments and consolidation of corruptive powers you're seeing due to modern capitalism would only be accelerated under a system like Feudalism or Mercantilism.

The biggest two flaws inherent in Capitalism are that not everyone can make themselves useful, and that there are finite resources available for consumption. These are just fundamental laws of the universe and you couldn't get around them in any other system. Any and all life will need to constantly consume resources at some rate to stay alive, and in a world where "cultural" or "human" principles were the cornerstone of economics you'd see even fewer people making themselves useful. Technology and specialization have allowed countless numbers of people who might've starved to death in a more tribalistic world to become productive members of society and benefit the world with their talents. The "human" instincts that give us the Will To Power and fill our egoistic hearts with pride are also the ones that drive us to slaughter the weak and ugly or even just anyone who looks at us the wrong way, and would ultimately make the world an objectively shittier place for most of us if left unfettered.



Don't blame Capitalism because our star will one day fade and the clever little animals around it finally die. Don't blame the bacteria for reproducing until they fill up the glass bottle and die. Blame nature. When you get right down to it, it's the root of all our problems.

[Aylen]

My comment had nothing to with Russia and all to do with "******s", "race and gender wars," and the desire to keep things white and Christian. I have reacted the same way to Americans expressing these views around here.

I am German and if someone attacked a German for racist homophobic views, I wouldn't be offended because this is not about nationality. It's about ideology.

I am a ENFj student from Germany currently living in Russia. I've seen several very interesting discussions on your board related to Socionics and the Enneagram and funny views on political matters. But I am encouraged by your enthusiasm

Let the fight begin.

[Pallas]

Over all, Capitalism has actually increased the quality of life and equalized economic classes more than any other comparable force in modern history. The erosion of governments and consolidation of corruptive powers you're seeing due to modern capitalism would only be accelerated under a system like Feudalism or Mercantilism.

The biggest two flaws inherent in Capitalism are that not everyone can make themselves useful, and that there are finite resources available for consumption. These are just fundamental laws of the universe and you couldn't get around them in any other system. Any and all life will need to constantly consume resources at some rate to stay alive, and in a world where "cultural" or "human" principles were the cornerstone of economics you'd see even fewer people making themselves useful. Technology and specialization have allowed countless numbers of people who might've starved to death in a more tribalistic world to become productive members of society and benefit the world with their talents. The "human" instincts that give us the Will To Power and fill our egoistic hearts with pride are also the ones that drive us to slaughter the weak and ugly or even just anyone who looks at us the wrong way, and would ultimately make the world an objectively shittier place for most of us if left unfettered.



Don't blame Capitalism because our star will one day fade and the clever little animals around it finally die. Don't blame the bacteria for reproducing until they fill up the glass bottle and die. Blame nature. When you get right down to it, it's the root of all our problems.

The reason most people's quality of life is "high" in the first place is because they might as well be bacteria reproducing in a glass bottle. Anyone who doesn't think might as well not really be alive. Suffering is inherent to life, and anyone who thinks they don't suffer has the memory of a goldfish, so humans sacking and torturing is a bit better if nothing at the bottom changes but people rise at the top like a mountain from plate tectonics. And you think the people in charge under "Capitalism" aren't torturing everyone? All the sickness and poison that envelops the world isn't just a way to torture everyone who isn't at the top? If you step outside even the trees look sick in most places. Druids and Germani would not be happy. Philip K. Dick says that Rome is still around and that'd really explain everything. If he's an old Gnostic, it's time for the old Celts and Alemanni to attack already and the old slaves to rise up like Boudica and Spartacus. Nothing ever really happens. Life is a dream.

[Grendel]

The reason most people's quality of life is "high" in the first place is because they might as well be bacteria reproducing in a glass bottle. Anyone who doesn't think might as well not really be alive. Suffering is inherent to life, and anyone who thinks they don't suffer has the memory of a goldfish, so humans sacking and torturing is a bit better if nothing at the bottom changes but people rise at the top like a mountain from plate tectonics.

