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Thread: Introverted Aggressors

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    @Mist

    I agree that desperateness isn't aggression but I've witnessed Ij aggression brought on by desperateness - them metaphorically being backed into a corner. I would never expect an LSI to like relativizing words; it's what sets us apart from one another

    a.k.a. I/O

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amber View Post
    Strange. I've always though Aggressors pick on some "hard to get" aspect that Victims project. In my experience they don't really like vulnerability ....unless it's something momentary in the whole "symphony" of dating&co.
    That's very well worded, with the moments in the symphony of all of it.


    Introverted Aggressors have this aura of solidity, they look very contained (and to a certain extent hard to approach themselves) and observe you for a long time before getting into "attack mode". They like more games of sexual tension than extroverted ones, who are fairly straightforward in their approach. With ES_Ps there's hardly anything unpredictable, you usually know from second 2 when they want to get you and they will just pursue you instinctively. It's as if they don't need to process much of the whole interaction, they just react to immediate stimuli.
    Oh yes the observing thing before attack mode fits very much.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ares View Post
    LSI most likely won't give a damn and just start interacting with their chosen partner as if they already agreed to be together. ESI will probably be more cat-like and draw things out longer to see if their partner meets their expections before closing in.
    Er that makes no sense for the LSI one. I dunno about ESI but the LSI one really doesn't fit in this way. You may be confusing it with the male SLE stereotype thingy.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    In an online context:

    ---> the extrovert aggressor will show up in your private messages and be determined to talk to you
    ---> the introvert aggressor will seemingly be around wherever you post something

    They are both very sure about their choice but the first can never be indirect. The second appears to be testing the waters even if they are already certain.
    Private messaging online hardly requires extraversion lol. I find the latter a bit too indirect unless you mean this only goes on for a short time like that before going direct.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    @Mist

    I agree that desperateness isn't aggression but I've witnessed Ij aggression brought on by desperateness - them metaphorically being backed into a corner. I would never expect an LSI to like relativizing words; it's what sets us apart from one another
    Gotcha. And lol about the last comment

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    I'm looking for an ESI who is smart and attractive (which is pretty shallow, right? I know ,) and who lives in my zip code. Since I don't want to waste time with dating random people for months only to find they are SEI, I've been trying really hard to learn VI. I think I'm getting fairly good at it, for the most part. I might sometimes confuse some types and miss some ESI's, but generally, I think I'm getting closer.

    So I arrive at this hotel that is close to one of my best customers (time to hammer out their future needs for the next year) late on Monday night and its entire lobby is being renovated and is a construction nightmare with drywall and heat lamps and ladders and plastic sheet but a receptionist is there and she can see me arrive through the front windows and doors and motions me to come in because they are open, which is good because it is very late and I made a reservation. She is blonde and not that friendly but nice enough, and very nicely dressed, and as she checks me in I'm thinking she looks like an ESI, so I ask her what she is studying (she was looking at a laptop when I arrived) and she says she's not studying, she's writing a book, and she has a Master's degree in writing.

    It's late and I'm tired because I've been traveling for half the day and most of my filters are off so I say "And what can you do with a Master's degree in writing?", implying that she's headed for a life of frustration, debt and servitude, and she says she has six published books and is working on her next one.

    And I blink and look closely at her and Yep She's an ESI. So while I'm contemplating my stupidity she goes on and says that she wishes she could hurry up the writing process because it takes so long to write a book and the advances are only like $10k. (My brother-in-law is a book publisher, and he told me the author gets one-third of the book's sale price plus the advance so yeah, it would be good to have this as passive income and would also be good to hurry up the process.) I think about this for two seconds and say, "Maybe you could have the plot outlines organized on a spreadsheet. That way, you could keep track of several books at once, and work on one or the other as inspiration strikes, and you could keep all the details of each plot straight.", because I know that task-switching is an efficiency killer.

