Fragment

[Cone]

Here's a fragment of what I need to say, because I can't hold it in any longer.

Cognitive psychologists try to partition the mind into separate modalities, which are areas of the brain that deal with like cognitive processes. Modalities are set off from each other by how much interconnectivity there is in one area and how little connectivity there is between these different areas. The brain can be split into many different modalities, but combining these, there are only two: the verbal modality and the non-verbal modality. Verbal refers to language processing, and non-verbal refers to any processing that does not require spoken language (mostly visual elements).

It is in my belief that the functions rest on these two modalities. The verbal functions are T and F, the non-verbal functions are N and S. Any information processing in any of the functions takes place solely in one of these modalities.

To go even further, Kepinski, Gross, and the cognitive psychologists have shown that information metabolism is split into two parts: analysis and synthesis. The analysis process is the simple collecting of information; it takes in the whole and splits it into its parts. After that, the synthesis process creates associations between that information; it takes the parts and assembles them into the whole. This is also the process of understanding.

So J types accept information verbally and synthesize it non-verbally. P types accept information non-verbally and synthesize it verbally.

There is plenty more that can be derived from this, but for now, this post was only meant to be a fragment...


Your INTp friend,

Cone

[implied]

lk;j

[ayoforjager]

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[Cone]

i'm thinking that it can't be divided solely into just j and p, and that a lot of this rides on the other functions (maybe temperaments would be useful here.)

There is alot more to these modalities than just words and pictures. There are ways that I can show why j types or p types act the way they do based on verbal/non-verbal processing. Plus, there are other facets to the functions that influence how this information gets analyzed/synthesized.

cone, this makes sense, but what about Se types? When they get together and don't stop talking, are they accepting information or synthesizing it?

or do they accept information nonverbally, unless that information happens to be another person talking?

For p-types, speech is automatically converted into non-verbal cues. They analyze the visual image they get when you say the word, 'apple', for instance. Then verbal information is synthesized from there. The verbal modality deals with representing things by language, thus we can derive certain j-type characteristics from there.

The analysis process works by expectations. Since a j-type represents the world verbally, he will expect non-verbal elements to fall under his analysis. And what things are mainly verbal? Logic, rules, ethics, what one "should" or "shouldn't" do, what is "right" or "wrong", etc. So for a j-type, these verbal rules govern the non-verbal world. For a p-type then, he expects verbal elements to fall under non-verbal analysis, thus we get that "the rules apply here but not there." Non-verbal elements are visual/auditory thoughts (not physical sensations), description, illustration, spatial processing, etc.

I find that I can understand words, concepts, etc. without actually putting any effort into thinking, but if I'm actyally doing something (synthesizing information?) my body, mind, or whatever will perform a lot better when I actually think to myself, in words, what I'm doing. Is this me in Te mode?

This is the understanding process. You will understand a concept better if you make verbal connections between your non-verbal elements. Note that IxTp types are experts in inventing methods. You know what do to, now you just need to make the rules that explain it.

When I'm too lazy to think, and I sort of think without thinking (have an idea, know I have the idea, but not actually think it to myself, it's more of a picture or a memory or a audio/spatial thought, or some connection between any of the above) I'm assuming this comes from the Si function, and is still unmmolded clay.

is just as much unmolded clay as the next function. What you are describing may be correct, but I'm not entirely sure.

Some more post-it notes, please.

[Cone]

how do you experience Ni BEFORE you start thinking to yourself and molding it into thoughts? what do your ideas look like (or feel like, since a lot of Si is that too). It would be interesting to look at the differences/similarities between how people experience those two functions....

I have theories about this, but I'm not really sure of their validity. All I can say is that T/S thinks in "wholes" and F/N thinks in "fragments". Or maybe T/S is convergent thinking, and F/N is divergent thinking. Again, I'm not so sure about this. I could write about it if you are interested.

[Creepy-pokeball]

If I remember right I think Jung thought that Fe gathered a lot of minute details into one whole and described it as a very cold process that somehow gave off warmth. Very strange lol.

