Results 1 to 8 of 8

Thread: The State of Flow

  1. #1

    Question The State of Flow

    Is the state of "flow" (physical flow) Se or Si?

    I know that you can have different types of flow, but what is physical flow usually attributed to?

  2. #2
    Adam Strange's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Midwest, USA
    TIM
    ENTJ-1Te 8w7 sx/so
    Posts
    15,485
    Mentioned
    1479 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    I spent some time in a class in a Buddhist temple trying to learn how to meditate and failed completely. They were talking about getting into a state of flow, and I was sitting on my ass on a cushion in a dark room, bored out of my mind.

    However, I did, much later, figure out what a state of flow was. It was the subjective state that I found myself in when I was machining parts in a machine shop. It goes like this:

    Stand next to the mill, place the part to be machined in a vice, clamp the vice, place the correct cutter in the spindle, turn on the spindle, adjust the speed, drop the spindle to the correct height, move the table to the right position, engage the cutter into the workpiece, avoid the hot chips, listen to the sound of the cutter to ensure that it's neither too fast or too slow in removing material, finish the cut, check the table readouts, move the table, repeat the cut, measure the part, correct if necessary, stop the spindle when the cut is done, change the cutter to the next operation, look at the readouts and move the table to the correct position, turn on the spindle, check the speed and adjust if necessary, make a new cut,...

    ....and this goes on for eight or ten hours straight. It puts a person in a zone of continuously, always doing, always thinking about the next step as the present step is being executed. It's "being in the zone", and it's quite pleasant and therapeutic until you realize that you haven't actually done anything that uses any part of your brain that evolved in the past 60 million years.

    This state is very animalistic and almost entirely without forethought or foresight, or even much thinking. It is a process of robotically following a preset pattern. I'd say it mainly uses extroverted sensing to be aware of one's surroundings, and introverted sensing to be aware of the way your body needs to move in order to accomplish the task, but it needs very little of anything else. Very little thinking (T) other than to be aware of the steps in the process, very few value judgements (F), and almost no intuition (N).

    Actually, it might use intuition by my definition of the term, because I believe that intuition is a process that takes place in the brain in which a previously recorded pattern is matched to what is occurring in the outside world, like hearing a series of footsteps growing louder, and then projecting ahead along the recorded pattern to see what it recorded previously. Previously, when you heard a series of steps growing louder, you eventually noticed that a person was walking near you, so you have this intuition that you will soon see a person standing near you.
    The patterns that are being run out when a person is in the Zone, whether they are machining or doing the dishes, are intuitive in that sense. But it's a very simple intuition, and a very simple level of Se and Si.

    Maybe the reason that I found this kind of flow calming is because it used very primitive skills and wasn't demanding, and the reason I was bored out of my mind in the temple and why I eventually abandoned machining as a trade was because it used no Thinking or Ethical skills.

  3. #3
    Kardashev Scale Blade Runner 2017 2049 Bunny ZidaneLugia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Location
    Macroverse MtBattle ScholarsGarden RealMadridLive SuperNexus InfinitiesUltimate AllSpectraEverywhere
    TIM
    WiredforBattleShingo
    Posts
    2,991
    Mentioned
    72 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Flow is a mental shard that drinks from the cup of liberty as tyrants and would be conquerors of the old demon haunted world shows that by going into our Zen state and hijacking the silver snack of colosseums to rebels dye of the twisted scarecrow always invites a mouse to the banquet of stars and balloons.

    Basically, the flow of life is found in serenity and compassion with the milkshake of drama and halos showing your courage and patience for the harps of heaven with Zeus and crows.
    https://sabrinacasey.webstarts.com/9systemswishes
    https://sabrinacasey.webstarts.com/evolvedraichu
    Pokemon is somewhere fun over the Rainbow emblazoned by the Power of 4ever. The clouds soar and the island escalates a Lugia petal dance tempest blizzarding shiny Ash. Evanescence sparkles glistening auroras of mirth and high frequency channels embarking with the winds of new beginnings. This magical adventure turns on at the dawn of time in 2000. Ceremony and enchantment dazzle the world with colors galore. Mania and extravagance shape shift and transform into the greatest show on earth, the evolution of Pokemon
    Something has arrived. That threatens to throw everything terribly out of balance. When it comes, will you accept your destiny? And when it’s your chance to be a hero, will you rise to the challenge? This year, discover how 1 person can make all the difference! Pokemon the Movie 2000 The Power of 1

  4. #4
    Baqer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2021
    TIM
    ILE-De
    Posts
    540
    Mentioned
    45 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Flow state doesn't have anything to do with functions, it's completely outside of it. Flow, as Adam Strange described, is basically a state of "No thought", the same thing that meditation is supposed to induce. Functions are aggregates of personality traits, the Flow state is a state of mind.

  5. #5
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2021
    Posts
    444
    Mentioned
    52 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    hmm. i think while functions does not necessarily equal flow state, properly engaging them (under challenging or optimal conditions) can help one get into flow state.

    for Se-lead maybe being in an environment where he/she has to adapt on the fly ie: sports

    for Si-lead maybe being in an environment where he/she can fully immerse one's sensations ie: savoring every detail, relaxing every muscle
    Last edited by peteronfireee2; 07-14-2021 at 04:33 AM.