    And she looks at me and her face doesn't move but she's like falling in love with Te and says "Oh! That's a good idea" and hands me the key to my room and tells me where it is, and I can tell that even though she's doing everything normally, she's now thinking about me, and I'm thinking, Yep, Dual.

    The next evening I get back from my customer earlier, 8PM (progress, but no contracts yet), and the regular girl is there (an LIE manager - I've stayed there before and she knows me) and she says "Good evening, Mr. Strange" and because I make an effort to be polite I ask her what is the name of the new girl and she tells me and says "She's new. She's my cousin. She's really nice."

    And just as we're talking, the ESI comes in for the start of her night shift and the LIE manager kind of gasps and says "Just when I told you she was nice, she comes in looking like that", because the ESI is not dressed as she was last night, but now looks like she's going to do some of the construction work herself. And I think to myself, ESI's only care about who a person is, not their looks because looks fade, and she is dressed that way to test me to see if I still think she's nice, which I do, because she actually is nice. I asked the LIE manager "Do you guys talk a lot?" and she says "Yes, we get along great. We talk about everything. Our mothers are sisters, and they took turns raising us." So now I know that twenty minutes after I leave the lobby, the ESI will know everything about my history there, every conversation I've ever had with the LIE manager, and in thirty minutes the credit limits on my credit cards.

    The next night negotiations go on late because tomorrow is the last day and they want stuff that has never existed before and some of it violates the laws of physics and is impossible and they don't know that and don't care. It's way after midnight when we stop, I look for my hotel room key and can't find it. I drive back to the hotel and call ahead to see if they can have a new key ready for me because I need to get to sleep fast and the ESI answers and says sure.

    When I get there the place is absolutely deserted, except for the ESI working on her laptop behind the plastic sheets. She's wearing what looks like just her underwear. I go up to the desk and say "Do you normally work in your underwear?" and she looks up, smiles at me and says "The heat lamps for drying the drywall make it so hot in here!" Then she bounces up, runs around the corner of the lobby and in a heartbeat is back wearing a red track suit. I mean, she got dressed in like fifteen seconds. She hands me the room key, smiles, and says "Have a nice night." But I'm a zombie at this point and I return to my room and I do have a night before checking out the next morning, but not a particularly nice one.

    She, of course, is not in my zip code and so is outside of my prospecting range, but she is definitely an introverted Aggressor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Oh yes the observing thing before attack mode fits very much.

    What does attack mode consist of? I am hearing both Overt and Discreet types of "aggression" as it relates to introverts in the thread.

    I've had girls (who I later dated) ignore me for a long time and then make subtle attempts at a casual interaction. Is that aggression? A simple interaction as an attempt to break the ice?


    Is it much different than SLE SEE and how so and do you believe an Se/Ti or Se/Fi act differently among subtypes? Thnx

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    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    I've had girls (who I later dated) ignore me for a long time and then make subtle attempts at a casual interaction. Is that aggression? A simple interaction as an attempt to break the ice?
    It means she likes you, but she's still unsure and needs to observe you, a little intimidated, and doesn't want to appear as easy. It's not aggression in socionics interpretation.

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    Attack mode look like


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    Quote Originally Posted by peteronfireee View Post
    Attack mode look like

    is this how you go after girls?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Milo View Post
    It means she likes you, but she's still unsure and needs to observe you, a little intimidated, and doesn't want to appear as easy. It's not aggression in socionics interpretation.
    Thanks, I understand they like you, I was just wondering if this falls under "aggressor" behavior because this seems as overt as it gets with the Se introverts with gender differences accounted.
    Reading the thread I am wondering why socionics ascribes the term aggressor to people who take zero initiative.

