"Adulting"
I've seen this word thrown around here and there by delta NF's...
I think I get the gist of it, sure, but I'm trying to figure out what the actual personal experience of "being bad at adulting" means. What exactly do you see as the barriers to "adulting" and why?
I think it basically means being responsible and doing things that are good for your mental and physical well-being instead of giving into laziness or vice. Like taxes paying for your own shit, not needing people to do basic shit for you like driving or doing chores, etc.
So laziness and basically taking the easy route would be the barrier. Or fear of failure.
I don't have much of a problem with adulting tbh. My issue is mainly health stuff. I don't think most people have adulting problems. Life is just harder than it used to be.
@Aramas: what kind of health stuff?
I don't feel like getting into it lol. But I went to college and did fine with stuff like taxes, filling out all the paperwork, going grocery shopping, doing chores, etc. by myself. I started cooking as a pre-teen, so that sorta thing has never been a challenge really. I eat simply.Originally Posted by remiges
IME with delta NFs the main issue is that they are thrust into extremely high-responsibility roles while being from essentially sheltered backgrounds. They have high expectations for themselves and lack confidence because of it, understandably. Like I know one IEE guy with two kids who is barely able to support himself... luckily his dad is a doctor though. I had an EII client in his early-mid 20s who was thrust into the role of running a big national company after his dad passed away, meanwhile becoming a dad soon with his wife (who is luckily his dual). These guys still look like kids themselves. But I saw him receive phonecalls from his company employees and he handled them skillfully, at least on the interpersonal front. His attitude was very mature even though he himself was kind of childlike and obviously inexperienced.
It’s this disparity and non-linearity of maturation that characterizes delta NFs to me. With a small amount of support they can basically do normal adulting stuff though. Children / Ne egos can also be “wise” lol.
@sbbds Thanks for the input.
So, assuming a delta NF was not from a sheltered background... would you support the claim that they could look very different than the typical description? Or do you think that said environment would have pushed them to develop more IE's, and have not become NF's in the first place?
For me it's not being able to do a job I hate but need because I need to pay my bills like an adult. It's me always putting my wants over my needs and not having self discipline to take care of my responsibilities first before doing what I want, like an adult. It's me being bad with money and time management, especially time management for things I do not care to do in the first place. Luckily my Se PoLR gets activated whenever emergencies are on the horizon, it kicks my ass into a panicking gear and gets all the crap that I have put off done, albeit in a very unhealthy and irresponsibly timed way, but hey it gets done. So yea it's me procrastinating my life into crap until I have no more option but to do what the thing I been putting off. But yea, screw being an adult, it's filled with bills and taxes til you die. For me it's this compulsive play > work attitude that doesn't go away once you past 25 like most other adults.
I think this might show up a few ways (at least for me):
1. What I not-so-affectionately call banal clerical work (that we all have to do) requires disproportionate mental effort for me. As of now I haven't gotten a new drivers license even though I've lived in a different state for almost a year and a half. I need to schedule some doctors appointments (that are several months overdue). Need some contact lenses (I've been wearing this pair for a few months now). Need to get some bills paid.
It builds up and stresses me out until I deal with it. It sucks, because it's so easy - I only think to myself, why am I so bad at it? I only need to take a day to sit down and mentally organize my life (I prefer to spend my time other ways, though...). I love when there are simple solutions to simple problems that don't require me to think, because I unnecessarily overcomplicate them
2. Related to the above - taking care of myself is a bit of a blind spot. I regularly fall asleep on the couch half slouched over. If it weren't for other people I might skip meals when I'm mentally preoccupied. I've had some health issues due to routine negligence when I was younger so I've made a very conscious effort not to be stupid about it.
3. I might come across as too casual. I'm a bit of an improviser and probably come across as less put-together than I'd like to be.
sucks. It essentially means having to work on a consistent basis (mostly if it's something you aren't passionate about, 40 hours every week, very little vacation time, 9-5, same shit every day etc.), have lack of freedom in life in terms of time, and have to focus on practical things on a daily basis... errands, business, finances, insurance, list goes on. One could view it in terms of merely being responsible, but I don't think its that black and white. It can be used to express a desire to go back to youth and just be more free, hence "adulting".
