Btw I actually think that sometimes 'sharing a number or especially MORE than one number in the tritype' can actually lead to an unhealthy relationship (but maybe a high amount of initial attraction!)..you can be 'too' similar'. I think this depends on your socionics type and your enneagram instincts.
It could be a good thing or a bad thing!
I know of three female LIEs who are in relationships.Originally Posted by Scarlett
Hahah, of course, don't worry. There's so many things matter more than personality types.
Anyway.
I also see in a dual couple, usually the male is a T, and the female is an F.
Kinda like those traditional pairings with traditional gender stereotypes, you know.
There you go again, male LIE and female ESI.
If the female is a T, they usually go for their semi-dual or mirage partner.
The first is a woman about 60 who used to run a division of GE. Her first husband called her “Sledge”, short for sledgehammer. I like her, but I can understand why she might get a nickname like that. Her second husband is LSI and she seems happier with him, but if she has any reservations, she wouldn’t share them with me. She might not admit them to herself.
The second is my niece and she is ex-military, and she and her partner have adopted two kids. I don’t know what her partner’s type is, but I don’t think she is her Dual.
The third is a woman who manages a hotel. She has two kids by a common-law SEE husband whom she met when she was 17. She is now 36 and she wants nothing to do with him and kicked him out because all he does is party and he contributes nothing to the family except empty promises.
She has a terrific relationship with the owner of the hotel, who is a female ESI-Fi, married to a male ILI. I showed the female LIE some pictures of male ESIs, and she said, “Ewww. Not them.”
Relationships are hard.
Lol. The problem is, I might not like them.
I'm serious though. Let's go with 145 and 135 first. Both are enneagram 1. I dislike e-1.
Seems like when you're e-8 you're someone who likes to be in charge and loves challenges, you would hate a perfectionist e-1. It's just they contradict with each other. Sooner or later you will realise it's not gonna work.
The 459? Hell to the no.
This is tripple withdrawn. The most socially withdrawn tritype I believe. They have the least amount of energy, easily drained by external environment.
And the 359? This. Is. Actually "my type". My LSI and LII ex's they're all this tritype. The LSI that I told you I'm often attracted to, they're mostly e5, tritype 593.
Anyway.
If we're talking about socionic dual, in my case an ESI, I don't think I can ever find an e-8, e-3, or e-5 ESI (if we want to share 1 type in tritype). The e-5 is possible but that would be tritype 459 which is a very withdrawn type, can't handle it, not my forte.
Anyway I always, always love e-7, but tbh I admire e-2.
And you know what, I was thinking,
If someone actually has a 2 and 7 in their tritype and the next number is the type that we actually share in our tritype, which is 8, that would be perfect!
In my case, dual is not possible, so I think I would go for my activation partner, SEE 278 Sx/So!
Haha.
So. You're 946 and you like guys with e-4 and e-6, that makes sense. Like dissolves like. We tend to like people who are like us. Again, similarity.
I'm an 835, and when I was young, I was often attracted to e-8 and e-3. My first boyfriend ever was actually an ESTP 738.
And I agree, most ESTP (SLE) they're all 7, 3, or 8. E-7s are FUN!
SLE with 4 or 6 in their tritype? Seems not possible. A dom-Se like SLE will most likely to have 7 instead of 6 in their tritype. And 3 instead of 4.
I also think e-8 is glued to their tritype. Can't imagine e-9 or e-1 in their tritype.
But if you're a 9 and you prefer to share 1 type in your tritype, your activator LSI would be perfect, because most of them I believe will have 9 in their tritype. That what makes them very laid back and easy going.
The 593.
Last edited by Scarlett; 02-27-2021 at 02:12 AM.
When I asked an ESI "what's your idea man", she described an imaginative man look like EIE. But she has never knowns an EIE in person, so she end up dating SLE, SEE all the time... She knowns some LIEs, but feels neutral towards them. She doesn't like someone who focus too much on business and money.
It's like asking me a question, what my ideal man, and I would definitely answer an LSI.
But I end up dating an ILI and SLI.
Translates:
the ideal man is your mirage, but end up dating your mirror and supervisor instead.
Oh yeah, true story though. I completely agree. When you're young you will never appreciate your dual. Ever.
It takes time, experience, and high level of maturity for an ESI to finally see that LIE is more than just someone who focus too much on business and money.
@Scarlett Thanks for your comments, again
Can I just say..that a 145 tritype doesn’t have to be e1? They could be e4 or e5..(but ESI don’t come in 5 pretty sure)
I don’t know what you mean by this, soz! If you are 835 tritype (order of numbers doesn’t matter btw) then according to the article your enneagram dual is a 6. I know you said you don’t like them..But just pointing it out in case you haven’t noticed it in the article. Soz if I’m reverse supervising you!
In the article she suggests two things:
- It is good to share one number in your tritype. E.g me -964 with let’s say a..631. We would share the number 6. (She is not saying that I'm suited to 9s,4s and 6s.
- She has worked out the enneagram duals for each tritype using a ‘formula’..she doesn’t explain her workings out clearly and I had to figure out what she meant. It will hurt my brain to explain it- I might do it, but later haha. If one person in the couple, is the enneagram dual of another…it creates a sort of ‘glue’ she says.
Yes, it’s a shame that there aren’t many e2 males..I haven’t been looking but I can’t think of any I know?? Yes, SEEs can be e2 or have tritype 728. My sis is SEE e7 (tritype 728).
