Adventures in Dating

[Armitage]

Do you ask them probing questions to try to get them to elaborate? The ESIs I know like the go ahead to tell even more... Like they are seeking out people's receptiveness to what they are trying to reveal.

Oh, is this what I'm doing wrong? The bike ESI just keeps mysteriously referring to something that I don't know about, and I just thought it'd be the polite thing to not ask any further, since he keeps it ambiguous on purpose. My thought was that if he wanted to tell me, he would, so it would only be impolite of me to pry any further. He generally keeps alluding to something he has to sort out for himself that he has to do alone, because his friends cannot help him with it.

[Adam Strange]

Do you ask them probing questions to try to get them to elaborate? The ESIs I know like the go ahead to tell even more... Like they are seeking out people's receptiveness to what they are trying to reveal.

Sometimes, when I'm alone, I get this feeling like I want to talk to someone about my personal life and where it is going, but so far, I haven't had an ESI that I can do that with. Not since high school, anyway.

Which reminds me, about ten years ago I visited my high school ESI buddy in Tucson and we sat in a pizza house and shot the shit for hours. When it was time for me to catch my plane, he said he wished I lived in Tucson so we could just talk like this often. Just like we used to do in high school.

Evidently, this was a more important part of our relationship than I thought it was.

[adage]

Oh, is this what I'm doing wrong? The bike ESI just keeps mysteriously referring to something that I don't know about, and I just thought it'd be the polite thing to not ask any further, since he keeps it ambiguous on purpose. My thought was that if he wanted to tell me, he would, so it would only be impolite of me to pry any further. He generally keeps alluding to something he has to sort out for himself that he has to do alone, because his friends cannot help him with it.

Sounds like he's looking for help but either doesn't know how to ask or won't because the help recieved so far wasn't great.
Fi tends to make people misunderstood, honestly, all introverted functions are more difficult to out into words and, even when expressed, tend to look not great to extroverts.
Finding an outlet is harder for introverts, they tend to turn to online where they can lay it all down.
So yeah, for you too @Adam Strange those conversations that you don't think much of are very meaningful to ESI and introverts in general.
The thoughts introverts have are often left where they're from, they kind of become useless and gather dust there, and only expressing them can help them bloom into something better. This letting thoughts out gives space for new ones, for better ones, it's good for the self-esteem to have alive thoughts.

[Lord Pixel]

Oh, is this what I'm doing wrong? The bike ESI just keeps mysteriously referring to something that I don't know about, and I just thought it'd be the polite thing to not ask any further, since he keeps it ambiguous on purpose. My thought was that if he wanted to tell me, he would, so it would only be impolite of me to pry any further. He generally keeps alluding to something he has to sort out for himself that he has to do alone, because his friends cannot help him with it.

fuck, that is too relatable. Fi, if I ever seen it in words.

[Lord Pixel]

Any advice for me regarding LSIs? Lol

I think deep down every LSI wants to be a Bear Grylls hunter survivor man lol. Maybe take them to axe throwing or something where they feel like they can either practice or learn a skill that helps them survivor when the world goes to shit tomorrow, like they secretly believe lol. Maybe a self defense martial arts first timer class might work as a first date.

[Lord Pixel]

I must not be setting out the right kind of cat food.



Yes. Absolutely.

Never lie to them. You can tell them any crazy thing you want, but it better be true or you are done.

I was having a first date in a very nice restaurant with an LSI (because she is smart and I need some smart female friends) and she said "What's your deal?", meaning I wasn't coming on to her the way she expected.
I said, "I'm looking to get married, but not to you."
She got this outraged look in her eyes and said "I feel like I should just get up and leave right now!"
I said "No, no, you don't understand."
At that moment, the check came and it was way over $100 and I paid it without blinking.
I continued, "Look, I asked you out because you're smart and a good conversationalist, but if we started having sex, the sex would be great and we'd last three months."

She thought about that for a moment. I'm sure she was measuring my response to the check and my direct honesty and she thought, "In three months, I can change his mind."

Lol.

Once again, Never. Lie. To. Them.

As an EIE, you do emotional manipulation the way I do fact manipulation. You build social interactions, I build complex weapons. Don't let your natural talent for subterfuge stray into deception. An LSI is uniquely equipped to detect deception, and they WILL find you out, and if you outright lied to them, or deceived them in any important way, they will cast you out and all your skills will not get you back in.

Don't you hate that lol? When you know?

[Lord Pixel]

From my experience, if someone keeps bringing something up even in vague terms, it often means he wants to talk about it but just isn't certain about the nature of the relationship or has conflicted feelings and doesn't want to be judged for it..

