Screw duality - I prefer to feel whole without a dual

[BrainlessSquid]

So right now I'm definitely stating why I am going to leave duality for anything other than marriage (or living together)

The worst thing about finding something or someone you really enjoy is that the absence of it in your life makes all the rest seem pointless. Everything you seemed to enjoy becomes second nature and you crave for the other's presence all the time.

It's like I can spend the entire afternoon with her and I never get enough of it, and when I leave it seems that it wasn't enough, and all my energy gets directed at ways to have fun with this person. And I simply forget that I need to work, study, have fun on my own.

I've decided I'm never going to talk to her again because it is just to good to be fit for my life on earth, my body simply was not prepared for such intensity, and I simply can't stand the experience of missing her presence anymore. I prefer to detoxic myself from such a other worldly happiness.

There are too many barriers that could make me live with her that I don't want to discuss, but I won't accept anymore being dependent on someone else to feel whole and alive.

I know this is all drama but I just feel that too good can be BAD and distracting

[Sol]

among all types duality helps the most
- to establish friendship relations and love state
- to shift more of the attention to your weak functions, teaches to improve and use them

also, it's pleasant people (of other sex especially), communications with who may make you feel better

you seem don't understand own type as changed it many types and should mistake significantly in types of other people too. this may prevents you to understand IR, including duality

[BrainlessSquid]

among all types duality helps the most
- to establish friendship relations and love state
- to shift more of the attention to your weak functions, teaches to improve and use them

also, it's pleasant people (of other sex especially), communications with who may make you feel better

you seem don't understand own type as changed it many types and should mistake significantly in types of other people too. this may prevents you to understand IR, including duality

I haven't changed my type for almost 2 years now. I'm pretty sure of my type and of my duals, which are very rare (IxTx women are not very common) I know what good relations are like. I don't really understand what you're trying to convey, you probably haven't read what I wrote

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

I admit in Heterosexual World I don't know many IEE male - SLI female couples. They are all the other way around (IEE female - SLI male) So that maybe part why it's not working out for you?

Duality can be overrated and it shouldn't be idealized- but I think it might be just a sad coping mechanism to think that you can feel whole without your dual. I have this feeling where I feel so spiritually good and loved after I talk to a dual I like. It isn't really sexual or erotic that much- even though I know Betas like to make a lot of pervy jokes etc. It's like such a warm happy balanced whole romantic feeling. So don't give up hope.

And I agree- if you try to dualize with a dual you're not meant to be with for whatever reason- it just seems to cause friction and drama and ur better off not interacting. I think that has a lot to do with the pseudo-type thing @Braingel posted. Some SLEs are LIE-like & try to be my supervisor, and I drop an anvil on them and go the other way when that happens.

That one SLI female on the forum - didn't she die? And the other one I haven't seen her in ages lol. Not that you should use this site as a dating site or anything I just mean - SLI women seem to be on the rare end to me.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

I even have this theory Kurt Cobain offed himself in large part due to being a str8 male IEI in a world where SLE male - IEI female is more common than dirt and the other way around not so much, so the chances of finding happiness is stacked against you.

And yes, Courtney Love was his dual- but it still didn't work out. =( /creates a cloning engineering plant for all the heterosexuals with rare type-gender combinations.

[memory]

this sounds like codependency more than duality.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

Lets say you have something in your life you crave but cannot produce yourself. Then someone comes along and produces this thing that you've craved all along and you produce a thing that they have craved all along as well.

This is the theory of duality in a nutshell.

[Stray Cat]

Lets say you have something in your life you crave but cannot produce yourself. Then someone comes along and produces this thing that you've craved all along and you produce a thing that they have craved all along as well.

This is the theory of duality in a nutshell.

You THINK you can't produce yourself.

[Baqer]

Lets say you have something in your life you crave but cannot produce yourself. Then someone comes along and produces this thing that you've craved all along and you produce a thing that they have craved all along as well.

