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Thread: Conservatives are insane

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    Quote Originally Posted by None View Post
    Nietzsche didn't 'hate' Christianity, because 'One does not hate as long as one has a low esteem of someone'. He thought of it as a moralism the weak use to control the strong. Nietzsche railed against the Christianity of Paul and the apostles, not the Christ figure itself. I have no doubt Christ was one of the 'free spirits' he championed. I think his ideal, just as mine was the “Roman Caesar with Christ’s soul”.
    I don't think this is entirely accurate. Yes, he saw Christian morality as a form of what he called 'slave morality', and I suppose we could debate what it means to 'hate' in this case, but based on his writings, it is pretty clear he also hated (or at least, rejected) Christianity because it placed 'the ideal' in a metaphysical realm, ie outside of this life here on earth, and also because it encouraged pity as a virtue. He does criticize Paul's Christianity, and perhaps I don't know enough about his writings to distinguish between how he viewed the Christ figure vs Paul, but I nevertheless, I seriously doubt that he would have recognized the 'Christ figure', as understood by the Christian church for the last 2000 years, Paul or no Paul, to have been a free spirit.

    I do think it's fair to say Nietzsche hated Christianity, it's pretty obvious whenever he writes on it that the resentment comes out, not that I entirely blame him for that. You can sense the resentment even if he doesn't explicitly say 'I hate this'. But people, especially in recent years, have tried to make it seem as though Nietzsche was somehow more sympathetic to Christianity than he actually was, which is really hyporcritcal and odd to me.

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    Sorry @chriscorey I believe I have made my point unclear and you have misunderstood.

    I meant to say that NTs put an end to the discussion after the solution has been reached AKA not engaging with the discussion anymore. I did not mean to say 'ignore'.

    'I wouldn't ignore you if I was wrong. I'd keep talking to you.'
    I know, that is what I said.

    When I said '
    In fact that's basically the whole point of being an NT. Correcting illogical stupidities.' it was hyperbole. Obviously the logic would have to be worth engaging in for the NT to enjoy it. Just an an Ni-Fe user wouldn't engage with mediocre art.

    Frankly I don't think we are actually making different points here, we have only misunderstood one another. In fact the first response you gave to me which began this exchange I have misread. I would have addressed this sooner but I did not bother to do so I will do it here.

    'You couldn't get me to shut up about why I thought a person was wrong.' is what I meant when I said: 'In fact that's basically the whole point of being an NT. Correcting illogical stupidities.' Originally I did not read this understanding that you were AGREEING with me, which is what lead to the response I gave.

    Also I did not understand your usage of the metaphor of that individual being 'hand shy' which is why I responded saying 'I don't know anything about shyness'. I searched up what being 'hand shy' is and I still don't understand what it means. I do not have experience with dogs.

    I hope I was able to clarify myself in a way which you will find adequate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by None View Post
    Sorry @chriscorey I believe I have made my point unclear and you have misunderstood.

    I meant to say that NTs put an end to the discussion after the solution has been reached AKA not engaging with the discussion anymore. I did not mean to say 'ignore'.

    'I wouldn't ignore you if I was wrong. I'd keep talking to you.'
    I know, that is what I said.

    When I said '
    In fact that's basically the whole point of being an NT. Correcting illogical stupidities.' it was hyperbole. Obviously the logic would have to be worth engaging in for the NT to enjoy it. Just an an Ni-Fe user wouldn't engage with mediocre art.

    Frankly I don't think we are actually making different points here, we have only misunderstood one another. In fact the first response you gave to me which began this exchange I have misread. I would have addressed this sooner but I did not bother to do so I will do it here.

    'You couldn't get me to shut up about why I thought a person was wrong.' is what I meant when I said: 'In fact that's basically the whole point of being an NT. Correcting illogical stupidities.' Originally I did not read this understanding that you were AGREEING with me, which is what lead to the response I gave.

    Also I did not understand your usage of the metaphor of that individual being 'hand shy' which is why I responded saying 'I don't know anything about shyness'. I searched up what being 'hand shy' is and I still don't understand what it means. I do not have experience with dogs.

    I hope I was able to clarify myself in a way which you will find adequate.
    Great points. I agree.

    I keep not getting your notifications. I just happen to be staring at the newsfeed. I'd have answered you sooner about the latter.
    The mind is restless and difficult to restrain, but it is subdued by practice

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    @Hardware Punk
    This is not something I am interested in 'debating'. Re-read 'The Anti-christ'.

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    Quote Originally Posted by None View Post
    @Hardware Punk
    This is not something I am interested in 'debating'. Re-read 'The Anti-christ'.
    Dude.

    We should not deck out and embellish Christianity: it has waged a war to the death against this higher type of man, it has put all the deepest instincts of this type under its ban, it has developed its concept of evil, of the Evil One himself, out of these instincts—the strong man as the typical reprobate, the “outcast among men.” Christianity has taken the part of all the weak, the low, the botched; it has made an ideal out of antagonism to all the self-preservative instincts of sound life; it has corrupted even the faculties of those natures that are intellectually most vigorous, by representing the highest intellectual values as sinful, as misleading, as full of temptation. The most lamentable example: the corruption of Pascal, who believed that his intellect had been destroyed by original sin, whereas it was actually destroyed by Christianity!—
    -The AntiChirst, aphorism 5

    Christianity is called the religion of pity.—Pity stands in opposition to all the tonic passions that augment the energy of the feeling of aliveness: it is a depressant. A man loses power when he pities. Through pity that drain upon strength which suffering works is multiplied a thousandfold. Suffering is made contagious by pity; under certain circumstances it may lead to a total sacrifice of life and living energy—a loss out of all proportion to the magnitude of the cause (—the case of the death of the Nazarene)
    -TheAntiChrist aphorism 7

    Under Christianity neither morality nor religion has any point of contact with actuality. It offers purely imaginary causes (“God,” “soul,” “ego,” “spirit,” “free will”—or even “unfree”), and purely imaginary effects (“sin,” “salvation,” “grace,” “punishment,” “forgiveness of sins”). Intercourse between imaginary beings (“God,” “spirits,” “souls”); an imaginary natural history (anthropocentric; a total denial of the concept of natural causes); an imaginary psychology (misunderstandings of self, misinterpretations of agreeable or disagreeable general feelings—for example, of the states of the nervus sympathicus with the help of the sign-language of religio-ethical balderdash—, “repentance,” “pangs of conscience,” “temptation by the devil,” “the presence of God”); an imaginary teleology (the “kingdom of God,” “the last judgment,” “eternal life”).—This purely fictitious world, greatly to its disadvantage, is to be differentiated from the world of dreams; the latter at least reflects reality, whereas the former falsifies it, cheapens it and denies it. Once the concept of “nature” had been opposed to the concept of “God,” the word “natural” necessarily took on the meaning of “abominable”—the whole of that fictitious world has its sources in hatred of the natural (—the real!—), and is no more than evidence of a profound uneasiness in the presence of reality.... This explains everything. Who alone has any reason for living his way out of reality? The man who suffers under it. But to suffer from reality one must be a botched reality.... The preponderance of pains over pleasures is the cause of this fictitious morality and religion: but such a preponderance also supplies the formula for décadence....
    -TheAntiChrist, aphorism 15