Last edited by Bethanyclaire; 02-25-2021 at 01:39 PM.
@Scarlett
Thanks for your comments, again
Can I just say..that a 145 tritype doesn’t have to be e1? They could be e4 or e5..(but ESI don’t come in 5 pretty sure)
‘If we're talking about socionic dual, in my case an ESI, I don't think I can ever find an e-8, e-3, or e-5 ESI (if we want to share 1 type in tritype). The e-5 is possible but that would be tritype 459 which is a very withdrawn type, can't handle it, not my forte.
Anyway I always, always love e-7, but tbh I admire e-2.’
I don’t know what you mean by this, soz! If you are 835 tritype (order of numbers doesn’t matter btw) then according to the article your enneagram dual is a 6. I know you said you don’t like them..But just pointing it out in case you haven’t noticed it in the article. Soz if I’m reverse supervising you!
In the article she suggests two things:
- It is good to share one number in your tritype. E.g me -964 with let’s say a..631. We would share the number 6. (She is not saying that I'm suited to 9s,4s and 6s.
- She has worked out the enneagram duals for each tritype using a ‘formula’..she doesn’t explain her workings out clearly and I had to figure out what she meant. It will hurt my brain to explain it- I might do it, but later haha. If one person in the couple, is the enneagram dual of another…it creates a sort of ‘glue’ she says.
Yes, it’s a shame that there aren’t many e2 males..I haven’t been looking but I can’t think of any I know?? Yes, SEEs can be e2 or have tritype 728. My sis is SEE 728.
Haha no problem!
I noticed that, and reject that haha. Not for me. I dislike someone with e-1 and e-6. Like ever.
Don't get me wrong, I have lots of friends who have 6 and 1 in their tritype, I'm ok with all types as friends/colleagues, but not as dates. Anyway. It's not possible though, I'm not naturally attracted to someone with e6, and e1 always constantly contradicts me.
I've rejected an ESI e6 in the past, I'm just not into him. And I've dated my supervisor an SLI who's an e1 and broke up not long after that.
Anyway it's not just because of that, somehow I always knew, it's just not for me. Anything but a 1 or 6.
So what I was saying, if could choose between the head centre, e5 or e6 or e7, I would choose either e5 or e7 in someone but never e6.
And the body centre, e8 or e9 or e1, I would choose either e8 or e9 but never e1.
And the heart centre, well, anything, I don't mind, but somehow I'm not too interested in dom-Fi with e4, too much feeling for me I guess.
Hahah
I have quite a few SEE friends, some of them are e2, most of them are e7. And they're all amazing. They're all female though.
Can I just add, when people actually have both 2 and 7 in their tritype, seems like they have sort of very pleasant, seductive air about them.
I actually just met a client, who, I suspect, had this combination, and boy did he have that charisma around him!
He's definitely an Se-dom.
I can't see a 1 in him (of course not), he must be either SEE 728 or SEE 729.
He's extremely magnetic, fun and sociable. And we get to know each other extremely quickly.
Anyway, 2 and 7 tend to be very enthusiastic types.
I find enthusiasm to be very attractive myself.
Last edited by Scarlett; 02-25-2021 at 02:52 PM.
Ok, I get you about choosing between the different head centres..coool.
For me, I have basically learnt to type people's tritypes in the same way I learnt to type their sociotype. I began by figuring out a few people's and then compared and contrasted until I now have a 'catalogue' of people of varying tritypes in my mind lol. Now I can sort of 'feel' out people's tritypes, but it's not easy. Need to read a bit more.
Um, my point is.. I don't think about it in terms of what 'heart, head and body centre' I like. Although maybe I do a bit..for example I have noticed I don't mind it if they have 1 in the tritype, if it also has a 2 lol.
So yeah, I sort of 'know' what tritypes I think I could date, basing it on my experience of that tritype in general. I suppose never say never to the other ones..yet it's also good to feel informed.
It's funny, I like people with 7 and 2 in the tritype tooI get on well with tritype 127s as well as 278s, but then I generally get on well with e-7s and e-2s. You are correct, 'pleasant and seductive' they are. People with 3 or 6 in the tritype can also be seductive for me lol. But not in such a good way!
Ok, I get you about choosing between the different head centres..coool.
For me, I have basically learnt to type people's tritypes in the same way I learnt to type their sociotype. I began by figuring out a few people's and then compared and contrasted until I now have a 'catalogue' of people of varying tritypes in my mind lol. Now I can sort of 'feel' out people's tritypes, but it's not easy. Need to read a bit more.
Um, my point is.. I don't think about it in terms of what 'heart, head and body centre' I like. Although maybe I do a bit..for example I have noticed I don't mind it if they have 1 in the tritype, if it also has a 2 lol.
So yeah, I sort of 'know' what tritypes I think I could date, basing it on my experience of that tritype in general. I suppose never say never to the other ones..yet it's also good to feel informed.
It's funny, I like people with 7 and 2 in the tritype too
I know right!
Oh by the way, I just figured this out, if I still wanna pursue a dual, lol, the best tritype is ESI 295!
They got the e-2, you know, e-2 with Fi, I would be instantly admiring them. And we share 1 type in the tritype which is a 5, perfect.
