Democratic Presidential Debate

[xerx]

Not anymore.

LOL. Yeah, there's still an incentive and drive to assimilate.

That's a retcon adaptation borne from the 20th century, contemporaneous with the 1965 Immigration Act. Has little to do with what America's historical character had been 200-300 years prior.

The biggest migrant wave started in the 19th century when the circle of racial acceptability grew from Anglosaxon to encompass the other races of Europe. The continued growth of that circle and the shedding of ignorance about other races isn't a retcon and is wholly precedential.

[mfckrz]

LOL. Yeah, there's still an incentive and drive to assimilate.

You don't live here, how would you know?

The biggest migrant wave started in the 19th century when the circle of racial acceptability grew from Anglosaxon to encompass the other races of Europe. The continued growth of that circle and the shedding of ignorance about other races isn't a retcon and wholly precedential.

No, we're now living in the midst of the largest wave of immigration.

[xerx]

You don't live here, how would you know?

How do you know what's going on?? Don't tell me your personal anecdotes are evidence-worthy. Besides, everyone watches American media (which includes blogs/vlogs) and is familiar with the outlines of the situation. But that's beside the point, because the idea that historically unequal people don't have an incentive to be considered equals is exceptionally stupid.

No, we're now living in the midst of the largest wave of immigration.

The 1860s-1920s wave was fucking huge and significantly changed the character of the country; the world didn't end, a porthole to hell didn't open up on Ellis Island, and America experienced a golden age as the world's dominant culture as a direct result.

[mfckrz]

How do you know what's going on?? Don't tell me your personal anecdotes are evidence-worthy. Besides, everyone watches American media (which includes blogs/vlogs) and is familiar with the outlines of the situation.

It's a skin-in-game issue. The entire tract of reasoning is unmoored from any real stakes.

Ceteris paribus, people who don't live in the US can't be expected to form epistemically coherent opinions about the US.

But that's beside the point, because the idea that historically unequal people don't have an incentive to be considered equals is exceptionally stupid.

No longer the case when identity politics is in vogue.

The 1860s-1920s wave was fucking huge and significantly changed the character of the country; the world didn't end, a porthole to hell didn't open up on Ellis Island, and America experienced a golden age as the world's dominant culture as a direct result.

The 1965-Present wave is now bigger than that, and shows no signs of decelerating anytime soon.

[xerx]

It's a skin-in-game issue. The entire tract of reasoning is unmoored from any real stakes.

Ceteris paribus, people who don't live in the US can't be expected to form epistemically coherent opinions about the US.

No longer the case when identity politics is in vogue.

The 1965-Present wave is now bigger than that, and shows no signs of decelerating anytime soon.

Regarding your first point: lolwut??? Then stop having "epistemically incoherent" opinions about anything that you're not personally involved in: like immigration to Europe.

Regarding identity politics: not sure how you measured what's in vogue, but judging from the Internet, a chunk of practitioners of identity politics are White identitarians who can't stand the sight of Black people. When Black seperatism becomes Bernie Sanders' platform (it won't), then you'd be right to invoke Leftist identity politics as a threat to the melting pot idea.

Regarding migration: no, the 19th century wave was bigger. By 1920, only 45% of Americans were ethnically British or German -- down from 90% in the mid 19th century.

[mfckrz]

Regarding your first point: lolwut??? Then stop having "epistemically incoherent" opinions about anything that you're not personally involved in: like immigration to Europe.

Funny… since I've only been talking about contemporary US immigration trends with you.

Regarding identity politics: not sure how you measured what's in vogue, but the main practitioners of identity politics are White identitarians who can't stand the sight of Black people. When Black seperatism becomes Bernie Sanders' platform (it won't), then you'd be right to invoke identity politics as a threat to the melting pot idea.

Lol, it's in vogue for everyone.

Regarding migration: no, the 19th century wave was bigger. By 1920, only 45% of Americans were ethnically British or German -- down from 90% in the mid 19th century.

Raw % foreign-born is at parity w/ C19th wave, will soon exceed it.

[xerx]

Funny… since I've only been talking about contemporary US immigration trends with you.

You literally talked with someone else about Europe a few posts ago.

Lol, it's in vogue for everyone.

Absolutely not. If anybody's proposing straight-up racial segregation, it isn't the side that celebrates mixed-race couples; not by any stretch of the imagination.

Raw % foreign-born is at parity w/ C19th wave, will soon exceed it.

Absolutely not. Non-Hispanic whites make up about 60%, which is blatantly not at parity with 45%. Even if it were, so what? You have yet to present me with compelling evidence that the society won't stay the same or become better as a result.