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Thread: Autistic individuals have a hard time eliciting relaxed pleasure

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    Default Autistic individuals have a hard time eliciting relaxed pleasure (Norio ANDO "emotional cure for autism")

    I came across a highly interesting book with an interesting idea that I've never heard before; individuals that display autistic traits have difficulty getting into a state of "relaxed pleasure."

    This concept is best understood when we categorize three emotional domains;

    The theory of three emotions

    The first group is tensioned emotion which promotes bodily tension, narrows the scope of awareness, maintains posture, awareness, and ideas.

    In short, it produces rigid and narrow thinking. An example of getting into this state is studying

    The second group is excited emotion which promotes bodily excitement, facilitates shifting the direction of attention, promotes active behavior.

    In short, it produces animated and reckless behavior. An example of getting into this state would be trying to sell items to customers

    The third group is relaxed emotion which promotes bodily relaxation, facilitates stopping action, reflecting on the past, feeling safe, becoming intimate

    In short, it produces broad, flexible thinking. An example of getting into this state would be the feeling you get after someone tickled you for a prolonged time and you laughed really hard, and now you're in a state of relaxed pleasure.






    Why is this important?

    Depending on the social activity, an individual should be in the appropriate emotional state. Autistic individuals, when in a social setting, are still mainly stuck in "tensioned emotion," hyperfocusing on one thing a person said, analyzing it deeply... but everyone else is moving on quickly and the autistic individual can't keep up.

    Individuals that display autistic traits have heightened tension emotions compared to being in a state of relaxed emotion. By getting into a state of relaxed pleasure, these individuals can temporarily get rid of their autistic traits, become more emotionally expressive, smile and laugh, broaden their thinking, and more easily become interested in people and interact with them.
    Last edited by spatula boy; 05-15-2024 at 01:48 AM.

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    Couldn't this also just apply to "social anxiety"?
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    an autistic trans person whos also i think borderline got drunk and became hyper at some dude's bday party. he slapped her for it. also shes mbti INFJ and this thing is literally just Se inferior happening, but its not uncommon for this kind of thing in my country or in general. i get humiliated mocked and assaulted in a lot of places i go just bc of superficial reasons. ppl get it for dressing a certain way and this is supposed to eb "normal". i have an issue with "getting rid of autistic traits" saying. a lot of autism is ilterally just chronic trauma and stress + projection from ppl on the outside. even normal ppl need to stim, normal ppl get overstimulated and have triggers and need things a certain way and have restricted interests and obviously issues with empathy. wheres the empathy in how they got treated and all that, when thy are also thoughtless inconsiderate abusive avoidant and deflective? the whole thing about autism was made by psychopaths narcissists and other ppl nonetheless, they are way more prevalent in society than any statistic says.
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    Quote Originally Posted by squishycans2 View Post
    Couldn't this also just apply to "social anxiety"?


    yeah when we feel anxiety, we focus on the possible unpleasant future. if we continue to focus on something unpleasant over a long period, the fear raises body tension as we prepare for the eventual arrival of the undesirable event. At the lower end of the spectrum, we sometimes experience worry, which can entail a certain amount of flexibility. Even at that level of anxiety, though, our ability to think flexibly tends to lose. Finally, at the extreme level, we experience immobilizing, frozen terror.

    so you're absolutely right, I believe you can apply some of these principles to non-autistic individuals, as their is considerable overlap across the board.

    but what's unique about autistic individuals is that they express dominant tensioned emotions, making their body and emotions rigid....but they exhibit this also in a calm state. they always tend to focus on their particular stimulation, and ignore what people are doing. a young autistic would thus barely learn from others and not learn social skills. fundamentally, they do not have interest in social interaction. when they learn social skills, they only gain them "mechanistically" or only a part of them. but even when they start to develop an interest in people, they can only focus narrowly on one aspect of people's behavior and conversation, thus having difficulty understanding the entire message

    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    an autistic trans person whos also i think borderline got drunk and became hyper at some dude's bday party. he slapped her for it. also shes mbti INFJ and this thing is literally just Se inferior happening, but its not uncommon for this kind of thing in my country or in general. i get humiliated mocked and assaulted in a lot of places i go just bc of superficial reasons. ppl get it for dressing a certain way and this is supposed to eb "normal". i have an issue with "getting rid of autistic traits" saying. a lot of autism is ilterally just chronic trauma and stress + projection from ppl on the outside. even normal ppl need to stim, normal ppl get overstimulated and have triggers and need things a certain way and have restricted interests and obviously issues with empathy. wheres the empathy in how they got treated and all that, when thy are also thoughtless inconsiderate abusive avoidant and deflective? the whole thing about autism was made by psychopaths narcissists and other ppl nonetheless, they are way more prevalent in society than any statistic says.
    this post wasn't meant to demonize autistics, sorry if it came off that way. it was actually meant to give greater insight into it and to help break out of the hell prison of their mind, since so many people can hardly grasp what it is beyond superficial descriptions that are available. the majority of this world was designed for "normal" "neurotypical" individuals, so unfortunately there will be no empathy for autistics. the only thing that they can do is adapt the best way that they can using whatever tools are available to them, and put themselves in an environment where they can somewhat thrive in an ugly world with thoughtless psychopaths that try to abuse them.
    Last edited by spatula boy; 05-15-2024 at 01:15 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by spatula boy View Post


    yeah when we feel anxiety, we focus on the possible unpleasant future. if we continue to focus on something unpleasant over a long period, the fear raises body tension as we prepare for the eventual arrival of the undesirable event. At the lower end of the spectrum, we sometimes experience worry, which can entail a certain amount of flexibility. Even at that level of anxiety, though, our ability to think flexibly tends to lose. Finally, at the extreme level, we experience immobilizing, frozen terror.

