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Thread: IEIs-INFps, what does your Si role function look like?

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    Forgetting to brush my teeth in the evening, not feeling thirsty for a whole day every now and then, not wearing rain coats when I should...

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    My Si role function shows itself in me bumping into shit that's right in front of my face.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kadda1212 View Post
    Forgetting to brush my teeth in the evening, not feeling thirsty for a whole day every now and then, not wearing rain coats when I should...
    Sounds like lii

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    One thing I've noticed – and I've talked about this with another IEI and she said she has noticed the same – is that I have trouble telling apart emotions and physical sensations. For instance, I might feel noticeably bad but have trouble telling whether it's because of something I ate or because of something someone said. I was wondering if anyone else had this problem too?

    Other Si role problems I've noticed include ignoring things I probably shouldn't be ignoring like severe pain or ache (unless it's bad enough to make me unable to function normally), sitting in weird postures for prolonged periods of time (and only realizing it was a bad idea when I feel fucking sore afterwards), feeling hungry or tired as hell but not bothering to do shit about it, not being able to tell when I'm full and shouldn't eat any more if I want to avoid feeling sick. And not noticing the temperature and its effect on me! I sometimes sit at home wondering why I feel like crap for hours, and then my ESE brother drops by and the first thing he says is "it's really hot in here, aren't you uncomfortable?" Then he proceeds to open the window and I go, ahhh, how refreshing! Oh, and I eat the same food for like two or three months straight. Goddamn zucchini, kale and kidney beans every single night. Because once I come up with a meal that tastes bearable and satisfies my nutritional needs I sure as hell am going to stick with it for as long as I can get it down my throat without gagging out of sheer boredom. Yup. Can't bother to come up with anything new to eat once something works for me.

    I don't know if it's very usual for Si role but sometimes I'm overly sensitive to sensory stuff. Might have to do with non-type-related sensory defensiveness but sometimes I really flip my shit over minor sensory annoyances such as itchy seams on clothes or small repetitive noises (clocks ticking, other people breathing or stuff like that). Then again my pain tolerance is really high. You can literally drag me around from my hair and the only thing that makes me mad about it is that you're ruining my hairdo. You don't want to end up in a physical fight with me because I'll beat you simply by not reacting to physical pain significantly.
    Last edited by Aivonaima; 12-25-2013 at 12:21 AM.
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    Default IEIs and Si

    The IEIs I know seem to have strong Si. They love order, notice sensations like smell taste looks and are good at providing these sensations. Is this just a manifestation of another function?

    C-EII-INFj 4w3 Sx/sp 479

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    I don't know if its a thing.

    My guess would be that Si is in the super ego and an evaluatory position. Super-ego being that inner voice of the external information and Si fits into role. So however the role usually behaves, and just put Si in that spot.

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    Being good at providing those sensations might be because they are introverts who have a lot of focus on their own sphere of influence and because they are ethicals, are able to just figure out what might feel good for others and experiment with those ideas. Getting feed back fits into their intuitions and they apply those standards next time.

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    Are they harmonizers?
    The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.

    (Jung on Si)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    Are they harmonizers?
    This. Is. It. Thank you!

    C-EII-INFj 4w3 Sx/sp 479

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    "IEIs who have strong " = ISFx
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    Exceptions might be certain enneagram image type (2 or 4) INFx-Fx individuals, but at the end of the day their Si is just 'an act' (especially with IEI-Fe who doesn't value it) and not actually strong.
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    IEI in their natural state without adaptation to societal standards:

    IEI after role adaptation:
    MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
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    I think the role is strong enough and actually useful and somewhat close to your lead. I think it is fairly easy to identify and thus you can copy with your lead. Fi of LSI for example might use their Ti to steer up the Fi and remember from life and earlier how things work.

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    I am this way. IEIs can care a lot about the aesthetics they prefer as part of their desire for elegance. They also may be particular about order and organization because of their Ti hidden agenda. Personally, my mood is easily influenced by my environment. If my surroundings are a mess I feel like a mess too, so for that reason I like to keep on top of my Si tasks. I always do them for a specific purpose, not simply out of routine. I like my spaces to be organized, hygienic and aesthetically pleasing. I do it for myself but also very motivated by the image I project to others. I’m not really able to consistently keep this up especially when I’m stressed or depressed. The biggest thing that gets in the way is my laziness and low energy.