This is the theory of duality in a nutshell.

duality is just complementary personality traits. there's nothing really being "produced" by either end, just collections of traits that go well together when communicating and interacting.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

duality is just complementary personality traits. there's nothing really being "produced" by either end, just collections of traits that go well together when communicating and interacting.

https://www.the16types.info/vbulletin/content.php/6-Translation-Model-A


Please refer to this for more information.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

You THINK you can't produce yourself.

You can't

[Baqer]

https://www.the16types.info/vbulletin/content.php/6-Translation-Model-A


Please refer to this for more information.

Ya i know about the model A, i just think that idea that somehow "information metabolism" has anything to do with duality is wrong. The Jungian functions are basically completed made up categories that have no obvious links to the human brain, and are more accurately described as clusters of personality traits.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

Ya i know about the model A, i just think that idea that somehow "information metabolism" has anything to do with duality is wrong. The Jungian functions are basically completed made up categories that have no obvious links to the human brain, and are more accurately described as clusters of personality traits.

Won't argue about that. This is just a game were playing. Its not actually real.

There is no scientific basis to justify this theory, its just something to do for fun.

[Stray Cat]

You can't

Bullshit cultism that socionics teaches. Believe that dogshit, be co-dependent, be needy. If you can't use your DS then you're just a sorry pussy who makes excuses

[EUDAEMONIUM]

Bullshit cultism that socionics teaches. Believe that dogshit, be co-dependent, be needy. If you can't use your DS then you're just a sorry pussy who makes excuses

cringe

[Stray Cat]

cringe

Cringe all you want. Apparently fear suits you

[Stray Cat]

If you think you're "needy" for a cognitive function, you will be even if it isn't actually true.

[rose]

If you think you're "needy" for a cognitive function, you will be even if it isn't actually true.

That's what I dislike most about socionics, this idea of "needing" someone else to fill in your weak spots.
I have met caregiver women who were sick of caring for infantiles who really just acted like stupid kids, duality or not, it all went to hell in the end.
Some people really use it to be blind and act like little morons who refuse to see beyond the walls they put up for themselves. Of course, we are all in this life together, helping each other's gonna happen and is necessary for growth, it's this stagnation, this resignation to be unable to help yourself because "I'm that type" that I can't stand.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

If you think you're "needy" for a cognitive function, you will be even if it isn't actually true.

That's what I dislike most about socionics, this idea of "needing" someone else to fill in your weak spots.
I have met caregiver women who were sick of caring for infantiles who really just acted like stupid kids, duality or not, it all went to hell in the end.
Some people really use it to be blind and act like little morons who refuse to see beyond the walls they put up for themselves. Of course, we are all in this life together, helping each other's gonna happen and is necessary for growth, it's this stagnation, this resignation to be unable to help yourself because "I'm that type" that I can't stand.

@Stray Cat @flowers and sugar

I agree that you shouldn't take your "weak" functions as an excuse to be bad at something. I also think that socionics does not view people in a very dynamic way. People can grow and become better. So you shouldn't see your suggestive functions as weaknesses that you are desperate to rely on others for.

If an ILE can't brush his teeth or go to bed on time and blames his bad Si and never tries to improve, that's not good.

Many women nowadays are doing better than their boyfriends and I've seen a lot of them get stuck with loser boyfriends that never want to grow up. Socionics shouldn't be used as an excuse.

But if you agree that you can get better at a function then who else would be better to help you do that than your dual?

You dual can help you get better at a lot of things even your superego functions. It doesn't have to be a romantic relationship either. It can be a platonic friendship or a professional one. It could be a teacher or coach.

My point is you don't need socionics to justify why you need other people to help you become better, but it does work theory wise.

[Stray Cat]

@Stray Cat @flowers and sugar

I agree that you shouldn't take your "weak" functions as an excuse to be bad at something. I also think that socionics does not view people in a very dynamic way. People can grow and become better. So you shouldn't see your suggestive functions as weaknesses that you are desperate to rely on others for.

If an ILE can't brush his teeth or go to bed on time and blames his bad Si and never tries to improve, that's not good.

Many women nowadays are doing better than their boyfriends and I've seen a lot of them get stuck with loser boyfriends that never want to grow up. Socionics shouldn't be used as an excuse.