You can say something like, "hmmm, what do mean by X? You have mentioned this several times before. I am interested in hearing more about what you have to say. "


" He generally keeps alluding to something he has to sort out for himself that he has to do alone, because his friends cannot help him with it."

This honestly sounds like he wants a safe space to vent but also doesn't want to burden his friends or receive unsolicited advice. He could be possibly seeing if you would be ok with that.

In social psychology, what he is doing is called "a bid for attention".

I would be careful with this, although it's partly right, it's a delicate balance of distance. Try to get too nosey 2 fast and your gone, and just ignore it'll linger forever. It's a dish best eaten in bite sizes. I feel like Fi is all "YOU DON'T KNOW ME SON!" but also "plz someone see the real me" at the same time.

I think it's best to give an option for a response and an escape at the same time, like "Hey I could be wrong but it seems like something is going on with you." They can say yea and elaborate or confirm you are wrong and escape without it being weird. This case they aren't pressured to open up but know if they want to it's safe to do so. ENFp handle this balance well ime.

[Armitage]

Yeah, yesterday he told me that he landed a date with the girl he fancies, as she invited him to visit the Rijksmuseum with her on Saturday. I asked him if that was the thing that he had to "sort out for himself" this weekend, to which he replied: 'Ah not really, maybe somewhat indirectly'. So he's still keeping vague on purpose what's bugging him. It's up to him if he wants to tell me or not. I won't force him to, especially not because it's probably just a matter of time and asking gently again, in order for him to feel like telling me.

[Lord Pixel]

If it's super delicate, I will have a different approach. "I have noticed that your energy seems lower than usual, is everything ok?" And then I don't push it if they don't want to talk about it.

Different approaches work for different people. Because the way IEEs try to connect with me usually misses the mark and their advice is hit or miss. However, when Fi leads try to get me to open up, their accuracy is much higher. And Fi leads usually tell me that I can understand them pretty well. The mutual rationality seems to help.

Yea your approach seems more Ni, so maybe Ni valuing types might like that, I think Ne valuers would be more like "You could be wrong bruh" because addicted to possibilities and all that, and averse to absolutes.

Idk how it works for EIE but with the IEEs I've known they seem to pick up on it easily and somehow not make a big deal out of it with finesse, like "Looks like your having a shitty day, yea shitty days suck." *chuckles* changes topic and that somehow helps. With me and EIE's they can easily get me and easily see me, but they try and close to gap too quick sometimes and it freaks me out to go from stranger to 100, from stranger to talk about deepest dreams and such to trying to motivate me to chase my biggest dreams and goals in life and I'm like bruh I barely know you lol, later down the line it's much more appreciated. I had an EIE frend in college who pulled me away from some toxic people and is like a brother to me all because he understood the crap outta me. But sometimes EIE's I know can also assume they know you more than they do or know you more than you know yourself (which is damn near offensive to an Fi dom), I imagine it's an Ni assumption making associations with things, like "If you like X you must like Y since Y is the origin of X", but you might not like Y still, maybe it's also a Ti thing because when you tell them you don't like Y they cna really take it as a contradiction, but Fi is just like, idk what to tell you, if I don't like it I don't like it lol regardless if it's logically consistent or not.

But yea being seen so easily can be scary, I remember one time I started a new job and I just started learning about personality types and stuff while I was at work, and the idea that I was born with some fixed personality had me super depressed, I felt like I was cursed to never change the things I don't like that I do, and the HR manager who hired me was an EIE and she walked by my cubicle and it was like she could see right through me and that freaked the hell outta me cuz sometimes you don't want people to see all that, especially at work, I was a new hire after all I'm supposed to be happy to be there and there she is staring right at my mess, I just wanted to hide. I think Fi has ownership issues.

[Bethanyclaire]

Don't you hate that lol? When you know?

How can one tell..(aside from knowing their type)

[Lord Pixel]

This aligns with my experience 100%. IEEs are usually good at picking up on things but where I struggle with them is that they will go on a 1-2 hour brainstorming session about the problem and solution, my brain gets fried, I snap, they get hurt because they were just genuinely trying to help.

On my end, I can get too focused on one or two trajectories and become too negative and the IEE feels stifled by it.

Fi leads tend to help me cut through the emotional mess. I can usually help them see things through another person's perspective even if it isn't closely connected to mine.

Fi is good at defining things from a highly perspective which makes them better at judging interpersonal distance and closeness while Fe is more suited for how things fit into the general social/group atmosphere. This is why Fe is so reliant on feedback in order to adapt to the situation. Like silent treatment for me is so much worse than being chewed out.