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    I'm not sure what romance style this would be, but from as far back as I can remember, I would have a crush on a girl and she would be my only focus. I would watch her from afar and slowly interact more and more until I would muster up the courage to ask her out. Sometimes the person would have no idea was I interested until I approached them. I would find their number, call them to ask them out or eventually walk up to them and ask them out all nervously. I would be the one to ask them to dance too. Usually, the person would decline and I would still try a few times before I realized it just wasn't going to happen, just to make sure. Then I would forget about her. Eventually, a new love interest would develop and the process would continue. I had no problem asking out. It's like that was expected. I was a little turned off by women I wasn't interested in that would ask me out, probably because I hadn't thought about them in that way and had my mind on someone else.
    Important to note! People who share "indentical" socionics TIMs won't necessarily appear to be very similar, since they have have different backgrounds, experiences, capabilities, genetics, as well as different types in other typological systems (enneagram, instinctual variants, etc.) all of which also have a sway on compatibility and identification. Thus, Socionics type "identicals" won't necessarily be identical i.e. highly similar to each other, and not all people of "dual" types will seem interesting, attractive and appealing to each other.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nate Chur View Post
    I'm not sure what romance style this would be, but from as far back as I can remember, I would have a crush on a girl and she would be my only focus. I would watch her from afar and slowly interact more and more until I would muster up the courage to ask her out. Sometimes the person would have no idea was I interested until I approached them. I would find their number, call them to ask them out or eventually walk up to them and ask them out all nervously. I would be the one to ask them to dance too. Usually, the person would decline and I would still try a few times before I realized it just wasn't going to happen, just to make sure. Then I would forget about her. Eventually, a new love interest would develop and the process would continue. I had no problem asking out. It's like that was expected. I was a little turned off by women I wasn't interested in that would ask me out, probably because I hadn't thought about them in that way and had my mind on someone else.

    This is really interesting.
    In high school, I was incredibly interested in Astronomy and telescopes, and had even taken a night class to learn how to make the optics. I made my interest known to some of my classmates (my HS had 2500 kids in three grades) with a few, very low-key actions, like bringing my Newtonian telescope in to calculus class to demonstrate the practical properties of parabolas of revolution.

    One day, I was walking home from school and this older kid I had never seen before approached me on a corner downtown and said, with a tiny hint of nervousness (but I'm good at defusing nervousness), "You're that guy interested in Astronomy. I'm interested in astronomy, too." We talked about astronomy and telescopes and math as we walked home, and we became best friends in no time. To this day, that guy is my oldest and best friend. He is an ESI-Se, and I, of course, am an LIE-Te.

    I have always thought there was something strange about the way that he approached me that day, like he had done a huge amount of homework on me, and was just waiting for an opportunity to approach me and say something.

    Even though he knew a lot about me and I knew absolutely nothing about him, it made no difference after a few minutes, because we quickly bonded over our mutual interests. @Nate Chur, thanks. Your explanation helps to confirm and clarify some of my impressions of that first meeting.
    Last edited by Adam Strange; 03-07-2017 at 01:39 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    This is really interesting.
    In high school, I was incredibly interested in Astronomy and telescopes, and had even taken a night class to learn how to make the optics. I made my interest known to some of my classmates (my HS had 2500 kids in three grades) with a few, very low-key actions, like bringing my Newtonian telescope in to calculus class to demonstrate the practical properties of parabolas of revolution.

    One day, I was walking home from school and this older kid I had never seen before approached me on a corner downtown and said, with a tiny hint of nervousness (but I'm good at defusing nervousness), "You're that guy interested in Astronomy. I'm interested in astronomy, too." We talked about astronomy and telescopes and math as we walked home, and we became best friends in no time. To this day, that guy is my oldest and best friend. He is an ESI-Se, and I, of course, am an LIE-Te.

