WW3 any day now, feel that breeze of freedom from western media.Originally Posted by ContractedCriminalboy
WW3 any day now, feel that breeze of freedom from western media.
Lol, no. WW3 would only happen if the US government were as Authoritarian as Russia's. With Trump no longer trying to pal up with every Authoritarian leader on the planet, the US is on a much safer track.
Just imagine if Russia invaded Mongolia, what would China do?
Instead of invading other countries, liberal democracies just hold meetings to exchange information and ideas and then they cut off the credit of the bad guys, so they can't play with the adults anymore.
There is a reason the world needs liberal democracies if it is going to survive the resource scarcities which are coming our way.
Last edited by Adam Strange; 02-22-2022 at 02:10 AM.
Just two nice guys signing a mutual non-aggression pact.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/fr...ny-russia-1939
Is Ukrainian neutrality really such a bad compromise? Why does it have to either join NATO or become Russian?
Why not let the Ukrainians decide how they want to govern themselves?
It's up to us to choose whether or not to extend NATO. I get that it's a purely defensive alliance, but it won't seem that way from the Russian perspective.
If Mexico decided to join, say, a Chinese-led alliance, allowed Chinese troops to use its bases, allowed China to station rockets within firing distance from Houston and Los Angeles, and did war games 100 miles from the coast of California, would the United States not go into full panic mode?
Who is invading who, here?
My narcissist mother once told me that it was my fault that she broke a vein in her hand while punching me in the face.
The West appeasing Putin is like the firefighters appeasing the arsonists.
I have no problem believing that Putin is a revanchist at heart. But even if he were a jingoist — one who'd love to see Russian troops stationed in London and Paris, let alone Donetsk — he can nevertheless be kept bottled up. We can still guarantee Ukrainian independence without it having to formally join NATO. And to that effect, we could maintain an expeditionary force in Poland and Romania (close enough to Ukraine, but far enough away from Russia).
Last edited by xerx; 02-22-2022 at 05:09 AM. Reason: .
Friendly reminder: Putin is not Adolf H!tler. He doesn't have the military strength or the delusional ambition. And we're not "appeasing" him by not totally encircling his crippled country.
It’s my understanding that the US thinks it would be bad to let Putin dictate which countries are allowed to join NATO when a) Russia is not a member of NATO, and b) Putin actively opposes NATO and wants to see it destroyed. But ignoring that…
NATO has a rule that bars joining members from being involved in a territorial disputes. Would Ukraine even have a chance of joining NATO as long as Russia claimed Crimea? Why is Putin so desperate for us to promise that Ukraine will never join?
I get the importance of standing up to tyrants (let's be honest about what he is). No country has the right to tell other countries how to conduct their foreign policies.
But when it comes to Ukraine, the stakes are very high for Russia. Russia's geographical location is bad. Its border with Europe is a wide-open plain — there are no mountains or choke points that can be easily defended. Russia's historical solution was to conquer as much space as possible between Moscow and Western Europe. If Ukraine invited foreign armies, they could threaten an important part of Russia. Russia would have to respond by raising its military expenditures, possibly unsustainably.
Last edited by xerx; 02-22-2022 at 06:56 AM.
Unbelievable levels of mental gymnastics and justification for the unjustifiable from the US side.
Let's put nukes at 4 minutes from Moscow completely compromising a country's security, and when that country wants to go through the diplomatic route, respond with 0 concessions and a hundred menaces and attacks. Make up some date for a russian attack and tell lies to all your partners in order to drive up tensions enough so Europe cannot reach a diplomatic solution. Take all the decisions over Nordstream 2 even if it's not your right to do so. Suddenly come up with sourceless claims about Russia wanting to kill and send LGBT, jews and gypsies to death camps when this does not even happen within Russia's borders to justify a fucking war, Then let Zelensky attack Novorrosiya, with heavy fire and artillery attacks, and when Putin recognizes Donetsk and Lugansk as independent states and sends troops in throw up your histerics about Russia wanting to invade.
And after all of this claim that Russia is the agressor.
Really if you support NATO on this you should seek help. Gotta be a huge retard when it is NATO who's being the agressor (as almost always since the cold war ended) and driving up a war so the US monetary system doesn't collapse even though Petrodollar is going obsolete.
