The Office (US version)

[Suomea]

Michael Scott (Regional Manager of the Scranton Branch of Dunder Mifflin) ENTj I have a hard time seeing it... He seems Se dominant, though I could see him being a bit too out there to be an irl SLE. I figured it was an Alpha caricature of SLE's.

Yeah, definitely an Alpha caricature. It's basically an Alpha playing dumb so it pretty hard to type.

Dwight Schrute (Assistant "to the" Regional Manager) ISTj I could see that. Again, he's too "rational" and greedy to be an irl LIE, I figured it was an Alpha caricature of LIE's.

Same.

Pam Beesly (Receptionist) ISFp But then why is she so incapable of standing up for herself? It's literally painful to watch. :?

ISFps can have a hard time standing up for themselves. Alot of the time they just avoid conflict. Hence why us ENTps are useful.....:)

[Joy]

By "Alpha caricature" I meant "an SLE from the perspective of Alpha".

[Joy]

Roy Anderson (Dock Worker) Don't know him......

Pam's boyfriend.

[Suomea]

By "Alpha caricature" I meant "an SLE from the perspective of Alpha".

I know...... makes them slightly harder to type.

[Joy]

Dwight Schrute: LIE

I could see that. Again, he's too "rational" and greedy to be an irl LIE, I figured it was an Alpha caricature of LIE's.

No, he's an LSI. Notice the Jim/Dwight supervision.

I just figured it looked like that because Jim's the "cool" one (it is an Alpha show, after all), and Dwight is unhealthy.

But still you should not say that LSI's are greedy and that LIE's could not possibly be that

The "greedy" observation was a point for LIE, not against it.

Jim Halpert: ILE
Pam Beesly: she seems EII when she's dealing with Michael, but a little IEI when she's dealing with Jim, and I sometimes wonder if she's not SEI

But then why is she so incapable of standing up for herself? It's literally painful to watch.

Pam and Jim are the easiest types to recognize on this show. She is SEI and Jim is definitely ILE. Even SEI's have difficulties standing up for themselves at times. But Pam has been under the yolk of Roy for so long that she is scared to break away from the certainty that he represents. She does begin to stand up for herself though towards the end of Season 3, but that is because she now has to stand alone.

God I hope I'm not forced to sit through that much of the show. Regardless... No spoilers!

Do you think Pam is a "typical" SEI? I ask because if so, it may help me to recognize them.

Ryan Howard: LII for sure

Really? Granted I'm only on episode 5 or 6 or so, but this seems extremely unlikely thus far. His mannerisms and behavior so far seem totally in line with LII to me.

While some people say this, I find it doubtful. As we see in later episodes, his greater concern is improving "what works" in Dunder Mifflin and increasing the efficiency of the business, and he possesses an ambition for an MBA so that he can own his business. That is not to say that LII's cannot, but comparing Ryan with Jim shows that they do not seem to have the same Quadra values.

Wouldn't know.

Roy Anderson: generic ST

Perhaps.

Generic ST is a good way of putting it. But it would perhaps best be to examine the nature of the relationship the "generic ST" has with SEI Pam.

Not having typed her yet, I couldn't do that. Also, I figure Michael represents the shows version of an SLE, and he's much different than Roy.

But if we're going to take the show's characters as being "Alpha caricatures", I'd say Delta ST is more likely as so far he seems to be boring and totally lacking and unappreciative of Fe.

Kevin Malone: I don't know. Some sort of introvert?

Really? I don't have much of an opinion at this point, but ILI had crossed my mind.

I said ISTp in part due to the sort of friendship he had with Jim, whom he tends to get along well with.

Wouldn't know about that yet, either.

[Logos]

The "greedy" observation was a point for LIE, not against it.

I do not even believe that about LIEs.

Well this is overall something of a conundrum created by your limited understanding of the show and my limited understanding of Socionics, or at least to the extent that I realize that I may be reading what I want to out of the characters' types.

[jessica129]

Best show on tv.

[xyz]

Best show on tv.

Yeah. Steve Carrel is a fucking genius. So is everyone else on that show. I genuwinely hate ryan

[Joy]

The "greedy" observation was a point for LIE, not against it.

I do not even believe that about LIEs.

I don't think most LIE's are greedy, either. I do think it's a bad stereotype of them though. (Sometimes caring about profit is seen as greed.) And I think that if Alpha has two bad stereotypes about Gamma, it's that we're cold and greedy.