The examples I gave were the most extreme ones that I know. I can’t think of any delta NFs I know with unsheltered backgrounds, so I can’t say anything about them, but I’m sure they do exist. I know at least one beta NF (two including Tony Robbins) from an unsheltered environment though, so I don’t think the last thing you’re proposing is unequivocally the case. However, it’s possible through epigenetics or whatnot that it’s more likely the case than not.
What's a sheltered background. You're parents were well off and pampered you?
I don't think my background is more or less sheltered than anybodies and I don't think that changed my work ethic or maturation or whatever. The only thing I wished happened was that my dad would have forced me to learn to drive because I didn't until I was 27. My dad kept trying hammer in my head to be "responsible" since he was type 1 SLI with high standards, but it never mattered to me until I grew up, which sounds natural for kids, but I still seem to struggle with it.
How do you survive in the USA without a license until 27? I was driving by the time it was legal for me to do so lol. Do you have public transportation where you live?
And yeah most people are not really "sheltered." That's just a meme.
By being a burden.
I know that feeling. No need to feel ashamed.
Shames not always bad, it got me my license.
I haven't thought much about it, but it does seem like something IEEs say on Fakebook a lot. "Ugh I don't want to adult today!" /picture of 20 or 30 something caucasian female in bed with a house cat.
Lol at the insurance arbitration I just went to, the lawyer was all acting skeptical. "For the last 5 years, you didn't need a ride to the store?" *raise eyebrow*
No. I lived 2 blocks from trader joes, 4 blocks from target, 3 blocks from my phone company, and a quick bus ride to any other possible things I might need.
(I'm 35 and I've never driven. Anxiety about it.)
I really was never a burden even though apparently I'm lying about that lol.
Not everybody has the luxury of choosing their own apartment and selecting for the ability to live independently, though. But really, that's what you do.
I HATE relying on people. I avoid it when possible in part because of the whole pride thing but in part because things really are done better if done yourself - somebody else brings in all their complications.
I was actually looking in this thread and thinking about my insistence on adulting even if I'm not in the best position (because of youth or injury) to do so. I think being at the behest of other people and their unknowns and potential errors and potential things to account for hurts my Ne. After the car hit, when I had to live at my bfs parents (huge, beautiful) house and have the cooking and cleaning done for me, he said I was "living in the lap of luxury." THANKS I HATE IT. I eagerly looked elsewhere.
Re: sheltered, how I imagined sbbds meant though I’m not certain and hope I am not assuming too much - would have been an environment where being an NF naturally would not kill you. This doesn’t mean the family being well off, because even lower middle class could still support an NF even if not as well as a richer family... so I was thinking of very lower class, perhaps. Where you literally cannot daydream about feels if not you and your little sister will not eat for the day because your mom has to work two full time jobs and your dad is lying in the corner drunk. And even if there was an NF there... I bet their natural inclinations would not come out until years after being removed that situation and stable.
And so... perhaps there is a bit of a bias in that, in the sense of... we may never know if they were naturally “meant” to be an NF or not because unless they got into typology themselves and really did soul searching, they would certainly not match up to the usual outward behavior.
in other words idk
I meant something like that, yes. If you don’t think being sheltered is a thing, just look at Gwyneth Paltrow @Lord Pixel @Aramas (also, as I told you I don’t think you’re an EII Aramas). Not everyone needs to be rich as balls to be sheltered, just pampered and shielded from harsh realities, and not encouraged to push themselves, a little bit too much.
My very responsible SLI ex didn’t have a driver’s license until she was 35. She walked or took the bus everywhere, but Ann Arbor is a very walkable city.
Her reason for not driving was she had “lazy eye” and would sometimes see two images when she was tired, and she had a very hard time judging distances.