I think for an ESI they most likely to have e-9 so it's tritype 952 instead of 295,
but I do hope they have e-2, so tritype 295, the e-2 would make them appear a little extroverted I guess, well, I prefer ESI-Se to ESI-Fi anyway.
Or, just go for their extroverted cousins, my activity partner, the SEE e-2, tritype 278, I love 2 and 7 in someone tritype's and we share an 8, awesome.
Lol.
I used to say "Yikes. Nope." whenever I saw male ESI's.
Somehow I notice if a dual/activity couple get together quite young, like late teens or early 20s, they end up divorcing anyway. And they will say "we're too different, we're really opposite, bla bla"
Like I said, it takes time, experience, and high level of maturity.
When you're young I think you should be dating your semidual/mirage/mirror/contrary/kindred, for experience. They easy to form anyway. You get along with your mirror really well.
I don't know if anyone notice, but in my case, when I was in school, and then college, and then early years of work, my circle or best friends were mostly other NT's and NF's. And a few ST's. So the quadra thingy, it doesn't really apply at the beginning.
Not until the later years of work, and then I went travelling, and back to grad school and work again THEN I realised my close friends now are mostly SP's, especially those in the same quadra with me. It's funny if I think about it.
When I was in school/college I didn't like interacting with ESI/SEE, seems like they're not mature enough, or I wasn't mature enough, that makes us too different.
But now after grad school if I meet an ESI/SEE they somehow impress me. And they said they admire me as well, "how can you be so knowledgeable, bla bla.." a mature ESI/SEE really wants to learn and hardworking actually. But I believe, when they were young, they weren't like that.
The point is, I think you have to grow yourself first to be able to appreciate your dual.
So after those experience interacting with all different people, you might end up with the one you date, you might not, you might separate, but later in life you grow and are mature enough to see "the other side of the coin".
Last edited by Scarlett; 02-26-2021 at 02:07 AM.
Ohhh nice...I have a EII 925 friend..she is very very lovely. Very gentle and smart. And hey, makes me think that an Estp 825 could work for me. I tend to get on well with this tritype..(my mother’s tritype?!)
I had some more thoughts! This kinda connects to you saying you’re not attracted to your enneagram ‘dual’ according to the article...and I was also thinking about how I don’t go for 8s or 3s.
I started thinking about this SLE/IEI couple I know of. I know he’s a sexual 738 and I thought she was a sexual 936. But I just realised that’ she’s probs a sexual 639..coz she looks like a wannabe supermodel and sexual 6s are associated with wanting to look good. So before I was thinking ‘oh what a perfect, romantic 7 + 9 couple’...but nope she’s probs a 6.
It makes me idealise Estp 7s less..in fact, though a 9 and a 7 get on really well...actually my relationships with 7s in general are not my most stable relationships. My most stable relationships are with 5s...who integrate to 8, so maybe an Estp 8 would be nice.
Similar to how I’m usually attracted to 6s, but actually I get on better with 5s.
Oh My God.
Very gentle and smart.
My IEI bestfriend not long ago mentioned the same thing!
You know in the past I've mostly dated NT/ST guys, logical and strongwilled, I kept saying that.
But nowadays, I don't know how I started admiring more F guys, until at one point my IEI friend shouted "Oh wow, I didn't know Scarlett's type was a very very gentle and smart kind of gentleman like XXX" I did not actually realise that.
Now that I think about it, I don't go for all ESI's, but I think when I can pick up the 2-ish in them, then that's it.
Then the 5, it's like a must in the tritype, that's the one that we share anyway, that's how I feel attracted, the similarity, the logical "smart" thing.
And I'm aware most of ESI's are e9. So yeah, 925. Which I believe quite rare.
It's funny they call 925 The Problem Solver. Because 835 is The Solution Master. Lol
So, you don't go for 8s and 3s?
Remember I told you that when you're an e8, seems like e1 constantly contradicts you.
The same thing I think happens with e3, it kinda contradicts e6. Seems like if you have a high 3 in your tritype, you usually don't go for 6, unless if you have it both 3 and 6 in your tritype.
Maybe you're not into 3s because you have a high 6 in your tritype. Or you're so attracted to 6s, or something like that.
But 8s?
I think an 8 and 9 get on fine.
They say the best partner for e-8 is e-2, but many female 8s are usually with male 9s.
Last edited by Scarlett; 02-27-2021 at 12:19 AM.
Hahaha tritypes are fascinating aren’t they..
I have read a few comments on the forum made by people with the same tritype as me and it feels kinda spooky coz they talk in a way that feels familiar.
Yeah similarly to what you said I have gone for soft, sensitive types in the past..I usually go for people who I feel a ‘magical’ connection with- they often have a similar tritype to me (e.g too similar- 639/549). Didn’t work!
Interesting!!! I will have to mull this over..I think you are correct though.
Yeah I think I didn’t usually go for 8s for a few reasons..(kinda personal things) But one of them is that I just haven’t been around them much. I didn’t know what an Estp 8 looked like. I can think of one I ‘unmatched’ a while ago which is lame!
Nvm..one good thing I have realised is that 8s often like going to clubs, which I like, so I can at least look out for them there (I'm not that young but I still like clubs) I think my ideal 8 tritype would be 826 or 846 and actually I know people of these tritypes..and an Esfp 826 seemed interested in me recently. Uh there is hope! I think I’d maybe prefer an Espf 8 to a 7 somehow.
I think I am also learning how to spot someone’s tritype from their facial features a bit?? Like I swear I just found an 836 online.