...because it's somehow better for 60 billion people to be born and have a shitty quality of life than only a couple billion to be born and live enjoyably, before the flame inevitably dies out? Consume as little as you want, the flame will still die. We've just managed to make the best of our stay. We may have even escaped overdue extinction a couple of times due to our efforts.

Yes, one day the sun will sear the planet to death and everything we've slaved to erect will vanish without a trace. So I guess we should just scrap the work that's made our lives easier, right? Go back to living in huts, killing slaves in cold blood as a rite of passage into manhood, brutally deforming women's bodies because we can't teach our men to keep their cocks to themselves? Maybe we should all just kill ourselves. That's the furthest logical conclusion of what you're proposing. We're guzzling all the resources off our planet and the artifices that have improved our lives are destroying our souls or some shit, so let's just wipe out the human plague for Mother Gaia rite?


Consumption of energy is inherent to life. Exertion of effort to acquire that energy is inherent to life. Suffering is only inherent if the circumstances are especially adverse. Since there weren't enough of us to tailor the planet to our needs specifically for all but a narrow sliver of our kind's existence, we all suffered greatly until civilization exploded and advanced technology followed. If you're anything you claim to be, you live in the first world and have benefited from technology and capitalism in ways you vastly take for granted. Everyone I know cites me as a paragon of memory and I can tell you any of my "suffering" is minuscule compared to that of people like me who lived where I do as recently as 60 years ago.


It's so easy to bitch about those countries that actually know how to better themselves and feed their people occasionally steamrolling a couple of the shitholes that can't. It's like you people don't remember a time when constant war, mass rape, torture, and ruthless culling of anyone marginally weak was the norm, when only less than one percent of a given piece of land's population could live at a quality of life anywhere near what millions already have in some countries today. Ever wonder why American politicians constantly disappoint the middle class? Because they're the most visible proof of the creation of wealth through repeated technological innovation and policies that promote growth, because they're the ones most clearly benefiting from it - and yes, I do mean creation, not just pillaging via military technology. There were untapped veins of oil the world over in the Middle Ages but I'll be damned if anyone could feed their populace by automating the growth of crops on otherwise inarable land with that oil, because the technology didn't exist yet. Some resources just aren't resources if the tech isn't around, and if one economic system promotes innovation, it's Capitalism.


People who complain about vulture capitalism forget that thraldom is the whole of human history. Anyone who has a problem with what America has done to the world either lives in one of those countries that is indeed directly suffering for our actions (because that's inevitable, man has always conquered and forged empires), lives elsewhere and feels threatened and/or jealous, or is in America biting the hand that feeds and needs to shut the fuck up.

And you think the people in charge under "Capitalism" aren't torturing everyone? All the sickness and poison that envelops the world isn't just a way to torture everyone who isn't at the top? If you step outside even the trees look sick in most places. Druids and Germani would not be happy. Philip K. Dick says that Rome is still around and that'd really explain everything. If he's an old Gnostic, it's time for the old Celts and Alemanni to attack already and the old slaves to rise up like Boudica and Spartacus. Nothing ever really happens. Life is a dream.

Pillaging long predates Capitalism, my dear, as does the need for energy - as does the permanence of energy's exhaustion from the universe. A tribalistic society or even a "benevolent" despotism would devolve into a torture chamber a lot quicker and more starkly than what we have now. I mean unless you exonerate Stalin.


Hanlon's Razor applies. People may recklessly maximize their own utility at the expense of others even when a more cooperative approach might benefit everyone, but it's only a troubled few who delight especially in the suffering of others. And it's a fantastic leap of logic to assume that small percentage also happens to be that which holds all the wealth/power.

It's easy to demonize the wealthy because they are so few and the poor so numerous. It's the Sword of Damocles - if you're wealthy and didn't inherit or anomalously acquire your wealth, you probably need to invest the same proportion of your profits into ensuring your venture stays afloat. The less fortunate just see a man in a suit taking out a thousand-dollar check without realizing he's paying off the rent for a nearby location, and they assume he's just using it to buy a fancy car or seven lobster dinners a week.