  6. #6
    Shazaam's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Lamp
    TIM
    AB-IEI-Ni
    Posts
    13,562
    Mentioned
    580 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Are you talking about where you don't stop and over think neurotically and stay in the motion and rhythm of what you are doing? Where thinking/action become more one. I think it could be a Se/Ni thing or Si/Ne thing really - perhaps both.

    It doesn't happen for me that much either cuz I guess I get too Ni and just sort of zone out and uselessly think instead of flow. =/ I like the advice 'Be a river, not a lake' but that is way easier said than done, for sure. ((if somebody is a 'river' but they're also too shallow it annoys me lol.))

  7. #7
    ouronis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    TIM
    ref to ptr to self
    Posts
    2,866
    Mentioned
    124 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Flow state is not necessarily as a result of physical activity, unless you include thinking as a flow state. Flow states are probably when you are able to maximally engage your ego functions, or just when you're generically inspired and thus firing on all cylinders.

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ouronis View Post
    Flow state is not necessarily as a result of physical activity, unless you include thinking as a flow state. Flow states are probably when you are able to maximally engage your ego functions, or just when you're generically inspired and thus firing on all cylinders.
    Ah, I see. So basically "in the moment" with your function usage, using them as they were intended to be used functionally? Letting it flow, and work with that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I spent some time in a class in a Buddhist temple trying to learn how to meditate and failed completely. They were talking about getting into a state of flow, and I was sitting on my ass on a cushion in a dark room, bored out of my mind.

    However, I did, much later, figure out what a state of flow was. It was the subjective state that I found myself in when I was machining parts in a machine shop. It goes like this:

    [Method]

    ....and this goes on for eight or ten hours straight. It puts a person in a zone of continuously, always doing, always thinking about the next step as the present step is being executed. It's "being in the zone", and it's quite pleasant and therapeutic until you realize that you haven't actually done anything that uses any part of your brain that evolved in the past 60 million years.

    This state is very animalistic and almost entirely without forethought or foresight, or even much thinking. It is a process of robotically following a preset pattern. I'd say it mainly uses extroverted sensing to be aware of one's surroundings, and introverted sensing to be aware of the way your body needs to move in order to accomplish the task, but it needs very little of anything else. Very little thinking (T) other than to be aware of the steps in the process, very few value judgements (F), and almost no intuition (N).

    Actually, it might use intuition by my definition of the term, because I believe that intuition is a process that takes place in the brain in which a previously recorded pattern is matched to what is occurring in the outside world, like hearing a series of footsteps growing louder, and then projecting ahead along the recorded pattern to see what it recorded previously. Previously, when you heard a series of steps growing louder, you eventually noticed that a person was walking near you, so you have this intuition that you will soon see a person standing near you.
    The patterns that are being run out when a person is in the Zone, whether they are machining or doing the dishes, are intuitive in that sense. But it's a very simple intuition, and a very simple level of Se and Si.

    Maybe the reason that I found this kind of flow calming is because it used very primitive skills and wasn't demanding, and the reason I was bored out of my mind in the temple and why I eventually abandoned machining as a trade was because it used no Thinking or Ethical skills.
    That makes sense. If you do a hyponotic job, and you get into it, and you have something to focus on you get into the zone and the state of flow.

    Quote Originally Posted by RaptorWizard View Post
    Flow is a mental shard that drinks from the cup of liberty as tyrants and would be conquerors of the old demon haunted world shows that by going into our Zen state and hijacking the silver snack of colosseums to rebels dye of the twisted scarecrow always invites a mouse to the banquet of stars and balloons.

    Basically, the flow of life is found in serenity and compassion with the milkshake of drama and halos showing your courage and patience for the harps of heaven with Zeus and crows.
    Nice

    Quote Originally Posted by Baqer View Post
    Flow state doesn't have anything to do with functions, it's completely outside of it. Flow, as Adam Strange described, is basically a state of "No thought", the same thing that meditation is supposed to induce. Functions are aggregates of personality traits, the Flow state is a state of mind.
    Ah, that makes sense. So, it would be like what Pandemic Candy gave as an example in the next quote?

    Quote Originally Posted by pandemic candy View Post
    I think while functions does not necessarily equal flow state, properly engaging them (under challenging or optimal conditions) can help one get into flow state.

    for Se-lead maybe being in an environment where he/she has to adapt on the fly ie: sports

    for Si-lead maybe being in an environment where he/she can fully immerse one's sensations ie: savoring every detail, relaxing every muscle
    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    i don't know if i've experienced this much - but i might have idealistic standards for what qualifies as it. sometimes when i was playing the piano it felt like i was one with the piano and it was almost like some other force was using me to play, but it wasn't another force because what it played is like what i play. so i wasn't like literally possessed.
    Interesting, like the force of the flow?

    Quote Originally Posted by BandD View Post
    Are you talking about where you don't stop and over think neurotically and stay in the motion and rhythm of what you are doing? Where thinking/action become more one. I think it could be a Se/Ni thing or Si/Ne thing really - perhaps both.

    It doesn't happen for me that much either cuz I guess I get too Ni and just sort of zone out and uselessly think instead of flow. =/ I like the advice 'Be a river, not a lake' but that is way easier said than done, for sure. ((if somebody is a 'river' but they're also too shallow it annoys me lol.))
    Yeah, I think so. Overthinking is stinky at times. Why not be an ocean, man?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •