Incels

[The Reality Denialist]

OK, I'm going to start my own *cel movement. It will be called natcels.

Nat stands for natural. Our life philosophy is that our biological nature tries to trick us to procreate. We want to be one step ahead of the curve and show the nature who's the boss and not the weakling cuck who is submissive towards their unnecessary biological needs.

[lkdhf qkb]

Incel thought seems to be some kind of compensatory narcissism, where instead of taking responsability for feelings of loneliness or inadequacy, the incel starts to blame the other sex in an attempt to regain value in his own eyes. It's based on a refusal to deal with any kind of feelings of worthlessness, so the incel tries to revenge himself by disapproving others.

As always, refusal to see reality for what it is (= loneliness, isolation, feelings of unattractiveness and disapproval that we all feel at one moment or another) only leads to more suffering.

I once asked a girl on a date and she was like "Stop mansplaining me my feelings, you should be ashamed" when I told her I wanted to know if this was going somewhere or not. She mixed both femcel/feminazi thought, and I hope for her she'll change at some point.

[maniac]

boys who cant accept that the patriarchy is dying and its residue belief that women owe you sex. you also have to have some level of narcissism to be an incel. blaming the world for women not sleeping with you PUA culture is in the same league - stratregies to get women. how about you instead try to make actual meaningful connections and see women as equals who have other things to offer you than to sleep with you or be your girlfriend?

[The Reality Denialist]

Maybe it is just "cool" to get a reason to cry over these things.

Seems like many use incel term as a bait and refuse to accept real meaning. I got attention, ha ha.

[ContractedCriminalboy]

The book No More Mr. Nice Guy gives a great understanding of the incel phenomenon, which is just a more sexually specific form of the Nice Guy phenomenon, and how to resolve it for those who are incels or more broadly, "nice guys".

The extreme form of incel of Eliot Rodgers is more a manifestation of the antisocial personality on the 2nd Dynamic or in other terms, narcissism on sexuality. Those people are an extreme rarity that get more media coverage than needed due to Rodgers and quite frankly just used as boogeymen. You're more likely to run into a genuine man hating SJW, most common form of femcel, than the extreme narcissist incel. I speak from experience, go work a job full of art students and have fun.

[Averroes]

Inceldom is a result of Sx-last (low sex appeal and inability to form spontaneous emotional connections with women) and narcissism (entitlement and validation-seeking)

[The Reality Denialist]

Inceldom is a result of Sx-last (low sex appeal and inability to form spontaneous emotional connections with women) and narcissism (entitlement and validation-seeking)

Eh, if I understand inceldom right it is not about the neglect.Wouldn't the behavior related to asexual manifestations be closer to this?

[Minde]

This Twitter account is like watching a proverbial train wreck: Incel pickup lines https://twitter.com/incelReplies


And then there's this article: The rise of lonely, single men https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/b...ely-single-men

[VewyScawwyNawcissist]

Damage to brain parts in frontal lobe results in narcissism, hypersexuality, poor perception of reality, distirted thinking. Impulsivity and agression. Those brain parts shrink with abuse trauma and neglect

[DogOfDanger]

Isn't every person that's celibate involuntarily so? So what is the difference between and incel and a celibate...?
One of the few nice things about becoming an old man .... is you're much less dependent on social / female validation of this kind. I do feel for young men growing up in this social climate, though. You can't even support yourself until you're in your mid/late 20s, assuming you do everything right, which... only the children of narcissistic abusers do everything right. And regardless it's very hard to connect as everyone is just working toward their goals, moving from one place to another, and staying in their homes.
The culture is either not worth being involved with, or it is dead entirely...
So I don't think I want to mock young men these days by calling them incels when the world is really such a crappy place and the cards are stacked against them. But I would tell them to rise to the challenge.... and try to stay away from video games...
Another important thing is... not to choose the wrong women. Go after the decent ones - learn to recognize character in women, see a little past looks. Usually the most attractive women are the most narcissistic... be wary.