The US would burn the world if that means the financial institutions controlling them maintain their status and power. Warmongers with the image of world police, actually being the world's cartel.
Last edited by RBRS; 02-22-2022 at 08:15 AM.
The insanity and derangement of Tankies is truly hilarious. Why would the U.S. and NATO need Ukraine to nuke Russia? They have Poland and the Baltics and more than advanced enough ballistic weaponry to make Ukraine unnecessary for such a task.
Funny enough, Novorrosiya gangsters have broken each and every single cease fire agreement with the Ukrainian government, just look at how they took the airport! Fucking spineless dogs. Even still firing on Ukrainian positions as the Ukrainians have orders not to fire back. Gangsters who strong armed the lands from the people and government with Russian aid, not through any will of the people of those lands.
NATO is always the aggressor? Did NATO force Serbia to commit genocide, oppress, and ostracize each and every single one of their neighbors? I think not. And did NATO force Russia to commit acts of aggression against Georgia and Ukraine? I think not. If you support violent separatism so much, do you condemn Russian actions against the secular Chechen breakaway of the 1st Chechen war? Or is violent separatism only supported when it benefits Russia?
How these Tankies support such oligarchical gangsters is beyond me, gangsters who've robbed their nations dry, just look at the state of Ukraine right up before their revolution and see is it any wonder they got fed up with you cunts bleeding them dry? Even the fucking military was paper mache then. Ukraine is still corrupt as fuck but strides better than it ever was with Russia leading it, and the further Russian cunts are from the country, the more prosperity it will achieve, ergo the desire of the people to get the hell away from you crooks.
Word to the Russkies. Maybe literally everyone in Europe wouldn't hate your asses so much, if you could stop acting like violent criminal cunts towards them throughout history and still now. Even the people of Belarus, the closest nation to Russia in Europe, are fed up with this horror of a state, only being tied to Russia through a brutal dictator who wants to revive the USSR. Give them free will to achieve their own destinies and watch how fast they run the hell away.
US thinks the Russians made a mistake and are taking advantaging of situation, American appears to be looking for a pretext to weaken the Russians and re-establish Western dominance, while risking the lives of millions in a far away country.
ἀταραξία
From Ukraine they can nuke Moscow in less than 4 minutes, making it impossible for Russia to detect the bombs and react, reason why this conflict is starting. There's been two weeks of talks where Russia has tried to compromise with the only petition to not allow Ukraine to enter NATO. What has been the US response? Zero consideration, and a thousand threats.
All of this shit is just the US trying to gain monopoly over European energy for OPEC as their currency is bullshit and other currencies could end up being exchanged for OIL and other goods like Microchips, tungsten... making the US financial system unsustainable.
You need top levels of derangement to defend a nation who lies and invents threats while not allowing independent nations to take their own stand over something that directly affects them, at the same time they force a state to go to war while crying about muh ebil imperialist ruskies.
Serbia is not US business. Irak, Lybia, Syria, wars or proxy wars fought with the sole intention of protecting and consolidating Petrodollar.
And I don't support any form of separatism, I support Ukraine not joining NATO to spark a bloodshed just so BlackRock and their Fed associates can continue to fuck up the world. I really don't give a fuck about what happens to Ukraine, it's simply not worth a bigger conflict.
This is simple; If Ukraine is allowed to enter NATO, there's war, if the US didn't wanted to provoke a war Biden would have atleast followed a diplomatic stance, instead of menacing.
NATOsimps need pills and some subsidy.
Last edited by RBRS; 02-22-2022 at 10:37 AM.
This issue is proving to be a good litmus test for whether you can trust certain people's opinions, especially media figures.
Last edited by ouronis; 02-23-2022 at 09:45 AM.
Isn't that what happened in the breakaway regions of Ukraine?
It seems Zelenski gave a speech signaling he won't respond with military force. What an overblown "crisis."
But hey, treating it as the spark for the next world war sells pentagon defense contracts.
Highly probable russian invasion if Ukraine is to join NATO. Tanks with Zs painted on them (¿Zapad?) Have supposedly been seen in Novorossiya, and the DPR as well as the LPR claim they are still being attacked by Ukraine.