But if you agree that you can get better at a function then who else would be better to help you do that than your dual?

You dual can help you get better at a lot of things even your superego functions. It doesn't have to be a romantic relationship either. It can be a platonic friendship or a professional one. It could be a teacher or coach.

My point is you don't need socionics to justify why you need other people to help you become better, but it does work theory wise.

I basically agree but sometimes my "dual" will say a tidbit that's inspiring while the rest is fantasy hog piss.

Socionics suggests a person, or a dual, compliments. It's the function, not the person, which compliments. Cause of that, its wise to be responsible for your own cognitive development

[EUDAEMONIUM]

It's not impossible to disagree with someone just because they happen to be your dual.

But yes you should not be overreliant on others for your own mental health and personal development.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

Knowing that you have tried to jump to an ILI immediately I would think that you are just a person with commitment issues megatrop.

Are you talking about me? If so what do you mean?

[Beautiful sky]

You are a whole person! It’s just that you and your dual see the opposite sides of the street

[EUDAEMONIUM]

It was under my message, I didn't know what a megatrop was. If you want to reach out to someone you can use the @ sign before their username so they know you're talking to them.
@one like this

[MissDucki]

Duality isn’t the end all be all. It’s not going to save anything. If you are not a healthy, mature, and grown person and neither is your partner, duality an isnt going to save it. You can live a full and happy life without your dual. Though ihn, having a mature dual in your corner that loves you and tries is a nice feeling. Not every dual is going to work out and you can’t just expect that your dual is going to take care out it. I think people start overusing theory or rely to heavily on it. They forget the human aspect. Just whatever works for you in the end.

[lkdhf qkb]

I agree with you for the most part, but those kind of nagging comments are really BS:

Many women nowadays are doing better than their boyfriends and I've seen a lot of them get stuck with loser boyfriends that never want to grow up

Since when are relationships a competition?

Like first you date someone you can't respect, and then you resent him for it? Grow up girl, and learn responsability for your choice or leave. No one's "stuck". People only change because they want, not because of some "caregiving". Men are not some pet project that you can resent when he fails misplaced expectations. Why would any guy want to hear that shit just because he didn't get enough sleep?

Men gets "stuck" with less ambitious wife = "nice, he's got a trophy wife"
Women gets "stuck" with less ambitious guy = "oooof, he's a looser"

Nice crispy double standards! Cheap! Cheap!

[EUDAEMONIUM]

I agree with you for the most part, but those kind of nagging comments are really BS:



Since when are relationships a competition?

Like first you date someone you can't respect, and then you resent him for it? Grow up girl, and learn responsability for your choice or leave. No one's "stuck". People only change because they want, not because of some "caregiving". Men are not some pet project that you can resent when he fails misplaced expectations. Why would any guy want to hear that shit just because he didn't get enough sleep?

Men gets "stuck" with less ambitious wife = "nice, he's got a trophy wife"
Women gets "stuck" with less ambitious guy = "oooof, he's a looser"

Nice crispy double standards! Cheap! Cheap!

I think you are mostly having a problem with my language.

By "better" I mean making more money, its not that they are better for making money but if you have bills to pay and only one person is contributing it can put a stress on the relationship.

By "stuck" I'm saying they are stuck with someone, that is from my pov. I agree they can leave and they don't, to me they're stuck with a loser.

So what I'll say is there is always a part to play in a relationship. If someone sits around and does nothing all day that person is a loser, plain and simple.

[lkdhf qkb]

By "better" I mean making more money, its not that they are better for making money but if you have bills to pay and only one person is contributing it can put a stress on the relationship.

Makes sense.

By "stuck" I'm saying they are stuck with someone, that is from my pov. I agree they can leave and they don't, to me they're stuck with a loser.

So what I'll say is there is always a part to play in a relationship. If someone sits around and does nothing all day that person is a loser, plain and simple.

So then maybe they are not stuck from their point of view? You just have different standards for a partner and would be unhappy with someone like that.