The thing that confuses me is…the instincts/ stacks.
So, I do believe you can roughly sort people into the 6 stacks. (At least I think people could put their own preferences of the instincts in an order??)
I can think of two Estps I have known with the same tritype (739). I would have said one guy was sp/sx (incompatible to my so/sx) and one guy was so/sx.
The sp/sx 739 was nearly 10 years younger than me and unbelievably cool and good looking (high 3sx??) with a bit of bad boy image. At the time when I met him, I didn’t know about socionics but even then I thought ‘nahhh wouldn’t have worked’ even if he was older…'
So I’m kinda worried now, if you meet someone who isn’t the right stack (for me sp/sx or so/sp) what are you supposed to think? That it’s doomed to fail?
Maybe it isn’t though and the ‘stacks’ are just kind of in ‘our head’?
Orrrr maybe certain tritypes are less likely to feel ‘clashy’ to us and be an incompatible stack.
Or maybe you do just have to trust your gut a bit when you first meet them. It’s hard because you won’t know if it is just normal duality friction at the start or if you really aren’t compatible?
Maybe like you said before about having 'high 6'..it's all just about compatibility within compatibility..so people came up with the idea of 'stacks' to roughly explain it. The strength of the numbers/ functions need to match up? (Or you just need to be on a similar 'wave length’ or something..be from similar backgrounds etc) Maybe DNCH can be used at this point, which I've never thought much about before..
ALSO I swear that a guy I know is an Estp 835 (he could be e3 though..) It’s funny..we get on..but he does kinda feel a bit like a conflictor sometimes :s
Btw..
Sometimes I feel like I’m in a dream when I talk about this stuff..it’s just all so weird..still! Haha
Reading over this I can see my tritype all over it. So much seeking and doubting like a typical 946
Last edited by Bethanyclaire; 02-27-2021 at 09:13 PM.
"If you meet someone who isn’t the right stack what are you supposed to think? That it’s doomed to fail?"The thing that confuses me is…the instincts/ stacks.
So, I do believe you can roughly sort people into the 6 stacks. (At least I think people could put their own preferences of the instincts in an order??)
I can think of two Estps I have known with the same tritype (739). I would have said one guy was sp/sx (incompatible to my so/sx) and one guy was so/sx.
The sp/sx 739 was nearly 10 years younger than me and unbelievably cool and good looking (high 3sx??) with a bit of bad boy image. At the time when I met him, I didn’t know about socionics but even then I thought ‘nahhh wouldn’t have worked’ even if he was older…'
So I’m kinda worried now, if you meet someone who isn’t the right stack (for me sp/sx or so/sp) what are you supposed to think? That it’s doomed to fail?
Maybe it isn’t though and the ‘stacks’ are just kind of in ‘our head’?
Orrrr maybe certain tritypes are less likely to feel ‘clashy’ to us and be an incompatible stack.
Or maybe you do just have to trust your gut a bit when you first meet them. It’s hard because you won’t know if it is just normal duality friction at the start or if you really aren’t compatible?
Maybe like you said before about having 'high 6'..it's all just about compatibility within compatibility..so people came up with the idea of 'stacks' to roughly explain it. The strength of the numbers/ functions need to match up? (Or you just need to be on a similar 'wave length’ or something..be from similar backgrounds etc) Maybe DNCH can be used at this point, which I've never thought much about before..
ALSO I swear that a guy I know is an Estp 835 (he could be e3 though..) It’s funny..we get on..but he does kinda feel a bit like a conflictor sometimes :s
Btw..
Sometimes I feel like I’m in a dream when I talk about this stuff..it’s just all so weird..still! Haha
Reading over this I can see my tritype all over it. So much seeking and doubting like a typical 946
I'm an Sp/Sx, if I meet a Social person, So/Sx or So/Sp, I will notice right away and they actually kinda turn me off.
They make good friends, for sure, but I'm not interested in So/Sx or So/Sp in a romantic way.
For example, you know "my type" is an LSI right, and I have a close friend here an LSI, but I'm not attracted to him in a romantic way, ever.
He's personally such a true LSI, which is strange how I'm not into him at all. Then I realised he's an So/Sp. I need Sx for connection! Lol.
"Maybe like you said before about having 'high 6'..it's all just about compatibility within compatibility..so people came up with the idea of 'stacks' to roughly explain it."
Haha interesting.
Now that I think about it, I remember long time ago I rejected an ESI e-6, I just couldn't, I wasn't into him at all, like at all.
He's a social too! He's So/Sx.
Maybe that's why I can't with e-6. Most of them are So/Sx or So/Sp.
All of my previous relationship always with Sexual (Sx/Sp and Sx/Sp) or with other Sp/Sx like me.
And yes, I believe I'm naturally attracted to Sx/So, Sx/Sp and Sp/Sx only.
Haha.
It's amazing how two intuitives seem to immediately connect the dots between such disparate subjects.
IEI's are always pleasant to be with. I'm often fascinated by the mix between powerful emotions and cold logic.
Last edited by Scarlett; 02-28-2021 at 07:39 AM.
aww yes it's been a helpful discussion. My brain needs a lil rest now
It's interesting to think that there are some cool, attractive triytpes that exist in non dual-types..
You know I also think that the instinct I'm attracted to can vary depending on the type. So that's something to think about too! E.g I think sx/so can be nice in a semi-dual and quite special. Where as I'd prefer same stack for duals I guess.