    I have always thought there was something strange about the way that he approached me that day, like he had done a huge amount of homework on me, and was just waiting for an opportunity to pop up and say something. @Nate Chur, your explanation helps to confirm and clarify some of my impressions of that first meeting.
    That's funny because I like astronomy too, lol.
    Important to note! People who share "indentical" socionics TIMs won't necessarily appear to be very similar, since they have have different backgrounds, experiences, capabilities, genetics, as well as different types in other typological systems (enneagram, instinctual variants, etc.) all of which also have a sway on compatibility and identification. Thus, Socionics type "identicals" won't necessarily be identical i.e. highly similar to each other, and not all people of "dual" types will seem interesting, attractive and appealing to each other.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nate Chur View Post
    I'm not sure what romance style this would be, but from as far back as I can remember, I would have a crush on a girl and she would be my only focus. I would watch her from afar and slowly interact more and more until I would muster up the courage to ask her out. Sometimes the person would have no idea was I interested until I approached them. I would find their number, call them to ask them out or eventually walk up to them and ask them out all nervously. I would be the one to ask them to dance too. Usually, the person would decline and I would still try a few times before I realized it just wasn't going to happen, just to make sure. Then I would forget about her. Eventually, a new love interest would develop and the process would continue. I had no problem asking out. It's like that was expected. I was a little turned off by women I wasn't interested in that would ask me out, probably because I hadn't thought about them in that way and had my mind on someone else.
    This sounds like me, although I only ask out once and don't keep trying after a firm no. I focus on one person as well, with feelings building up for some time before I decide I want to date this person. Sounds victim. LIE should initiate although this is still hard for me, never quite sure how much I am into someone. Takes me a long time to be attracted to someone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    What does attack mode consist of? I am hearing both Overt and Discreet types of "aggression" as it relates to introverts in the thread.

    I've had girls (who I later dated) ignore me for a long time and then make subtle attempts at a casual interaction. Is that aggression? A simple interaction as an attempt to break the ice?

    Is it much different than SLE SEE and how so and do you believe an Se/Ti or Se/Fi act differently among subtypes? Thnx
    No that's not aggression lol. That's just, attempt to break the ice. At least not entirely passive of course.

    It's different from Se bases, yes. I called it "attack mode" because it's a distinct new phase and distinctly more active and decisive after the observation phase. I'm more direct than the subtle attempts thing you write about.

    Whatever it consists of specifically depends on the situation. Give me a type of situation and I can say more.


    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    Thanks, I understand they like you, I was just wondering if this falls under "aggressor" behavior because this seems as overt as it gets with the Se introverts with gender differences accounted.
    Reading the thread I am wondering why socionics ascribes the term aggressor to people who take zero initiative.
    Zero initiative - that's not me. I may want a signal first before I take initiative but in some cases not needed. With ESI-Fi's, I think it's more soft/subtle, if that's the type you were mainly thinking of.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    I called it "attack mode" because it's a distinct new phase and distinctly more active and decisive after the observation phase. I'm more direct than the subtle attempts thing you write about.

    Whatever it consists of specifically depends on the situation. Give me a type of situation and I can say more.

    ESI Fi probably use a softer/subtle approach.
    A coworker who has been ignoring me that I have caught staring at me several times is moving in after ignoring and avoiding me for a year. She's everywhere suddenly......dropping comments when I am in earsthot and talking with people in my "clique" that she never spoke to before. Engages everyone but me, never makes eye contact, it's odd. I can tell she is trying to get me to interact subtly. . She was very rude to me the 2 times I interacted with her in the past so I never speak to her. Never done a thing to this woman. Suddenly she's a sweetheart. I don't understand any of her behavior. She's closing in.......or she hates me.
    Last edited by hatesyardwork; 03-09-2017 at 01:12 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    A coworker who has been ignoring me that I have caught staring at me several times is moving in after ignoring and avoiding me for a year. She's everywhere suddenly......dropping comments when I am in earsthot and talking with people in my "clique" that she never spoke to before. Engages everyone but me, never makes eye contact, it's odd. I can tell she is trying to get me to interact subtly. . She was very rude to me the 2 times I interacted with her in the past so I never speak to her. Never done a thing to this woman. Suddenly she's a sweetheart. I don't understand any of her behavior. She's closing in.......or she hates me.

    Lol.

    Now, why would you think that?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Lol.

    Now, why would you think that?
    My Ni has narrowed it down to those 2 possibilities.

    My Te has narrowed it down to one solution assuming she is closing the distance.........playing it cool, letting her get close, and punching her in the face.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    My Ni has narrowed it down to those 2 possibilities.

