Mel Gibson

[Galen]

But why?

He doesn't give off any of that energy of unshakeability that 8s always do. Same reason I could never buy Ashton as an 8. Gibson seems kind of nervous to me; volatile, sure, but more reactionary.

Well 8s are in the reactive triad too. He kinda creeps me out with his presence though, like he just exudes energy in everything he does instinctively. I can't really imagine a 6 having that kind of energy; you see it as nervousness, but I interpret it as him just not knowing what to do with the energy he has and it just comes out when he doesn't expect it, something I've heard from other 8 testimonials before.

Regardless of being 8 or 6, I'd imagine him as a 7 wing.

[Beautiful sky]

No way. He's SLE type...HE'S NOT MY DUAL. For example, my dual would NEVER SAY THE KINDS OF THINGS HE SAID TO HIS GIRLFRIEND (THAT'S A FACT!!! LOL). Have you heard some of the stuff he said about her?

[Crispy]

my dual would NEVER SAY THE KINDS OF THINGS HE SAID TO HIS GIRLFRIEND

Hehehehehe wishful thinking

[golden]

I think I'd go LSE for him too. Definitely delta and extroverted. Si subtype seems likely.

No way. He's SLE type...HE'S NOT MY DUAL. For example, my dual would NEVER SAY THE KINDS OF THINGS HE SAID TO HIS GIRLFRIEND (THAT'S A FACT!!! LOL). Have you heard some of the stuff he said about her?

Maritsa. Have you drastically changed your views of SLE men in recent months? A while back, you posted the following in a thread I began:

If you go to a restaurant with an SLE and the food is bad, they are gentlemen, they will pay for the food and just leave; my SLE friend says, "what's the point? they are not going to fix it" so why start an argument or complain?

Your duals are not loud, obnoxious, or unkind by any means whatsoever. If they were, then I wouldn't be attracted to them as I am; me, being a humanitarian, very soft hearted person, who cares about not hurting other people's emotions also love and admire this respective and mature trait in SLE, but ultimately, they don't have use for my Fi, instead preferring your humor.

SLE and I have a lot in common; we like the same shows on TV, the same movies and the same books, the same almost and just about everything except that I can't sleep or have sex unless the floors are clean and the forks are back in their spot or that I know what the meals are going to be for the family for the next week. . . .

This is certainly not an SLE behavior. They are very gentle. My SLE friend and I walk at same comfortable pace; he NEVER, EVER, EVER rushes before me and is always conscious and conscientious about where I am in proximity to him.

SLE are NOT AGGRESSIVE in a brutal manner; I have known LSE far more aggressive then SLE who have slapped my hand and pushed me ; my LSE friends are very soft and kind around women in public; they treat women with manners.

Mel Gibson is a mentally deranged man, at any rate: insert the longed-for NTR emoticon here.

[Korpsy Knievel]

insert the longed-for NTR emoticon here.

tyj

[Beautiful sky]

No way. He's SLE type...HE'S NOT MY DUAL. For example, my dual would NEVER SAY THE KINDS OF THINGS HE SAID TO HIS GIRLFRIEND (THAT'S A FACT!!! LOL). Have you heard some of the stuff he said about her?

Maritsa. Have you drastically changed your views of SLE men in recent months? A while back, you posted the following in a thread I began:

If you go to a restaurant with an SLE and the food is bad, they are gentlemen, they will pay for the food and just leave; my SLE friend says, "what's the point? they are not going to fix it" so why start an argument or complain?

Your duals are not loud, obnoxious, or unkind by any means whatsoever. If they were, then I wouldn't be attracted to them as I am; me, being a humanitarian, very soft hearted person, who cares about not hurting other people's emotions also love and admire this respective and mature trait in SLE, but ultimately, they don't have use for my Fi, instead preferring your humor.

SLE and I have a lot in common; we like the same shows on TV, the same movies and the same books, the same almost and just about everything except that I can't sleep or have sex unless the floors are clean and the forks are back in their spot or that I know what the meals are going to be for the family for the next week. . . .

This is certainly not an SLE behavior. They are very gentle. My SLE friend and I walk at same comfortable pace; he NEVER, EVER, EVER rushes before me and is always conscious and conscientious about where I am in proximity to him.