Well this is overall something of a conundrum created by your limited understanding of the show and my limited understanding of Socionics, or at least to the extent that I realize that I may be reading what I want to out of the characters' types.

Well, I don't think Dwight is a good representation of a LIE by any stretch of the imagination... I was just thinking about what he's supposed to be, or whatever.

And we agreed about more characters on this show than we have on any other, I think.

[Logos]

Well, I don't think Dwight is a good representation of a LIE by any stretch of the imagination... I was just thinking about what he's supposed to be, or whatever.

And we agreed about more characters on this show than we have on any other, I think.

Again, I think that Dwight is more of an LSI since he has more Beta values and does have a Stalinesque quality about him.

ETA: And if it makes you feel better, this "Alpha show" even shows a negative or unhealthy portrayal of the ESE with Kelly.

[eunice]

This is indeed the best show on TV.

Michael Scott - I don't know his type, but I certainly dislike him. He has no empathy or respect for people whatsoever.
Dwight Schrute - Se-LSI
Jim Halpert - Ne-ILE
Pam Beesly - Si-SEI
Ryan Howard - I only liked him when he was still the temp. Ti-LII
Angela Martin - Se-ESI
Roy Anderson - Si-LSE
Kevin Malone - Si-SLI

[Ezra]

I've never actually seen the American version of The Office, but I know that the original UK The Office is fantastic. It's a love-or-hate affair, really. Would you say the same of The Office of the US?

Also, just out of interest, has anyone seen The Thick Of It? It was written by the Alan Partridge crew (Americans beware, most if not all of the humour contained within you would not understand. It's nothing personal), and it's a political satire; a bit like The Office but quicker paced and more aggressive (after all, it is politics).

[plantrootz]

Michael Scott - a goofy INFp
Dwight Schrute - ISTj Edit: I change my choice to ESTp
Jim Halpert - ENFp He reminds me of a low key Pauly Shore
Pam Beesly - INFj
Ryan Howard - ESTj
Angela Martin - ISTj
Roy Anderson - ISTp
Kevin Malone - INTp

Edit: a few of the minor characters

Stanley Hudson - ISFp
Phyllis Lapin - seems like an unhealthy INFj
Andy Bernard - ENTj
Karen Filippelli - INTj
Kelly Kapoor - ESFp
Creed Bratton - ENTp
Toby Flenderson - ISTp

[Ms. Kensington]

Michael Scott -no idea
Dwight Schrute - ISTj
Jim Halpert - I guess ENTp
Pam Beesly - ISFp
Ryan Howard - ENFp/ESTj Te type with Ne
Angela Martin - ISFj
Roy Anderson - ESTj
Kevin Malone - ISTp
Phyllis Lapin - seems like an unhealthy INFj
Karen Filippelli - INxj
Kelly Kapoor - ESFp
Toby- INxp

edited a little of plantrootz's suggestions.

[plantrootz]

Pam reminds me of Kate Beckinsale after reviewing more types, who has been typed as INTp. Jim is most likely the same type as Pauly Shore.

Edit: Phyllis: Not sure anymore, but seems to be in a Fi valuing quadra. Angela, I see her as being in the same quadra as Dwight

[Joy]

Pam reminds me of Kate Beckinsale after reviewing more types, who has been typed as INTp. Jim is most likely the same type as Pauly Shore.

We're typing the characters, not the actors.

Angela, I see her as being in the same quadra as Dwight

That's probably the Alpha perspective of what Se creatives are like.

[Hitta]

Ryan as an INTj is by far the worst typing I have ever seen.

[Joy]

So far he seems very INTj to me. However, I've only seen the first 6 episodes.

[eunice]

Pam reminds me of Kate Beckinsale after reviewing more types, who has been typed as INTp. Jim is most likely the same type as Pauly Shore.

We're typing the characters, not the actors.

Angela, I see her as being in the same quadra as Dwight

That's probably the Alpha perspective of what Se creatives are like.

Come to think of it, Dwight and Angela could be an example of an ENTj-ISFj pairing.

As for the rest of the duality present,

Jim and Pam - ENTp & ISFp
Kelly and Ryan - ESFj & INTj
Phyllis and Bob Vance - INFj & ESTj
Michael Scott and Jan Levinson - ENFj & ISTj

Just a suggestion

[plantrootz]

I don't understand, why bother typing the characters at all then. Being set in the right circumstances characters can be real people. We're probably just not exposed enough physically or mentally to people set in those particular circumstances. Btw What do you mean by alpha perspective?