Read my initial comment and please show me the data that the breakaway was the will of the people and not a strong armed coup heavily supported by Russian forces. You could make more of that argument for Crimea but not the east.
I used to think @FreelancePoliceman knew everything about everything and everyone, real big brained and omniscient. But this thread has me eating crow.
Obviously. What else? Initiate attacks against Russian forces? I don't think it very surprising Zelensky announced that he doesn't want to kill himself. The crisis is in regards to the potential of Russian forces initiating attacks against Ukrainian forces, not the other way around.
One of the very best things about this forum is that you can get to know people on several levels, and they can surprise you at any time. Although there are a limited number of patterns that anyone might follow.
I first encountered this when Trump was up for election and most people thought that he was what he was, which is a lazy, narcissistic, self-interested, vindictive asshole. A truly small man. The remarkable thing to me was that there was a very smart guy on the forum named Hitta who, when pressed, would admit that Trump was a bad human being but still wanted to see him elected. This made no sense to me. In my view, Hitta was not going to materially benefit in the slightest from Trump's election. Hitta's student grants might even be hurt by Trump's election, since Trump is an anti-intellectual.
Hitta doesn't vote, incidentally. He merely complains.
I absolutely could not understand why Hitta, with something like four advanced degrees, wanted to see Trump elected, until I realized this:
To be clear, I don't think that @FreelancePoliceman wants to watch the world burn, but Hitta did. I don't agree with FP's views on America or the Ukraine, but I think it's important to hear what he says. Lots of times, things that are painful to hear, or which seem to be patently ridiculous viewpoints, deserve our attention and consideration, if only because they help us to see the errors in our own thinking.
Last edited by Adam Strange; 02-22-2022 at 03:20 PM.
I *strongly* doubt that hitta has four advanced degrees, and I'd be shocked if he even has one. I personally trust nothing that hitta claims about his personal life or accomplishments. Nothing.
@xerx, you might have better insight into his character than I do, but I tend to take what people say at face value, unless there is evidence to the contrary.
I will say that I once read a paper that he wrote, and it was full of what I thought was bad science and spelling errors and was poorly written, in my opinion.
On the other hand, he has some of the highest scores on the arcade games on this site.
Life is full of contradictions.
Putin seems to be displaying a pattern of exposing the foolishness and psychopathic nature of Kissinger style foreign policy.
Perhaps to cause cognitive dissonance in the perception of both the US and Russia while carving out a place for himself in the future.
ἀταραξία
He once threatened to kill me.
I know who he is, and I know enough about his personal life such that four advanced degrees sounds like a real stretch. I won't say anymore, though, because I don't want to doxx him.
An interesting article about the mood in Estonia: https://www2.politicalbetting.com/in...soviet-states/
If so, they are under no delusion that it is possible to find compromise with Putin. They expect war.
I found his True Name on the paper he wrote, but I immediately forgot it, because...........who cares?
And the "four advanced degrees" might not have been his claim, it might have been my inference from a discussion he had in chat about getting yet another degree.
Will economic sanctions + shutting down Nord Stream 2 deter Putin at all?
Russia has lost a lot due to sanctions, and it stands to lose more. European, especially German, automakers have factories there; Russia is a major export/import market to/from the European Union; and Russia is a major energy exporter to Europe. Only Europe supplies the sophisticated electronics that the Russian defense industry needs (China isn't yet technologically advanced enough).
https://apnews.com/article/russia-uk...8cd9399a1d3b7c
I find it hard to believe that Putin would throw all of that away over some small breakaway regions.
It's clear that the man has deeply-embedded revanchist yearnings, that he resents the fall of the Soviet Union, and that he's willing to use force for geopolitical gain. His critics have correctly articulated the ease with which he's willing to break international law. But I do believe that there's something more going on, something that the West is doing to force his hand.
Biden already has what he wanted (EU's energy market) the "decrepit old man" as they call him won. Putin fell directly into the US plan, yesterday's Biden speech demonstrates that my prediction about the US's intentions were true, look at my past post here and LOOK AT THE CURRENT SITUATION, I got it almost perfectly. Petrodollar will not go obsolete for far more time.