    I wouldn’t say that I’m “good at providing these sensations to others” although I’m not exactly sure what you mean by that. I’m definitely not a caretaker. I get annoyed if I have to clean up after others or dote on them constantly, because I don’t have enough energy for that.

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    A harmonizing iei is going to have terrible si. More energy put into Ni means less into Si.
    Projection is ordinary. Person A projects at person B, hoping tovalidate something about person A by the response of person B. However, person B, not wanting to be an obejct of someone elses ego and guarding against existential terror constructs a personality which protects his ego and maintain a certain sense of a robust and real self that is different and separate from person A. Sadly, this robust and real self, cut off by defenses of character from the rest of the world, is quite vulnerable and fragile given that it is imaginary and propped up through external feed back. Person B is dimly aware of this and defends against it all the more, even desperately projecting his anxieties back onto person A, with the hope of shoring up his ego with salubrious validation. All of this happens without A or B acknowledging it, of course. Because to face up to it consciously is shocking, in that this is all anybody is doing or can do and it seems absurd when you realize how pathetic it is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    A harmonizing iei is going to have terrible si. More energy put into Ni means less into Si.
    An IEI I know that has very good Si is normalizing I think.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fox View Post
    Victor Gulenko says the harmonizing subtype IEI has boosted Si, Ni and Fi.

    for reference:


    Creative: +Ne +Se +Fe
    Dominant: +Se +Te +Fe
    Harmonizing: +Si +Ni +Fi
    Normalizing: +Fi +Ti +Ni





    I'm actually not good at this stuff, I actively have to work at it... for instance, I'm currently talking a medication that makes me eat more because I always forget to eat (I don't notice the sensation of hunger and will go all day without eating). I'm also probably the least organized person I know, lol. I highly doubt anyone with strong Si would forget to eat/drink and allow themselves to live in a messy environment because they would be too aware of their body and their surroundings and the feeling of being uncomfortable.

    I can create the appearance of a put together person though, but it's mostly an allusion for the aesthetic... I actually think this is the case with a lot of IEI because of their Fe creative.

    I also know some IEI who have taken up stuff like cooking as a hobby, but it's usually a briefly lived thing, as they always seem to go back to their regular ways. Like, I knew one who took it up as a hobby for a few years (and he actually got really good at it), but hardly ever cooks for himself now.
    I believe Gulenkos assertion directly contradicts fundamental axioms of socionics and other Socionists assertions on the DCNH. One of them has to be wrong, and I believe his makes much less sense.

    Plus, I'm IEI-H and my Si is pronouncedly worse than my PoLR, though less stressful.
    Projection is ordinary. Person A projects at person B, hoping tovalidate something about person A by the response of person B. However, person B, not wanting to be an obejct of someone elses ego and guarding against existential terror constructs a personality which protects his ego and maintain a certain sense of a robust and real self that is different and separate from person A. Sadly, this robust and real self, cut off by defenses of character from the rest of the world, is quite vulnerable and fragile given that it is imaginary and propped up through external feed back. Person B is dimly aware of this and defends against it all the more, even desperately projecting his anxieties back onto person A, with the hope of shoring up his ego with salubrious validation. All of this happens without A or B acknowledging it, of course. Because to face up to it consciously is shocking, in that this is all anybody is doing or can do and it seems absurd when you realize how pathetic it is.

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    Smell, taste and looks are terms that also have relativistic (N) aspects, and image is very important to IEIs. They often seek security by hiding-behind-walls in a metaphorical sense; order can frequently provide secure walls. IEIs are very adept at using bureaucracy, society and rule-bound people to their own advantage without truly conforming. Only certain bottom-up perspectives can be attributed to Si; it's not a box of items.....
    a.k.a. I/O

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    I don't agree with this characterization of IEIs.