My EIE feels this way also, he'd rather have a passionate if not heated discussion than to get the cold shoulder, maybe an Fe/Se combo. When we would have arguments his Se would pressure me and get real loud with me and to get some Si peace I'd be silent but it would not calm him down, he really hated that, one time he had to go for a walk outside because of it, but on my end he was making me extremely uncomfortable so I was doing my best to keep calm.

I can definitely see how an IEE feels like Ni pops all it's bubbles. I feel that way 2 sometimes, floating in the land of possibilities and someone comes and just shoots them all down with an Ni gun because none of these possibilities are probable. I do think Fe does a real good job of getting into other people's shoes for sure.

[Lord Pixel]

How can one tell..(aside from knowing their type)

I remember before I knew anything about typology that I hooked up with this ESXp girl, all I knew about her is that she was rough, wild, impulsive and got around alot, but was really cool and down to earth. The minute we kissed the thought in my head was "I'm not supposed to be with this chick, this is gonna last a week at best.". Just a gut feeling. I guess without even knowing typology I could just feel the huge gap in Se between us. A week later her ex boyfriend comes into town and that was the end of it. So it ended up lasting a week.

[Bethanyclaire]

@Lord Pixel haha fair. Hmm I once met a dual who was the cutest person I’ve ever kissed. He is a God, physically I swear lol. And so cool, like SEE cool. I didn’t sleep with him but he’s on my Instagram and sometimes I imagine messaging him one day. Even though he was so cute and we had a special connection, I know even without the age difference we did not suit each other. I grew up in a family of quite good-looking sensers..this particular SLE gave me strong reminders of my cool senser family members and we grew up near each other so there was a strong connection. I met him at an older people’s music event night. He was 19 and there with some older adults as was I. The only reason I went was because I was bored, being occasionally stuck for things to do being single all the time. Those nights are funny, when you meet someone totally unexpected and unique

[Bethanyclaire]

I think I’m finding better ITR matches now that I’m not over-thinking it..not caring/thinking about type yet still matching with duals and semi-duals.

[Bethanyclaire]

Oh no. I matched with someone who I think is a dual, but he lives 5 hours away. I dunno how it happened. This sucks. He’s very handsome.

[Bethanyclaire]

I think there's still a lot of value in pursuing a casual friendship if the connection is strong enough. I have been trying to do that with LSIs and it's been quite valuable. They basically call me out on my behavior and it's been a growing point.

thanks. Yeah it’s strange I feel like I could talk to him very easily about stuff. His face just seems familiar or something. It’s only happened a couple of times on dating apps where I’ve felt the connection through the screen/from a photo. Both other times I think the feeling was mutual because they pursued me quite quickly, even though I thought they seemed a bit ‘too good for me’. (One was ILE, one was SLE, but I wasn’t ready to date at the time.) It’s helpful to think that it could be a useful friendship/acquaintanceship rather than being depressed about the distance

[Armitage]

Yes, look at the positive side of your duals liking you. It's always nice validation to experience that handsome duals go chasing you!
Just like Foxy says, he might make for a good friend. Even more, summer's around the corner, and you might plan a fun holiday coincidentally nearby his village. You might then message him that you're around and if he'd like to meet up.
In the end, distance is a problem that can be resolved, whereas mutual attraction, duality, and healthy attachment cannot be controlled. You can probably guess what weighs heavier in my opinion. So go for it girl, take your chances, and get to know him. If you two hit it off, you can always use your weekends to travel back and forth, if you can sleep over at his place. That way you use your travel time way more effectively, haha.

There are options, so don't let the distance scare you, because this might be the opportunity for a relationship. Best of luck, @Bethany!

[Adam Strange]

When I was formerly dating two LSIs, I don't recall ever having a problem with finding ways to spend time with them. The ESIs, I've dated, though, are a completely different story. They have always been too busy to see me very often.

What the hell.

I think this has to do with the fact that Gamma is the Quadra of Work, and unless two Gammas are collaborating on a work project, what's the point?

Man, this sucks if true, but it could account for the fact that I only have ever met two ESI-LIE couples, out of the many, many people I know. Both ESI-LIE couples met in college and both members of each couple are working in the same field. One couple is in medicine, and the other couple are engineers.

[Raptor2016]

Being with people has always been hard for me, because I’m so peaceful and mediating, never journeying out of my mind to play with characters and Chinese overlords. It’s only by flying off with independence and liberty that time stands still and weaknesses are costly in the experientially over-struck empire of evolution.

So I’m not fit for dating, I’m too much of a loner.