A little downside is Germans freezing, energy and basic utilites skyrocketing in prices thus bankrupting european businesses and making families unable to sustain their lifestyle, while a financial crisis approaches us. Most migrants barely can sustain themselves without the help of the goverment, and are not integrated among the general population, I hope I don't have to say anything else for you to catch what I mean. These conditions can end up in the US losing Europe from it's sphere of influence. If that doesn't go awry the WEF will have it's way even before 2030, as this means property will be far more unequally distributed (than it already is).
Last edited by RBRS; 02-23-2022 at 12:18 PM.
Nope, it will force them to strengthen their relations with China while not being subjected to a trade relationship with Europe (meaning they don't need cordialities now, and they can act as agressively as they see fit with us, including subversion and espionage as well as financing terrorist organizations).
All of this has the intent of replacing Russia with other OPEC countries oil in the EU energy market, OPEC's oil is exchanged for USD which gives the US geopolitical strength it wouldn't have otherwise while allowing the fed to print as USD as wanted and distribute them as they want (constant demand for USD in international markets) I have a deeper post on this very thread explaining. The thing is China is competing with USD and trying to establish Yuan as a reserve currency, while developed economies no longer need oil exclusively to keep functioning, growing and innovating (Microchips, Tungsten, Coltan... rare earth in general are as much as needed and the major producer, refiner and exporter of these goods is China) which alongside oil exporters having better relations with China (Russia itself, but now they're cut off from the west) are making Petrodollar obsolete.
So, Biden directly menaced Russia's security by trying to get Ukraine into NATO so the russians invaded, in order to be able to make Germany close Nordstream 2 and sanction Russia until expelling them from the EU's energy market, making sure Europe has to buy american-allied OPEC oil (like that of the saudis) thus making sure Petrodollar doesn't go obsolete and securing their own financial system. And Germany folded like a bitch because Europe is the US's backyard, american client states.
A certain southern European country from which I am, already fuels itself on Saudi oil and has refined oil as one of it's main exports, meaning this country is gonna make huge bank on this. Sadly, that country's goverment isn't very competent when it comes to economic policy (and I think its on purpose) hope they aren't stupid enough to let this opportunity go awry.
In last time USA & its band (the ones who controls those nations) by soldiers from different nations + the ones pushed by the force and lie to its army from occupied since 2014 by USA Russian borderland territory called as "украина" does regular intensive attacks by diversions and artillery fire to territory of Russian interests (and in core sense to part of Russia, kills Russians) and also sometimes does attacks to official territory of Russian Federation. It's done against military and also mainly civil objects (as power and water sources), including wide artillery fire to towns territories of the borderland - what can be named as terrorism.
The aim is to provoke Russia to protect own interests and people by open military force. Also USA recently has made threats to do terroristic attacks in deep Russian Federation territory. 2nd aim is to push civil people living on attacked borderland territory (which effectively opposed to USA occupation still) to leave it - what can be named as a form of genocide.
In medias USA & its band does massive lieing, including show falsifications about what happens, as same did before in Syria and other places.
Attacks on Russian borderland territory by USA & band are happening since 2014, when USA did illegal military overturn there to place own people to formal power. Attacks were _partly_ reduced by Minsk agreements of late 2014 and recently were openly rejected by USA, what factually is seen by starting of intensive deversions and artillery attacks on military and civil objects of borderland and people there.
An example of news line about the situation on historical Russian borderland, which was illegally and against people wish in referendum(!) of 1991 departed from Russia in December of 1991 and large part of which is occupied by USA-hithlerists since 2014.
Man was so terrified that he accidentally gives away Russia's plan lol
China ain't said shit about this, lol.
ἀταραξία
In other words, by taking Ukraine, Putin is preparing for war.
Zelensky addressed the people of Russia in a speech he made earlier today. Translation below:
"I have initiated a call today with the president of the Russian Federation. The result - silence. Although silence should be in Donbass.
That is why today, I want to come with an appeal to all citizens of Russia. Not as President. I am appealing to the people of Russia as a citizen of Ukraine. We share more than two thousand kilometres of border. Around it, today, is your army: almost 200,000 soldiers; thousands of military units. Your leadership has approved their movement towards us. Towards the territory of another country. This step can become the start of a big war on the European continent. The whole world is talking about what can happen any day now. A reason can appear at any moment. Any provocation. Any spark. A spark that has the potential of burning everything down.