SLE are NOT AGGRESSIVE in a brutal manner; I have known LSE far more aggressive then SLE who have slapped my hand and pushed me ; my LSE friends are very soft and kind around women in public; they treat women with manners.

Mel Gibson is a mentally deranged man, at any rate: insert the longed-for NTR emoticon here.

I think I have changed my concept of both types lately; starting with the thought, back then, that a NORMAL LSE didn't exist and that I would never find one who was kind. I do wonder though if Mel was drunk when he said those things to her. I honestly, rarely see an SLE who goes off like that; LSE will do so when they are not drunk, just out of pure anger.

[Slacker]

No way. He's SLE type...HE'S NOT MY DUAL. For example, my dual would NEVER SAY THE KINDS OF THINGS HE SAID TO HIS GIRLFRIEND (THAT'S A FACT!!! LOL). Have you heard some of the stuff he said about her?

So, there are nice people of every type, and mean people of every type. You know that, right? Someone being mean doesn't make them not "your dual".

[Gilly]

Well 8s are in the reactive triad too.

Yeah but 8s have more control over their "boiling point" than the other two, at least in my experience.

He kinda creeps me out with his presence though, like he just exudes energy in everything he does instinctively. I can't really imagine a 6 having that kind of energy; you see it as nervousness, but I interpret it as him just not knowing what to do with the energy he has and it just comes out when he doesn't expect it, something I've heard from other 8 testimonials before.

I see that as more likely a feature of EJ temperament than 8ness. I hardly have that feeling from LSI 8w9s, for example, but they still just take up so much space with their presence and have that aura of sturdiness; with Fi/Te types I feel it as a more kind of intractable stubbornness (I grew up with an LSE 8w7 mom, lol), whereas Fe/Ti types have a more crystalline solidity.

Regardless of being 8 or 6, I'd imagine him as a 7 wing.

Probably cp6w7 sx/sp.

[Gilly]

Throwing out LIE for Gibson as well.

[Gilly]

Looking at pictures, he's reminding me of George Clooney a bit, only stiffer and more volatile.

[Nowisthetime]

No way. He's SLE type...

I agree with you about that. I think he might be SLE. Doesn't seem LSE at all.

EDIT: yeah, he's so SLE (not just because he slaps his children, but the manners, everything)

[Galen]

Yeah but 8s have more control over their "boiling point" than the other two, at least in my experience.

In my experience with an 8w9 dad, it can feel like he reaches his boiling point easily and I have to back down quickly in order to prevent something from going overboard.

I see that as more likely a feature of EJ temperament than 8ness. I hardly have that feeling from LSI 8w9s, for example, but they still just take up so much space with their presence and have that aura of sturdiness; with Fi/Te types I feel it as a more kind of intractable stubbornness (I grew up with an LSE 8w7 mom, lol), whereas Fe/Ti types have a more crystalline solidity.

I'm sure him being EJ would play a big part of what I'm seeing in him, but it's more than just energy by itself: it's the nature of the energy that would have me thinking 8. He seems so grounded and sure of himself in a way I wouldn't expect out of a 6. The only (other) E6 ESTj, or any E6 EJ for that matter, that might come to mind for me is Daniel Radcliffe, and he seems a lot more overtly nervous compared to Gibson.

btw, what 8w9 ISTjs do you have in mind?

[Sol]

ENTP

[Galen]

ENTP

oh okay

[717495]

ENTP

Ah now I understand.

[Suz]

No way. He's SLE type...

I agree with you about that. I think he might be SLE. Doesn't seem LSE at all.

EDIT: yeah, he's so SLE (not just because he slaps his children, but the manners, everything)

What exactly about that video is "so SLE"?

To me he seems very LSE, mannerisms and all. And LSEs can be pretty strict disciplinarians per my understanding so what he's saying in the conversation is still consistent imo.

Also, LSE and SLE are quasis so they can appear similar.

[Suz]

ENTP

oh okay

Ah now I understand.

lollll, i know seriously...

[Gilly]

In my experience with an 8w9 dad, it can feel like he reaches his boiling point easily and I have to back down quickly in order to prevent something from going overboard.

That's just a tactic that 8s employ to get their way, letting their energy leak out steadily. They are pretty much always in control.