[adage]

Isn't every person that's celibate involuntarily so?

Nope.
They're called volcels.

[Aquamarine]

Isn't every person that's celibate involuntarily so?

No, why do you think this?

[DogOfDanger]

No, why do you think this?

I don't really take the things people say about themselves at face value. Because people engage in all kinds of denial mechanisms and are constantly coming to know themselves. Embracing your conditions when you have no choice doesn't mean you've voluntarily chosen them, but that's something people will say to themselves to come to terms with the conditions.
For a person to really be a voicel... they'd need to have enough opportunity and yet choose to be celibate in spite of that. Assuming the person isn't doing this for religious reasons... I am skeptical. And something tells me the people that claim this identity are looking for a more dignified way to identify themselves than as an 'incel'. But I'd prefer to just call them celibates since I think the name 'incel' is really kind of a derogatory sexual slur.

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

When really self-entitlement ain't gonna get me off
So that's why you finish last
Yeah, you complain that you're a nice guy
What, you think I'm dumb?
Passive-aggressive doesn't seem or look attractive
So I guess you're all on your lonesome

And, baby, boys like you can't usually fuck with me
They try their best and find they're shit out of luck with me
And 'cause of this they'll go and scream that it's misandry
So you're a little bit too much for me

[Aquamarine]

I don't really take the things people say about themselves at face value. Because people engage in all kinds of denial mechanisms and are constantly coming to know themselves. Embracing your conditions when you have no choice doesn't mean you've voluntarily chosen them, but that's something people will say to themselves to come to terms with the conditions.
For a person to really be a voicel... they'd need to have enough opportunity and yet choose to be celibate in spite of that. Assuming the person isn't doing this for religious reasons... I am skeptical. And something tells me the people that claim this identity are looking for a more dignified way to identify themselves than as an 'incel'. But I'd prefer to just call them celibates since I think the name 'incel' is really kind of a derogatory sexual slur.

Ah, I asked because your previous statement seemed to be going off the basis that everyone wants sex which is not the case and would mean that some people are celibate because they don't want it even when they have the opportunity to.

Also I might be referring to something different. But yea I understand being skeptical of that term since I've never seen anyone who genuinely wanted to be celibate refer to themselves as a volcel.

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

I don't really take the things people say about themselves at face value. Because people engage in all kinds of denial mechanisms and are constantly coming to know themselves. Embracing your conditions when you have no choice doesn't mean you've voluntarily chosen them, but that's something people will say to themselves to come to terms with the conditions.
For a person to really be a voicel... they'd need to have enough opportunity and yet choose to be celibate in spite of that. Assuming the person isn't doing this for religious reasons... I am skeptical. And something tells me the people that claim this identity are looking for a more dignified way to identify themselves than as an 'incel'. But I'd prefer to just call them celibates since I think the name 'incel' is really kind of a derogatory sexual slur.

Thanks for this. I finally understand the reason some people (you are definitely one of them) assume the worst about others, jump to judgments, etc: paranoia combined with the inability to read people well, which is overcompensated for with overgeneralizations. Cannot read people well, thus do not read on a case by case, individual basis; instead, groups people together in a way that assumes negative so that false positives do not present (it is "safer" for you for false negatives to present)....

probably 6 sp shit...and not gamma or alpha, either beta or delta because those are aristocratic/group minded instead of individualistic.

I can finally stop taking such misjudgments personally. It's nothing I did, it's just that some people suck at reading others. Huh. Seems so obvious, in hindsight.

[VewyScawwyNawcissist]

the mentalities they exclaim are held by a lot of people. same logic as shitty parents thinking children owe them. most people dont exclaim those mentalities on internet forum but they are real and they live by them. andrew tate is not even an incel but his mentality is incel. most people have incel mentality. it varies to what they think but they are still wrong in a way that just breaks relationships

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

It's 2022 and most "incels" are still just memeing because it's fun to be edgy online when you're a teenage/young adult lonely internet addict

I don't see what's "fun" about being edgy. Either you are or you aren't, and most people who are, aren't well-liked or appreciated. Moreso targeted, made fun of, misunderstood, etc. That goes for anyone who stands out or has their own voice in any way. Not being just like everyone else, part of the crowd of little sheeple who are too cowardly to be individualists. Being "edgy" makes you walk alone, and most people lack the strength, courage, and ability to be authentic.

