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Thread: How to win back an SEI?

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    Default How to win back an SEI?

    To start off, I get it. I’m not brilliantly mischievous ILE. I don’t have an acerbic sense of humor that boasts an endearing, unwitting impertinence.

    SEI was my best friend. Wanted to spend time with her every chance I had; I was in the sisterhood for the long haul. I foolishly assumed she saw our friendship the same way. She told me I was too intense, and I know I am...sx-first. She didn’t need all that. I let her go.

    She became close to an SLE who was everything I wasn’t. To an extent, I understood the appeal. SLE made her feel needed, which I failed to do. Although, her presence in my life meant so much. Her ability to bring me joy on bad days was unrivaled.

    maybe she just didn’t care or like me that much. It happens. But sometimes she reaches out, throws down chips, tells me things that make me think she misses our friendship. But I’m still a bit confused, and don’t want to make the same mistake twice.

    my question is, how can an EII make an SEI feel cared for? I’ve been on the other side with ILIs - often they don’t even notice my existence, but the ones who do, while they care, don’t know how to care. They don’t understand my needs.

    We are complementary (Ne-Si) subtypes. Theoretically, this is as good as Benefit relations can get (more similar to activity). Is there a way I can optimize this?
    Last edited by PinKDiGiT18; 05-27-2021 at 04:55 PM.

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    I was in a similar situation with an SEI. I don't know how similar exactly our situations were, but this seemed familiar to me:

    maybe she just didn’t care or like me that much. It happens. But sometimes she reaches out, throws down chips, tells me things that make me think she misses our friendship. But I don’t know, nor do I want to make the same mistake twice.
    You might think of things like this as signs of love/friendship. So would I. I don't know how the SEI brain works, so I can't tell you why they do this, but mine did the same thing. But if she wanted to restore your friendship she would be trying to do it. Ignore indications like these and focus on what she's actually doing. If she's not trying to reconnect, she isn't interested in doing so again.

    my question is, how can an EII make an SEI feel loved?
    And here my advice would be: she doesn't love you, or she would be trying to reconnect. And if she's written you off after everything you've been through, recognize that she's a shallow person and the relationship you thought you had was a fraud. Anger and hatred would be more productive to feel than nostalgia for a hallucination. Find someone who will give a shit about you when you aren't entertaining them.
    φιλοκαλοῦμέν τε γὰρ μετ᾽ εὐτελείας καὶ φιλοσοφοῦμεν ἄνευ μαλακίας.

    It’s hard to translate this literally and poetically into English, but this is my attempt at a translation: “For we love beauty, that we attain good ends thereby, and we love wisdom, though not in a way that makes us soft, nor that causes us to value weakness.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by FreelancePoliceman View Post
    I was in a similar situation with an SEI. I don't know how similar exactly our situations were, but this seemed familiar to me:



    You might think of things like this as signs of love/friendship. So would I. I don't know how the SEI brain works, so I can't tell you why they do this, but mine did the same thing. But if she wanted to restore your friendship she would be trying to do it. Ignore indications like these and focus on what she's actually doing. If she's not trying to reconnect, she isn't interested in doing so again.



    And here my advice would be: she doesn't love you, or she would be trying to reconnect. And if she's written you off after everything you've been through, recognize that she's a shallow person and the relationship you thought you had was a fraud. Anger and hatred would be more productive to feel than nostalgia. Find someone who will give a shit about you when you aren't entertaining them.
    a huge thanks, I appreciate this so much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PinKDiGiT18 View Post
    a huge thanks, I appreciate this so much.
    No problem. Feel free to PM me if you’d like to talk more.
    φιλοκαλοῦμέν τε γὰρ μετ᾽ εὐτελείας καὶ φιλοσοφοῦμεν ἄνευ μαλακίας.

    It’s hard to translate this literally and poetically into English, but this is my attempt at a translation: “For we love beauty, that we attain good ends thereby, and we love wisdom, though not in a way that makes us soft, nor that causes us to value weakness.”

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    Ксеркс, царь царей xerx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinKDiGiT18 View Post
    To start off, I get it. I’m not brilliantly mischievous ILE.
    There's your problem.