    My Te has narrowed it down to one solution assuming she is closing the distance.........playing it cool, letting her get close, and punching her in the face.
    Your perception might be right, but this relationship does not sound healthy.

    Personally, I like to spend my time with people with whom I feel like I'm accepted and can be a better person.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    A coworker who has been ignoring me that I have caught staring at me several times is moving in after ignoring and avoiding me for a year. She's everywhere suddenly......dropping comments when I am in earsthot and talking with people in my "clique" that she never spoke to before. Engages everyone but me, never makes eye contact, it's odd. I can tell she is trying to get me to interact subtly. . She was very rude to me the 2 times I interacted with her in the past so I never speak to her. Never done a thing to this woman. Suddenly she's a sweetheart. I don't understand any of her behavior. She's closing in.......or she hates me.
    I don't really get that sort of behaviour. Sounds like some Ethical type for sure. You think she might be your dual?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    I don't really get that sort of behaviour. Sounds like some Ethical type for sure. You think she might be your dual?
    ESI I think. She is mute and shy around me and very rude for no reason a couple of times. Rolled her eyes at me once when I joined in conversation, it was so out of place that I called her on it "what the fuck is that look for"? Caught a couple of dirty looks. Again I don't really even know her, never talk to her or socialize. I leave her alone, but if we bump into each other she is very tense around me. Won't look at me when we pass each other, but I catch her looking at me often from afar. Lately she is much more talkative "around" me, not to me but to others I converse with. She comments to others I am speaking with but not to me. She doesn't join in, walks by and says something. This weird friendly and funny side I have never seen from her around me.
    She is closing in or she hates me.
    Last edited by hatesyardwork; 03-09-2017 at 10:58 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    ESI I think. She is mute and shy around me and very rude for no reason a couple of times. Rolled her eyes at me once when I joined in conversation, it was so out of place that I called her on it "what the fuck is that look for"? Caught a couple of dirty looks. Again I don't really even know her, never talk to her or socialize. I leave her alone, but if we bump into each other she is very tense around me. Won't look at me when we pass each other, but I catch her looking at me often from afar. Lately she is much more talkative "around" me, not to me but to others I converse with. She comments to others I am speaking with but not to me. She doesn't join in, walks by and says something. This weird friendly and funny side I have never seen from her around me.
    She is closing in or she hates me.
    And you are LIE yeah?

    Sorry I can't give advice there, this would be pretty confusing to me too. Good luck tho'

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    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    ESI I think. She is mute and shy around me and very rude for no reason a couple of times. Rolled her eyes at me once when I joined in conversation, it was so out of place that I called her on it "what the fuck is that look for"? Caught a couple of dirty looks. Again I don't really even know her, never talk to her or socialize. I leave her alone, but if we bump into each other she is very tense around me. Won't look at me when we pass each other, but I catch her looking at me often from afar. Lately she is much more talkative "around" me, not to me but to others I converse with. She comments to others I am speaking with but not to me. She doesn't join in, walks by and says something. This weird friendly and funny side I have never seen from her around me.
    She is closing in or she hates me.
    Sounds like she doesn't like you and is trying to win your friends over to her side.

    You might wanna make sure she isn't spreading some rumors about you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Resonare View Post
    Sounds like she doesn't like you and is trying to win your friends over to her side.

    You might wanna make sure she isn't spreading some rumors about you.
    @Resonare, do ESI's really do that?