    The Christian concept of a god—the god as the patron of the sick, the god as a spinner of cobwebs, the god as a spirit—is one of the most corrupt concepts that has ever been set up in the world: it probably touches low-water mark in the ebbing evolution of the god-type. God degenerated into the contradiction of life. Instead of being its transfiguration and eternal Yea! In him war is declared on life, on nature, on the will to live! God becomes the formula for every slander upon the “here and now,” and for every lie about the “beyond”! In him nothingness is deified, and the will to nothingness is made holy!...
    -TheAntiChrist aphorism 18

    In my condemnation of Christianity I surely hope I do no injustice to a related religion with an even larger number of believers: I allude to Buddhism. Both are to be reckoned among the nihilistic religions—they are both décadence religions—but they are separated from each other in a very remarkable way. For the fact that he is able to compare them at all the critic of Christianity is indebted to the scholars of India.—Buddhism is a hundred times as realistic as Christianity—it is part of its living heritage that it is able to face problems objectively and coolly; it is the product of long centuries of philosophical speculation. The concept, “god,” was already disposed of before it appeared. Buddhism is the only genuinely positive religion to be encountered in history, and this applies even to its epistemology (which is a strict phenomenalism). It does not speak of a “struggle with sin,” but, yielding to reality, of the “struggle with suffering.” Sharply differentiating itself from Christianity, it puts the self-deception that lies in moral concepts behind it; it is, in my phrase, beyond good and evil.—The two physiological facts upon which it grounds itself and upon which it bestows its chief attention are: first, an excessive sensitiveness to sensation, which manifests itself as a refined susceptibility to pain, and secondly, an extraordinary spirituality, a too protracted concern with concepts and logical procedures, under the influence of which the instinct of personality has yielded to a notion of the “impersonal.” (—Both of these states will be familiar to a few of my readers, the objectivists, by experience, as they are to me). These physiological states produced a depression, and Buddha tried to combat it by hygienic measures. Against it he prescribed a life in the open, a life of travel; moderation in eating and a careful selection of foods; caution in the use of intoxicants; the same caution in arousing any of the passions that foster a bilious habit and heat the blood; finally, no worry, either on one’s own account or on account of others. He encourages ideas that make for either quiet contentment or good cheer—he finds means to combat ideas of other sorts. He understands good, the state of goodness, as something which promotes health. Prayer is not included, and neither is asceticism. There is no categorical imperative nor any disciplines, even within the walls of a monastery (—it is always possible to leave—). These things would have been simply means of increasing the excessive sensitiveness above mentioned. For the same reason he does not advocate any conflict with unbelievers; his teaching is antagonistic to nothing so much as to revenge, aversion, ressentiment (—“enmity never brings an end to enmity”: the moving refrain of all Buddhism....) And in all this he was right, for it is precisely these passions which, in view of his main regiminal purpose, are unhealthful. The mental fatigue that he observes, already plainly displayed in too much “objectivity” (that is, in the individual’s loss of interest in himself, in loss of balance and of “egoism”), he combats by strong efforts to lead even the spiritual interests back to the ego. In Buddha’s teaching egoism is a duty. The “one thing needful,” the question “how can you be delivered from suffering,” regulates and determines the whole spiritual diet. (—Perhaps one will here recall that Athenian who also declared war upon pure “scientificality,” to wit, Socrates, who also elevated egoism to the estate of a morality).
    -TheAntiChirst aphorism 20

    Buddhism, I repeat, is a hundred times more austere, more honest, more objective. It no longer has to justify its pains, its susceptibility to suffering, by interpreting these things in terms of sin—it simply says, as it simply thinks, “I suffer.”
    TheAntiChrist aphorism 23

    Here I barely touch upon the problem of the origin of Christianity. The first thing necessary to its solution is this: that Christianity is to be understood only by examining the soil from which it sprung—it is not a reaction against Jewish instincts; it is their inevitable product; it is simply one more step in the awe-inspiring logic of the Jews. In the words of the Saviour, “salvation is of the Jews.”—The second thing to remember is this: that the psychological type of the Galilean is still to be recognized, but it was only in its most degenerate form (which is at once maimed and overladen with foreign features) that it could serve in the manner in which it has been used: as a type of the Saviour of mankind.—
    TheAntiChrist aphorism 24

    The Jews are the most remarkable people in the history of the world, for when they were confronted with the question, to be or not to be, they chose, with perfectly unearthly deliberation, to be at any price: this price involved a radical falsification of all nature, of all naturalness, of all reality, of the whole inner world, as well as of the outer. They put themselves against all those conditions under which, hitherto, a people had been able to live, or had even been permitted to live; out of themselves they evolved an idea which stood in direct opposition to natural conditions—one by one they distorted religion, civilization, morality, history and psychology until each became a contradiction of its natural significance. We meet with the same phenomenon later on, in an incalculably exaggerated form, but only as a copy: the Christian church, put beside the “people of God,” shows a complete lack of any claim to originality. Precisely for this reason the Jews are the most fateful people in the history of the world: their influence has so falsified the reasoning of mankind in this matter that today the Christian can cherish anti-Semitism without realizing that it is no more than the final consequence of Judaism.
    TheAntiChrist aphorism 24

    The gospels are invaluable as evidence of the corruption that was already persistent within the primitive community. That which Paul, with the cynical logic of a rabbi, later developed to a conclusion was at bottom merely a process of decay that had begun with the death of the Saviour.
    -TheAntiChrist aphorism 44

    https://www.gutenberg.org/files/1932...-h/19322-h.htm

    Bruh. I could go on and on, but everyone reading this gets the picture. Nietzsche hated Christianity, based on the very book you claim I should re-read. He hated the fact it placed the ideal in another life, he hated the fact it was a religion of pity, and he doesn't consider that Paul perverted Christianity, but only acted to worsen a process that was set forth by the death of the "Savior" and "Nazarene".

    So much for the pipe dream of a supposed bromance between Nietzsche and 'Christ the free spirit'.


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    @Hardware Punk
    I will give you a response to this shortly. I am under the influences right now. LSD in particular.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by None View Post
    @Hardware Punk
    I will give you a response to this shortly. I am under the influences right now. LSD in particular.
    Sure, take your time. Tbh with you though, I don't particularly care to debate this as I feel I've made my points. I don't really care to 'win' here. If you have any interesting comments that you think could add to the discussion regarding what I posted though, feel free to send them here.