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    Do bizarre loony things that seem slightly uncomfortable.
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    Are you sure that both of you are the types that you say that you are? EII and SEI tend to be cognitively dissonant; they will likely never walk the same path, have the same goals nor take the same approaches. Being both input sub-types also creates significant imbalance in the relationship and any major joint venture will likely bring out disagreement and distrust. The SEI may benefit from your insight into over-the-horizon thinking if that person should ever listen but for the most part may view you as too impractical or “out there” to be useful. I would have thought that her general lack of foresight and potential siege mentality would have irritated you to no end. If you are correct about type then it must be libido or some personal-baggage related dependency that has kept you together up to this point.

    a.k.a. I/O

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    Are you sure that both of you are the types that you say that you are? EII and SEI tend to be cognitively dissonant; they will likely never walk the same path, have the same goals nor take the same approaches. Being both input sub-types also creates significant imbalance in the relationship and any major joint venture will likely bring out disagreement and distrust. The SEI may benefit from your insight into over-the-horizon thinking if that person should ever listen but for the most part may view you as too impractical or “out there” to be useful. I would have thought that her general lack of foresight and potential siege mentality would have irritated you to no end. If you are correct about type then it must be libido or some personal-baggage related dependency that has kept you together up to this point.

    a.k.a. I/O
    Yes, SEI was very receptive to my insights, but not to my ethics. Also, if it was not clear in my original post, this wasn’t a romantic relationship.

    also, I am EII-Ne and she is SEI-Si. I forget what the term input means with regard to inert and contact dichotomies, but I notice SEI-Fe is more tolerant of my EII quirks.
    Last edited by PinKDiGiT18; 05-27-2021 at 04:28 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PinKDiGiT18 View Post
    Yes, SEI was very receptive to my insights, but not to my ethics. Also, if it was not clear in my original post, this wasn’t a romantic relationship.

    also, I am EII-Ne and she is SEI-Si. I forget what the term input means with regard to inert and contact dichotomies, but I notice SEI-Fe is more tolerant of my EII quirks.
    Differences in ethics can be real show-stoppers. Note that relationships can develop dependencies without them being romantic. I view the term sub-type as a processing imbalance that creates barriers to relationships due to the subsequent quirkiness, and two quirks don't cancel each other out. I've had significant subtype experience because I'm most certainly one.

    a.k.a. I/O

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    if you think someone as a friend - this means you understand him good to do not ask such questions
    if it's not your friend after much communicating - you'd better switched the attention on who can be so
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    Default "Win back?"

    Gulenko "Criteria of reciprocity"

    Direct request - integration for intervention

    There is some tension in communication, however, it is quite attractive because in your partner you see someone who can implement your plans and ideas. Therefore, you start looking for a way to integrate with this person and earn his or her trust. This happens only when when you can catch them off guard, when he or she was distracted, relaxed, and had poor control over his or her actions. Coming out from the "hypnosis" the partner understands that he was in some degree used, after which there is a period of cooling in these relations. Discovering that your influence is weakening, you start to take steps to more fine-tuned integration. Communication for this reason has a sort of pulsating nature.
    Well, my SEI-Si ex gf always said her EII friends never really listened to her insights and that they loved the sound of their own voice. In general in relationships where both people have 4D Fi they seem to smooth over too many problems and then resent each other for not being more upfront. And 3D Ne always judges 1D Ne for not "being normal"(expect 2D).

    Quote Originally Posted by FreelancePoliceman View Post
    Find someone who will give a shit about you when you aren't entertaining them.
    Sounds like PinK also mostly gave a shit about her bc she was entertaining, lol, so no need to be offended :

    Quote Originally Posted by PinKDiGiT18 View Post
    She became close to an SLE who was everything I wasn’t. To an extent, I understood the appeal. SLE made her feel needed, which I failed to do. Although, her presence in my life meant so much. Her ability to bring me joy on bad days was unrivaled.
    Quote Originally Posted by PinKDiGiT18 View Post
    my question is, how can an EII make an SEI feel cared for? I’ve been on the other side with ILIs - often they don’t even notice my existence, but the ones who do, while they care, don’t know how to care. They don’t understand my needs.

    We are complementary (Ne-Si) subtypes. Theoretically, this is as good as Benefit relations can get (more similar to activity). Is there a way I can optimize this?
    Benefaction is not a good relationship for becoming close because even if it seems like it, you can't really understand each other. It's a nice relationship to do activities or to work together, but not for intimacy. As the benefactor, the initiative is up to you, as I know you've guessed.
    Last edited by lkdhf qkb; 06-13-2021 at 08:17 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lkdhf qkb View Post
    Well, my SEI-Si ex gf always said her EII friends never really listened to her insights and that they loved the sound of their own voice...Benefaction is not a good relationship for becoming close because even if it seems like it, you can't really understand each other. It's a nice relationship to do activities or to work together, but not for intimacy. As the benefactor, the initiative is up to you, as I know you've guessed.
    What was interaction with your ex like? Did you understand each other well? Were her needs very apparent to you? I feel like in Benefit there is a blind spot on part of the benefactor.

