Typology is not about who you want to be. Typology is about how you cognitively process information.Originally Posted by Baqer
I want to be myself, so yes I want to be.
I just happen to disagree with some definitions.
Yes
No
Typology is not about who you want to be. Typology is about how you cognitively process information.
I want to be myself, so yes I want to be.
I just happen to disagree with some definitions.
Is there a description of Si you think is good? Just curious.
Well if anyone who types another person or themselves has to be aware of their own biases. All people have feelings of what they want to be or who they think they are which may actually be false, but until people recognize that they have those feelings it's impossible for them to use logical systems to figure them out.
When you say "I want to be myself, so yes", you say it as if being SEI is the starting point, not something to be proven but simply a hard fact. That's why I'm asking you if you want to be SEI, because you seemingly start with the assumption that you're SEI and then try to prove it, instead of the other way around.
Well okay let's narrow down the types:
I'm not a logical type for sure, ethics has always been apparent in me. Then I'm pretty sure I value Fe over Fi, so Alpha/Beta ethical type. I don't really use Ni like real IEIs usually do. As for EIEs or ESEs, I'm pretty sure my Fe is creative and not base because I seem emotionless even compared to other SEIs, and I think my Fe is just supporting the whims of my base, not that I hold base Fe values. My demo Fi is strong, pretty sure I can easily cover up Fi PoLR with no problem and explain ethical situations to Fi PoLR with no problem. Ni is not my PoLR, I don't feel any confusion or hurt when speaking to Ni users. I feel more threatened by Te pragmatic logic. That leaves SEI as my type. Not to mention three or four people think I am SEI.
TBH I don't feel like I have Ne DS but I think I might be blind to my weakness with Ne. I think Ne base could probably spot my weaknesses IRL or smt, idk I would have to ask my ex why I am Ne DS again. Maybe because I can't come up with 100 variants of what to do in a situation on the spot. And current definitions of Si can go straight to the trash, they only perpetuate shitty stereotypes.
Of course that's not really a detailed explanation but the best I could honestly give.
Last edited by MidnightWilderness; 08-10-2021 at 05:29 PM. Reason: sigh
Yes, You are largely ruled by feeling, going by impulses and high class refinement of internal awareness for a big hot spring of holiday spirit.
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Ah, but you didn't prove that you where Si base, simply that you can't be Ni base because you "don't really use Ni like real IEIs usually do." Can you give specific things about yourself that make you think you have Si and not Ni, or that make you more like SEI's in general than IEI's?
My description of Si is nostalgia. You internalzie various elements that are related to each other while every one of them has made an impression on you. This could be a specific car and trips you had with it, the people you were with, moments and actions, textures, colors, smells, lights. You like to remember the pleasureable memories and relive them through doing something similar which could turn into a tradition. Speficif items or things people say, the way they say them, the way they move, the clothes they wear anything could trigger an assocation to a something in your mind that gives you some ideas about what you would want to experience. Si seems synesthetic to me. You can't come up with 100 variations but you come up with specific combinations that form an idea of experience you want to move towards based on your previous experinces. This could also translate into hobbies like collecting some things which are very similar to each other but yet diferent and synesthetically connect to give you satisfying sensory input which you also experience as feeling. When you can't achieve that it upsets you, as your main inclination.
I don't really experience nostalgia, so it's a bad description to say "nostalgia". I also don't think it could be connected to hobbies to give satisfying sensory input. I will sort of agree with this: "You can't come up with 100 variations but you come up with specific combinations that form an idea of experience you want to move towards based on your previous experiences." Not always do I choose to do something based on previous life experiences, but sometimes new information or just to explore.
I also think maybe the reason I don't feel nostalgic is that there is really nothing to feel nostalgic for. I realize my best moments are still ahead of me, so I tend to long for the future instead.
Listening to music could be considered sensory input also, though I don't connect it with any nostalgia whatsoever, it maybe triggers daydreams related to my internal self/struggles or maybe I will think about future scenarios to music.
Because I don't see patterns like Ni base users do most of the time, and read my answer to Bryanbone.
SEIs like to explore. As an IEI they tell me "try this or that" but I already know I won't like it. Not nostalagia but it's a sort of satisfaction where everything falls into place the way you want to, not like a plan but you try something and you just like it or not and that makes an impression on you? The impression is what you want, sensory experience is just an element which could be part of the impression. Also anything could be related and translated into hobbies.
As an SEI, when other people try to tell me to do things I also stubbornly refuse because I already know what I want to do. I explore in my own way and not based on other people's ideas of what I should do.
It's exactly like a plan, it's not that I try something and it makes an impression on me, (well sometimes, but it makes an impression for a plan so to say), but that it is part of some final goal. It's that I realize my potential through my interests, and I wouldn't call them hobbies, more like work that I enjoy.
Pursuit of something specific that's created by internal impulses. @Poptart
Last edited by VewyScawwyNawcissist; 08-10-2021 at 06:20 PM.
Yes exactly, that's how I already know what my purpose in life is. So every action is crafted around this purpose, every interest that I have all goes back to this purpose.
I did read your answer to bryanbone. From what I read, you seem to focus more on the future than the past. How can you focus on the future if you don't notice patterns? Or at the very least come up with possibilities.
You can develop your functions to help you with that.
I can notice patterns and possibilities but it won't be at the level of base users and I won't use it in the same way as base users.
Everyone on this forum needs to stop equating Si with the stupid stereotypical definitions.
I'm FUCKING sick of this mundane ass shit that's dumped on top of us.
Alright.