I'm sure him being EJ would play a big part of what I'm seeing in him, but it's more than just energy by itself: it's the nature of the energy that would have me thinking 8. He seems so grounded and sure of himself in a way I wouldn't expect out of a 6. The only (other) E6 ESTj, or any E6 EJ for that matter, that might come to mind for me is Daniel Radcliffe, and he seems a lot more overtly nervous compared to Gibson.

Well he is, what, 17?

Gibson, IMO, has a brand of dismissive arrogance that is characteristic of 6s when their beliefs are addressed. When he talks about hitting kids, he has this bright eyed look, like he's trying to be cool, making things seem like they should be obvious, while internally he is going into defensive mode. He doesn't seem truly confident to me at all. Christopher Hitchens, while more volatile (sx primary) and probably an introvert (ESI is my best guess), is another 6w7 (sx/sp probably) who has a similar method of addressing others' objections to his beliefs, although he is much more thorough and, umm, intelligent. Another example would be Bill Maher, 6w7 so/sx, probably ILE.

I would say Hitchens and Gibson probably have 8 in their trifixes, if you believe in such a thing. Maher is probably 9 for gut.

btw, what 8w9 ISTjs do you have in mind?

My best friend from high school's father was LSI-Ti 8w9 sp/so, I spent a good amount of time around him for about 2 years. He and his EIE wife always loved me; their 2 kids were Alphas, LII (my friend) and ILE, and I think they actually would rather have had me as a son than either of them, especially the ILE He (LSI) had this very solid and steady but obviously volatile energy to him; you could tell he was always seething internally, you could see it in his eyes, but he let it out steadily most of the time, and when the pressure was really on, you fucking knew it.

Contrast to Mel Gibson, who could never scare me unless he was holding a real 8 foot broadsword.

[Korpsy Knievel]

Contrast to Mel Gibson, who could never scare me unless he was holding a real 8 foot broadsword.

He'd be easy to outmaneuver and vanquish if he were dumb enough to keep hanging onto an unwieldy weapon like an 8-foot section of steel.

[Gilly]

He'd be easy to outmaneuver and vanquish if he were dumb enough to keep hanging onto an unwieldy weapon like an 8-foot section of steel.

Yeah but it'd still be scary, he's a crazy fuck.

[Gilly]

Compare to Bruce Willis, a real LSE 8w7.

[Galen]

Gibson, IMO, has a brand of dismissive arrogance that is characteristic of 6s when their beliefs are addressed. When he talks about hitting kids, he has this bright eyed look, like he's trying to be cool, making things seem like they should be obvious, while internally he is going into defensive mode.

Hmm, interesting. I think I see what you're seeing, and this is something I find myself doing sometimes (although I imagine there are some common patterns for when people are defensive). I'll have to think about it. His kind of energy still reminds me of my dad though, but like a more intense version (sx vs sp).

Compare to Bruce Willis, a real LSE 8w7.

I could agree with this.

[Gilly]

Maybe your dad isn't an 8? *shrug* I don't think I would ever mistake Gibson for an 8. My mother and one of my closest friends are both Te dominant 8w7s, and there is a kind of easy-going obstinacy with just the tiniest bit of itch underneath, almost undetectable, that I could never mistake for anything else.

[Galen]

Maybe your dad isn't an 8? *shrug* I don't think I would ever mistake Gibson for an 8. My mother and one of my closest friends are both Te dominant 8w7s, and there is a kind of easy-going obstinacy with just the tiniest bit of itch underneath, almost undetectable, that I could never mistake for anything else.

I really couldn't imagine what else my dad would be other than 8w9. Nothing else comes close really. He definitely has that sense of 'domain' that E8 sp firsts have, he likes to herd people around, very grounded, knows what he wants and doesn't second guess himself about it, etc etc.

[717495]

Bruce Willis is the logical Homer Simpson. He sux.

[Gilly]

I really couldn't imagine what else my dad would be other than 8w9. Nothing else comes close really. He definitely has that sense of 'domain' that E8 sp firsts have, he likes to herd people around, very grounded, knows what he wants and doesn't second guess himself about it, etc etc.

Eh. An LSE is an LSE, I suppose.

[Gilly]

Bruce Willis is the logical Homer Simpson. He sux.

Seriously? Bruce Willis is the man.

[strrrng]

Ezra probably wants to type him SLE.

lmao

Contrast to Mel Gibson, who could never scare me unless he was holding a real 8 foot broadsword.

how about a katana?

[717495]

Bruce Willis is the logical Homer Simpson. He sux.