    Even if it was true, order is Ti/Se, not Si. And Si is a lot more than just pleasant sensations, though that is a part of it.
    Last edited by Exodus; 02-14-2018 at 02:51 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    I believe Gulenkos assertion directly contradicts fundamental axioms of socionics and other Socionists assertions on the DCNH. One of them has to be wrong
    there is no basis to assume those DCNH "subtypes" exists at all. it's more other typology than "subtypes"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaebette View Post
    The IEIs I know seem to have strong Si. They love order, notice sensations like smell taste looks and are good at providing these sensations. Is this just a manifestation of another function?
    it's more role skills which they think should to have good enough to impress others
    like my "impressive" shallow joking
    they can be good to some degree by coping others. it's not quantum physics

    also some of those IEI may to have S type

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sol View Post
    there is no basis to assume those DCNH "subtypes" exists at all. it's more other typology than "subtypes"
    But its still more Socionics than it is other typology. Ex. - "Harmonizing boosts Ni, Si, & Fi" or whichever it says. That in of itself denotes itself as supplemental to the Socionics framework. So it should be subject to the same fundamental priniciples.

    Now, exists is a tricky word. If you mean "valid", then yeah sure. But exists is a very lazy word because it usually never is used correctly.
    Projection is ordinary. Person A projects at person B, hoping tovalidate something about person A by the response of person B. However, person B, not wanting to be an obejct of someone elses ego and guarding against existential terror constructs a personality which protects his ego and maintain a certain sense of a robust and real self that is different and separate from person A. Sadly, this robust and real self, cut off by defenses of character from the rest of the world, is quite vulnerable and fragile given that it is imaginary and propped up through external feed back. Person B is dimly aware of this and defends against it all the more, even desperately projecting his anxieties back onto person A, with the hope of shoring up his ego with salubrious validation. All of this happens without A or B acknowledging it, of course. Because to face up to it consciously is shocking, in that this is all anybody is doing or can do and it seems absurd when you realize how pathetic it is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    But its still more Socionics than it is other typology.
    It's not Socionics and it's baseless. And it's other typology as uses the traits which Jung's types have no.

    > Ex. - "Harmonizing boosts Ni, Si, & Fi" or whichever it says.

    It's only an assumption how those traits are linked with the Jung's types.
    There are a lot of stuff besides Jung's types in people by which they can be categorized and their behavior was explained. And that stuff is not Socionics at all.

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    I've noticed I use Si for 100% comfort and that's all.. Like, I'll set a "mood atmosphere" for an entire house & etc.. I will have the curtains "cracked" open, put on some mellow music & relax... That's all

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    I think spas are hell on earth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by silke View Post
    I think spas are hell on earth.
    Sounds like someone needs a forceful massage.
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    I wouldn't say I have bad Si... it's more like... I have selfish and stubborn Si. Like I know better than the dumb ese/lse's who try to tell me I need a sweatshirt or something. No, I need nothing except your silence thank you.

    Alot of my issues with Si are just feeling oppressed by those who constantly think about it.

    I'm probably more likely than other iei's to actually be sei, so don't take my word.

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    I have difficulty knowing how my body feels, e.g, I'd force myself to run until I end up throwing up.

    I don't give a damn about how food tastes like. I can eat plain bread and instant noodles every day, I don't care what I eat as long as I'm able to survive in this world without dying.
    Just don't feed me poison and i'll be fine.

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    They lazy ASF and messy (ILEs messy to so..). but at least Si role is good enough, snack nom-nom


    ILI

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    I wouldn't say I'm unable to understand my bodily needs, just that I easily disassociate from them. Everything in my life is very chaotic, I have pretty much no routine. This goes for eating and sleeping habits as well. "It's like I have a snooze button on my bodily needs.", this was a good way of putting it. I often go for 12+ hours without eating, and once I do eat I eat such bad food it's not even funny. I have periods where I like to splurge excessively, usually on junk food, candy and alcohol. I hate cooking and preparing food. I don't care much for comfort or my surroundings. My apartment is basically a prison cell with no decoration whatsoever. Most of the time it's incredibly messy too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kadda1212 View Post
    Forgetting to brush my teeth in the evening, not feeling thirsty for a whole day every now and then, not wearing rain coats when I should...
    I came

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    Quote Originally Posted by Emily View Post
    , or projecting calm if they're in a heightened state of anxiety. Mirror neurons and all that. I've been told throughout my life that I come off as calming, but don't usually feel that way internally.
    This one.
    Last edited by karas; 01-16-2020 at 01:24 PM.