I mentioned above somewhere that an Esfp 8 (social) seemed into me a while ago. You know what? I think he may have actually been a dual. I remember meeting him on a night out and his friend pointing out- ‘you guys are talking like you’ve known each other for years’. The next time I saw him I even spoke to him all about my ongoing romance troubles. He messaged me a bit and I think he was interested but I wasn’t in the right head space, also he’s younger and physically not really my type. But what did it feel like being around him? Like he was a really good mate, someone I would have hung out with as a child or something. Maybe that’s how 8s are for me, compared to 7s who feel exciting and 3s who intimidate me a bit.
thanks for this post, my problem has been fixed too.
Best scenario: IEI works with SLE to find a better alternative to making money for SLE so SLE doesn't feel like robbing a bank. SLE brings home the bacon as gratitude to the IEI
Fictional scenario: IEI Pam steals an idea for a vampire bar from Ginger and gives it to SLE Eric Northman in True Blood.
Funny anecdote: I knew an SLE who robbed a bunch of places, so it's a common thing
Np!
I’ve been thinking a bit more about it. Sorry if this repeats some of what has already been said.
I do think for duality, it seems important to be of the same instinct. Socials with socials, sexual with sexual and self preservation with self preservation.
Other than that, I reckon that duality is going to be at its best when the two people’s tritypes are more compatible.
A compatible tritype will mean:
-the couple share at least one number in the tritype, if there are two this is better (more likely to be same instinct?)
-certain tritypes are more suited to each other. For me, a 946, these are:
-Estp 826 (seems very compatible)
I seem to get on very well with this tritype- have had close friends of this type. (Eg. Enfp 268) It doesn’t surprise me as I get on well with 2s, 6s and 8s in general. (8s more recently)
-Estp 846 (seems very compatible)
I like people of this tritype and I think sharing the 4 adds a bit of intensity.
Also, in the article I shared earlier in the thread, it explains that 9 is the enneagram dual for these two types according to her theory. But I also know from my own observations that I get on well with these types.
-Estp 749
I think this would be my favourite. I like 7s a lot- I guess coz they have a romantic air about them. Bizarrely, all this thinking about tritypes has made me think of someone I have met before, who may be an Estp 749.
-Estp 845
This one could also work as it has 5 and I get on really well with 5s.
-Estp 369
In general I prefer 8s and 7s to 3s but I think this particular tritype would work fine. I have an Estp 369 in mind, who I met briefly and have just remembered now. Also, 369 is one of the special, balanced tritypes.
There are some other tritypes that may work (836, 739, 359) but something’s telling me they might not be quite right as the 3 may feel too prominent. 748 and 729 don’t seem quite right either. Also not sure about tritypes with a ‘1’ (714, 316). 825 could work as it is one of the ‘balanced’ tritypes. (There may be a proper term other than ‘balanced’.)
For non duals, a similar pattern may follow. (Not necessarily however!! As I have actually had some bad experiences with non-duals with similar tritypes to mine..e.g with lookalike or comparative who were far too similar to me)
Also I was thinking that some tritypes might be better for a non dual. E.g an Entp 739 sounds nice..I like 739s in general but it might be too intense in a dual but nicer in an Entp. I’m not sure of this but it’s just a thought.
Btw I don’t know if it matters about the order of the numbers in the tritype. I have just been writing them starting with the main type and then numerical order for second and third numbers.
Edit: I am questioning whether Estp 749 or Estp 846 actually would be compatible with me- it might be that this tritype is too similar to mine.
Last edited by Bethanyclaire; 03-08-2021 at 08:13 AM.
Today I was listening to a male LSE talk about how tough it's been at work recently because he's overloaded, and a (new) female IEI overheard him and threw her arms around him and said "Big hug!".
The LSE instantly froze, and then when he was released, shifted his speech over to her and gave her a monologue consisting of a highly technical and excruciatingly detailed description of how his project is mechanically constructed. The IEI's eyes instantly glazed over.
Later, she (the IEI) was talking about how her role (quality control) is essential for ensuring that a product is built correctly and conforms to government standards. A male SLE said "We don't need no stinking quality control documents. That's what the D stands for in R & D. Freedom to try stuff."
"Oh yeah?", she said. "Here." She gave him the finger. He looked at her, mildly surprised.
Later I saw them bouncing down the hall together, happily in pursuit of something.
This is wholesome. The kind of wholesome stuff that never happens to me.
Enneagrams deals with trauma and core fears, it's not in-born. It's just weird and wrong to misuse it as a way to determine relationship compatibility since Enneagrams came from a place of wanting to identify and analyze psychological disorders. A person's enneagram doesn't deter from duality and the fact is, people don't always want to dualize.
@Lolita some thoughts..
But at some point e-type does become fixed? You could argue that socionics is also about dealing with fears..people acting a certain way because this is how they are programmed to survive. You have your tritype in your bio right? Do you not think there is a link between that tritype and you being a high ti user?
Enneagram/tritype is useful for some people to think about as it suits their brains more than socionics, also it simplifies aspects of the psyche down into neat pieces (instincts/stacks, e-type, tritype), which seem easier to compare than comparing socionics types. I see learning about tritype as a kind of a short cut to understanding people rather than learning in-depth socionics. Both socionics and enneagram confused me at first- and gave me unrealistic ideas about compatibility. But you learn from mistakes I guess.