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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post

    those people's entire point of living is to reproduce. they exist to hurt others. i remember reading an article trying to pain them in a better light, about how they are logical and have a balanced worldview (their brains process huamn lives to have the same value as a car) while liberals are irrational hysterical emotional wrecks
    they create institutions and rules that take away from people's lives, making it harder to do anything meaningful, and kill them. bullying, abuse, murder, denial. after someone collapses under their regime they say they did it to themselves. the only way to not "collapse" is to destroy ur sense of self and ethics, so u become an abuser like themsleves.
    they dont learn or care. u cant make compromises with them. any little thing u give them they will exploit and u cant hope to get treated better by treating them well. wahtever u give them they will take and wahtever they owe u they will also take.
    they genuinely beleive they've buillt the world (they've stolen and organized the material world in a way that u are forced to go through them to get something which makes it look as if they are giving you but it only means they are in the way)
    How do you even know this is a real person? That opinion is extreme and not shared by any rational person I know. You're taking a strawman and generally applying that brush to paint all conservatives in this wacky light. This is the problem with Twitter and social media discourse in a nutshell. You have tons of bots, trolls, and generally mentally ill people who are allowed free reign, with no filter, to say whatever they want. I'm all about free speech and I think it's good that there are no restrictions on speech, and I will never advocate for "controls" on speech (within reasonable limits). But what people need to understand, and which they often don't have, is context. Who is saying these insane things? Where is it coming from? How much weight does this person's opinion actually have? Who is listening to them? These are all valid questions, and ones that will better place in perspective whether you should pay ridiculous Tweets like this any mind at all.

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    dewusional entitwed snowfwake VewyScawwyNawcissist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
    How do you even know this is a real person?
    edit: deleted me saying u are delusional
    there are podcasts with that
    there are people with experiences with such people
    there are people living with such people
    i know such people
    my life has been threatend by such people
    there are videos of such people with comments by such people
    why do u give a f if this particular pesron is real or not, rich or not, etc
    just bc they in particular dont have "power" doesnt mean that someone with hte same views doesnt, or wouldnt, or themselves wouldnt

    who is listening to them? why do u care again? do u want a list of names? statistics? people in power? why? completely irrelevant information. u just think it scompletely insane and oh god how could someone listen to someone like that??
    this kind of reasoning is so infantile. this is reality. nothing to expect much of a conservative of course, to be unfamiliar with reality. a conservative brainwashes themslevs further by denying anything real as "insane" while not exploring and exercising their mind. so many things now are reality that people would have considered insane before, and a lot of ppl still consider thme insane now, and sojme things liberals say are considered insane and are insane, and other things are considered insane which arent insane.
    weight of a view is not controlled solely by something easy and streamlined like a number of people with the same view.
    this was a youtube comment on a video, on a more specific topic. its not a bot.

    there are many "rational" arguements that are only rational so far as u take them out of context. when u take everything into consideration a lot of arguements are strawmans as they are. just bc u think ur more complicated than u are doesnt mean u are.
    what about insane things u dont see said publicly as much but are implied in speech or kept in private or in specific public places.
    i dont know if u are legitimately that ignorant or u are in on it and trying to deflect everything as many sociopaths try to do, and no one dares criticize sociopaths bc the sociopaths would make that someone a target and take care of them.


    all my life ive had to pay mind and attention to things that i thought were obvious, but other ppl kept finding insane reasons to justify insanity
    dp u know how many comments i have heard or seen like urs denying that gay ppl were abused in various bc it would be insane and it almost never really happens or when it happens it doesnt happen to them more bc they are gay, its for everyone for instance? why do i need to give u that comparison anyway, well bc u'd say "example" since most ppl whom i tried to reason with claimed i was imagining things and thinking too much. u dont need an example. the logic is there

    besides who are u to decide who is mentally ill, who is rational
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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    edit: deleted me saying u are delusional
    there are podcasts with that
    there are people with experiences with such people
    there are people living with such people
    i know such people
    my life has been threatend by such people
    there are videos of such people with comments by such people
    why do u give a f if this particular pesron is real or not, rich or not, etc
    just bc they in particular dont have "power" doesnt mean that someone with hte same views doesnt, or wouldnt, or themselves wouldnt

    who is listening to them? why do u care again? do u want a list of names? statistics? people in power? why? completely irrelevant information. u just think it scompletely insane and oh god how could someone listen to someone like that??
    this kind of reasoning is so infantile. this is reality. nothing to expect much of a conservative of course, to be unfamiliar with reality. a conservative brainwashes themslevs further by denying anything real as "insane" while not exploring and exercising their mind. so many things now are reality that people would have considered insane before, and a lot of ppl still consider thme insane now, and sojme things liberals say are considered insane and are insane, and other things are considered insane which arent insane.
    weight of a view is not controlled solely by something easy and streamlined like a number of people with the same view.
    this was a youtube comment on a video, on a more specific topic. its not a bot.

    there are many "rational" arguements that are only rational so far as u take them out of context. when u take everything into consideration a lot of arguements are strawmans as they are. just bc u think ur more complicated than u are doesnt mean u are.
    what about insane things u dont see said publicly as much but are implied in speech or kept in private or in specific public places.
    i dont know if u are legitimately that ignorant or u are in on it and trying to deflect everything as many sociopaths try to do, and no one dares criticize sociopaths bc the sociopaths would make that someone a target and take care of them.


    all my life ive had to pay mind and attention to things that i thought were obvious, but other ppl kept finding insane reasons to justify insanity
    dp u know how many comments i have heard or seen like urs denying that gay ppl were abused in various bc it would be insane and it almost never really happens or when it happens it doesnt happen to them more bc they are gay, its for everyone for instance? why do i need to give u that comparison anyway, well bc u'd say "example" since most ppl whom i tried to reason with claimed i was imagining things and thinking too much. u dont need an example. the logic is there

    besides who are u to decide who is mentally ill, who is rational
    You seem to have missed the point of my posing those rhetorical questions. The point is that these comments, tweets, whatever, can be written by anyone, anywhere, for any reason. You can't possibly know the true intent or whether they are being serious or not, ergo it is pointless to get worked up over anonymous "internet demons" and other things that are of no actual threat to you, real or existential. That comment may represent to you the sum of all the evil things people have said or done to you in your lifetime, and that is regrettable, but you are extrapolating that negativity into a valid preposition for viewing other people and the world at large, and that's dangerous. Even in your (apparently edited) response to my slight dissent, you are making assumptions about me and my "argument" that I have never said, nor have given any indication that your suppositions about me are true. I am not a "gay abuse denying conservative," but when the world is so small and black-and-white as yours seems to be when you wrote this response, I can see why you would assume that I am just another manifestation of "the enemy." I will not sugarcoat my reaction, it makes you look rather petty and pathetic. Your instincts are not serving you well, and you suffer from an extremely irrational malreasoning that suggests you are an emotionally unstable individual, reeling from the effects of whatever trauma you've experienced in your lifetime. I pity where you're at mentally, and I hope that you find the strength to be honest with yourself one day, and find your sense of self-worth and act upon it to make better choices for your life, and live happily ever after.

    As for your final question, who am I to be saying who is rational or mentally ill? Perhaps you should ask yourself that, considering the very title of this thread you've created.