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    ESIs sometimes have reservations about someone but not really know why; it seems almost instinctual with little basis in fact. It often takes someone else to actively probe the ESIs information or rationale, or lack thereof - to force the ESI to address the real source of problem rather than the wrong one they're maintaining. Sometimes they cannot see beyond their own noses and will allow issues to fester, and as time goes on, will become more convinced that they're right. Their hyper-cautiousness seems manifest itself as rash (jump-to-conclusions) decision making. They further defeat themselves with their isolationist behaviour toward those suspicious others and their seeming inability to clear the air especially when it might involve conflict of even a minor nature.

    a.k.a. I/O

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    @Resonare, do ESI's really do that?
    I highly doubt she is ESI.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Resonare View Post
    I highly doubt she is ESI.
    My best guess. Some type of ethical introvert I believe, although SEI doesn't seem right. No Fe displaying ever was my basis for typing. Keeps everyone at a distance. Maybe LSI or SLI, admitting I am more familiar with men than women of these types.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    ESIs sometimes have reservations about someone but not really know why; it seems almost instinctual with little basis in fact. It often takes someone else to actively probe the ESIs information or rationale, or lack thereof - to force the ESI to address the real source of problem rather than the wrong one they're maintaining. Sometimes they cannot see beyond their own noses and will allow issues to fester, and as time goes on, will become more convinced that they're right. Their hyper-cautiousness seems manifest itself as rash (jump-to-conclusions) decision making. They further defeat themselves with their isolationist behaviour toward those suspicious others and their seeming inability to clear the air especially when it might involve conflict of even a minor nature.

    a.k.a. I/O
    Wow, this is rings true for me. Rude to me from day one, without even interacting with me. Nice to others.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    And you are LIE yeah?

    Sorry I can't give advice there, this would be pretty confusing to me too. Good luck tho'
    Are SLI females very coy? I got her ESI, others are questioning my typing. I include "watching" from afar as coy, not engaging too much before you decide to go into attack mode.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    ESIs sometimes have reservations about someone but not really know why; it seems almost instinctual with little basis in fact. It often takes someone else to actively probe the ESIs information or rationale, or lack thereof - to force the ESI to address the real source of problem rather than the wrong one they're maintaining. Sometimes they cannot see beyond their own noses and will allow issues to fester, and as time goes on, will become more convinced that they're right. Their hyper-cautiousness seems manifest itself as rash (jump-to-conclusions) decision making. They further defeat themselves with their isolationist behaviour toward those suspicious others and their seeming inability to clear the air especially when it might involve conflict of even a minor nature.
    ESI E6 version?

    I've seen ESI that isn't so afraid of conflict. She does have the cautious, panicky "negativist" Ne PoLR of ESI but conflict always alright by her if she has to face it. Not sure about her enneagram but if 6 then not the entirely phobic 6 for sure .

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    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    Are SLI females very coy? I got her ESI, others are questioning my typing. I include "watching" from afar as coy, not engaging too much before you decide to go into attack mode.
    I dunno about SLIs. I can do the watching from afar thing myself (depending on what kind of interest I have in someone and on how they behave, etc), no idea if it looks coy lol. But I don't do this indirect manipulation thingy with talking to other people instead of the person I'm interested in or the rude/dirty looks or whatever.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    I dunno about SLIs. I can do the watching from afar thing myself (depending on what kind of interest I have in someone and on how they behave, etc), no idea if it looks coy lol.
    Sorry I meant LSI. I tried reading the romancing an LSI thread but the comments are all over the place.
    Last edited by hatesyardwork; 03-10-2017 at 06:27 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    ESI E6 version? I've seen ESI that isn't so afraid of conflict...........
    You must be referring to their Jeanne d'Arc mode, which is when they can no longer cope and their inner dual (LIE) emerges causing them to want to metaphorically conqueror all the heretics. I find it that takes a lot of stewing before they go Napoleon and then it's an eruption.....

    a.k.a. I/O

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    Quote Originally Posted by hatesyardwork View Post
    Sorry I meant LSI. I tried reading the romancing an LSI thread but the comments are all over the place.
    That thread was mainly talking about putting LSI in a good mood a lot, which sure, works as a first step.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    You must be referring to their Jeanne d'Arc mode, which is when they can no longer cope and their inner dual (LIE) emerges causing them to want to metaphorically conqueror all the heretics. I find it that takes a lot of stewing before they go Napoleon and then it's an eruption.....
    Maybe. She's often in this mode about some things. About people less often but it happens.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I'm looking for an ESI who is smart and attractive (which is pretty shallow, right? I know ,) and who lives in my zip code. Since I don't want to waste time with dating random people for months only to find they are SEI, I've been trying really hard to learn VI. I think I'm getting fairly good at it, for the most part. I might sometimes confuse some types and miss some ESI's, but generally, I think I'm getting closer.