Perhaps it is true that if you put two healthy duals together for long enough, they would eventually dualise? But, in reality it is probably going to be far easier for people to dualise who have some other things in common/or compatible differences, aside from being duals. Perhaps, this can be explained by enneagram/tritype. I haven’t made enough observations to know if I believe it yet. Atm, I am interested in tritype compatibility based on some ideas from the enneagram dual thread.
Also, it’s not easy to spot someone’s tritype but I think if you’re around someone long enough, it will click. (Also need to test this out more
Last edited by Bethanyclaire; 04-08-2021 at 08:06 AM.
You can also compare enneagram compatibility to DCNH compatibility. (I have read that H and C go together, and D and N go together).
Enneagram isn't in-born (that's EIE lenses) but yes, it's developed over time based on the person's experiences so their enneagram becomes fixed in adulthood. At no point did Ichazo or Naranjo say that enneagrams is in-born. This is why they used the specific word "fixation" meaning that it's an obsession. You're not born obsessed. You become obsessed over time. That's not the same as cognition which is actually in-born, because that describes how the person is wired (although it doesn't describe why they're wired that way).@Lolita some thoughts..
But at some point e-type does become fixed? You could argue that socionics is also about dealing with fears..people acting a certain way because this is how they are programmed to survive. You have your tritype in your bio right? Do you not think there is a link between that tritype and you being a high ti user?
Enneagram/tritype is useful for some people to think about as it suits their brains more than socionics, also it simplifies aspects of the psyche down into neat pieces (instincts/stacks, e-type, tritype), which seem easier to compare than comparing socionics types. I see learning about tritype as a kind of a short cut to understanding people rather than learning in-depth socionics. Both socionics and enneagram confused me at first- and gave me unrealistic ideas about compatibility. But you learn from mistakes I guess.
Perhaps it is true that if you put two healthy duals together for long enough, they would eventually dualise? But, in reality it is probably going to be far easier for people to dualise who have some other things in common/or compatible differences, aside from being duals. Perhaps, this can be explained by enneagram/tritype. I haven’t made enough observations to know if I believe it yet. Atm, I am interested in tritype compatibility based on some ideas from the enneagram dual thread.
Also, it’s not easy to spot someone’s tritype but I think if you’re around someone long enough, it will click. (Also need to test this out more
Yeah, I have my tritype, but I didn't figure it out. I had 5 duals and 2 identicals independently came up with my tritype. An identical, a benefactor, a supervisor, 2 duals, and 2 kindreds actually typed me as 8 core from knowing me for 2 or more years and they're very well versed in enneagrams. My enneagram and tritype doesn't determine my socionics type, since they're separate. Enneagrams talks about the ego's fears (mainly irrational fears) and taps into a person's emotions. That's not the same as thinking. Socionics explains a person's cognitive motivations. All enneagrams does is give another dimension to understanding a person but it doesn't explain how one set of fears can be "compatible" with another. Fear is fear. Some people can overcome them, some can't. Enneagram is totally self-focused, while Socionics is more about relations and society-focused.
I guess I am a "high" level Ti user, but I don't get pedantic and unlike Ti valuers, I don't care about finding endless info to answer a question that's already been answered before. If you're referring to the naturally hostile attitude people take towards their PoLR and equating it with fear and linking that to enneagram, then no, I'm not scared of Ti, however, it's still my PoLR. I'm just a subtype of SEE that has developed shadow functions. Some people who have developed PoLR functions don't get affected by it much, and for some, it's more intense. Enneagram may be able to explain why the individual has that level of intensity of being (negatively) affected by their PoLR, but doesn't determine it. I don't think I ever was scared of Ti, since my dad is LSI and he taught me Ti all my life. I work in the legal field, that's heavily Ti (but also Te) and I really enjoy it. This isn't to say that because I have developed Ti as SEE-N that another SEE-N is going to be at the same level of Ti development as I am. N subtype just means engagement with Ti, so whether Ti is the type's PoLR or lead, it doesn't matter, it is just a way to identify that the person has Ti accentuation.
One's mental health doesn't eradicate duality. It just happens. I've dualize with some who weren't at their best and over time we became friends. Duality doesn't mean there's an actual personal relationship, although it could develop into one over time. The point of duality is to provide each other assistance while one or both are in stressful situations. Think of it in terms of having an ally during tough times.
Actually I'd say that Ni-Se pairings are quite common, especially Se guy. Basically because Se men are the stereotype of masculinity. Even ugly guys that act masculine get girlfriends. Typically an Ni girlfriend who forgives appearance (Si unvalued) in exchange for valued Se.
Ne men being relatively childlike are generally unappealing to most women (except caregiver types). And even then if they don't look handsome or cute then even caregivers don't want em lol. As an Ne guy I naturally developed my Se somewhat in order to get women to like me cuz seriously even my duals thought I was just a lame ass nerd. Well now I'm a lame ass nerd that acts cocky but it works so whatever.
Anyways from the experiences I had I suppose that Ne men are generally less wanted than other types. Also E men have an easier time than I men because men are expected to initiate. And therefore extroverts feel quite comfortable doing this in the same way that Se men feel quite comfortable in acting cocky and aggressive.
So generally the more someone conforms to gender stereotypes, the more likely they can find their dual (assuming of course they are straight lol). But it's more of a probability thing (dating being a game of numbers) rather than unique to types.