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    SEI is my look-a-like and I get on with them well. However, I went through a hugely difficult period with an SEI friend recently. I thought of him as such a nice guy so it was incredibly difficult to accept when he started to push me away and wouldn't listen to me when I made attempts to build bridges with him. He seemed to think he had some sort of authority over me and that only his methods of fixing the problems in our friendship would work (ignoring my words of concern, pleas for resolution, withdrawing from communicating with me and when he did communicate talking to me as if I was a child he was teaching how to behave). Well, in the end I grew sick of this and I sent him an almighty email telling him just how much of a little twerp he had been (in nice words of course). He went crying to our work manager which was fine by me and now we aren't allowed to talk to each other (for a while). I told my manager all about it (she sort of knew anyway) and she was very supportive and telling the story made me remember just how rubbish the situation had been. Anyway, so far, so good. We have spoken about work a bit and so far it feels like he's treating me much more like an equal. And I finally feel free from his hold on me. I wish I had been this assertive with him right from the start. It now feels like he has no way of ignoring or passing the blame for any big problems that might come up if we become friendly again. Because he knows my true thoughts about him and I don't think he would want me to judge him so harshly again. Probably not useful info for understanding benefit relations soz. But I know how sweet SEI can be and therefore how upsetting when they turn away from you. If I sound bitter I don't mean to, SEI are my faves and I'm glad I have an improved understanding of the potential problems I can have with them.
    Don't judge each day by the harvest you reap but by the seeds that you plant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bethany View Post
    SEI is my look-a-like and I get on with them well. However, I went through a hugely difficult period with an SEI friend recently. I thought of him as such a nice guy so it was incredibly difficult to accept when he started to push me away and wouldn't listen to me when I made attempts to build bridges with him. He seemed to think he had some sort of authority over me and that only his methods of fixing the problems in our friendship would work (ignoring my words of concern, pleas for resolution, withdrawing from communicating with me and when he did communicate talking to me as if I was a child he was teaching how to behave). Well, in the end I grew sick of this and I sent him an almighty email telling him just how much of a little twerp he had been (in nice words of course). He went crying to our work manager which was fine by me and now we aren't allowed to talk to each other (for a while). I told my manager all about it (she sort of knew anyway) and she was very supportive and telling the story made me remember just how rubbish the situation had been. Anyway, so far, so good. We have spoken about work a bit and so far it feels like he's treating me much more like an equal. And I finally feel free from his hold on me. I wish I had been this assertive with him right from the start. It now feels like he has no way of ignoring or passing the blame for any big problems that might come up if we become friendly again. Because he knows my true thoughts about him and I don't think he would want me to judge him so harshly again. Probably not useful info for understanding benefit relations soz. But I know how sweet SEI can be and therefore how upsetting when they turn away from you. If I sound bitter I don't mean to, SEI are my faves and I'm glad I have an improved understanding of the potential problems I can have with them.
    No thank you so much, I completely understand the pushing-away-without-explanation thing. That honestly sucks but I’m glad you were able to acquire some level of balance in the end. For me, it was hard to talk out what our problems were because my friend was extremely conflict-averse, possibly even moreso than I was.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PinKDiGiT18 View Post
    No thank you so much, I completely understand the pushing-away-without-explanation thing. That honestly sucks but I’m glad you were able to acquire some level of balance in the end. For me, it was hard to talk out what our problems were because my friend was extremely conflict-averse, possibly even moreso than I was.
    yep didn't think I would but definitely feeling more balanced. Hm it's hard. If I could go way back in time, I think I would have asked the SEI if we could have a chat about things because I was feeling a little upset about stuff. Maybe he would have listened if I was 'gentle but firm' in the first place? Gentle but firm and nice but also serious...haha. I think he probably thought I was putting too much pressure on him to be 'my friend' so it also might have helped if I just stopped talking to him and he might have felt worried/naturally concerned and asked what was wrong. Even now, I have accepted that if we become friends again, it would likely be a friendship where we saw each other infrequently and spontaneously. We are mis-matching subtypes for sure (or on the wrong sides of the subtype spectrum). He is SEI-Fe. Only now do I understand the annoying side of Fe, lol.
    Don't judge each day by the harvest you reap but by the seeds that you plant.