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    wow just more denial and defleciton as i just said u would

    my question about who u are to be saying, is that u say whoever u perceive as such to be ignored instead of listened to. u need to listen, because those peopel are real, as i said, and way too many of them. im sure u know exactly what conservatives at large think, and im sure u have considered and investigated all possibilities and implications. ur ignorant commentarny and tendency to ignore,. what am i supposed to make of it? ur not an experienced person or someone who wants to be experienced. pointless to reason or inform you, u never wanted the truth.


    u fail to read betwene the lines, so i need to explain myself in full detail, and u miss my point still.
    i didnt claim or mean u were denying gay abuse, but compared ur reasoning to be the same to people who do it.
    sorry i dont really think im supposed to be explaining to an adult nonetheless how to think and understand argumentation.
    its a standard to try to notice ur own patterns and compare them to other dysfunctional ones. the mere fact that u take this to be a projection instead of being something to reflect on (even if u have reflected on it and disagree) signals there may be something wrong. despite all of waht i said that i knew was true i was open minded enough to talking to u, as if u would say anything different than ive seen on forums comments the internet at large and in reality.
    if u deny ur problems u can keep ur head in the sand and pretend ur helping address and solve things. u can take pity on others as long as u deny ur own vulnerabilities or are insane enough to do absolutely everything to protect ur own delusions.
    Your instincts are not serving you well
    would u rather i was self absorbed and in denial? serve myself well on the backs of others? jjust bc it makes me "healthy" and "rational"
    I hope that you find the strength to be honest with yourself one day, and find your sense of self-worth and act upon it to make better choices for your life, and live happily ever after.
    problems and consequences dont disappear just bc u feel narcissistically good about ur situation and the situation at whole. ive said thisbefore and i keep saying it still, msot people are children who never grew up, they want to be happy idiots enver thinkign about the bad things and how to address them.
    Last edited by VewyScawwyNawcissist; 04-27-2022 at 03:27 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    wow just more denial and defleciton as i just said u would

    my question about who u are to be saying, is that u say whoever u perceive as such to be ignored instead of listened to. u need to listen, because those peopel are real, as i said, and way too many of them. im sure u know exactly what conservatives at large think, and im sure u have considered and investigated all possibilities and implications. ur ignorant commentarny and tendency to ignore,. what am i supposed to make of it? ur not an experienced person or someone who wants to be experienced. pointless to reason or inform you, u never wanted the truth.


    u fail to read betwene the lines, so i need to explain myself in full detail, and u miss my point still.
    i didnt claim or mean u were denying gay abuse, but compared ur reasoning to be the same to people who do it.
    sorry i dont really think im supposed to be explaining to an adult nonetheless how to think and understand argumentation.
    its a standard to try to notice ur own patterns and compare them to other dysfunctional ones. the mere fact that u take this to be a projection instead of being something to reflect on (even if u have reflected on it and disagree) signals there may be something wrong. despite all of waht i said that i knew was true i was open minded enough to talking to u, as if u would say anything different than ive seen on forums comments the internet at large and in reality.
    if u deny ur problems u can keep ur head in the sand and pretend ur helping address and solve things. u can take pity on others as long as u deny ur own vulnerabilities or are insane enough to do absolutely everything to protect ur own delusions.
    would u rather i was self absorbed and in denial? serve myself well on the backs of others? jjust bc it makes me "healthy" and "rational"
    problems and consequences dont disappear just bc u feel narcissistically good about ur situation and the situation at whole. ive said thisbefore and i keep saying it still, msot people are children who never grew up, they want to be happy idiots enver thinkign about the bad things and how to address them.
    There is nothing here really worth responding to. You insist that your demons are real, and you are prepared to defend them at all costs. I hope you find your way out of this dark hole at some point. Perhaps you will gain perspective and wisdom with maturity, but this doesn't happen for everyone, no matter how bright they appear at the outset. It's difficult to tell who will persevere, and who will not. Good luck in your journey, traveler.

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    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/b...s-and-ideology

    "Previous research in political psychology has suggested that people with conservative political attitudes tend to have better physical health than their liberal counterparts (Chan, 2019) (which I discussed in more detail in a previous post). A more recent study (Kirkegaard, 2020) found that political ideology may also be relevant to mental health, as people who are more liberal, especially those identifying as “extremely liberal,” are more likely to have mental health problems."

    Seems like it might be the opposite.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xelor View Post
    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/b...s-and-ideology

    "Previous research in political psychology has suggested that people with conservative political attitudes tend to have better physical health than their liberal counterparts (Chan, 2019) (which I discussed in more detail in a previous post). A more recent study (Kirkegaard, 2020) found that political ideology may also be relevant to mental health, as people who are more liberal, especially those identifying as “extremely liberal,” are more likely to have mental health problems."

    Seems like it might be the opposite.
    hurt other people, focus on urself, be happy
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    CUNTservatives tend to be more moral, or at least think they are more moral/care about morality more whereas LIEberals tend to be more compassionate. I admit I'm biased and more liberal because of course I think the CUNTservative shrills about morality are faker than the lieberal shrills for compassion - or quite frankly I care about a person being compassionate or not, and not as big on morals.

    CUNTservatives are known to be too punishing and harsh, LIEberals are known to be too forgiving/lenient. I don't think punishing people and acting holier than thou like a LSE judge is really solving or helping anything... ppl at the group home were shocked/touched/surprised that I was so nice to the SLE gay boy there but I wasn't really that nice to him, I just didn't trigger his Fi polr or get on my high horse like I was so superior- and I taught more by real example rather than being Te smug or condescending. Funnily enough he thought I was a goody two shoes when I'm not that either....

    So anyway CUNTservatives unfairly call everybody else groomer because they want to come off like they really care about children, but they don't have much compassion for real children at all. It's just the morality that defending children is the right thing to do. And well, of course it is. People can eat this stuff up, because what idiot wants to look like the jerk that doesn't care about some innocent little kid? But that is sorta the other side y'know - little kids might be cute and all but they often aren't all that innocent or nice, anybody who's experienced bullying and the cruelty of children knows this- it's this dumb veneer.

    I think the confusion comes that in America, LIEberals are supposedly thought of as 'left-wingers' often appeal to authority when traditionally speaking appealing to authority is a very right-wing thing to do... but in US there's not really a left-wing like in other countries. Or I mean that's just the natural differences between being a LEFTist and being a true LIBERAL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    hurt other people, focus on urself, be happy
    help other people, get exploited, be sad
    Loser mentality. Helping others helps you, dummy.

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    @Hardware Punk
    It's not a debate, your interpretation of him is simply and horrifying-ly wrong. You are interpreting him far too literally. Nietzsche has a poetic essence which you simply have not grasped, and I will show you. But it is an essay long work. I can only afford so much of my labor to this website. You will get it, I promise you. Within this week. You have seen some of my posts and how lengthy they can get. And trust me, I will not be merciful.

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    Quote Originally Posted by None View Post
    @Hardware Punk
    It's not a debate, your interpretation of him is simply and horrifying-ly wrong. You are interpreting him far too literally. Nietzsche has a poetic essence which you simply have not grasped, and I will show you. But it is an essay long work. I can only afford so much of my labor to this website. You will get it, I promise you. Within this week. You have seen some of my posts and how lengthy they can get. And trust me, I will not be merciful.
    What a piece of work. If you were as clever as you think, you wouldn't talk this way. Get a hobby.