And about the LII and ESE pair, I have seen many of them. Somehow it feels like a very natural pair. The ESE of course is the one initiating. I haven't met an LII woman ESE man pair. Mostly because ESE guys are all gay lol (the few ones I met at least, don't mean to offend haha).
Anyways this is my point of view from a more general public kinda sense. I can see how Ne-Si pairings occur more frequently in settings where Ne types congregate. In a Ne-dominant environment the ones getting laid aren't the most aggressive or those who possess the most resources but rather the most imaginative, witty ones etc. As a general rule people are attracted to others at 'the top of the social hierarchy'. But of course this differs depending on the social group. Just a bit of wisdom I gathered from being a lame nerd at the bottom of the totem pole in HS to a guy who was well-liked in college lol.
Oh definitely S types gain presentation points. Some N types are gross. Like dudes with dirty nails or the typical IT dude that never heard of deodorant lol (used to be me).
So guys like SLE rarely lack confidence so even if they don't look so good they just kinda get women because they don't even second guess themselves. On the other hand take a pretty EII guy with low confidence and guess which one gets more ladies.So I think confidence in general is a good predictor at least of short term relationships or 'initiation' of a relationship. I would say EII guys have much higher quality in their relationships because of Fi lead. They can naturally 'make it work' no matter the person. So it's a quantity vs quality thing I suppose.
I get pussy just because i am charming af and I guess handsome. But i am a creep, honestly. Still I am better than all Se types, smarter and all around cooler. Sensors should bow to us.Oh definitely S types gain presentation points. Some N types are gross. Like dudes with dirty nails or the typical IT dude that never heard of deodorant lol (used to be me).
So guys like SLE rarely lack confidence so even if they don't look so good they just kinda get women because they don't even second guess themselves. On the other hand take a pretty EII guy with low confidence and guess which one gets more ladies.
SLI girls asking you on dates? Teach me your ways, senpai. This land is filled with pretentious Se hoes who just want my cock for one night. Tho I feel you are more "suave" than me, i'm the Spider Jerusalem kind of IEE.
It is true. If you are not a good looking Ne type. You are castrated. Si egos are superficial as fuck as they are dumb HAHAHAActually I'd say that Ni-Se pairings are quite common, especially Se guy. Basically because Se men are the stereotype of masculinity. Even ugly guys that act masculine get girlfriends. Typically an Ni girlfriend who forgives appearance (Si unvalued) in exchange for valued Se.
Ne men being relatively childlike are generally unappealing to most women (except caregiver types). And even then if they don't look handsome or cute then even caregivers don't want em lol. As an Ne guy I naturally developed my Se somewhat in order to get women to like me cuz seriously even my duals thought I was just a lame ass nerd. Well now I'm a lame ass nerd that acts cocky but it works so whatever.
Anyways from the experiences I had I suppose that Ne men are generally less wanted than other types. Also E men have an easier time than I men because men are expected to initiate. And therefore extroverts feel quite comfortable doing this in the same way that Se men feel quite comfortable in acting cocky and aggressive.
So generally the more someone conforms to gender stereotypes, the more likely they can find their dual (assuming of course they are straight lol). But it's more of a probability thing (dating being a game of numbers) rather than unique to types.
And about the LII and ESE pair, I have seen many of them. Somehow it feels like a very natural pair. The ESE of course is the one initiating. I haven't met an LII woman ESE man pair. Mostly because ESE guys are all gay lol (the few ones I met at least, don't mean to offend haha).
Anyways this is my point of view from a more general public kinda sense. I can see how Ne-Si pairings occur more frequently in settings where Ne types congregate. In a Ne-dominant environment the ones getting laid aren't the most aggressive or those who possess the most resources but rather the most imaginative, witty ones etc. As a general rule people are attracted to others at 'the top of the social hierarchy'. But of course this differs depending on the social group. Just a bit of wisdom I gathered from being a lame nerd at the bottom of the totem pole in HS to a guy who was well-liked in college lol.
I also had to develop high ego and cockyness to get laid, so... I relate. I'm good at it and they buy it, while inside i am suffering and just want mommy gf.
Me as a Se polr is just really fucking weird, even for you. I'd accept IEI over EII, still, i am in no way an introvert.Lol, you're the tank kind of IEE(i still think you're EII-Fi D, but whatever)
I guess I just try to be respectful and the girls feel safe because they sense I'm not gonna push them to anything. I guess it's the law of 'the less you ask for it, the easier you get it'. Personally my problem is that I don't even know if I want it until it's too late. I actually need a girl that can convince me to get with her, so I guess I'm not the standard 'pushing for p****y' kind of guy. The drive is there though
I don't push ever. What I mean is that I don't ever find SLI girls where I live.
That is weird. But realistic. It makes sense. Still think I'm Ne lead though, Fi ain't as strong as to be my leading function. And no way i'm IJ temperament.
That means you're hot bro, congratz.
That reminds me of this IEE guy I knew. Tall, hot, blonde dude who was sooo awkward in general dealing with women it was hilarious lol. Only caregiver types liked him because he gave these passive sorta vibes that were a bit of a turnoff for most.