    so you're absolutely right, I believe you can apply some of these principles to non-autistic individuals, as their is considerable overlap across the board.

    but what's unique about autistic individuals is that they express dominant tensioned emotions, making their body and emotions rigid....but they exhibit this also in a calm state. they always tend to focus on their particular stimulation, and ignore what people are doing. a young autistic would thus barely learn from others and not learn social skills. fundamentally, they do not have interest in social interaction. when they learn social skills, they only gain them "mechanistically" or only a part of them. but even when they start to develop an interest in people, they can only focus narrowly on one aspect of people's behavior and conversation, thus having difficulty understanding the entire message



    this post wasn't meant to demonize autistics, sorry if it came off that way. it was actually meant to give greater insight into it and to help break out of the hell prison of their mind, since so many people can hardly grasp what it is beyond superficial descriptions that are available. the majority of this world was designed for "normal" "neurotypical" individuals, so unfortunately there will be no empathy for autistics. the only thing that they can do is adapt the best way that they can using whatever tools are available to them, and put themselves in an environment where they can somewhat thrive in an ugly world with thoughtless psychopaths that try to abuse them.
    im autistic but a lot of things about autism dont work the same for me and i dont think work the same for autistics. WHY do they focus on 1 thing? why is no one asking that or answering ti, ppl just say relax and socialize more to understand others like no thats not how it works. i foucs on many and many things and its so chaotic and overwhelming and ppl cant even keep up with me. i myself alone can project more emotions variety and insight simultaneously than a group of neurotypicals. the usual assessment of autistic ppl is done about pariticualr set of autistic ppl in particular time. there was an incident that involved people forcing a dolphin or smth out of water and passing it to each other by their hands, and it died from shock. this wasnt done by a set of psychopaths or soo allegedly, but why do i as an autistic indiv idual know better? aren't those people the ones focusing on their own feelings and sense of fun and entertainment completely disregarding the experience of the animal and how this may affect it? this isnt rocket science is it. i understand u dont intend to demonize autistic ppl but id ont think most ppl who talk about it understand whats happening even if they themselves are autistic too. the non autistic ppl themselfes aren't properly adapted. they are not functioning well and give me the impression that they just react to things without understanding them and make superficial observations, when pressed tend to be in denial. what is is lack of perception and perceptiveness caused by? and wouldnt autisticp pl be emotionally developed properly if they had someoen who could give them empathy, like an autistic person who is emotionalyl developed, except the pressures of the external world themselves force u to isolate and may damage ur brain similar to emotional abuse that happens when you enocunter narcissists.
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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    im autistic but a lot of things about autism dont work the same for me and i dont think work the same for autistics. WHY do they focus on 1 thing? why is no one asking that or answering ti, ppl just say relax and socialize more to understand others like no thats not how it works.
    Autistic individuals only have a narrow scope of attention. When they focus on one thing, they are incapable of noticing anything else. When they are interested in one thing, they tend to have no interest in anything else. When they concentrate on something they like, their expression of interest tends to be deep.

    While this is good for studying and deep analysis, it's bad for socializing. When they act pleasantly with friends, excited emotion or relaxed emotion is suitable. But in that situation, if tensioned emotion is dominant, they cannot respond appropriately to the friend's random, unpredictable remarks. With tensioned emotion, they tend to focus on one opinion of a friend and continue thinking about it despite the conversation advancing and therefore can't follow the ever-changing topics.

    We do not understand why they show severely restricted interests in one thing. According to this, the important thing is not to find out the slight origin but to broaden their scopes of attention by eliciting relaxed pleasure.

    i foucs on many and many things and its so chaotic and overwhelming and ppl cant even keep up with me. i myself alone can project more emotions variety and insight simultaneously than a group of neurotypicals.
    That makes sense that many autistics would have ADHD as well. People with ADHD also show little relaxed pleasure due to decreased dopamine levels. Even if you tried forcing yourself to be calm, you cannot relax because you are still in a strained although calm state, therefore increasing irritability. You'd become hyperactive. In this way, ADHD symptoms never ease. The way drugs like Adderall and Ritalin help ADHD individuals is by increasing the amount of dopamine, thus the individual not being so bored to death, thus being able to decrease irritability hyperactivity and allowing one to better relax.