Seriously? Bruce Willis is the man.

Nah, I'm just messin'.

[Lobo]

I don't see Mel as being an intuitive type at least.

[Galen]

Eh. An LSE is an LSE, I suppose.

Dad's Si-ESFj, but yeah it's close enough

Seriously? Bruce Willis is the man.

Yeah poli, learn to appreciate men.

[Gilly]

Ezra probably wants to type him SLE.

lmao

Contrast to Mel Gibson, who could never scare me unless he was holding a real 8 foot broadsword.

how about a katana?

Lol dick.

[strrrng]

vodka

[Creepy-male]

I'm unsure with Mel Gibson... he seems to be 6 in thinking and 8 in instinct... many cops have this pairing of thought and instinct, and Mel Gibson has played "cop" roles in lethal weapon so maybe their is something to this.

No idea on the heart triad maybe some e3 in there?

Socionics typing.... ST something or another?

Also I think people obsess too much over his anti-jewish rant and the phone calls... the guy is human, I get tired of celebrity worship in the first place. The guy made/directed/acted in some great movies and has plently of public appearances that were positive and charming. It's just a matter of time before the shit hits the fan for people. It's great to see celebrities get knocked down by the media every once in a while, especially when they start to get a case of inflated ego, but people should really get over these occasionally slip ups and not be surprised by them imo. It seems like people indulge on these sort of smear stories a little too much because they like to see people they feel are more successful than them mess up, it makes them feel better about their pathetic existence.

Also I agree with Maher being an ILE. For some reason I want to say 7w6 over 6w7, the guy is a satirist. I'd say 3w4 for the heart triad. No idea on instinct... toss up between 8 and 1... he's too outspoken for a 9.

Bruce Willis seems e8 and ST. Likely Delta ST... I favor ISTp personally.

[golden]

There was, however, more going on with Mel Gibson than vitriol against Jews. He funded and controlled every aspect of the Passion of Christ film and has poured millions of dollars into his own private Catholic church, and has professed himself to be a rather fundamentalist Catholic. Meanwhile, he was accused of and pleaded no contest to battering his wife.

He's a celeb, he's richer than most human beings, whatever ... but when someone is that hypocritical in the public eye, they get called out for it, that's all, imo.

[Creepy-male]

There was, however, more going on with Mel Gibson than vitriol against Jews. He funded and controlled every aspect of the Passion of Christ film and has poured millions of dollars into his own private Catholic church, and has professed himself to be a rather fundamentalist Catholic. Meanwhile, he was accused of and pleaded no contest to battering his wife.

He's a celeb, he's richer than most human beings, whatever ... but when someone is that hypocritical in the public eye, they get called out for it, that's all, imo.

So your claiming hypocrisy on him for battering his wife and hate speech while being Catholic?

I don't get that... since when has the Catholic church ever lived up to its image of being a purely holy and pious institution? If anything realistically could be said about religion it would be that its an institution of desire for righteousness, rather than literally being an institution of righteousness. Same with any government/law etc...

Mel Gibson is a catholic so what... so were the priests that raped little boys.

I think the problem is people may have given the guy too much credit... ala celebrity worship. I don't remember Mel Gibson ever standing up and publicly announcing he was like Christ incarnate or something. So how is he a hypocrite? He seems like a celebrity that made some dumb decisions to me.

[golden]

There was, however, more going on with Mel Gibson than vitriol against Jews. He funded and controlled every aspect of the Passion of Christ film and has poured millions of dollars into his own private Catholic church, and has professed himself to be a rather fundamentalist Catholic. Meanwhile, he was accused of and pleaded no contest to battering his wife.

He's a celeb, he's richer than most human beings, whatever ... but when someone is that hypocritical in the public eye, they get called out for it, that's all, imo.

So your claiming hypocrisy on him for battering his wife and hate speech while being Catholic?

I don't get that... since when has the Catholic church ever lived up to its image of being a purely holy and pious institution? If anything realistically could be said about religion it would be that its an institution of desire for righteousness, rather than literally being an institution of righteousness. Same with any government/law etc...

Mel Gibson is a catholic so what... so were the priests that raped little boys.

I think the problem is people may have given the guy too much credit... ala celebrity worship. I don't remember Mel Gibson ever standing up and publicly announcing he was like Christ incarnate or something. So how is he a hypocrite? He seems like a celebrity that made some dumb decisions to me.