[DogOfDanger]

Ah, I asked because your previous statement seemed to be going off the basis that everyone wants sex which is not the case and would mean that some people are celibate because they don't want it even when they have the opportunity to.

Also I might be referring to something different. But yea I understand being skeptical of that term since I've never seen anyone who genuinely wanted to be celibate refer to themselves as a volcel.

Everyone does want sex, billions of years of evolution has ensured this... people who are very old may be the exception, but a person cannot just decide to will away their basic instincts, you can insist that you have done this all you like, your instincts are unaffected... instinct will win that tug of war. ... people like to believe their conscious is in the drivers seat but the preponderance of evidence indicates otherwise ...

Thanks for this. I finally understand the reason some people (you are definitely one of them) assume the worst about others, jump to judgments, etc: paranoia combined with the inability to read people well, which is overcompensated for with overgeneralizations. Cannot read people well, thus do not read on a case by case, individual basis; instead, groups people together in a way that assumes negative so that false positives do not present (it is "safer" for you for false negatives to present)....

It is a pretty mainstream line of thought in psychology that the instincts cannot merely be willed away, and when so repressed will only surge up again in a big, deferred way - the idea that the unconscious & the instincts rule the conscious is one of the fundamental ones in psychoanalysis - to claim this is based on nothing but mere "paranoia" is just a stupid comment. And why would this be assuming the worst? What is so bad about sex, exactly...? It sounds like you need to better distinguish between sex as a biological act and sex as a cultural practice. There is a reason that you have organs for this... you may not want sex as its practiced in the culture, or imposed onto you by others, but this is still just a conscious attitude that applies in the particular cultural context, your biology remains unchanged and if you repress it hard enough it will resurface in deferred ways - that much we can count on.
The assumption is simply that, when in conflict, instinct mostly prevails over conscious will, the conscious will can channel things but not fundamentally alter them. Whether this is good or bad is a question of your perspective.

TBH if you haven't noticed this contradiction in will / behavior in human beings by now you are indeed horrible at reading people.

probably 6 sp shit...and not gamma or alpha, either beta or delta because those are aristocratic/group minded instead of individualistic.

Well this is just abstract, confused babble. Socionics tends to make people do this... Ironic in light of the fact you're claiming I'm "negatively overgeneralizing".

Keep trying

[EIE H]

This is an example of a zone that people go towards but it's most likely leading them to somewhere they don't wanna be in like I said on the chat box earlier. You get something but you lose sight of the actual goal

I kinda don't understand the "ugly-average people don't get love" but maybe the game they're playing is more rooted on typical external qualities anyway. So of course if want a very pretty woman, what can you offer to match that? Need to look alpha or be rich. You play the game of "I give you this, you give me that". But in many small local chill spaces that's not how it works.

But maybe like before someone will tell me I'm not even aware of the whole thing so I shouldn't have a say because I do not have a penis (... or do I? ⊙_⊙ )

Ugly people fuck all the time. Ugly incels just have extremely unrealistic expectations and get mad when the world doesn’t bend over for them. That said, I think a lot of incels are fairly physically attractive but have highly repellent attitudes/personalities.

[EIE H]

Random aside, I have met some extremely attractive men who have awkward AF personalities and struggle with women. People joke that those men are incels so it can be used as an empty insult.

[Averroes]

Random aside, I have met some extremely attractive men who have awkward AF personalities and struggle with women. People joke that those men are incels so it can be used as an empty insult.

They probably have low sex appeal. There’s a world of a difference between being handsome/cute/well put-together and being hot/sexy/fine

[EIE H]

A lot of them are either very cocky or insecure which can detract from the sex appeal.