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    @Hardware Punk
    What is wrong with the way I write???? Seriously you're not the first person to pick on me for that. .
    Please don't get offended by my light banter. Does it annoy you? I find that quite endearing.
    I have a hobby, it's literature. Not cold hard logic, so I will address all the errors which your Nietzsche post made in FULL. Just know that picking apart philosophies is not my 'modus operandi' but it is something which I am quite competent in.

    Please, don't insult me- perhaps you will walk away with a new understanding of Nietzsche. A new 'perspective'? *wink* *wink*

    Love your Evola quote. He was such a sweety. It was a shame faith took his legs when he went out for walks during artillery bombardments~

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    Quote Originally Posted by None View Post
    @Hardware Punk
    What is wrong with the way I write???? Seriously you're not the first person to pick on me for that. .
    Please don't get offended by my light banter. Does it annoy you? I find that quite endearing.
    I have a hobby, it's literature. Not cold hard logic, so I will address all the errors which your Nietzsche post made in FULL. Just know that picking apart philosophies is not my 'modus operandi' but it is something which I am quite competent in.

    Please, don't insult me- perhaps you will walk away with a new understanding of Nietzsche. A new 'perspective'? *wink* *wink*

    Love your Evola quote. He was such a sweety. It was a shame faith took his legs when he went out for walks during artillery bombardments~
    I apologize. I did not realize it was banter on your part. I thought you were being hostile, sometimes these things can be hard to pick up on through text, but no worries.

    I would love hearing your perspective on Nietzsche btw. I'm perfectly willing to admit my interpretation is wrong. I myself enjoy reading philosophy, especially if the author's text has poetic value. Just don't throw Kant at me and expect to read that passionately. I don't claim to be an expert on Nietzsche, I read the anti-christ almost 20 years ago, as I did some of this other works and just started getting back into reading his texts a few months ago.

    I'm glad you like my Evola quote, I actually haven't read him much but I love that quote too.
    Last edited by Ave; 05-02-2022 at 01:51 PM.


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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    hurt other people, focus on urself, be happy
    help other people, get exploited, be sad
    I'd just like to point out that this is literal demon logic. Only demons see that as being obviously true. Yes, you can try to help others and get exploited and be sad. Or you can see it as a test. A spiritual battle that you are waging against this world. Saint Monica never gave into despair despite being wed to an alcoholic abusive husband and a son who was into all the sickest and most debauched shit that could be imagined at the time.

    She persevered, she never gave up, and earned her happy ending thereby. Both converted to the faith and died in a state of grace. I wonder. Seriously, do you think it is even possible to earn your "happiest" ending as you'd perceive of it? Could you pray to a God that everyone around you tells you is BS and see no form of validation for 17 years right up until, on that last day before you/they died they came to you and thanked you?

    Perhaps you can and, I'd argue, already do. The key difference is my God is true and benevolent and yours is False and Evil/Malevolent...

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    Moderate here.

    I don't think conservatives are insane, is just a shame that some people are so trapped in their echo chambers that they refuse to see the sanity in the other side. If you're really interested in the other side, I suggest looking into Jonathan Haidt's work about the different values across the political spectrum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xelor View Post
    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/b...s-and-ideology

    "Previous research in political psychology has suggested that people with conservative political attitudes tend to have better physical health than their liberal counterparts (Chan, 2019) (which I discussed in more detail in a previous post). A more recent study (Kirkegaard, 2020) found that political ideology may also be relevant to mental health, as people who are more liberal, especially those identifying as “extremely liberal,” are more likely to have mental health problems."

    Seems like it might be the opposite.
    Bad people generally speaking live happy lives. It a fact that is thousands of years old. Psalm 73 begins with the author lamenting this fact (but he concludes that all will not be well for them in the end). The Talmud states that the righteous have no rest, either in this world or the next. (Talmud, Berachot 64a) That's why you can't have happiness as a core value. You got to live your life by principles.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rune View Post
    Moderate here.

    I don't think conservatives are insane, is just a shame that some people are so trapped in their echo chambers that they refuse to see the sanity in the other side. If you're really interested in the other side, I suggest looking into Jonathan Haidt's work about the different values across the political spectrum.
    jonathan haidt doesnt deserve to breathe. his research might have been even what i mentioned earlier in the thread
    : On average, the conservatives care roughly equally about not harming others, not cheating, letting people choose themselves, loyalty to ingroup, deference to authority, and purity or sanctity. In contrast, on average, liberals care less about the last three, and much more about the first three—harm, fairness, and liberty.
    this is some shortened bs, where more context was that a conservative considers a car, money, house of equal value to human lives, while liberals put human lives above those. which is very very very damn generous of him towards conservatives. part of the stupid Te lie here is, that conservatives dont even care about human lives, they only care to exploit them, which allows them to phrase it as if they care about ppl.

    also dont waste mine or anyone else's time esp with bs like this
    that they refuse to see the sanity in the other side
    do u know how much time ive spent trying to understand them, their arguements, and all that, while its the same shit over and over and over again, omiting of information when convenient, acusing libs of what they are doing, etc. no consistency with what they say. theres even a study that says conservatives LIE AND LIE WAY MORE THAN LIBERALS. i dont even like studies, they are often very fucking biased and useless, done by ppl who are mentally incapable of such complex problem solving and delienation. i dont need a study to tell me conservatives lie way mroe. i knew it all before. its a cult. i have more experience with conservatives than conservatives. nothing can convince a narcissist. they want to believe their delusions.
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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    ...i have more experience with conservatives than conservatives...
    Fascinating...

    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    jonathan haidt doesnt deserve to breathe.
    So much for the virtue of care/"do no harm."
    Last edited by ILoveChinchillas; 05-18-2022 at 03:08 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maromi View Post
    Bad people generally speaking live happy lives.
    Seems like you're twisting things to a warped perspective using DA cognitive style, that's not HP and you're not an LII. You're an ILI-N just like Gulenko said. That's funny too though, all of the bad people I've met have usually had unhappy lives and are deeply jealous of those thriving, then again, I'd say 99% of the bad people I've met have been on the internet. This one guy actually pretended to be a teenage girl and tried to pump me for info before, I didn't fall for it though - I simply lied to him. Regardless, what a fucking Freak.

    Quote Originally Posted by Maromi View Post
    (Talmud, Berachot 64a)
    That's quite disgusting appropriating Jewish culture to your needlessly vindictive narrative. And frankly, I think anyone can have any core values, any notion to the contrary seems like mind control and manipulation. The concept of Principles though, I guess it's good to "practice what you preach." You should try it sometime instead of passive aggressively attacking people using rules, norms, religions, and dogma, then again, you lack self-awareness, but that is typical of Normalizers in Model G.