    So I arrive at this hotel that is close to one of my best customers (time to hammer out their future needs for the next year) late on Monday night and its entire lobby is being renovated and is a construction nightmare with drywall and heat lamps and ladders and plastic sheet but a receptionist is there and she can see me arrive through the front windows and doors and motions me to come in because they are open, which is good because it is very late and I made a reservation. She is blonde and not that friendly but nice enough, and very nicely dressed, and as she checks me in I'm thinking she looks like an ESI, so I ask her what she is studying (she was looking at a laptop when I arrived) and she says she's not studying, she's writing a book, and she has a Master's degree in writing.

    It's late and I'm tired because I've been traveling for half the day and most of my filters are off so I say "And what can you do with a Master's degree in writing?", implying that she's headed for a life of frustration, debt and servitude, and she says she has six published books and is working on her next one.

    And I blink and look closely at her and Yep She's an ESI. So while I'm contemplating my stupidity she goes on and says that she wishes she could hurry up the writing process because it takes so long to write a book and the advances are only like $10k. (My brother-in-law is a book publisher, and he told me the author gets one-third of the book's sale price plus the advance so yeah, it would be good to have this as passive income and would also be good to hurry up the process.) I think about this for two seconds and say, "Maybe you could have the plot outlines organized on a spreadsheet. That way, you could keep track of several books at once, and work on one or the other as inspiration strikes, and you could keep all the details of each plot straight.", because I know that task-switching is an efficiency killer.

    And she looks at me and her face doesn't move but she's like falling in love with Te and says "Oh! That's a good idea" and hands me the key to my room and tells me where it is, and I can tell that even though she's doing everything normally, she's now thinking about me, and I'm thinking, Yep, Dual.

    The next evening I get back from my customer earlier, 8PM (progress, but no contracts yet), and the regular girl is there (an LIE manager - I've stayed there before and she knows me) and she says "Good evening, Mr. Strange" and because I make an effort to be polite I ask her what is the name of the new girl and she tells me and says "She's new. She's my cousin. She's really nice."

    And just as we're talking, the ESI comes in for the start of her night shift and the LIE manager kind of gasps and says "Just when I told you she was nice, she comes in looking like that", because the ESI is not dressed as she was last night, but now looks like she's going to do some of the construction work herself. And I think to myself, ESI's only care about who a person is, not their looks because looks fade, and she is dressed that way to test me to see if I still think she's nice, which I do, because she actually is nice. I asked the LIE manager "Do you guys talk a lot?" and she says "Yes, we get along great. We talk about everything. Our mothers are sisters, and they took turns raising us." So now I know that twenty minutes after I leave the lobby, the ESI will know everything about my history there, every conversation I've ever had with the LIE manager, and in thirty minutes the credit limits on my credit cards.

    The next night negotiations go on late because tomorrow is the last day and they want stuff that has never existed before and some of it violates the laws of physics and is impossible and they don't know that and don't care. It's way after midnight when we stop, I look for my hotel room key and can't find it. I drive back to the hotel and call ahead to see if they can have a new key ready for me because I need to get to sleep fast and the ESI answers and says sure.

    When I get there the place is absolutely deserted, except for the ESI working on her laptop behind the plastic sheets. She's wearing what looks like just her underwear. I go up to the desk and say "Do you normally work in your underwear?" and she looks up, smiles at me and says "The heat lamps for drying the drywall make it so hot in here!" Then she bounces up, runs around the corner of the lobby and in a heartbeat is back wearing a red track suit. I mean, she got dressed in like fifteen seconds. She hands me the room key, smiles, and says "Have a nice night." But I'm a zombie at this point and I return to my room and I do have a night before checking out the next morning, but not a particularly nice one.