When she decided to buy a car, she researched the cheapest, most reliable new car available, then walked three or four miles to the dealership to buy it. It wasn’t in stock, so she walked next door and bought a different model. And, of course, had the requisite accident in it during her first three years of driving.
I was attracted to her because she seemed so mature and responsible, so on our first date, I insisted she drive my Jaguar XKE because it was so much fun to drive. 275 hp and more torque than a freight train in a 2500 lb car put it into race car territory. She didn’t want to drive it, but didn’t say why. I stupidly insisted. She popped the clutch and drove it sideways into my house’s brick chimney, which smashed every panel on the driver’s side of the car.
Last edited by Adam Strange; 02-01-2020 at 05:32 PM.
Driving is essentially life-threatening lmao. As if regular life weren’t threatening enough with this planet full of weirdos. Above examples are why I don’t really care that I don’t own a car or need to drive for a living yet.
I know your feeling about anxiety when driving. I've always had issues with driving, and I think they come from my parents yelling constantly when they were in the passenger seat. To this day, driving takes a lot of energy out of me, and I don't really enjoy it. The main reason I learned how was necessity, and because it was something everyone did where I live. Even without the anxiety, I think that having to constantly concentrate on the world around me and things moving by so fast somehow drains me. Of course, I think maybe a lot of people have a similar experience when driving of being stressed out, but they won't tell you even if you ask lol. They'll say, "Oh I love driving." But it means about as much as when people say, "Oh I love my job."
I don't judge you for not driving. Or anyone else really. I was really happy when I went to college and could just take the bus or walk. Having to sit with other people didn't bother me so much unless it was so packed that I felt squished. And then it depends on who you're squished next to.
I don't know what your sentence means, "But that's what you do." It didn't take sense to me in the context of the prior sentence maybe???
I looked her up on Wikipedia. I didn't see too much that indicated that she might be "sheltered." I think though that you can basically go around in circles all day if you want to argue about definitions because it's all subjective. I don't think anyone is sheltered because everyone experiences hardship of some kind during their lifetime. Paltrow isn't a trust fund baby anyway as far as I read. She's done acting and modeling stuff. Modeling in particular is really demanding and often exposes someone to harsh criticism about their bodies. That criticism in turn reveals something about human nature.
Lol... Yeah. If someone tells you they don't want to touch your expensive thing, they generally have a good reason for it.
Basically my dad paid my license and half forced me to do it. I don't have any plans to own a car. If someone gives me a car for free I wouldn't take it if I couldn't resell it... but money could work as well in this case.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
@Aramas It’s her character that makes it more obvious. Being criticized and told to be prettier is not on the same level as needing to deal with non-petty things. If you can’t see there could be a difference between this and think it’s all the same level then well... Ne polr IMO.
Do you live in Germany? I've heard licenses are expensive there.
I think it is quite high in EU region and it is getting more and more expensive for those who get it now (additional education) but no I live in Finland
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
Oh good to know. I've always liked the Nordic countries. Everywhere has problems, but you guys have taiga haha. As well as polar night in the North.
I'm not saying everything is the same, but everyone has dealt with something. Not trying to get involved in the pain Olympics....
I had EII suggested to me but one thing that I did not get was this child thing. I am aware of the possibility I may be reading too much into it (woops).
While I will joke sometimes about it (I recently bought a shirt that said "cleverly disguised as a responsible adult" which is ... in a way how I see myself), there is one thing that does not quite click in my mind, and that is specifically, that being a child is basically giving up all your power. Not sure I like this, to be at someone else's whim and to let them decide my fate because I don't want to be "practical," even if ideally, I wish I didn't have to do that shit, either. How do you guys relate to that?
Children can be powerful too. Cue a little kid pulling mom’s hair and screeching at her to buy them toys at Walmart.
Are you sure?
Well I def shouldn't be an NF then going by this.
I believe being sheltered is a thing. I just don't think I turned out much more mature than a sheltered EII. I think the whole infantile ego thing is probably more subconscious than based off environmental circumstances. Like I think anybody would be more mature than anybody who was sheltered, but as far as adulting I still feel unskilled compared to other people, even without being pampered my whole life.