    You've failed every test and I'm done with your toxic self. The game was fun while it lasted, but you took my bait in that typing thread - you latch on to things that suit your confirmation bias and twist it to the most fucked up and negative perspective possible. Toxic. You're blocked and I'd appreciate it if you stalk someone else.
    Last edited by Ocean Man; 05-18-2022 at 10:20 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    jonathan haidt doesnt deserve to breathe. his research might have been even what i mentioned earlier in the thread
    this is some shortened bs, where more context was that a conservative considers a car, money, house of equal value to human lives, while liberals put human lives above those. which is very very very damn generous of him towards conservatives. part of the stupid Te lie here is, that conservatives dont even care about human lives, they only care to exploit them, which allows them to phrase it as if they care about ppl.

    also dont waste mine or anyone else's time esp with bs like this do u know how much time ive spent trying to understand them, their arguements, and all that, while its the same shit over and over and over again, omiting of information when convenient, acusing libs of what they are doing, etc. no consistency with what they say. theres even a study that says conservatives LIE AND LIE WAY MORE THAN LIBERALS. i dont even like studies, they are often very fucking biased and useless, done by ppl who are mentally incapable of such complex problem solving and delienation. i dont need a study to tell me conservatives lie way mroe. i knew it all before. its a cult. i have more experience with conservatives than conservatives. nothing can convince a narcissist. they want to believe their delusions.
    I actually agree with most of this, although not so stridently.

    Haidt did some very good research into the morality of liberals and conservatives. In my opinion, he, himself, is a very smart conservative, in that he promotes conservative values by masquerading as a liberal, or at least, as someone who is above choosing sides. But he has chosen sides.

    I don't entirely agree that one side or the other has a monopoly on valuing human life. Conservatives can be pretty cruel to people whom they deem to be "beneath them", or "undeserving", while liberals have been cheerleaders for a lot of wars. Basically, I don't think that "valuing human life" is a good way to discriminate between the two groups.

    Valuing "in group" is much better. It explains why conservatives are so ready to kill/abandon the "out groups", and why they appear to lie. What they are actually doing when the repeat the party line is signaling that they are part of that group. They don't really believe that the sky is green. If you ask them why they say that, and if they tell you the truth, they will say that it's "to own the libs". To enrage the other side.

    Authoritarianism, which I think is incredibly toxic and dangerous, is also common among conservatives, but it is separate from conservatism and is not exclusive to conservatives.

    Both conservatives and liberals keep being born. The difference seems to be in the level of the fear response, with conservatives being more fearful of everything. Personally, I feel that if something keeps appearing in the genetic record, there must be some use for it.

    The whole conservative thing with gun ownership is coming from a standpoint of fear. Guns kill a lot of people, usually family members actually, but some people think that having a gun makes them feel safe, and feeling safe can feel better than actually being safe.
    I grew up around guns (my father was in the military and was as conservative as they get), and while I don't feel a need to own a gun to be safe, I will say that owning a gun and knowing how to use it safely is a good thing for many reasons. Owning a locked gun cabinet is also a good idea.
    (If Russia decides to invade Texas, Texas won't even have to call up the National Guard, much less the US Army. The Texas citizens will finish them off.)

    Fear of loud noises, fear of strangers, fear of the new, all conspire to make cities uncomfortable places for conservatives. This is unfortunate for them, because cities are where most of the wealth is created. On the other hand, a healthy fear of strangers can keep your country safe from murderous invaders. So in the long run, both orientations are valuable.

    This can be hard to see, though, when someone is trying to burn your grandmother for being a witch, or wants to shoot someone for jogging while black.

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    Last edited by Adam Strange; 05-18-2022 at 04:14 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post

    Haidt did some very good research into the morality of liberals and conservatives. In my opinion, he, himself, is a very smart conservative, in that he promotes conservative values by masquerading as a liberal, or at least, as someone who is above choosing sides. But he has chosen sides.
    Haidt has identified as centrist since 2012. Of course, that means to the liberal he is a conservative, and to the conservative, he is a liberal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rune View Post
    Haidt has identified as centrist since 2012. Of course, that means to the liberal he is a conservative, and to the conservative, he is a liberal.
    Haidt is a very clever liar.

    I believe this because I lie in the same way. By omitting all the information my audience might need to make a fully informed decision, and letting their biases carry them to my conclusion.

    But I hear what you are saying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    jonathan haidt doesnt deserve to breathe. his research might have been even what i mentioned earlier in the thread
    this is some shortened bs, where more context was that a conservative considers a car, money, house of equal value to human lives, while liberals put human lives above those. which is very very very damn generous of him towards conservatives. part of the stupid Te lie here is, that conservatives dont even care about human lives, they only care to exploit them, which allows them to phrase it as if they care about ppl.

    also dont waste mine or anyone else's time esp with bs like this do u know how much time ive spent trying to understand them, their arguements, and all that, while its the same shit over and over and over again, omiting of information when convenient, acusing libs of what they are doing, etc. no consistency with what they say. theres even a study that says conservatives LIE AND LIE WAY MORE THAN LIBERALS. i dont even like studies, they are often very fucking biased and useless, done by ppl who are mentally incapable of such complex problem solving and delienation. i dont need a study to tell me conservatives lie way mroe. i knew it all before. its a cult. i have more experience with conservatives than conservatives. nothing can convince a narcissist. they want to believe their delusions.
    You seem schizophrenic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xelor View Post
    You seem schizophrenic.
    a lot of great ppl have been schizophrenic. theres nice schizophrenics on this forum. there was also and he returned someone whos not so nice. and hes not a liberal nor center despite what he pretends
    https://linktr.ee/tehhnicus
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    Quote Originally Posted by VewyScawwyNawcissist View Post
    a lot of great ppl have been schizophrenic. theres nice schizophrenics on this forum. there was also and he returned someone whos not so nice. and hes not a liberal nor center despite what he pretends
    Take your meds, buddy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean Man View Post
    Seems like you're twisting things to a warped perspective using DA cognitive style, that's not HP and you're not an LII. You're an ILI-N just like Gulenko said.
    Thank you for the information. Hopefully this will be useful for something in the future.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean Man View Post
    That's funny too though, all of the bad people I've met have usually had unhappy lives and are deeply jealous of those thriving
    There's no connection between how just of a person you are and the amount of happiness you receive in life. None. Zero. Nada. Look at how much St. Teresa of Calcutta suffered. Mao Zedong was a butcher and died a happy, wealthy man in his 80s. To the contrary, there's a reverse correlation. Jesus says that those who are happy in this life have received their reward. (Luke 6:24)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean Man View Post
    You've failed every test and I'm done with your toxic self. The game was fun while it lasted, but you took my bait in that typing thread - you latch on to things that suit your confirmation bias and twist it to the most fucked up and negative perspective possible. Toxic. You're blocked and I'd appreciate it if you stalk someone else.
    "I know very well what I am of myself because for this purpose Jesus has opened the eyes of my soul; I am an abyss of misery, and hence I understand that whatever good there is in my soul consists solely of His holy grace." - St. Faustyna Kowalska
    Last edited by SacredKnowing; 04-10-2023 at 02:01 AM.
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    Is @Maromi still trying to talk to me? I guess he hasn't realized he lost the privilege of being known after pretending to be a woman, doxing, gaslighting, leaking chats and so on. What a freak. Blocked for life, it's my choice to never view your messages again, bro - no amount of horseshit you write will change that.