    She, of course, is not in my zip code and so is outside of my prospecting range, but she is definitely an introverted Aggressor.

    Interesting. Is this a chapter from a book you are writing?

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
    YWIMW

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Interesting. Is this a chapter from a book you are writing?
    Maybe.

    Let me tell you about my experiences with IEI's......

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Maybe.

    Let me tell you about my experiences with IEI's......
    You don't want to do that.

    Not today anyway.


    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
    YWIMW

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    My experience with being chased by ISxjs is that they are really obvious while trying NOT to be obvious It's endearing, really.
    Not to derail this thread onto the Infantile-Caregiver axis, but I was in the office of a male SLI when a female IEE came in and asked for a report while smiling, kind of approaching and receding from his desk, turning to show her ass and leaning over to show her chest while talking non-stop, and he's like OMG she has a great ass and great tits and he says, carefully, really, really trying hard to focus, "Uh, when did you need that report?", like that was the only thing on his mind.

    Honestly, when she bent over and he tried not to look, I could see the circuit breakers popping in his head, turning a guy with a PhD instantly stupid. It's like he has no defenses against this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Not to derail this thread onto the Infantile-Caregiver axis, but I was in the office of a male SLI when a female IEE came in and asked for a report while smiling, kind of approaching and receding from his desk, turning to show her ass and leaning over to show her chest while talking non-stop, and he's like OMG she has a great ass and great tits and he says, carefully, really, really trying hard to focus, "Uh, when did you need that report?", like that was the only thing on his mind.

    Honestly, when she bent over and he tried not to look, I could see the circuit breakers popping in his head, turning a guy with a PhD instantly stupid. It's like he has no defenses against this.
    Yeah it's like ESIs (who are usually pretty chill with people and not very excitable or easy to shake) and LSIs (who are generally really coherent and sensible) just can't "act normal" in these circumstances. ESIs just get this lightening-in-a-jar thing going on, and LSIs loose handle on their emotions. Pretty funny really, to see such self contained people show sign of lack of control.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GuavaDrunk View Post
    I'm reasonably direct about approaching people and talking, but I don't have the *ahem* weightiness to just jump on them.

    One thing that could be a built-in* response to introverted aggression is that if I discover someone reasonably unobjectionable looking at me interestedly, then I have no qualms about going up and saying hi.

    They have to be direct about it too though. If their interest is too ambiguous, or morphs into some variety of blank-faced, disinterested evasiveness when I chat to them, then I'm straight out of Compton. Ain't got the time or interest to *convince* people to be interested in me. *psht*

    *Socionics rules all.
    Hear Hear!
    Blank faced evasiveness is not an effective method of maintaining my interest as well. I tend to view myself as the prize, which keeps me quite single.

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    So I saw this woman at a place I visit who is attractive in an ESI-Se way, so I started to flirt with her whenever I passed her desk. By flirting, I mean, going out of my way to say something fairly normal to her. Like, "Where is a good place to eat around here?", or "What are the rates for renting a space in this building?", and "If I go out the front doors, can you let me back in?" (High security building, I guess...)
    She pretty much didn't respond to me any more than absolutely required, and even then, she looked at me like I was potentially trouble and almost certainly of bad moral character. I got pretty discouraged at her uniformly taciturn responses. I kind of figured that she thought I was a creep. Which I am, but a nice creep. Still, I persisted.
    Last week, I asked her if she worked full time and what her hours were? She said she did work full time from eight to four. I said, "Oh", in a disappointed way. "So you work through lunch." and walked away while she just stared at me.
    Today, I followed her into the break room and said "I'd like to take you out.."
    "Yes"
    "..to lunch."

    Introverted aggressors.

    Now to see if we can agree on a day, since she said her schedule was pretty full.

    I gave her my name and phone number and address, so she probably has my dental records and last few deposit amounts into my 401k by now. We shall see if that deters her.

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