ESI/LIE Conversations

[nanashi]

I know this female ESI whom I described in post #5 of this thread. She’s ESI-Se, e6, about 44, and looks exactly like the singer Peggy Lee. She owns a lawn care company and I first talked to her a few years ago when she was working on the house across the street. At that time, she suggested that we go out for “a burger and beer but no sex”, and I thought “Who the hell thinks like that?”

It took over a year of me constantly asking, but she and I eventually went out for a burger and beer and no sex. And no beer, because I don’t drink, but we did end up talking for eight hours.

I asked her out again, many times, and she always had an excuse for not going out. I like her, and I actually think she’s sexy, but she’s never been married and it’s easy to see why. She’s just saying No No No No No. You know, after a while, this gets to be a pain in the ass, and at some point, I just stopped trying to date her and flipped a mental switch to “she’s a lawn care resource, and that’s all she is”.

Today, I spent the entire day working with a male ESI customer, trying to sort out the problems of a device my company designed for his company. He and I dualized months ago and we broke for lunch at his favorite lunch place, just because we enjoy each other’s company. So my tank was basically “filled up” with dual understanding by the end of the day.

When I got home, I noticed that the tree trimmers had cut down a tree and had left the wood on the ground, so I called the female ESI and asked her if she wanted some free firewood. She said she knew someone who would take it. I said I’d have some workmen over this weekend who could help her load it.

”Are they cute?”, she asked?

I thought, WTF? “They are a guy like your father and a muscular guy who did prison time. I don’t think you want to go there.”

”Are you still seeing your girlfriend from across the street?” She asks the craziest things.

”She’s not my girlfriend. She’s not my type. I don’t even know if she’s still living there. I haven’t seen her in months.”

”Oh, she’s still there. I saw her today.”

”Look, she’s the same type as my last girlfriend and I’m not going there again.”

”At least you’re keeping your standards high.”

Now this is exasperating. “Why are you asking about the woman across the street?” I thought this conversation was about firewood?

She says, ”I’m flirting with you, dummy.”

I do a mental head slap. For three years, all I get is No No No and now she wants to flirt. Well, I’m not a very romantic guy. If she wants to talk to me, she should come over and take her clothes off.


*EDIT*
Stratiyevskaya said, in her essay on LIE-ESI Duality, that relations between this Dual pair proceed quickly and practically without a lot of elaborate formalities, because for both of them, “Life is work.”
This seems to be exactly the attitude that I am defaulting to.

I think you and I may miss things. Like maybe the neighbor has a crush on you so the lawncare worker thought you were in a relationship....but...her asking about the neighbor could be construed as flirting in that she's trying to see if you're free.

But, were the years of 'no's only about the neighbor? or was it something else? CAN SHE GIVE ACCOUNT when it comes to those 'no's?
I mean, people don't owe us explanations, but if she wants to date you, I think it's a good idea.

Okay, this sounds weird, and...she MIGHT OR MIGHT NOT be healthy to date, but just being blunt and saying the 'when you said no over the years, I concluded you are not interested in dating me, and you being open to it now makes me wonder why you said no then and i f you really are attracted to me now.' that lays out your thought process and hints at the vulnerability that lies underneath. It could work. You might BOTH be being self-protective. That might be enough frank vulnerability to indicate you're looking for something real and not to hurt nor be hurt.

Listen to yoursel f about whether that's a good idea with this person.

[Adam Strange]

I think you and I may miss things. Like maybe the neighbor has a crush on you so the lawncare worker thought you were in a relationship....but...her asking about the neighbor could be construed as flirting in that she's trying to see if you're free.

@nanashi, I completely agree with you that you and I miss things when it comes to relationships. Thinking back, there were a lot of girls who seemed to like me, or mutual friends told me that they liked me, but at the time, I was completely unaware of their interest.
In the case of this ESI, I think you're right: she's trying to see if I am free, or if I'm interested at all in the woman across the street. The truth is, I'm anti-interested. My neighbor is a nice person, now stay away.

But, were the years of 'no's only about the neighbor? or was it something else? CAN SHE GIVE ACCOUNT when it comes to those 'no's?
I mean, people don't owe us explanations, but if she wants to date you, I think it's a good idea.

I've thought about her behavior a lot, and I think the years of her stand-offishness were simply due to her not wanting to leave her comfort zone and having no idea about the passage of time, combined with the fact that she'd never, ever interacted with an interested LIE at close range. She had no one to compare me to, and so assumed I'm like everyone she's ever met before. It was only my steady persistence that gradually enabled her to "see" me. I think that, to her, I look kind of like a comet from the outer solar system. Something dim or unnoticed for months in the night sky, never seen before, and then one night it shows up all across the sky. Our one date went really, really well, for a date that didn't include any sex, or kissing, or even touching. It was all conversation. She's had a long time to think about that, and I think she's probably comparing that date to every single day of her life before and since then, and comparing me to her other male acquaintances, and now she's slightly curious.

Or maybe she just decided she needs some attention from someone who might give her some. I really have no idea what she's thinking.

Okay, this sounds weird, and...she MIGHT OR MIGHT NOT be healthy to date, but just being blunt and saying the 'when you said no over the years, I concluded you are not interested in dating me, and you being open to it now makes me wonder why you said no then and i f you really are attracted to me now.' that lays out your thought process and hints at the vulnerability that lies underneath. It could work. You might BOTH be being self-protective. That might be enough frank vulnerability to indicate you're looking for something real and not to hurt nor be hurt.

Listen to yoursel f about whether that's a good idea with this person.

Lol. You think she might not be healthy to date? That's hilarious. Where did you get that idea? From the fact that she's 44 and still single? From the fact that she falls for guys who are the same type as her father? From the fact that she says "No" to every single advance?

I have no idea where you got the idea that she might not be healthy. SMH.

Still, I'm not the most normal person I know, either.

I'm interested in her because she's incredibly easy to be around (for eight hours, AFAIK*) and she's pretty and she's funny. But I'm also pretty sure she has some serious problems when it comes to trust and relationships. I've thought about this a lot, which is why I'm taking a laissez-faire approach to future contacts with her. I'm not running away, but I'm done chasing her. If she wants to go out again, I'll go out with her, but I'm going to be very, very cautious.

Your advice about being open with her is really good. Thanks.

*

The only time I was with her that I saw a red flag was when I was helping her locate a rumbling noise in her car (not on the date). I had driven it to an open parking lot and was under the car looking for loose brake parts or play in the universal joint, and she's standing next to the car, bitching about something instead of being grateful that I'm helping her. It wasn't a big deal; it was more like one of those windows which open up during a date, where the woman is rude to the waiter and you're picturing yourself as the waiter in twenty years.
This woman is ESI e6, for sure.

ESI's come in three flavors; e4's who are a bit too "Tragic Romantic" for me, e6's who are active and go out and do things but who seem to hold me at arm's length because they trust no one, not even god, and e9's, who are easy to get along with but seem very passive, almost asleep, until they are not.
After living life with my problematic mother, who was violent, narcissistic, cold and selfish, I'm looking for kindness in a woman first. Not someone who is just going to bitch about things not being perfect.