[Joy]

I don't understand, why bother typing the characters at all then. Being set in the right circumstances characters can be real people. We're probably just not exposed enough physically or mentally to people set in those particular circumstances. Btw What do you mean by alpha perspective?

I was saying that VI-ing the actor isn't going to help type the character (unless the role was type casted).

[Joy]

I've been thinking about Michael Scott's type, and I just really cannot see LIE at all. The types of criticisms that bother him and the way he responds make much, much more sense as a Fi PoLR than Fi dual seeking.

[eunice]

I've been thinking about Michael Scott's type, and I just really cannot see LIE at all. The types of criticisms that bother him and the way he responds make much, much more sense as a Fi PoLR than Fi dual seeking.

I think he cannot stand Toby the most, followed by Phyllis. Toby is a clear Te-ISTp imo.

[Ms. Kensington]

karen is hot

[plantrootz]

Jim seems pretty consistent in maintaining relations with people which seems more Fi creative than PoLR. Also his tidbits of encyclopedic knowledge makes me think hidden agenda Te. I doubt he has Ti creative.

[Ms. Kensington]

I think he cannot stand Toby the most, followed by Phyllis. Toby is a clear Te-ISTp imo.

I don't think he doesn't like phyllis he just makes fun of her because she isn't as "pretty" as the younger and thinner women in the office.

[Logos]

Jim seems pretty consistent in maintaining relations with people which seems more Fi creative than PoLR.

Not really.

Also his tidbits of encyclopedic knowledge makes me think hidden agenda Te.

ENTps have strong unconscious , bud.

I doubt he has Ti creative.

Which must be why he uses it all the time to look at the logic of scenarios.

I've been thinking about Michael Scott's type, and I just really cannot see LIE at all. The types of criticisms that bother him and the way he responds make much, much more sense as a Fi PoLR than Fi dual seeking.

And I cannot see Ryan as an INTj, and I'm one too. Funny that.

[Creepy-bg]

lol Legos

[Ms. Kensington]

someone needs to type BJ Novak in the thread I made. I've grown more interested in him!

He seems to be writing himself some more dialogue too

[Joy]

I've been thinking about Michael Scott's type, and I just really cannot see LIE at all. The types of criticisms that bother him and the way he responds make much, much more sense as a Fi PoLR than Fi dual seeking.

And I cannot see Ryan as an INTj, and I'm one too. Funny that.

I've already mentioned that I'm basing my idea of Ryan's type off of the first six or so episodes. At this point there has been no reason to believe that he's EJ, and his mannerisms and responses thus far have seemed LII to me. If I see him when he's the way others have described him, I'm sure I'll have a different idea then.

Michael Scott, however, seems obviously Fi PoLR > Fi dual seeking, and I think EP > EJ makes sense, too. And it's not because he's a dumb ass. There are dumb asses of every type, and this is a fictional character written from an Alpha perspective anyways. If there was an LIE on the show, I'm sure (s)he'd be equally ridiculous, but in a different way.

[plantrootz]

ENTps have strong unconscious , bud.

Demonstrative is not the way you think it is, then. It's seen as pretentious and is skeptical towards it, which is fitting because their Strong Unconscious function comes from their Conflicting Quadra. In strong unconscious Te's, case he doesn't gather it from known causes from the past(TeNi), but comes up with a explanation(Ti creative) available infront of him(Ne accepting) rather than what they have read in books, etc. They like to come up with their own explanation, so they see Te as pretentious, so they invent.

Edit: It's also called strong because they know how to evaluate it. They don't know how to evaluate their weak ones.

[Ms. Kensington]

ryan seems very interested in getting ahead on a corporate ladder, but is not confrontational about it so that makes me think there is Se role/Non polr but not ego, Se.

[Logos]

ENTps have strong unconscious , bud.

Demonstrative is not the way you think it is, then. It's seen as pretentious and is skeptical towards it, which is fitting because their Strong Unconscious function comes from their Conflicting Quadra. In strong unconscious Te's, case he doesn't gather it from known causes from the past(TeNi), but comes up with a explanation(Ti creative) available infront of him(Ne accepting) rather than what they have read in books, etc. They like to come up with their own explanation, so they see Te as pretentious, so they invent.

