Albert Einstein

[jason_m]

I often see Einstein typed as an ILE. What I don't get about this is that EPs are supposedly high energy types - they like expending energy. When I look at Einstein's demeanor, and the way he carried himself, I don't see someone with a high energy level. My guess would be ILI - an IP, the lowest energy level group, and both intuitive and logical.

Jason

[Exodus]

Do you have a video or something?

[jason_m]

Do you have a video or something?

Jason

EDIT: For some reason, when I click on the "play" button of the video, it doesn't play. If this happens to you, go to http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?t...lbert_Einstein, and look at the video under "Videos."

Jason

[Exodus]

idk, it's pretty scant evidence. There are plenty of other reasons
why Einstein is ILE (see socionics.us + a billion past threads).

[Rick]

I just wrote a substantiation of the ILE typing based on a biography of Einstein. It's not perfect, but I think the reasons for ILE are pretty strong. Feel free to comment on http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?t...Admin/Einstein

[munenori2]

On a complete side note, I thought Exxp's expended energy as a matter of course, but Exxj's took it to the next level. Not saying one is better than the other, but Exxj's, especially Fe, seems very much out in the world as far as energy goes.

[Gilly]

On a complete side note, I thought Exxp's expended energy as a matter of course, but Exxj's took it to the next level.

I'd say it's the other way around.

[Jarno]

I often see Einstein typed as an ILE. What I don't get about this is that EPs are supposedly high energy types - they like expending energy. When I look at Einstein's demeanor, and the way he carried himself, I don't see someone with a high energy level. My guess would be ILI - an IP, the lowest energy level group, and both intuitive and logical.

Jason

While your reasoning is sounds right, it's still higly probable that einstein was ILE.

My arguments:
- Rick said that highly intelligent people tend to be loners.
- Igor Weisband is ILE, he's not the high energy type you'd expect. I've met him.
- another example, Rick is an IEE, he's not a high energy type, he acts coolish.
- Einstein seems to VI as an ILE
- ILE's tend to be capable of the things einstein did. ILI's not.
- Einsteins letters etc (i've got 2 books on him) are pretty strange. If he was an ILI I might
have recognized something of my own writing style in it, which I don't.
- Someone capable of recognizing Ne, would probably see it clearly in one of my books, I
remember thinking, this guy has great intuitive insights. He sees all sorts of things in what
seems mundane. Unfortunately I'm not an expert on Ne. But it's pretty obvious I think.

[tcaudilllg]

While your reasoning is sounds right, it's still higly probable that einstein was ILE.

My arguments:
- Rick said that highly intelligent people tend to be loners.

Way to think for yourself. I think anybody with any observational skills at all could have deduced that one. Except, damn... are we saying that Ronald Reagan wasn't intelligent here? Something isn't jiving, now.

[Not A Communist Shill]

This message is endorsed by rmcnew (blame him!).

[Brilliand]

Ni. Absurd in a Ne perspective.

No, that is precisely how Ne works. Information is taken in, reshuffled, and spit back out in a form that is unrecognizable. This is viewed as creativity... but to the Ne ego watching his own mind, everything came from somewhere.

[jason_m]

I started this thread when I didn't have much knowledge of socionics. Interestingly, I now still consider Einstein to be ILI, for three main reasons:

1. His mannerisms and facial expressions appear completely drained of Fe (enthusiasm). It wouldn't surprise me if Fe is his weakest function.

2. Einstein was very interested in moral causes. His interest in pacifism and the well-being of mankind is very clear in his writings. (i.e., Fi-valuing.)

3. I find his writing style incomprehensible. Perhaps Einstein's writings (even on simple things) are too difficult to be easily understood by the masses, but these difficulties are very typical in quasi-identical relations.

Jason

[Logos]

I started this thread when I didn't have much knowledge of socionics. Interestingly, I now still consider Einstein to be ILI, for three main reasons:

The evidence still weighs far more heavily towards ILE and your reasons do little to change that.

[quote1. His mannerisms and facial expressions appear completely drained of Fe (enthusiasm). It wouldn't surprise me if Fe is his weakest function.[/quote]Einstein may have also had Asperger's Syndrome.