    This is my last message acknowledging your sad hypocritical and evil existence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post

    I don't entirely agree that one side or the other has a monopoly on valuing human life. Conservatives can be pretty cruel to people whom they deem to be "beneath them", or "undeserving", while liberals have been cheerleaders for a lot of wars. Basically, I don't think that "valuing human life" is a good way to discriminate between the two groups.

    Valuing "in group" is much better. It explains why conservatives are so ready to kill/abandon the "out groups", and why they appear to lie. What they are actually doing when the repeat the party line is signaling that they are part of that group. They don't really believe that the sky is green. If you ask them why they say that, and if they tell you the truth, they will say that it's "to own the libs". To enrage the other side.
    its not fear, its disgust. liberals are often afraid of hurting others, and losing the spark of their own life - live like a slave, enjoy being punched and much worse, to serve an asshole who exploits more people. disgust manifests as that, everything different from me must be destroyed. conservative ingroup is themselves. anything different than themselves must be destroyed. outgroup means beyond the self.
    he difference seems to be in the level of the fear response, with conservatives being more fearful of everything. Personally, I feel that if something keeps appearing in the genetic record, there must be some use for it.
    it keeps appearing until it doesnt. it doesnt necessarily mean that there must be some use for it. its kind of similar to the christian or spiritual logic that everything that is happening is god's plan. just because something can exist or happen does not mean we need it to exist or happen, and even if it "should" there may exist clauses for how much. some people are obviously born to be used and dumped. sometimes bad things happen because shitty ppl dont want to take responsibility for their little monster, even if that monster did save people's lives. the ends do not justify the means anyway. it seems bad things happen and some ppl have to pay way more for that, but this logic is also used for ppl to claim they couldnt do anything better because thats just how the world is.
    i may be paraphrasing, but @End did make a case that forced/arranged marriages (thats fancy for human trafficking and sex slavery) can be a necessity.
    On the other hand, a healthy fear of strangers can keep your country safe from murderous invaders
    who would invade a country for its conservatives to defend it if not other conservatives?
    besides if liberals themselves werent nice to "the other", we wouldnt have conservatives. what happens is simply that the libs who tend to fight back are the ones exterminated, so the ones left have less 'healthy fear of strangers". u either fight a bitch or live a bitch.
    its the classic scam. they rob stores, then ask the owners to pay them protection fees, to protect the store. from whom? from themselves and ppl like themselves. simply parasytes. they invade a host and make their own cesspool. it all about themeslves. its their coutnry and their rules.
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    My very existance pisses off and trolls a Cuntservative Fauxtian... maybe more the other way around. The loathing is definitely mutual though- why try to hide it.

    I was moderate and overly polite before. But why? it's the dumb 'nice guy liberal syndrome' that I don't really respect. I like when liberals get angry and pissed- and we should, as more of our rights are being taken away by cuntservaitve FLAWmakers. You think you're a Conservative Lawmaker but bitch- you really a Cuntservative Flawmaker.

    can i say I don't like how rape-y Cuntservatives are? Sexphobic and homophobic CRUELservatives think raping is all about sex but there are so many ways you can rape ppl by invading their boundaries. I hate that so many Cuntservatives have spammed my cell phone with their bullshit political slogans- I will not be convinced by you- you RapeTards. I respect liberals so much better, because they never bother me with their views like this- and have more natural respect and empathy if we have similiar views.

    Just a few months ago, some Cuntservative Retard approached me talking about his Pro-Life views. Cuntservatives might have 'balls' but they have no brains- and their balls are based on their own bigotry and fear/disgust/whatever. Now listen Cuntservative Retard- I didn't go up to you talking about how gay I am and how much I love big smelly Italian dick all over my faggy little cute face- so why are you talking to me about this? I care nothing of your stupid virtue signaling for fetuses- you will do NOTHING to help kids when they actually get here, goddamn CONservative!!!!

    I actually like people who can state their views more diplomatically. It's kinda refreshing when we can disagree and still get along peacefully. But i also think that's a fake thing people do for the Te cameras as it were.

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    They ironically share the same values and reactionary political views as many of the immigrants that they look down on and see as a corrupting influence

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    @ipbanned @Hardware Punk

    First of all I would like to apologize for my long overdue response. I am a busy person with a lot on my plate so I can only devote so much time to this website. However, I know you are not the kind of person interested in excuses so I will just go ahead and write my response below:

    Ein Fälscher ist, wer Nietzsche interpretiert, indem er Zitate aus ihm benutzt, denn er kann ihn all das sagen lassen, worauf er selbst aus ist, indem er authentische Worte und Sätze nach freien Belieben geschickt arrangiert. Im Bergwerk dieses Denkers ist jedes Metall zu finden: Nietzsche hat alles gesagt und das Gegenteil von allem. Und überhaupt ist es unredlich, sich der Zitate aus Nietzsche zu bedienen, wenn man über ihn spricht; man verleiht so den eigenen Worten Gewicht durch die Wirkung, die von ihm ausgeht, daß die seinen in ihnen erscheinen.
    Giorgio Colli, "Nach Nietzsche", Aus dem Italienischen von Reimar Klein, EVA Frankfurt/Main 1980

    We must first understand that for Nietzsche 'Christ', 'Christianity', 'Christians', 'the New Testament', and 'priests' are all entirely seperate concepts. The same way he makes distinction between the thought of Socrates and the contemporary concept of Socratism in the 'Birth of Tragedy'. Nietzsche's criticisms in the Antichrist are primarily towards institutional interpretations of Christianity. Nietzsche bestows on Jesus the title of 'free spirit' in §32 of The Anti-Christ, and his overall interpretation of the figure is quite similar to Jung's interpretation in 'Aion' and Hegel's in 'The Life of Jesus' .