Edit: It's also called strong because they know how to evaluate it. They don't know how to evaluate their weak ones.

And how is that in any way contradictory with Jim?

ETA: But...Wikisocion:

Demonstrative Function
A person uses the element in this function mainly as a kind of game, or to ridicule those who he thinks take it too seriously. He often intentionally goes against its conventional usage simply to prove a point in favor of his creative function.

Te in this usage does go along with how Jim generally uses it.

[plantrootz]

ENTps have strong unconscious , bud.

Demonstrative is not the way you think it is, then. It's seen as pretentious and is skeptical towards it, which is fitting because their Strong Unconscious function comes from their Conflicting Quadra. In strong unconscious Te's, case he doesn't gather it from known causes from the past(TeNi), but comes up with a explanation(Ti creative) available infront of him(Ne accepting) rather than what they have read in books, etc. They like to come up with their own explanation, so they see Te as pretentious, so they invent.

Edit: It's also called strong because they know how to evaluate it. They don't know how to evaluate their weak ones.

And how is that in any way contradictory with Jim?

It is, because in that paragraph I'm not describing Jim.

ETA: But...Wikisocion:

Demonstrative Function
A person uses the element in this function mainly as a kind of game, or to ridicule those who he thinks take it too seriously. He often intentionally goes against its conventional usage simply to prove a point in favor of his creative function.

Te in this usage does go along with how Jim generally uses it.

He doesn't seem that way at all. Also he is very serious about his work, just not his relation with Dwight. His job is more Te oriented. And honestly his humor doesn't seem Alpha at all. His pranks are pretty rude and rowdy, actually, which Alpha probably don't like. Se accepting from him.

I actually think Jim is ESFp now. Superegos may seem alike because they have the same conscious functions and unconscious. If that is true then Kelly might not be ESFp, but ENFj.

[Gilly]

Wow, Michael Scott really does seem like a lame SLE, now that I think about it. I knew he was Beta for sure, but I was leaning more towards an EIE who's completely autistic or something. Good call, Joy.

[Logos]

He doesn't seem that way at all. Also he is very serious about his work, just not his relation with Dwight. His job is more Te oriented. And honestly his humor doesn't seem Alpha at all. His pranks are pretty rude and rowdy, actually, which Alpha probably don't like. Se accepting from him.

I actually think Jim is ESFp now. Superegos may seem alike because they have the same conscious functions and unconscious. If that is true then Kelly might not be ESFp, but ENFj.

This has just discredited your entire argument, and that is not even going into everything else you say here that shows you do not understand either Jim's character or Alphas.

[plantrootz]

He doesn't seem that way at all. Also he is very serious about his work, just not his relation with Dwight. His job is more Te oriented. And honestly his humor doesn't seem Alpha at all. His pranks are pretty rude and rowdy, actually, which Alpha probably don't like. Se accepting from him.

I actually think Jim is ESFp now. Superegos may seem alike because they have the same conscious functions and unconscious. If that is true then Kelly might not be ESFp, but ENFj.

This has just discredited your entire argument, and that is not even going into everything else you say here that shows you do not understand either Jim's character or Alphas.

Okay then I have a new argument.

Working or jobs are Te. ENTp's make organized businesses a mess. ENTps 'do' first then 'think' or do without thinking(they often leave things where they enjoyed them, they have bad memory of what they were doing a few minutes ago, etc) so static I guess, so the implications that happened from their previous doing leaves them to invent some other way of escaping it again. They have short memory(probably because of Unconscious Ni) and often do not remember what they did a few minutes before. So this leaves organized things a mess. This quirk about them is written in profiles. Jim's childish behaviour is not the same as the childish curiousity from Alpha value. He doesn't seem so naive about his relations with people.

What type are you?

[Joy]

Wow, Michael Scott really does seem like a lame SLE, now that I think about it. I knew he was Beta for sure, but I was leaning more towards an EIE who's completely autistic or something. Good call, Joy.

I see something of you in Jim. Do you relate to that character?

[Joy]

Working or jobs are Te.

No.

[PotatoSpirit]

Dwight Schrute (Assistant "to the" Regional Manager) ISTj

Yes! That guy is ISTj I think, he cracks me up.
"RETALIATION" ahahahahahha