[Lord Pixel]

my theory about dudes that are incels/chads/red pill and black pill is that, red pill doctrine is mostly Se/Ti/Te and the believers are mostly 1D in Se and/or Fe. so that'd put LII, ILI, IEI, LSI, SLI and EII as the majority of the incel population. Chads are the 3 to 4 D Se or Te valuers, and black pill is mostly Se/Ti in doctrine and almost purely Ti in belief, most the population in black pill is probably LII and LSI.

[DogOfDanger]

I've seen a woman stay with a violent alcoholic who didn't work for 18 years and took well over 2 million dollars from her elderly mother / family in that time... I lived with them briefly (had nowhere else to stay), the guy would wake me up at 3:30AM on work days screaming "FUUUUCKK" at the top of his lungs after he had died on call of duty, or shooting his AR15 imitation pellet gun at 3 in the morning.
They had a kid together.. they never sent the kid to school... they made the kid do all the house cleaning and would scream at this kid in the most aggressive, domineering way if the kid didn't do all the chores. The house was a wreck... They also had a bunch of dogs that spent their entire lives in cages. We called child / animal protective services but nothing materialized...
2 years back the guy was caught with possession of hundreds of child pornography photos, admitted it to the police... but the woman still didn't leave him. Instead she manipulated her mother into paying tens of thousands for a lawyer to defend him... her elderly mother (an extremely weak, easily manipulated woman) was now working nightshift as a nurse to pay their bills, was having frequent mini-strokes where she'd forget her name, what year it was, and everything that had happened to her.
This woman argued with me that a virus had downloaded and saved all these child pornography images to the guys thumb drive, which he then hid in his backpack, and that he admitted it because he was confused that they were talking about something else.
Anyway, he was convicted and is now serving a 6 year sentence...

I tell this story as an extreme example of just how low some women actually go in dating / staying with scum human beings.

I've known 2 women that allowed their boyfriends to pimp them out for meth money...
I know another woman, a close friend, who was chased out of the state she was living in by her boyfriend. He had shot a hole in the wall next to her with a handgun. He had also wrecked her car at 80MPH while drinking & almost killed them both...
I had the privilege of speaking to him - he was leaving harassing messages on her facebook page. He had absolutely no respect..
But 3 minutes later, after I had told him to fuck off, she was messaging him and they were making up / getting along wonderfully.

When I see women do this it annoys me and I look down on them, but I see it frequently.

[The Reality Denialist]

Everyone does want sex, billions of years of evolution has ensured this... people who are very old may be the exception, but a person cannot just decide to will away their basic instincts, you can insist that you have done this all you like, your instincts are unaffected... instinct will win that tug of war. ... people like to believe their conscious is in the drivers seat but the preponderance of evidence indicates otherwise ...

I don't think this is true. Just nudge your neurotransmitters to a different direction and see how your desires (including non sexual) change radically.

[DogOfDanger]

I don't think this is true. Just nudge your neurotransmitters to a different direction and see how your desires (including non sexual) change radically.

Eh, attitudes like this make sense to the conscious mind, to the instincts this is just an attempt to further repress them... and they'll well up more strongly in ways that are more deferred. While people deny this the fact is the numbers on porn support it, in studies on the topic it's hard to find anyone that hasn't used it within the past week, the rare people who don't use it have girlfriends / wives.
Nature has seen to it that the only solution is to get out there and be dating... This requires being social, and this is really where people get hung up. In the US alot of the ability / inability to do this successfully really just comes down to social / cultural dominance of various tribes. It's either this or you can find a niche where you belong... a good solution but takes some effort and luck.
It also helps alot to be near the middle of the IQ bell curve, at gaps larger than 20 points you run into communication barriers...

[on a peaceful hiatus]

A lot of them are either very cocky or insecure which can detract from the sex appeal.