[Armitage]

@Adam Strange, this makes sense. All the ESIs I befriended I know from my psychology study. I have rarely met any ESIs on my dating application, on the other hand, and am genuinely wondering where I can find them to date. I know from my ESI-Se straight biking friend that he has trouble dating, because he waits for the other person to make the move. He is generally very anxious about asking anyone out, despite him being a fit, muscular guy who always looks good, and struts like he owns the place.

He met this girl he likes at a party, and he loves how she fills the silences easily. They got along great and went on a few dates, but then she told him that she had exams and she didn't reply to his latest message thereafter. Three, almost four, weeks past by during which he waited. I encouraged him to send her another message as a reminder, but he just said: "The way I see it if she is interested she will eventually text me again, Im not gonna run after someone that cannot reply to a simple message"

After about a month she messaged him again. This time she invited him to the national art museum. He really looked forward it, but during the date itself he noticed himself getting more and more into her friendzone. He doesn't know what to do about it, however, nor how to escalate his relationship with her. He sure has a hard time taking the initiative, because even when I asked him to take the lead to travel to his place, instead of leading me from the front, he navigated me towards his apartment, while continuing to cycle behind me.

[Adam Strange]

@Adam Strange, this makes sense. All the ESIs I befriended I know from my psychology study. I have rarely met any ESIs on my dating application, on the other hand, and am genuinely wondering where I can find them to date. I know from my ESI-Se straight biking friend that he has trouble dating, because he waits for the other person to make the move. He is generally very anxious about asking anyone out, despite him being a fit, muscular guy who always looks good, and struts like he owns the place.

He met this girl he likes at a party, and he loves how she fills the silences easily. They got along great and went on a few dates, but then she told him that she had exams and she didn't reply to his latest message thereafter. Three, almost four, weeks past by during which he waited. I encouraged him to send her another message as a reminder, but he just said: "The way I see it if she is interested she will eventually text me again, Im not gonna run after someone that cannot reply to a simple message"

After about a month she messaged him again. This time she invited him to the national art museum. He really looked forward it, but during the date itself he noticed himself getting more and more into her friendzone. He doesn't know what to do about it, however, nor how to escalate his relationship with her. He sure has a hard time taking the initiative, because even when I asked him to take the lead to travel to his place, instead of leading me from the front, he navigated me towards his apartment, while continuing to cycle behind me.

Yes, Armitage, I find that interacting with ESIs is kind of weird. I mean, we can both like each other and find it really easy and rewarding to hang with each other, and yet we still need a definite excuse to actually meet. A reason which goes beyond just "Hey, I like you."

Most of my ESI dating relationships have failed because......well, let me list them.

ESI #1 (M. L.)......Lived too far away.
ESI #2 (J. P.)......was selfish the first time we had sex, and she lived too far away.
ESI #3 (S. W.)....was overweight at the time. Not now, FML.
ESI #4 (A. S.).....decided she was gay. I think we get along seamlessly, but we still need a concrete reason to spend any time with each other.
ESI #5 (B. K.).....kept cancelling dates at the last minute.
ESI #6 (M. P.).....kept cancelling dates at the last minute.
ESI #7 (B. D.).....kept cancelling dates at the last minute.

In contrast, the two LSIs were always there and were always up for sex, or a mini-adventure, or dinner, or just a walk where we could talk about whatever.

Honestly, it's like God hates Duals.

If I had to guess why the two ESI-LIE couples that I know IRL are still together, I'd say that it's because they met early, live in similar worlds, and moved in together soon enough so that living together became an instant habit, rather than a choice that constantly has to be justified. This is not something that will be easy for me to achieve, Fuck. My. Life.

Anyway, regarding your bicyclist friend, an ESI (M. P.) told me that she wants a guy who walks next to her; not in front and not behind. Plus, while I have found that the ESIs I've been with have been fairly selfish lovers (me, first), the ESI-LIE relationship is the Aggressor-Victim relationship that is closest to Switch, otherwise called "Even".

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

Ehh. When I'm looking I just join social groups of common interests. I'd sooner volunteer at a local cat shelter than go on a dating app, tbh. Those things are just...wired way wrong for relationships. They're good for short term hook-ups, that's about it imo.

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

@Adam Strange, this makes sense. All the ESIs I befriended I know from my psychology study.

Common interest

I only have ever met two ESI-LIE couples, out of the many, many people I know. Both ESI-LIE couples met in college and both members of each couple are working in the same field. One couple is in medicine, and the other couple are engineers.

Common interests

Ehh. When I'm looking I just join social groups of common interests. I'd sooner volunteer at a local cat shelter than go on a dating app, tbh. Those things are just...wired way wrong for relationships. They're good for short term hook-ups, that's about it imo.