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    This thread is full of nonsense, and most descriptions of what people claim to be Si-Role are in fact more about Si in other functions.

    Wikisocion has the following description for Si-Role:

    The individual dislikes it when others emphasize the need for relaxation, enjoyment, and activities that are supposed to bring these about, because what they need internally is just the opposite — a need for action and resolve. Rather than spend their time trying to "listen to what their body is telling them," they need to have clear external demands that are able to overcome their sense of uncertainty and hesitation.
    Source: http://www.wikisocion.net/en/index.p...IEI_and_ILI.29

    The essence of the role function is that, when used, the effects are harmful to the individual or their social environment. In the case of IEIs and ILIs, Si-role is not about "lack of awareness of body" etc.etc. but about a kind of laziness and inactivity that ultimately results in all kinds of problems. Totally unlike the Si in SLIs and SEIs: these two types do what needs to be done, so all obligations are met, and than relax. ILIs and IEIs, when using Si, get into a state of inactivity or leisurely play and start to neglect all kinds of external demands, demands that need to be met sooner of later, and therefore get into trouble. As such, the Si-Role function is connected to the Se-suggestive function. What ILIs and IEIs often need, is a proverbial kick-in-the-butt to get them into action. This is, in a sense, what wikisocion also tells us.

    Recently I gave this example of an ILI in need of Se-suggestive:

    https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...=1#post1371552
    Last edited by consentingadult; 01-16-2020 at 03:33 PM.
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    This role function is also called the third function. When a person is actively using his base function, the role function is essentially turned off. The two cannot both be "on" at the same time, because they represent two opposing approaches to similar things. An example of each opposing pair of elements are:

    Si Si vs. Ni Ni: a focus on one's environment and how it's affecting one's physical state vs. a focus on a situation's development over time and other underlying meanings
    Se Se vs. Ne Ne: active acquisition, control, and organization of visible territory and objects vs. active search for and development of invisible potential and emerging situations
    Fi Fi vs. Ti Ti: evaluation according to personal sentiments vs. evaluation according to impersonal laws (mercy vs. justice)
    Fe Fe vs. Te Te: evaluation according to the people/social element involved vs. evaluation according to efficiency, effectiveness or objective reasoning
    Because of this opposition, the more one gets carried away with one's base function, the more the role function is ignored or suppressed. People are generally somewhat aware of this suppression and perceive it as a personal weakness that needs to be "worked on" in order to meet other people's expectations and achieve something in society. It is typical for people to periodically work on their role function in order to correct imbalances in their life and improve their weak areas. However, these attempts are generally sporadic and are forgotten as soon as the perceived problem begins to go away and the person once again becomes carried away with their usual lifestyle which is dominated by their base function. Thus, development of the role function is more like patching up leaks than building a complete, self-sufficient structure. Often individuals wish they could build up their role function and become "supermen", but an excessive focus on this unreachable goal brings disappointment, because the base function always wins anyways.

    When people are criticized for their lack of attentiveness to their role function, they are often irritated because they are already well aware of the deficiency and have already tried and failed to correct it. When problems arise with the role function, energy flows away from the base function, the individual brings his usual activities to a halt, and tries to pick up all the tasks he had been neglecting. Directing energy through the base function is effortless; working with the role function requires effort and concentration. Thus, people's concept of self-development is often centered on development of the role function and the Super-Ego block in general.

    Compared to the vulnerable function, role function criticism is easier for a person to respond to or dismiss, since they believe that it has some value, in theory. The role function is triggered situationally, when individuals are met with situations that oppose their base aspect of reality. The base function only accepts information relating to its information aspect, and other information cannot be produced into new data with the creative function.

    http://www.wikisocion.net/en/index.p...#Role_function

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