Yeah I think it's often a character flaw. Yes physical attraction matters for a lot of people, but if you don't look that good and on top of that you have a shitty, bitter personality, why would anyone wanna be around you? Plenty of average people have attractive partners because they have something else to offer like humour or kindness

[The Reality Denialist]

Eh, attitudes like this make sense to the conscious mind, to the instincts this is just an attempt to further repress them... and they'll well up more strongly in ways that are more deferred. While people deny this the fact is the numbers on porn support it, in studies on the topic it's hard to find anyone that hasn't used it within the past week, the rare people who don't use it have girlfriends / wives.
Nature has seen to it that the only solution is to get out there and be dating... This requires being social, and this is really where people get hung up. In the US alot of the ability / inability to do this successfully really just comes down to social / cultural dominance of various tribes. It's either this or you can find a niche where you belong... a good solution but takes some effort and luck.
It also helps alot to be near the middle of the IQ bell curve, at gaps larger than 20 points you run into communication barriers...

It is not the individual. There is no requirement in biology that dictates that all individuals need to procreate. The unit itself can function in different ways in order to support survival of the species.

[FreelancePoliceman]

Unrelated to the thread but how do I, a mid-20s woman, exactly nudge my neurotransmitters to not wake up every day and think of babies

Can someone give me specific, bullet by bullet instructions

Why don't you get one?

[FreelancePoliceman]

If I don’t have to spend on it sure

Your desire for children isn't pure enough.

[FreelancePoliceman]

Hey, being pure is not always the right choice

In this case though?

[The Reality Denialist]

Unrelated to the thread but how do I, a mid-20s woman, exactly nudge my neurotransmitters to not wake up every day and think of babies

Can someone give me specific, bullet by bullet instructions

LOL. Accept that you are doomed to push out babies. Seriously, I think there might be a magic bullet for it but... why should you change it? Sometimes I wish that my craving for sugar would be lower but... dang it it would change something else too and I wouldn't like it. I have done enough experimentation.

[DogOfDanger]

It is not the individual. There is no requirement in biology that dictates that all individuals need to procreate. The unit itself can function in different ways in order to support survival of the species.

This peripheral support argument only shows a weak effect, it exists but it wouldn't prevent the kind of selection and evolution we're talking about. It doesn't deincentivize sexual reproduction since the two aren't really mutually exclusive, you can protect others kids while still having your own... One mechanism directly propagates your genes, with the other you're supporting other peoples kids if they're in danger, or possibly increasing their opportunities... they have to be in danger, you have to be the one that makes the difference in their survival or successful reproduction, ... these things must occur otherwise there is no effect. And you're only protecting some of your genes... it is a much weaker effect...

[Tallmo]

Seems like a serious case of Anima gone bad. Some incels want the state to provide sex to them. A development of the wellfare state. Paradise. That's poorly differentiated Anima. Back-to-the-womb mentality. The way forward is to develop yourself instead and become conscious of your life. I'm not saying that it's easy but everyone has to find his progressive process in his life, regardless of how much life sucks.

[timber]

Okay so incels is just a new word for "virgins"?

lmao.

[timber]

I missed out on the incel movement, aged out just before it happened.

I do think a lot of red pill stuff is true. Lots of neo-lib types are really leaning into their excuses of why their lives suck. We always reincarnate into the reason of why we hate ourselves (and therefore others).

[The Reality Denialist]

I think that incels are generally societal "losers" who can't get a partner because they don't have the necessary societal skillset. The skillset they're missing tends to be related to confidence/charm or the ability to become successful.

One possible solution to this might be to have some kind of training course that helps people learn how to get a partner. It should be optional, and somehow it'd have to be very successful at teaching them how to acquire the partner that they want. People involved in the training course need to understand and sympathize with the skillsets and plights of the incels.

There will always be "incels" that won't join the training course, simply because they're not desperate enough. I think that those should just be ignored.

I think being a certain kind of loser is strictly different from being an incel. Incel is just one sort of loser.

When I read through their wikis it seems that they have serious problems with perspective taking. Not everyone wants to have sex or find a partner.

[Popcorn]

I think I might be an incel.

[Popcorn]

What kind of sex robot do I get?