Common interests

I met my LIE on PerC

Common interest

Adam, I think you're overcomplicating it, tbh. Having relationships is enough of a reason in and of itself to ESIs, who, commonly value relationships above all. People who think 24/7 about relationships don't need things like Engineering to give them a reason to form or have relationships.

[Adam Strange]

Common interests

Common interests

Common interests

Common interest

Adam, I think you're overcomplicating it, tbh. Having relationships is enough of a reason in and of itself to ESIs, who, commonly value relationships above all. People who think 24/7 about relationships don't need things like Engineering to give them a reason to form or have relationships.

@Lady Lunacik, I see what you are saying, and I agree.

I met my first LSI GF at work. I met my ex-wife at an Astronomy club meeting. (After we were married, she never attended another meeting.) I met the second LSI at an Astronomy club meeting. I met the most compatible ESI (AS) after seeing her artwork in an art gallery while I was buying art (shared interest).

All the other ESIs I met by just walking around, and it seems that it is too easy for both of us to just keep on walking.

So, now my main interest is in running a business for profit, stacking up dollars, and taking trips to foreign countries in search of adventure. I think I’ve met exactly zero female ESIs engaged in any of these activities.
I’ve met a few male ESIs doing these things, but no females.

There is an interesting ESI in, once again, the Astronomy club, but she’s happily married.

IDK. I feel like I’m just whining. Maybe the real problem is that I’m just too old and too set in my bachelor ways.
Let me just say, it gets harder to make friends as you get older. People become less willing to compromise, and even Dual relationships require compromise.

[Armitage]

Yes, Armitage, I find that interacting with ESIs is kind of weird. I mean, we can both like each other and find it really easy and rewarding to hang with each other, and yet we still need a definite excuse to actually meet. A reason which goes beyond just "Hey, I like you."

I didn't experience it in the same way, instead they decide what they're looking for and when. The bicycle ESI is looking for a best friend to spend his student time with, another ESI was looking for a classmate friend in our statistics master, and two others were looking for a relationship. They set the goal of the relationship, while it's up to us to propose plans to them in which we can realize these goals together. That's how it looks to me at least. I wouldn't be surprised if oftentimes they aren't even aware that they are doing this.
We LIEs tend to work in my experience towards realizing our TeNi visions with the subconscious intent to make society align more with our values through the completion of our grand projects. ESIs on the other hand seem to only engage interesting people into relationships, with their definition of interesting generally being knowledgeable people who know how to realize their own goals.

Most of my ESI dating relationships have failed because......well, let me list them.

ESI #1 (M. L.)......Lived too far away.

Distance is merely a technical problem, which can be solved simply by moving. Finding someone who shares similar values, is a dual, you feel attracted to and she to you is a far more complicated problem. In my opinion a good romantic match is worth moving for.

ESI #2 (J. P.)......was selfish the first time we had sex, and she lived too far away.
ESI #3 (S. W.)....was overweight at the time. Not now, FML.

Have you checked yet if she's single perhaps?

ESI #4 (A. S.).....decided she was gay. I think we get along seamlessly, but we still need a concrete reason to spend any time with each other.

Friendly reminder, I again take issue with the way you phrase this, because people do not decide to be gay, they are born gay. It's quite a big difference, because if people would decide to be gay, it would lend credence to those dreadful conversion therapies that are emotionally very damaging to gay and lesbian people.

ESI #5 (B. K.).....kept cancelling dates at the last minute.
ESI #6 (M. P.).....kept cancelling dates at the last minute.
ESI #7 (B. D.).....kept cancelling dates at the last minute.

In contrast, the two LSIs were always there and were always up for sex, or a mini-adventure, or dinner, or just a walk where we could talk about whatever.

So why is it again that you don't date LSIs anymore?

Honestly, it's like God hates Duals.

Then imagine how difficult it is to find a gay dual. Fortunately I believe in no gods or kings. Only Man. Ni dieu ni maître!

If I had to guess why the two ESI-LIE couples that I know IRL are still together, I'd say that it's because they met early, live in similar worlds, and moved in together soon enough so that living together became an instant habit, rather than a choice that constantly has to be justified. This is not something that will be easy for me to achieve, Fuck. My. Life.

I know the feeling and the frustration all too well. When you visit any of these two couples again, bring up how great a couple they are, because people love compliments. Ask them what their trick is and if they got along from the start, because they might shed some new light on things that you assumed.

Anyway, regarding your bicyclist friend, an ESI (M. P.) told me that she wants a guy who walks next to her; not in front and not behind.

That makes total sense, and we did where possible, but when cars pass by or the roads are small, it's simply hard to continue cycling side by side. I had expected him to be more directive on which way to go to reach his place, because most people would provide more directive navigational instructions in such circumstances, but ESIs aren't most people and I like their quirks.