Here's a description of Si
Tell me why/if you think it's wrong
"Key Property: The ability to avoid situations of unnecessary stress and risk to health and life, achieving material well-being with minimal effort.
Social Role of Function: Ensuring the continuation of the reproduction of the material resource (especially food), flexible adjustment to the environment and wildlife that produces this resource.
• Good-natured, avoidance of conflicts, the desire for a quiet, measured life
• The quest for convenience, comfort; the ability to ensure your comfort and settle down in everyday life with minimal effort
• Focusing on the sensations of the body, the desire for pleasant sensations (primarily related to food consumption) and to the avoidance of unpleasant as the basis of behavior
• Characteristic of a relaxed body, smooth movements.
• Focusing on the current moment in time, unwillingness to think about the future and complex subjects
• Traction to nature - loves to tinker with animals and plants; love for green as the color of the tranquil tranquility of wildlife"
Edit: This is as a base function, doesn't count creative Si
I just want to fulfill my purpose in life and achieve all of my dreams. If there is something in my way, I get extremely tense. I want to become more socially outgoing and be able to focus more on what I should be doing right now. I want to be able to learn how to express myself externally in a way that sounds beautiful and translates what I think internally, externally. I want to find a life partner who will at least understand and support me, and I will do the same for them.
I guess I will just give up on Socionics before it is too late, as there is seemingly no explanation on self development through functions and how to get rid of possible ego delusions here.
My quest is not one of convenience or comfort, it will take some effort to manage it all, but I believe I can do it.
If you don't mind me asking, wdym by your purpose/quest? If you don't want to say specifically, a very general description of the nature of it is fine.
I think these are examples. Formal definition of Si is: external fields of dynamics. In-depth descriptions are from Jung's texts.
There is an formal, mathematical definition on Si: external dynamics of fields. I think this is the fundamental definition in Socionics. In-depth descriptions are in Jung's Psychological Types. Socionics definitions and Jung's descriptions are indeed the same (my comments ) so I don't find any reason to redefine.
In my opinion, the Socionics community has been very good but it's always like a pyramid. Different people come for different reasons so there are always different views.
If you have to redefine an element to relate to it, then you are probably not SEI.
I'm not sure if it's redefining or clarifying it needs, but I understand your distaste for the way Si-base types get stereotyped. It irks my ISTp aunt as well. My understanding (and remember this is coming from someone who has it as a Role Function, so I'm biased) is that Si is best thought of as the balance to Ne (much in the same way Se is the natural balance to Ni). There's a certain either-or kind of rigidity to Ne imparted to it by its extroversion which Si doesn't have. Si is fluid. Ne is of course an expanding and exploratory sort of element, but it does its exploring in a somewhat stiff kind of way. Ne sends probes out in straight lines in every direction. Its leaps can be wild at times, but the probes themselves are simple machines. Si doesn't operate in this sort of linear way since it's more about the relationship between oneself and one's surroundings/impressions/emotions/body. It isn't perceiving anything concretely 'there' but rather perceives the implied reality between things as well as the changes in those realities. I think really what Si perceives is dissonance. This is very much tied to the homeostasis definition, but a bit broader. Si senses when a relationship between things is somehow 'off' and seeks to correct it somehow.
I think of Ne and Si working together to explore the universe. Ne launches its exploratory probes in straight lines - unperturbed by terrain, and like water flowing down a rocky hill Si feels out the path of least resistance to wherever the Ne probe scouted out. Ne is scanning the horizon from a tall tree, and Si is down on the ground gliding through the jungle. Ne can't effectively navigate down on the ground on its own except by sheer dumb luck of trying every option, because it isn't sensitive to its immediate surroundings like Si is. Si is how we survive moment to moment. It knows what berries are safe to eat, what water source looks questionable, which paths are least fraught with danger, and it is always listening to what the forest is telling it. I think it could aptly be described as "wise" or "street-smart" depending on how exactly you want to characterize it. I perceive strong Si types as incredibly "aware" of what's going on in a way that I feel I am not at all. I don't know how to listen to the jungle. I know it's important, but I'm hopeless at doing so because to listen to the jungle I have to stop listening to the strange mushrooms I found on the trail. The mushrooms will teach you something about the jungle too, but knowing what it is to be a rock isn't going to help you survive. This is why Ni and Si simply cannot be active at once. Ni necessitates departure from the self, while Si is the very essence of being in yourself in the place that you are.
I think MBTI's definition of Si as having to do with memory is influenced by what Si as a Base Function looks like. When Base, Si is very good at using memory and imagination to more complexly solve local problems it encounters in the jungle. This doesn't mean that Si-Base people have a good memory (though they very well might), but just that the element Si itself is good at recognizing the patterns it has encountered before and altering them as necessary to suit its current situation.
Si in ISFps specifically is going to very often be applied to social situations due to that being a point of focus for Fe-Creatives. I think Alphas in general will navigate social situations analogously to the jungle scenario I described above, with the Si Egos spending more time on the ground and the Ne Egos being more in the trees scanning the horizons. The catch being that the Ne Egos are Ti-Creatives, and therefore not as likely to focus on their social reality. For Si Egos who feel they aren't particularly good at managing their social lives, I would guess they may be spending too little time scanning their horizons and should consider looking out for healthier long-term solutions. I think they can get caught up in the jungle at times because sometimes there simply is no "path of least resistance" and Si needs to be bailed out by other elements.
“Things always seem fairer when we look back at them, and it is out of that inaccessible tower of the past that Longing leans and beckons.”
— James Russell Lowell猫が生き甲斐
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