Nah, not merely for being Catholic. He put himself forward as a Catholic of influence, which is a bit different imo. And the priests who raped little boys got a lot of press, right? I mean, it's just the kind of stuff that will rankle some people, when there's a big mismatch between your talk and your walk.

fwiw, I agree that we have a pop-cultural climate of "build 'em up to tear 'em down." Someone going from underdog to top o' the world to washed-up weirdo is a classic American storl

[golden]

There was, however, more going on with Mel Gibson than vitriol against Jews. He funded and controlled every aspect of the Passion of Christ film and has poured millions of dollars into his own private Catholic church, and has professed himself to be a rather fundamentalist Catholic. Meanwhile, he was accused of and pleaded no contest to battering his wife.

He's a celeb, he's richer than most human beings, whatever ... but when someone is that hypocritical in the public eye, they get called out for it, that's all, imo.

So your claiming hypocrisy on him for battering his wife and hate speech while being Catholic?

I don't get that... since when has the Catholic church ever lived up to its image of being a purely holy and pious institution? If anything realistically could be said about religion it would be that its an institution of desire for righteousness, rather than literally being an institution of righteousness. Same with any government/law etc...

Mel Gibson is a catholic so what... so were the priests that raped little boys.

I think the problem is people may have given the guy too much credit... ala celebrity worship. I don't remember Mel Gibson ever standing up and publicly announcing he was like Christ incarnate or something. So how is he a hypocrite? He seems like a celebrity that made some dumb decisions to me.

Nah, not just because he was Catholic, but because he put himself forward as a kind of leader or spokesman in his Catholicism. I mean, when someone doesn't walk their talk, it tends to draw a lot of negative notice.

fwiw, I agree we have a media culture of "build 'em up to tear 'em down." The storyline of underdog-->top o' the world-->washed-up weirdo has-been is soooo American pop culturish.

I haven't paid that much attention to Mel Gibson, he's just some dude who makes movies and I don't expect much. But sometimes film stars go beyond movie making and get involved publicly in stuff like religion and politics, and once they do that, things often go kinda haywire. I think it'd be preferable if we sort of collectively ignored entertainers getting mixed up in stuff outside their actual profession, but it doesn't seem to go that way.

[Creepy-male]

So your claiming hypocrisy on him for battering his wife and hate speech while being Catholic?

I don't get that... since when has the Catholic church ever lived up to its image of being a purely holy and pious institution? If anything realistically could be said about religion it would be that its an institution of desire for righteousness, rather than literally being an institution of righteousness. Same with any government/law etc...

Mel Gibson is a catholic so what... so were the priests that raped little boys.

I think the problem is people may have given the guy too much credit... ala celebrity worship. I don't remember Mel Gibson ever standing up and publicly announcing he was like Christ incarnate or something. So how is he a hypocrite? He seems like a celebrity that made some dumb decisions to me.

Nah, not just because he was Catholic, but because he put himself forward as a kind of leader or spokesman in his Catholicism. I mean, when someone doesn't walk their talk, it tends to draw a lot of negative notice.

fwiw, I agree we have a media culture of "build 'em up to tear 'em down." The storyline of underdog-->top o' the world-->washed-up weirdo has-been is soooo American pop culturish.

I haven't paid that much attention to Mel Gibson, he's just some dude who makes movies and I don't expect much. But sometimes film stars go beyond movie making and get involved publicly in stuff like religion and politics, and once they do that, things often go kinda haywire. I think it'd be preferable if we sort of collectively ignored entertainers getting mixed up in stuff outside their actual profession, but it doesn't seem to go that way.

Yea basically that's what I'm saying, I don't understand why that happens. I honestly think part of it is because people allow celebrities to overstep their boundaries by over worshipping them. It would be a lot harder for joe normal to become some figurehead of the catholic church. Mel Gibson is able to because he is in the limelight.

I personally don't mind celebrity interviews and publicity, I just dislike it when people start to overworship them. Mel Gibson makes movies, he's not a priest, and doesn't have the time to study the word of god or something... so why does it make sense for him to have some special position in the church? Unless the church is using him for publicity and he is using the church for publicity or something? That's probably the root of the problem.

[Sol]

Ah now I understand.

maybe, you'd understand if typed correctly yourself