Plus, while I have found that the ESIs I've been with have been fairly selfish lovers (me, first), the ESI-LIE relationship is the Aggressor-Victim relationship that is closest to Switch, otherwise called "Even".

Yes, could you elaborate some more about this, please?

So, now my main interest is in running a business for profit, stacking up dollars, and taking trips to foreign countries in search of adventure. I think I’ve met exactly zero female ESIs engaged in any of these activities.

What if instead of visiting several foreign countries, you dive deep and visit a few specific ones and learn the language beforehand? Possibly at such a language course you may meet an ESI, because they have a general desire to develop their skills, knowledge, and competences. From what I know many want to travel and discover the world, but somehow never get to it. Even if it's just platonic, I'm going to propose if the ESI bicycle guy would like to travel together, because at the museum he mentioned how he regrets never having seen much of the world, not even Paris!

Perhaps single ESIs later in life go on group tours to take care of the logistical hassle for them when they never met the LIE that would happily discover the world with them. Have you yet considered such a group tour, because there are also those offered for singles? It would be a potential shared interest between the ESI and you.

[Armitage]

Ehh. When I'm looking I just join social groups of common interests. I'd sooner volunteer at a local cat shelter than go on a dating app, tbh. Those things are just...wired way wrong for relationships. They're good for short term hook-ups, that's about it imo.

Yes, this is exactly what the ESI bicycle friend told me too, but he goes to parties instead of cat shelters to date. My challenge is how to discover if an ESI I meet is gay and looking. And that's only if I come across them, because almost all ESI friends I have met through my psychology or statistics study. I know that many ESIs frequent the Gym and love music, some also are religious, but that's where my knowledge where I could meet one ends.

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

Yes, this is exactly what the ESI bicycle friend told me too, but he goes to parties instead of cat shelters to date. My challenge is how to discover if an ESI I meet is gay and looking. And that's only if I come across them, because almost all ESI friends I have met through my psychology or statistics study. I know that many ESIs frequent the Gym and love music, some also are religious, but that's where my knowledge where I could meet one ends.

Personally, the reason I'd go to cat shelters because being there requires empathy, etc. which is something I would be looking for in someone. Empathy is one of the #1 things I look for in a person, whether friend or more.

I have no idea how the gay dating scene works. What I do know is that it requires you to get to know people more before getting together than the straight dating scene—which is a good thing.

Personally, the reason I'd go to cat shelters because being there requires empathy, etc. which is something I would be looking for in someone. Empathy is one of the #1 things I look for in a person, whether friend or more.

In other words, sometimes where ESI's values are is where their interests are...and where they go for date seeking. Empathy is one of my strongest values, so I go looking for a date where my values are sure to abide.

Find out what ESIs commonly value the most, and you will be on to something in terms of where to find them.

Personally, I'd never go to a party to find one, as I am not interested in parties and I want someone who is at a stage in life where they are past partying and are more responsible. So, maybe age factors in, too.

If nothing else, I guarantee you, many ESIs will be involved in something that supports their own values. That means it's a statistics game.

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

@Lady Lunacik, I see what you are saying, and I agree.

I met my first LSI GF at work. I met my ex-wife at an Astronomy club meeting. (After we were married, she never attended another meeting.) I met the second LSI at an Astronomy club meeting. I met the most compatible ESI (AS) after seeing her artwork in an art gallery while I was buying art (shared interest).

All the other ESIs I met by just walking around, and it seems that it is too easy for both of us to just keep on walking.

So, now my main interest is in running a business for profit, stacking up dollars, and taking trips to foreign countries in search of adventure. I think I’ve met exactly zero female ESIs engaged in any of these activities.
I’ve met a few male ESIs doing these things, but no females.

There is an interesting ESI in, once again, the Astronomy club, but she’s happily married.

IDK. I feel like I’m just whining. Maybe the real problem is that I’m just too old and too set in my bachelor ways.
Let me just say, it gets harder to make friends as you get older. People become less willing to compromise, and even Dual relationships require compromise.