Im not sure about Ni or even Ne. Im guessing it has to do with checking against the absence of... something. Jungs archetype checking didnt really make sense and seemed a bit far fetched for me.

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"The Introverted Intuition Type
Introverted intuition is directed inward to the contents of the unconscious. It attempts to fathom internal events by relating them to universal psychological processes or to other archetypal images. Consequently it generally has a mythical, symbolic or prophetic quality.

According to Jung, the introverted intuition type can be either an artist, seer or crank. Such a person has a visionary ideal that reveals strange, mysterious things. These are enigmatic, 'unearthly' people who stand aloof from ordinary society. They have little interest in explaining or rationalizing their personal vision, but are content merely to proclaim it. Partly as a result of this, they are often misunderstood. Although the vision of the artist among this type generally remains on the purely perceptual level, mystical dreamers or cranks may become caught up in theirs. The person's life then becomes symbolic, taking on the nature of a Great Work, mission or spiritual-moral quest. If neurotic, repressed sensation may express itself in primitive, instinctual ways and, like their extraverted counterparts, introverted intuitives often suffer from hypochondria and compulsions."

"
The remarkable indifference of the extraverted intuitive in respect to outer objects is shared by the introverted intuitive in relation to the inner objects. Just as the extraverted intuitive is continually scenting out new [p. 507] possibilities, which he pursues with an equal unconcern both for his own welfare and for that of others, pressing on quite heedless of human considerations, tearing down what has only just been established in his everlasting search for change, so the introverted intuitive moves from image to image, chasing after every possibility in the teeming womb of the unconscious, without establishing any connection between the phenomenon and himself. Just as the world can never become a moral problem for the man who merely senses it, so the world of images is never a moral problem to the intuitive. To the one just as much as to the other, it is an ae[]sthenic problem, a question of perception, a 'sensation'. In this way, the consciousness of his own bodily existence fades from the introverted intuitive's view, as does its effect upon others. The extraverted standpoint would say of him: 'Reality has no existence for him; he gives himself up to fruitless phantasies'. A perception of the unconscious images, produced in such inexhaustible abundance by the creative energy of life, is of course fruitless from the standpoint of immediate utility. But, since these images represent possible ways of viewing life, which in given circumstances have the power to provide a new energic potential, this function, which to the outer world is the strangest of all, is as indispensable to the total psychic economy as is the corresponding human type to the psychic life of a people. Had this type not existed, there would have been no prophets in Israel.

Introverted intuition apprehends the images which arise from the a priori, i.e. the inherited foundations of the unconscious mind. These archetypes, whose innermost nature is inaccessible to experience, represent the precipitate of psychic functioning of the whole ancestral line, i.e. the heaped-up, or pooled, experiences of organic existence in general, a million times repeated, and condensed into types. Hence, in these archetypes all experiences are [p. 508] represented which since primeval time have happened on this planet. Their archetypal distinctness is the more marked, the more frequently and intensely they have been experienced. The archetype would be -- to borrow from Kant -- the noumenon of the image which intuition perceives and, in perceiving, creates.

Since the unconscious is not just something that lies there, like a psychic caput mortuum, but is something that coexists and experiences inner transformations which are inherently related to general events, introverted intuition, through its perception of inner processes, gives certain data which may possess supreme importance for the comprehension of general occurrences: it can even foresee new possibilities in more or less clear outline, as well as the event which later actually transpires. Its prophetic prevision is to be explained from its relation to the archetypes which represent the law-determined course of all experienceable things. "

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This is what Im focusing on:

"Introverted intuition apprehends the images which arise from the a priori, i.e. the inherited foundations of the unconscious mind. These archetypes, whose innermost nature is inaccessible to experience, represent the precipitate of psychic functioning of the whole ancestral line, i.e. the heaped-up, or pooled, experiences of organic existence in general, a million times repeated, and condensed into types. "

Come again? lol

[Creepy-pokeball]

So was this /end fragment?

[Cone]

It better not be. But I could use some more comments.