You're from Argentina, right? No wonder you can't find SLI gf. Like 80% of people there are Betas. I think I met 2 SLI over the course of 15 years there lol. And I met maybe 3 SEI. Out of maybe hundreds of people I analyzed. It's such a Se-Fe society it's not even funny: the politics, the drama, the egotism, etc. Part of the reason I moved out of the country was that I couldn't mesh with my own people
bruh you're living the dreamHmmm I always thought that randy Si doms acted like that with all Ne types once they decide to shave & put on decent clothes.
I'm not really hot but i think I may look "cute and harmless" which makes me look "easy to get". Some months ago I was at that birthday and spilled juice on my shirt (because I started talking before i had swallowed) and the rather gorgeous girl next to me(some alpha Si type) started giggling and wanted to "help me clean" my shirt while looking at me with the expression 'OhOohoohooOo he dirtied his shirtpls let me adopt you'. That kind of turned me off bc being treated like a pet or a child isn't a kink I have; I prefer someone who can hold a real deep discussion.
Also, how do you even begin talking with juice in your mouth... I mean. Seriously hahahah. Either IxE-Ne have terrible body control or I'm not a Ne lead after all
I can get spilling liquid when you're drinking and something funny happens so you start laughing and the liquid comes out your nose. That's happened so many times to me lol
So. You were born there? Interesante. Argentina is hell for Ne egos, honestly, especially ILE/IEE men imo. And yeah, i have met veeeery few Si egos here, I wonder why that is. But there are Se egos mostly, followed by Ni egos. I hate it.. dude. Where did you go to? I want to leave Hell as well.You're from Argentina, right? No wonder you can't find SLI gf. Like 80% of people there are Betas. I think I met 2 SLI over the course of 15 years there lol. And I met maybe 3 SEI. Out of maybe hundreds of people I analyzed. It's such a Se-Fe society it's not even funny: the politics, the drama, the egotism, etc. Part of the reason I moved out of the country was that I couldn't mesh with my own people
Yup. Born in Argentina, lived in Canada for a few years as a kid and then went back to Argentina so I'm dual citizen. I returned to Canada in September last year. There was a tiny window of time in which both borders were open so I escaped in the nick of time.
Now I'm in Vancouver which honestly feels like a Gamma society. Out of the frying pan and into the oven.I think I'll move to a more friendly rural place or small town in the future. First gotta make some cash.
If you wanna talk or something I can send you my Whatsapp contact. Always a pleasure to talk to a fellow argentinian now that I'm not surrounded by 'em 24/7 hahaha.
Seriously the lack of Si back at home is astounding. Guess people just kinda grow up to be confrontative, aggressive, etc. None of that Si chill kinda thing you know? All the Si valuers I knew were the outcasts whereas Se valuers were normies lol.
I think poor EIIs have it the worst though. Basically getting hit in their POLR every 10 minutes and dealing with the political and economic mess/instability. My mum is EII and she always disliked the instability of our country, the rude attitudes, the violence, etc.
Hell is exactly what I call it.Used to live in Jujuy which is Hell within Hell.
Oh man. True. The LII and EII men I know have it hard as fuck as well. So yeah I can see that. And hell yes! I'd love to talk to you, bro. DM me your number!Yup. Born in Argentina, lived in Canada for a few years as a kid and then went back to Argentina so I'm dual citizen. I returned to Canada in September last year. There was a tiny window of time in which both borders were open so I escaped in the nick of time.
Now I'm in Vancouver which honestly feels like a Gamma society. Out of the frying pan and into the oven.
If you wanna talk or something I can send you my Whatsapp contact. Always a pleasure to talk to a fellow argentinian now that I'm not surrounded by 'em 24/7 hahaha.
Seriously the lack of Si back at home is astounding. Guess people just kinda grow up to be confrontative, aggressive, etc. None of that Si chill kinda thing you know? All the Si valuers I knew were the outcasts whereas Se valuers were normies lol.
I think poor EIIs have it the worst though. Basically getting hit in their POLR every 10 minutes and dealing with the political and economic mess/instability. My mum is EII and she always disliked the instability of our country, the rude attitudes, the violence, etc.
Hell is exactly what I call it.
I know an EII-Fi like this, he's very gamma, used to think he was ESI.+ Se- retention of power, insubordination, defense, firmness, defense of one's interests, strong-willed pressure from the bottom upwards, strength, will, possession;
The theory behind that spectrum stuff is Model B (Bukalov) of socionics. Read about it here. The way I see it, Se+(Gamma, concrete Se) is the "awareness of strength" compared to Se-(Beta, abstract Se) which is the "awareness of power". Strength enables you to rely on yourself to push for what you want, to get up when you've fallen down, to take the blows of life, to take intiative, to never give up. It's what Arnie talks about in this video(I'd type arnie as LIE-Te, so he has the same boosted Se+/Si- HA as EII-Fi):
LSE has Se+/Si- as creative and Se-/Si+ as demonstrative.
Se-(beta) is about power because it's not about some concrete sense of will, but about some abstract sense of pressure. You don't have to be strong to win or control people, you can control them by being weak and sneaky too. By playing the victim. By blaming a scapegoat. By hitting the man who's already on the ground. There is no sense of Se+ integrity with Se-. It's you win or you loose. If you don't use all you got to win, you'll loose. Hard stuff. Explains all that shitty cruel stuff betas do to each others.
From this page:
@Dr PissBender that might interest you too. If you're IEE-Ne like me, then Se+/Si- would be your suggestive.
How would the need of Se+/Si- display on us then?
Sent bro
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