You're not whining, but even if you were, you are entitled to feel the way you feel. I'm just concerned that you may be self-defeating if you happen to come off to others as too eager, which would be off-putting...and may explain the ones that have cancelled last minute / ghosted. Best thing you can do, as hard as it is, is try to just enjoy your life without someone. That is when someone is most likely to come along. Eagerness is one of the most off-putting things about guys, and I speak for my gender in general, I've seen this in more than just myself. Even if you find yourself feeling eager, play it cool. Take up opportunities, but act like it's not breathing life into your world that you are doing so. Come off as though "if something comes, it comes; if it doesn't, it doesn't." (In other words, you don't have to go around rejecting in order to seem less eager.) Come off as intrigued, but not overpowered by your interest. I don't know if you already do this, I'm just saying this because on here it seems clear that you are lonely and really want to be with someone. There's nothing wrong with that, but in the beginning phases of relationships, it can come off as...hmm, how do I put it...almost creepy or too needy? Simping, worshippy? My LIE came off that way at first, I hated it, lol. He'd hate me for sharing that, lol, but I think it's important that you don't feel alone in that if you think you have come off that way, and I think it's a good example of how it does not even always mean you've ruined it if you do come off that way or slip up. You want to avoid things like giving a lot of compliments, or excessive admiration, etc. Again - all of this is IF. I'm guessing. I'm not sure how you have come off.

Adam...keep your chin up. You're not the only one out there looking for love at your age. We often find that which we truly seek Sometimes it just takes some dedication and perseverance. Don't get discouraged, just keep refining your methods and keep trying, and you will find someone. You'll get better and better at searching while you search. What journeys that are easy are usually worth it, anyway? You're a good guy with a lot to offer someone. You've got this. Then, when you finally find your special someone, you can tell her all about how you've searched so long for her, and she is a rare and precious diamond you will never let go, and she will feel special and loved, safe and secure, as she rests in the arms of your passion. So, just remember, that she will be worth your current efforts...and your current efforts will make you that much more connected to/passionate about her once you have her. You will fight that much harder to keep her when opposition comes, etc...knowing she would not be replaceable...

[Adam Strange]

The ex-wife just called me. She said she's back in town and she wants me to come over to her place for dinner tomorrow night. It'll be just her and me, she said.

I'm like Morty about this.

[Adam Strange]

I'm talking with three LIEs and an ILI who are grad students working on a project for a defense contractor to use lasers in space to do (what do you think a defense contractor wants to use lasers in space for) and they were referred to me because I know something about this.

They want to talk about tracking algorithms, spectral reflectances, and ablation energies, but I'm going to tell the LIEs that they either find an ESI while they are in school, or they are going to miss the boat.




What's an Identical for, if not to lend a helping hand where it's most needed?


I'll tell the ILI that he has some time to find Harley Quinn, but he'd better step up when she says Hi to him.

[Armitage]

It's good of you to tell them, @Adam Strange, because we Gamma NTs can get hogged up in all that's unimportant in the greater picture; success, achievements, and accomplishment. We desire to prove ourselves to others, in order to prove our own worth to ourselves.

I like your song, I myself am in a similar mood regarding my SLESI: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3vc7H_bSFU

[Raptor2016]

Omg same. Since the restrictions here became very loose recently I started going out most of the time again. This weekend I was minding my own thing and enjoying my food while someone in the restaurant started talking loudly as if he was monologuing about some analysis of his about some random bs. The fuck was that. Went to arcade hall and there were lots of people shouting for no reason. I enjoyed the whole thing but as I was going home I started thinking, "Maybe there's a reason why I enjoyed being locked up in my room". So yesterday I just went out for a walk at a silent park with not much people. lol.

I've only ever met lots people because of school and work, when people approach me I get very suspicious, I hate online dating and I even hate the whole idea of dating lol. I just want to find someone compatible and start doing things together. So maybe I would never find someone anytime soon. I would like to learn how to do crafts with leather, so maybe I could join a class. But I'm pretty pretty sure I wouldn't find who I'm looking for there.

I believe that the answers lie within though, and I can make things happen with my own will without much movement. It would just be way easier if I just know the right location and just go there. Thoughts-wise I started getting messages about vineyards or somewhere that is about getting money/money transactions. I don't know which person I'm picking up on. But other than that my intuition is failing me lol. In the mean time I guess I'll just rot here happily. Hobbies are enjoyable so far anyway.

When we go on these big debuts with the person being all inquisitive and debating, the actual arguments and explorations of fringe areas can be thought provoking and fluid, but being connected and centered on the person's aura and energy field when we would prefer silence and darkness would be a bad thing. We are on even terms One when people engage the doorbell to wrap their big eyes and ears on the photo, while pondering and ruminating in our rooms would have restored more self-empowerment.

[Lord Pixel]

I would probably just take a really stereotypical and shallow approach as a starting point, for example for ESIs just hit up a ton of art galleries in the area, especially ones that exhibit scupltures, pottery and physical things like that, and definitely the worksops where you get to produce the art instead of spectate. From sheer volume alone of hitting up a bunch of places theres no way not to run into an ESI. On top of the fact that being a polar opposite character in that place (Te lead) would cause someone to easily stand out. From there maybe the approach could become more nuanced at specific. Almost all female LSEs I've met were in upper management positions at places I've worked, I've only met one before working age and she's probably now someone's manager.