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    Personally, I would leave her alone and move on from the friendship. She doesn't seem to want to reconnect because if she did, then she would be more direct in my opinion and what others have mentioned as well. It may seem crappy now but there will be better people in the future to become friends with


    I may be able to explain this "push away without explanation" thing as I have done that. This is not for every SEI, but I can explain my thought process for this.
    The push is often done after a LONG pattern of issues that have not been explicitly dealt with or expressed. Most of the time, both people are not aware of it. What I mean by that is sometimes the actions that people do don't always bug or hurt me at first. I think they are not doing it to hurt me or it's a one time thing, it gets sweeped under the rug. I don't think about the possibility of the pattern happening in the future. I value harmony more so and I may find it awkward to bring it up. The person may continue the pattern and I don't realize it is hurting me until it strikes a strong nerve that was unknown before. It is kinda like an AHA moment. After that I start feeling the pressure of that kind of pain, I kinda start bring things up to fix the issue. This may be direct or indirect. If you look hard enough, the pattern is there. More often then not, the person doesn't want to fix the issue that is bugging me or it seems the pattern would continue. I imagine the pain and that's when I put the distance. It is much much worse if you try and close the distance after the push away, that can lead to a lot more bitterness. This choice is not made quickly or easily, it is made when there is no other choice left.

    I had an longtime EII friend that I was close with who would constantly ghost me and only reappear when she needed me for something. Eventually, I had enough and I had to cut contact and push away. I got a very direct and confused message from her after cutting her off but, it was too late. I didn't care and there was contradicting information. It wasn't worth it enough for me to continue even though for years I would use anyways and means to communicate with her.

    We speak. However, we may not be heard. Nothing is worse then not being heard. From there, I would rather choose silence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MissDucki View Post
    Personally, I would leave her alone and move on from the friendship. She doesn't seem to want to reconnect because if she did, then she would be more direct in my opinion and what others have mentioned as well. It may seem crappy now but there will be better people in the future to become friends with


    I may be able to explain this "push away without explanation" thing as I have done that. This is not for every SEI, but I can explain my thought process for this.
    The push is often done after a LONG pattern of issues that have not been explicitly dealt with or expressed. Most of the time, both people are not aware of it. What I mean by that is sometimes the actions that people do don't always bug or hurt me at first. I think they are not doing it to hurt me or it's a one time thing, it gets sweeped under the rug. I don't think about the possibility of the pattern happening in the future. I value harmony more so and I may find it awkward to bring it up. The person may continue the pattern and I don't realize it is hurting me until it strikes a strong nerve that was unknown before. It is kinda like an AHA moment. After that I start feeling the pressure of that kind of pain, I kinda start bring things up to fix the issue. This may be direct or indirect. If you look hard enough, the pattern is there. More often then not, the person doesn't want to fix the issue that is bugging me or it seems the pattern would continue. I imagine the pain and that's when I put the distance. It is much much worse if you try and close the distance after the push away, that can lead to a lot more bitterness. This choice is not made quickly or easily, it is made when there is no other choice left.

    I had an longtime EII friend that I was close with who would constantly ghost me and only reappear when she needed me for something. Eventually, I had enough and I had to cut contact and push away. I got a very direct and confused message from her after cutting her off but, it was too late. I didn't care and there was contradicting information. It wasn't worth it enough for me to continue even though for years I would use anyways and means to communicate with her.

    We speak. However, we may not be heard. Nothing is worse then not being heard. From there, I would rather choose silence.
    I understand you; thank you for this. At this point I feel there is nothing I could have done or can do to make her feel heard. I ask her, am honest about my limitations but make it clear I want her to feel she can talk to me and that I would make the changes I could so she could be comfortable, but she shuts down. And once that happens, I’m at a loss of how to proceed. It seems it would be better to let things lie at this point, but it doesn’t make it easy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PinKDiGiT18 View Post
    What was interaction with your ex like? Did you understand each other well? Were her needs very apparent to you? I feel like in Benefit there is a blind spot on part of the benefactor.
    I think we understood each other rather well and it was easy to hear her needs but difficult to cater to them when related to Ti and vice versa with Te for her. It felt like problems accumulated like dirty dishes in the sink over time because neither of us knew how to deal with or talk about them(Te+Ti Polr kind of extinguish each other). Thing with SEI is that you need to guess what they need and then help them with their logistics and tasks but without talking about it or expecting anything in return(Te demonstrative). IEE can't really guess that(inert and not contact Te) and EII always need thorough instructions themselves and thus force SEI to talk about it(Te inf). Also I'd guess that EII is ignoring the Fe of SEI so you can't really 'hear her', (while IEE can bc demo Fe).
    Life is soup. I'm a fork.

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