Hell no, that's how I relate to it, I don't want to give up any kind of power. But I relate to your shirt, that's exactly how I feel. I used to cringe when I was around 18/20 and guys my same age would say things like "I'm a grown ass man." I used to cringe so hard, cuz I really felt like "Do you feel like a grown man? Cuz I don't yet." I never dared to say that out loud though. I feel like a fucking kid floundering through a bunch of adult crap with no idea what I'm doing but some how make it to the next day. And idk if it's type related because I've heard other ppl say it, but I always thought adulthood just hit you, like one day you just felt like one, maybe 20, maybe 25, and all of the sudden you just feel like and adult. I'm just glad the words grown man make me cringe alot less than when I was say 23. It feels more like a fact now than some kind of thing I have to feel like.
Me feeling like a kid is not me feeling like I give up my power, it's me feeling like here's all this serious important and responsible stuff that I should care a whole lot about, should be a huge priority to me, all this shit I should have together, and 1. I don't want to do any of it, or care much about any of it. and 2. I suck at it and have no idea what I'm doing half the time. The childish thing I want to do now that would bring me pleasure is make my own video game, how respectable and adult does that sound. If I worked at a big name studio it would, but being some guy doing that on his own to avoid getting a job, that sounds hella suspect, even though other guys hae done that and have made serious money. So I feel like a kid in an adult body, cuz all the things I want to do are just things that bring my joy and pleasure and I want nothing to do with the things that bore the crap out of me but are important, and those things are not things that I find easy to do. Like taxes, fuck taxes, probably not gonna do em until a week before they are due. That's how I relate to it.
I remember even saying the words in the middle of a toy store as a kid "I don't ever want to grow up." because it meant I couldn't go to places like that and be in awe of all the cool things I could play with. I felt like adults were grey and colorless, and I wanted no parts of that kinda life in my future. And then when I finally grew up and had all the expectations of an adult to fulfill, I felt like i cursed my self to stay stuck as a child when I said those words that day in the toy store lol. like oh God wtf did I do, now I'm stuck like this lol. If I'm totally honest, I feel like somewhere stuck inbetween boy and man. Saying I'm a child doesn't feel accurate, and saying I'm a grown man doesn't fully feel accurate either, but it's getting there.
Last edited by Lord Pixel; 02-02-2020 at 04:24 AM.
Coffee enemas and gold dildos, wow, that was great lol. It's even funnier that she's getting crap from a furry lol.
Based on your description, it sounds like your parents didn’t really push you to learn things until you really had to though or were really getting much deeper into adulthood? Out of curiosity, did you ever have any initiative to learn those things before that yourself? And did your parents ever want to preserve a sense of childlike dependence in you? I know some types of parents who are like that.
Anyway I don’t think you need to feel bad. It’s just a matter of practice. Everyone feels immature and dumb when they’re new to something. And everyone has both childish and mature aspects to them. Ironically it’s being aware of the childish parts of yourself that actually makes you mature.
My dad was disciplinary. If I didn't do my work he'd whoop my ass. He pretty much expected me to act like an adult even as a child. Which made no sense back then, but now it makes a ton.
What like learning to drive and taxes? I kiiiinda wanted to learn to drive, but taxes hell now then and hell no now.
My dad didn't force me to learn to drive cuz he pretty much said "You're not touching my car until you get your permit". And I didn't pass the test so I was SOL.
.. Ok. Well that would make someone have mixed feelings towards adulting for sure then yeah. :/ That really sucks to hear.
Taxes and driving are only a small part of life though and nobody likes them anyway. I don’t really see what’s terribly childlike here about your attitude.
It's also worth considering that in many US cities singles in their 20s have to do about all the maintenance tasks required (chores, taxes, doctors' appointments, sewing buttons back on, etc.) for a household (be it of one person), when older assumptions about social order expect households to have one homemaker and one worker (nuclear family). Aka household maintenance was not expected to be entirely by one person who also working a full-time job. Aka it's a lot of work.
Reason is a whore.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