[Armitage]

@Lord Pixel, your solution is so beautifully simplistic and effective that only a clever person can think of it. As Einstein is attributed to have said: "Genius is making complex ideas simple, not making simple ideas complex." Kudos to you!
@Adam Strange, get your ESI-Se decorator friend to pick a few art expositions, handicraft workshops, and museums to visit for you that she thinks are great. I count on your gregarious nature as a fellow LIE SX/so to simply step up to ladies who are alone there and make some conversation with them about art and to get to know them.

One mentioned how she's going to learn how to craft leather, is going to pick strawberries out in nature, and is going to go horse riding. I did horse riding for several years myself and can confirm that there are quite some ESIs and SEEs who do so. They love animals, they love the outdoors, and they love physical activities, it's their ideal hobby. You'll just have to be able to accept that the horse is practically their child, though.

I would like to learn how to do crafts with leather, so maybe I could join a class.

I'll be going on a farm this month to pick strawberries and go on horseback riding, I'll let you know if ESIs are also easy to spot there. Lmao I already have a hunch.

By the way, do you guys believe Alec Benjamin to be an ESI? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50VN...mfDnt&index=37

[Karbonkel]

Dont ask me how I know this, but I know ESIs who go to these extreme drum and bass events where they all gather up up in a tiny sweaty room and dance the night away. (Well its more jumping and waving your arm, not actually dancing). I also know ESIs who are into the stereotypical skateboard/longboard stoner thing. Lastly, anything related to fashion is a good place to run into the Se subtype specifically. As for actual career choices tho, this tends to be very varied for the ESIs I've met, especially for the men.

[Nicozeyo]

Dont ask me how I know this, but I know ESIs who go to these extreme drum and bass events where they all gather up up in a tiny sweaty room and dance the night away. (Well its more jumping and waving your arm, not actually dancing). I also know ESIs who are into the stereotypical skateboard/longboard stoner thing. Lastly, anything related to fashion is a good place to run into the Se subtype specifically. As for actual career choices tho, this tends to be very varied for the ESIs I've met, especially for the men.

Sounds like satanic rituals to me.

[Adam Strange]

Neal Stephenson and Nicole Galland have a new collaborative book out called The Rise and Fall of D.O.D.O., and I found what seems to me to be an excellent description of the ESI-LIE Duality on page 21 of the hardback edition.

At least, it reads exactly like the way I feel in an ESI-LIE interaction. In the book, the protagonist, who seems ESI to me, is writing about her employer, Tristan, whom she has just met and who seems pretty LIE to me.

Here it is:

The Rise and Fall of D.O.D.O.

by Neal Stephenson and Nicole Galland

Our dynamic was singular, unprecedented in my life, certainly. It was as if we had always been working together, and yet there was an undercurrent of something else, a kind of change that only comes at the beginning of things. Neither of us has ever acted on it – and while I am the sort who rarely acts on such things, he is (while extremely disciplined and upright) the sort who immediately acts on such things. So I attributed the buzz to the excitement of a shared endeavor. The intellectual intimacy of it was far more satisfying than any date I’d ever been on. If Tristan had a lover, she wasn’t getting the real goods. I was.




I really like those last two sentences. They are exactly how I feel when I'm around an ESI.

"Girl, go out and meet anyone you want. I'm not worried, because no one is going to beat what we, together, have."

[Armitage]

@Foxy Grandpa, did you go out with the ESI-Se comedian tonight?

[Armitage]

If the two of you get along so well and he already showed that the feeling is mutual, then going into a relationship together would strengthen your love for each other, right @Foxy Grandpa? Otherwise you might miss out on a great, loving guy who genuinely cares for you, is reliable, and is there for you.

[Adam Strange]

We made plans to do something in two days. I had to text him something important and he said that he was thinking about me a lot lately and proceeded to make plans because he wanted to get to know me better.

I don't think we will end up in a relationship but I just feel so natural with him so I think it's good practice in learning to seek out compatible people.

If the two of you get along so well and he already showed that the feeling is mutual, then going into a relationship together would strengthen your love for each other, right @Foxy Grandpa? Otherwise you might miss out on a great, loving guy who genuinely cares for you, is reliable, and is there for you.

ESIs are only half like LSIs. I've had a couple of both types of GFs, and the LSIs were like each other, and the ESIs were like each other, but they were only half like the other type. That half was the "Se/Ni" and Erotic Aggressor parts. The other parts were completely different.