You are told that this flame will bring freedom to the people of Ukraine. But the people of Ukraine are free. They remember their past, and are building their own future. They are building it, not destroying it, as you are told everyday on TV. Ukraine in your news and Ukraine in reality are two completely different countries. The most important difference is that ours is real.
You are being told that we are nazis. But how can a nation be called nazist after sacrificing more than 8 million lives to eradicate it. How can I be a nazi, when my grandfather has survived the whole war as part of the Soviet infantry, and has died a colonel in an independent Ukraine. You are told that we hate Russian culture. But how can a culture be hated? Any culture. Neighbours are always enriching each other culturally. Yet, that does not make them one entity, and does not separate people into “us” and “them”. We are different, but that is not a reason to be enemies. We want to build our own history. Peacefully, calmly, and truthfully.
You are told that I am ordering to attack the Donbass. To shoot. To bomb without questions. Although there are questions: To shoot at whom? To bomb what?
Donetsk? To which I have been dozens of times. I have seen their faces and eyes.
Artema street? On which I have been on many walks with my friends in the past.
Donbass arena? Where I have been rooting with the locals for our boys during the Euros.
Shcherbakova Park? In which we were drinking together after our team has lost
Lugansk? The home of my best friend’s mom. The place where my best friend’s father is buried.
Note that I am now speaking in Russian, yet no one in Russia understands what these names, streets, and events mean. This is all foreign to you. Unknown. This is our land. This is our history. What are you going to fight for? And against whom?
Many of you have visited Ukraine in the past. Many of you have relatives here. Some of you studied in our universities. Befriended Ukrainian people. You’re familiar with our character, with our people, our principles. You know what we cherish the most. Look inside you, listen to the voice of reason, of common sense. Hear our voices. The people of Ukraine want peace. Ukrainian authorities want peace. We want it, and we make it. We do everything in our powers. We are not alone. It’s true, Ukraine is supported by many countries. Why? Because we are not talking about peace at any cost. We are talking about peace, and about principles, justice. About everyone’s right to define their own future, of safety, and everyone’s right to live without threat. All this is important to us. All this is important for peace. I know for sure that this is also important for you. We know for sure that we don’t want war. Neither cold, hot, or hybrid.
But, if we are threatened; If someone is trying to take away our country, our freedom, our lives. The lives of our children. We are going to defend ourselves. Not attack. Defend. By attacking us, you are going to see our faces. Not backs. Our faces.
War is a big distress, and it has a big price - in all meanings of this word. People lose their money, reputation, quality of life, freedom, and most importantly, people lose their loved ones. Lose themselves. A lot of things are always lacking in war. But what is in abundance is pain, dirt, blood, and death. Thousands. Tens of thousands of deaths. You are told that Ukraine is a threat to Russia. This was not true before, not now, and won’t be in the future. You are demanding security assurances from NATO. We are also demanding assurances of our security. The security of Ukraine from you. From Russia. And from other signatories of the Budapest memorandum. Today, we are not part of random security alliances. The security of Ukraine is tied to the security of our neighbours. That is why we are now talking about the security of all Europe. But our main goal is peace in Ukraine, and the safety of our citizens. Of Ukranians. We are determined to let everyone know about this, including you.
War is going to deprive everyone of any assurances. No one will have assurances of security.
Who is going to suffer from this the most? The people.
Who does not want this more than anyone? The people.
Who can prevent all this from happening? The people.
If these people are among you. I am sure they are. Public figures, journalists, musicians, actors, athletes, scientists, doctors, bloggers, stand-up comics, tiktokers, and others. Ordinary people. Ordinary, simple people. Men, women, old, young, fathers, and most importantly - mothers. Just as much as the people in Ukraine, no matter how much they try to convince you of the opposite.
I know that my announcement will not be aired on Russian television. But the citizens of Russia have to see it. They need to know the truth. And the truth is, that this needs to stop, before it’s too late. And if the authorities of Russia don’t want to talk to us, for the sake of peace, maybe they will talk to you.
Do the people of Russia want war? I would’ve very much liked to be able to answer this, but the answer depends only on you - citizens of the Russian Federation."
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