    the usual assessment of autistic ppl is done about pariticualr set of autistic ppl in particular time. there was an incident that involved people forcing a dolphin or smth out of water and passing it to each other by their hands, and it died from shock. this wasnt done by a set of psychopaths or soo allegedly, but why do i as an autistic indiv idual know better? aren't those people the ones focusing on their own feelings and sense of fun and entertainment completely disregarding the experience of the animal and how this may affect it? this isnt rocket science is it. i understand u dont intend to demonize autistic ppl but id ont think most ppl who talk about it understand whats happening even if they themselves are autistic too. the non autistic ppl themselfes aren't properly adapted.
    Lol yes, the common complaint autistics have on neurotypicals is that neurotypicals don't think deeply about anything and act on a whim. whereas autistics think too deeply, which helps them be more empathetic which is a strength. however, excessive concentration leads to a stiff mental state, sacrificing intellectual flexibility and any consciousness of the interconnectedness of the things around them.

    they are not functioning well and give me the impression that they just react to things without understanding them and make superficial observations, when pressed tend to be in denial. what is is lack of perception and perceptiveness caused by?
    A lack of perceptiveness, according to this author, is caused by heighted "excited" emotions and a lack of relaxed emotions. You may be shallowly attentive, cannot follow what is happening around you, think logically, or have deep impressions about your perceptions with experience.

    and wouldnt autistic ppl be emotionally developed properly if they had someoen who could give them empathy, like an autistic person who is emotionalyl developed, except the pressures of the external world themselves force u to isolate and may damage ur brain similar to emotional abuse that happens when you enocunter narcissists.
    that would actually be the best solution for autistic people, since essentially the environment they're in disables them. however since the majority of the population is superficial (autistic people look normal from the outside, and they are not physically in a wheelchair), they cannot see autistics as disabled so naturally a superficial society cannot be empathetic towards something they don't understand. it's like if I strutted around like a jock wearing athletic apparel even though I don't really play sports, people will still assume I play sports generally. It's just the way people think.

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    Quote Originally Posted by spatula boy View Post
    Lol yes, the common complaint autistics have on neurotypicals is that neurotypicals don't think deeply about anything and act on a whim. whereas autistics think too deeply, which helps them be more empathetic which is a strength. however, excessive concentration leads to a stiff mental state, sacrificing intellectual flexibility and any consciousness of the interconnectedness of the things around them.
    what interconnectedness did the non autistics perceive when forcing that animal into shock? is there any proof that autistic ppl focus too much on one thing to not see interconnectedness? the brain scans of autistic ppl were more interconnected compared to non autistic ppl which was related to even other forms of neurodivergence. is there any actual proof that autistic ppl see less of reality rather than that is a projeciton of someone who doesnt understand why we do things? the thing related to honesty and being blunt + trusting is also based on seeing interconenctedness. in a society where everyone lies and dodges problems and sacrifices integrity to appease social norms theres very harsh and destructive consequences. why is there no research on why people are shallow, the issues it causes and why its bad?
    so much of research and all that is flawed and biased on purpose for conspiracy reasons too.
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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    what interconnectedness did the non autistics perceive when forcing that animal into shock?
    Even neurotypical people with flexible attentional focus can overlook a dolphin's well-being due to factors like diffusion of responsibility, where everyone assumes someone else will take care of it, and groupthink, where the desire for harmony leads to neglecting critical issues. Social dynamics often prioritize interactions over environmental cues, and the excitement of the moment can overshadow the need for careful attention...

    is there any proof that autistic ppl focus too much on one thing to not see interconnectedness? the brain scans of autistic ppl were more interconnected compared to non autistic ppl which was related to even other forms of neurodivergence. is there any actual proof that autistic ppl see less of reality rather than that is a projeciton of someone who doesnt understand why we do things?
    It's true that autistic brain scans show unique connectivity patterns, but some people argue this doesn't always help with seeing the bigger picture. The increased local connectivity but decreased long-range connectivity might make it harder to integrate information from different areas, which can affect understanding broader social and contextual links. Also, the intense focus on specific interests can sometimes limit an autistic person's ability to navigate complex social dynamics. While their honesty and bluntness are valuable traits, they can sometimes come off as socially awkward, suggesting a different, rather than superior, understanding of interconnectedness

    the thing related to honesty and being blunt + trusting is also based on seeing interconenctedness. in a society where everyone lies and dodges problems and sacrifices integrity to appease social norms theres very harsh and destructive consequences. why is there no research on why people are shallow, the issues it causes and why its bad?
    so much of research and all that is flawed and biased on purpose for conspiracy reasons too.
    yeah, a society that values lies and dodging problems over integrity can lead to serious issues. The current studies we have on social conformity and its negative effects may not always be framed as "shallowness." Studies do look at the impact of superficial social behavior, like loss of trust and mental health problems, but more focus on the downsides of shallow behavior could definitely help highlight its harmful consequences.



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    Quote Originally Posted by squishycans2 View Post
    Couldn't this also just apply to "social anxiety"?
    Oh this topic is interesting since in personality dimension there is avoidant and schizotypal social anxieties. Their " vertness" are basically polar opposites. The former is thinking about oneself and the latter one is thinking about others.
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