Humans are rational but their intellect is not perfect, and it's not possible to create a flawless system with anything less than infinite energy at your disposal. Here, people just make the same mistake: they've never seen the economics of how energy is managed firsthand, but they've seen machines like helicopters flying overhead and cars bustling down the street consuming massive amounts of it, and so they assume all that is needed to solve their problems is in a private reserve tank under some fatass's mansion.


TL;DR? We're not sadistic, just a bit self-interested and occasionally stupid. It just looks calculated and not stupid when the effects trickle down through a convoluted system to impact you. More energy would solve more of our problems, but all things considered we're doing pretty well. At least I am, so someone must be doing things right.

[xerx]

I don't agree with any of the homophobic or racist views expressed in this thread, but America is indeed a `scum` country.

[Bertrand]

I'm curious when you say "`scum` country", what do you mean? its members? its prevailing values?--if so, what are its values? etc

[rat200Turbo]

lol @ the russophobia in this thread

What you must understand is that anti-Trump is anti-Russia. The Western (((media))) just wants him gone because he wants to talk with us. They are ginning up this war frenzy among the Americans to go to war against "great ****** Putin" as if that ****** is not the USA's own actions around the world for decades. You did it against us too, do not kid yourself kids. You destroyed our country in Wall Street shekel boys funding the Bolsheviks. And then once we Russified Bolshevism you tore us down again with the globalist backed Gorbachev treason

I don't care about your "liberal values" or whatever pretentious bullshit you talk about. These are not Russian values or even any non-USA values, you have no right to force us into an (((open society))) only wanted by George Soros and ******s. Wage war on our Christian heritage and European racial identity. Spread to us the same racial wars and gender dysfunction you have in America. NO THANKS we want a society that is strong, healthy, and natural but you don't know anything about that. No rootedness in America, all immigrants from somewhere else. No wonder your country fails. Quit spreading your bullshit to us

But I half hope your deep state and Clinton machine succeed. It'd expose what a farce American "democracy" really is. Honestly I'd love to see your shitty country blotted from the world forever so it doesn't spread the (((liberal))) cancer you celebrate. Just try to "press charges" on Assad like the travesty against Milosevich. You'll see how hard Russia fights, EVERY MAN fought against the Nazis which you are the modern version of. I'd love to see your joke of a country blotted out forever

Putin is a liberal BTW, Russian nationalists only support him b/c he supports Russian elite liberals rather than treasonous global/EUphile elite liberals. He is "liberal nationalist" which is really cucked nationalist when you get down to it. Capitalism destroys the nation inherently with mass migration. It is the biggest culture destroyer known to man. But b/c of Gorbachev our communists are even more pro-globalist than the Putinists so real anti-capitalists are forced into alliance with Putin

Look into National Bolshevism. It explains a lot of how the world works

Mostly correct... though a tad lopsided and excessively nationalistic. Though I can see why Trump and his supporters have natural comradery with Russians.
After what happened in Russia in the 1920s it's difficult to take seriously your preaching on Russian culture and the blight of American capitalism (don't get me wrong, liberalism in its current form is a mental disease)
This "deep state" machine is not an exclusively American or capitalist creation (as if this machine could be deconstructed)... infact the communist countries are often the primary source of labor for the multinational corporations working with their heads of state. For example Gorbachev - you imply America and their shadowy deep state put him into power. Well who put Clinton into power? Why do you choose to associate these corrupt multinationals with the united states exclusively? They're multinational. You may have temporarily succeeded in booting them out of your country (to a degree) - congratulations... but so have we for the moment (to a degree)... so has Britain. Would you have written off your own country as readily as you do ours back when Gorbachev was in power? I doubt it. Why don't you focus on maintaining stability in your own country and stop giving ours ultimatums. As far as Syria, you have no business backing Assad. Take your own advice - that isn't your fight, it's the fight of the Syrian people. You mouth off about Americans interference in the middle east - well why are you there? The Syrian people are fighting a civil war, what's your business in Syria?