You're so gamma(right?). I like doing nothing honestly, why run around like a headless chicken?(Se) But yea you got to contribute and work as a team in a relationship.

[lkdhf qkb]

Sorry I derailed the thread btw

I think in any relationship, duality or not, it's important to stay independent and if the experience feels too much like a loss of autonomy and too intense, then maybe you didn't find the right distance to each other.

Megatrop are you both sx doms?

[BrainlessSquid]

Sorry I derailed the thread btw

I think in any relationship, duality or not, it's important to stay independent and if the experience feels too much like a loss of autonomy and too intense, then maybe you didn't find the right distance to each other.

Megatrop are you both sx doms?

I think so, but I'm not a fan of this theory.
What does that mean to you?

[lkdhf qkb]

I'm not sure I can explain well since I'm still trying to understand how those instincts work in myself. Those instincts and the order they are in can dictate what you're looking for in life. You've been describing that you've been so concentrated on those intense merging experiences from your sexual instinct, that your self-preservation instinct(which is about being able to provide for yourself) was being endangered. It's like a struggle between sx and sp that is common in sp/sx and sx/sp stackings.

From what I get, when someone is sx-first, the first reflex in a relationship can be to obsess and crave intimacy. To such a degree that other needs like self-preservation or the social circle can be neglected. I've read that sx/sp and sp/sx people can get easily drained by sp-last people because the first person needs to focus on themselves but not the second.

[skosh]

That's what I dislike most about socionics, this idea of "needing" someone else to fill in your weak spots.
I have met caregiver women who were sick of caring for infantiles who really just acted like stupid kids, duality or not, it all went to hell in the end.
Some people really use it to be blind and act like little morons who refuse to see beyond the walls they put up for themselves. Of course, we are all in this life together, helping each other's gonna happen and is necessary for growth, it's this stagnation, this resignation to be unable to help yourself because "I'm that type" that I can't stand.

Worst, those "infantiles" are often stuck taking care of "caregivers."

[lkdhf qkb]

Worst, those "infantiles" are often stuck taking care of "caregivers."

This. "Caregivers"(and dynamics in general) can sometimes take Fi/Ti care for granted.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

I was thinking about this more and more and I think I might have an issue with duality after all. I have always thought that people shouldn't use socionics to choose a partner.

But I think there is something wrong with the idea of duality, which is an inherent problem with socionics.

I think people in this system are seen as a sequence of blocks of information that fits (or doesn't fit) with other blocks of information.

I think this is a very flat view of personality and humanity in general.

It's not crazy to say that everyone has different experiences and skills even within the same type.

I think people should take it for what it is and even a conflicting type could still be an excellent partner it just depends on the people involved and what they need in a partner.

[Rebelondeck]

........dependent on someone else to feel whole and alive......

No relationship will make a person feel whole and alive; that onus is on each individual. Duality under the right set of circumstances could be helpful to cognitive thinking and partnership adaptation but that's where it ends. Some dual couples can have more miserable lives with one another than non-dual; imagine your dual becoming a criminal, a gambler, an addict or abusive. Duality shouldn't be oversold because it's only one factor and not the most important one.

a.k.a. I/O

[Stray Cat]

I was thinking about this more and more and I think I might have an issue with duality after all. I have always thought that people shouldn't use socionics to choose a partner.

But I think there is something wrong with the idea of duality, which is an inherent problem with socionics.

I think people in this system are seen as a sequence of blocks of information that fits (or doesn't fit) with other blocks of information.

I think this is a very flat view of personality and humanity in general.

It's not crazy to say that everyone has different experiences and skills even within the same type.

I think people should take it for what it is and even a conflicting type could still be an excellent partner it just depends on the people involved and what they need in a partner.

Socionic theory inspire laziness, suggesting being with a dual would require minimal work. Imo, dual relationship psychological differences are resolved easier. Your dual is a guardian. In effect, even if you were involved in criminal activity your dual could somewhat decipher your motivation.

I don't believe any of that means duals will agree on things as understanding & agreement are different things. Optimal relationships, ime, require genuine agreement