    §33
    [...]It is not a ‘belief’ which distinguishes the Christian: the Christian acts, he is distinguished by a different mode of acting. Neither by words nor in his heart does he resist the man who does him evil. He makes no distinction between foreigner and native, between Jew and non-Jew… He is not angry with anyone, does not disdain anyone… The life of the redeemer was nothing else than this practice – his death too was nothing else.[...]
    The profound instinct for how one would have to live in order to feel oneself ‘in Heaven’, to feel oneself ‘eternal’, while in every other condition one by no means feels oneself ‘in Heaven’: this alone is the psychological reality of ‘redemption’. – A new way of living, not a new belief…
    §35
    This ‘bringer of glad tidings’ died as he lived, as he taught – not to ‘redeem mankind’ but to demonstrate how one ought to live. What he bequeathed to mankind is his practice: his bearing before the judges, before the guards, before the accusers and every kind of calumny and mockery – his bearing on the Cross. He does not resist, he does not defend his rights, he takes no steps to avert the worst that can happen to him – more, he provokes it…. And he entreats, he suffers, he loves with those, in those who are doing evil to him. His words to the thief on the Cross contain the whole Evangel. ‘That was verily a divine man, a child of God!’ – says the thief. ‘If thou feelest this’ – answers the redeemer – ‘thou art in Paradise, thou art a child of God.’ Not to defend oneself, not to grow angry, not to make responsible.… But not to resist even the evil man – to love him…
    §39
    I shall go back a bit, and tell you the authentic history of Christianity.—The very word “Christianity” is a misunderstanding—at bottom there was only one Christian, and he died on the cross. The “Gospels” died on the cross. What, from that moment onward, was called the “Gospels” was the very reverse of what he had lived: “bad tidings,” a Dysangelium.[14] It is an error amounting to nonsensicality to see in “faith,” and particularly in faith in salvation through Christ, the distinguishing mark of the Christian: only the Christian way of life, the life lived by him who died on the cross, is Christian.... To this day such a life is still possible, and for certain men even necessary: genuine, primitive Christianity will remain possible in all ages.... Not faith, but acts; above all, an avoidance of acts, a different state of being.... States of consciousness, faith of a sort, the acceptance, for example, of anything as true—as every psychologist knows, the value of these things is perfectly indifferent and fifth-rate compared to that of the instincts: strictly speaking, the whole concept of intellectual causality is false. To reduce being a Christian, the state of Christianity, to an acceptance of truth, to a mere phenomenon of consciousness, is to formulate the negation of Christianity. In fact, there are no Christians. The “Christian”—he who for two thousand years has passed as a Christian—is simply a psycho logical self-delusion. Closely examined, it appears that, despite all his “faith,” he has been ruled only by his instincts—and what instincts!—In all ages—for example, in the case of Luther—“faith” has been no more than a cloak, a pretense, a curtain behind which the instincts have played their game—a shrewd blindness to the domination of certain of the instincts.... I have already called “faith” the specially Christian form of shrewdness—people always talk of their “faith” and act according to their instincts.... In the world of ideas of the Christian there is nothing that so much as touches reality: on the contrary, one recognizes an instinctive hatred of reality as the motive power, the only motive power at the bottom of Christianity. What follows therefrom? That even here, in psychologicis, there is a radical error, which is to say one conditioning fundamentals, which is to say, one in substance. Take away one idea and put a genuine reality in its place—and the whole of Christianity crumbles to nothingness!—Viewed calmly, this strangest of all phenomena, a religion not only depending on errors, but inventive and ingenious only in devising injurious errors, poisonous to life and to the heart—this remains a spectacle for the gods—for those gods who are also philosophers, and whom I have encountered, for example, in the celebrated dialogues at Naxos. At the moment when their disgust leaves them (—and us!) they will be thankful for the spectacle afforded by the Christians: perhaps because of this curious exhibition alone the wretched little planet called the earth deserves a glance from omnipotence, a show of divine interest.... Therefore, let us not underestimate the Christians: the Christian, false to the point of innocence, is far above the ape—in its application to the Christians a well-known theory of descent becomes a mere piece of politeness....
    §40
    Obviously the little community had not understood the most important thing, the exemplary way of his dying, the freedom, the superiority over every feeling of ressentiment:— an indication of how little they understood him at all! In fact, there was nothing Jesus could want from his death besides publicly giving the strongest test, the proof of his teaching [...] the veneration gone wild of these totally unhinged souls could no longer stand that evangelical granting of equal rights to everyone to be a child of God, as Jesus had taught: their revenge was to raise Jesus aloft in an extravagant manner, and cut themselves off from him [...] The One God and the One Son of God: both products of ressentiment.

    §41
    ...the little community found a downright terrifyingly absurd answer: God gave his Son for the forgiveness of sins as a sacrifice. . . What atrocious paganism! - for Jesus had done away with the concept 'guilt' itself
    Even in your quotation of §44 he calls the Gospels a corruption.

    For Nietzsche, institutionalized Christianity was a betrayal of the world view that Jesus espoused. Jesus had attempted to go 'beyond good and evil'. He had denied any chasm between God and man, he lived this unity as ‘glad tidings’. Perhaps it was my mistake to tell you to reread 'The-Antichrist' because despite the appraisal Nietzsche gives to him, Jesus is still portrayed as insufficient. Though 'hatred' is far from it, ambivalence is a far more accurate description. In his other publications there are more 'praises' to be found.

    Now, Nietzsche did not 'hate' Institutionalized Christianity either. Why is that? well first we must examine where feelings of 'hatred' deride from on his own terms. He distinguishes between two kinds, a resentful hatred and a creative one. For the purposes of this post we will focus on the latter. For him, the affirmative hatred towards one's enemy is an exercise of the will to power. We must 'hate' in order to conquer and emerge victorious for the sake of growth. Hatred is 'greatest' when the struggle is between two equivalent powers. Nietzsche does not hate institutionalized Christianity but rather he held it in contempt [verachtung]. He was revolted by it and considered it useless and beneath him -not as an enemy worthy of hate but an object to excrete. Nietzsche warns against confusing the two.

    From Volume 11 §134 of his lost fragments

    Everybody continually excludes, separates that which is of no use to it in the assimilated being: that which human beings despise, that for which they have revulsion, what they call evil, are the excrements. But their unknowing “reason” often designates for them as evil what causes them trouble, what is uncomfortable, the other, the enemy, they confuse that which is useless with that which is difficult to acquire, to conquer to incorporate.
    Now for some letters.

    As far as Christianity is concerned, I hope you will believe this much: in my heart I’ve never held it in contempt and, ever since childhood, have often struggled with myself on behalf of its ideals
    to F. Overbeck, June 23, 1881

    Christianity (...) is the best piece of ideal life that I have really got to know, from childhood I followed it, in many corners, and I think I have never been mean in my heart to it. Ultimately, I am the descendant of entire generations of Christian clergymen.
    to Peter Gast, Sils-Maria, July 21, 1881

    With regard to Christianity, you will probably believe one thing: I have never been mean to it in my heart, and have since childhood offered much inner effort on behalf of its ideals, in the end, of course, always with the result of pure impossibility
    to Franz Overbeck, Sils-Maria, July 23, 1881

    ...this time I shall come as victorious Dionysus, who will make this world a holiday...Not that I have much time... [...] I have been hanged on the cross, too...
    to Cosima Wagner, January 3, 1889

    I know I said I would respond within a week, I know I didn't but I have my excuses... but I suppose a response within the month is not TOO bad. If you feel the need to correct me please do so!

    Oh, and by the way: I was not joking when I called Evola a sweety. Most of his intellectual contributions have been towards the study of Buddhism. He is genuinely among the best of his scholars and his works on perennialism are genuinely the standard. Among the European scholars of eastern faith only Guenon compares to him. Evola is scary towards the general public because like in that quote he challenged the idea of 'progress'. Now people who profit out of giving people bad images can say 'look Evola opposes progress!' Evola only asked people think about what 'progress' was. It was an idea which emerged out of scientific rationalism. Something no doubt an inwards focused person such as himself was dubious of.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 05-26-2022 at 04:37 PM.

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