2. Einstein was very interested in moral causes. His interest in pacifism and the well-being of mankind is very clear in his writings. (i.e., Fi-valuing.)

He was also highly interested in political causes. But none of this really points to Fi-valuing, especially considering that philosophers such as Seneca (ILE) and Marx (ILE) also have written extensively on morality. And philosophical Spinoza's (Alpha NT) magnum opus was entitled Ethics. (The same Spinoza whose philosophical works influenced Einstein. Einstein even wrote a terrible poem for him.) Or how about the political ethicist John Rawls (LII)? To say that concern over the well-being of mankind points to Fi-valuing is simply wrong when one begins at the grander scope of evidence.

3. I find his writing style incomprehensible. Perhaps Einstein's writings (even on simple things) are too difficult to be easily understood by the masses, but these difficulties are very typical in quasi-identical relations.

I do not find his writing style incomprehensible. If he is an ILI, and I am an LII this would be odd. If he is an ILI, and I am an LSI (as ephemeros believes), this would still be odd. Your ability or mine to comprehend his writing is not necessarily a good basis for typing.

If you were to look at the relationships that he had with his wives, it points towards Si-seeking. His difficulty of performing physical tasks required the aid of his wives. His second wife, Elsa, was described as a gatekeeper who protected him from unwelcome visitors and charlatans. Or this book excerpt describing his relationship:

[Elsa and Einstein] enjoyed the same foods and appreciated the same ideals of simple living.
...
Elsa's caretaking and nursing was a likely factor in Einstein's eventual decision to formalize his separation from Mileva.
...
While Mileva is rumored to have contributed to Einstein's early theories to at least some extent, it was Elsa who was a better match for Einstein. Rather than competing with him in the scientific arena, she was able to accept that her husband needed solitude and intense concentration to do his work, and she played a supporting role by creating a good working environment for him and placing few demands on him.

This is a caregiving behavior.

Einstein's love for sailing and rowing for relaxation of the mind and body also is an indication of Si-seeking. One book on Einstein writes:

Sailing was an excellent output for Einstein's energies, combining mathematics and physics, as well as nautical engineering. Sailing provided physical activity and mind-clearing freedom; he brought a notebook on all his sailing ventures in order to jot down his thoughts. Some of his best thoughts were said to occur while working on his sailboats-while he spent much time actually sailing, he was also said to enjoy simply drifting and cogitating.

Here we have Einstein engaging in leisurely physical activity (Si) as a means of generating ideas (Ne). It does not get much clearer than this.

Albert Einstein was much respected for his kind and friendly demeanor rooted in his pacifism. He was modest about his abilities, and had distinctive attitudes and fashions—for example, he minimized his wardrobe so that he would not need to waste time in deciding on what to wear. He occasionally had a playful sense of humor, and enjoyed sailing and playing the violin. He was also the stereotypical "absent-minded professor"; he was often forgetful of everyday items, such as keys, and would focus so intently on solving physics problems that he would often become oblivious to his surroundings. In his later years, his appearance inadvertently created (or reflected) another stereotype of the scientist in the process: the researcher with unruly white hair.

This is behavior that occurs frequently in Ne-egos. There is a reason why the ILE is associated with the archetype of the absent-minded professor.

[Creepy-bg]

oh thank god... I thought that somebody had made a new thread on Einstein

[717495]

I personally think that temperament has more to do with the elements than the typing, Ni and Si fitting in with IP, Ne and Se fitting in with EP, etc.. And high energy is not the right idea. Extroversion is more about controlling and producing, making an impact. You're not always going to have high energy extroverts, no. So an ENTp with Ti subtype is especially not going to be high energy with passive and observant Ti.

Ti subtype is still wanting to control and make an impact, but is far less direct. There is more observation, waiting, and planning involved, and there less value placed upon the experiential.

[JWC3]

I often see Einstein typed as an ILE. What I don't get about this is that EPs are supposedly high energy types - they like expending energy.

Goto the mall or any public place, look around and tell me how many people you see that you personally would describe as having 'exploding energy' when you do that get back to me.

[1981slater]

Goto the mall or any public place, look around and tell me how many people you see that you personally would describe as having 'exploding energy' when you do that get back to me.

[JWC3]

Right, I'm going to assume that was a joke and have a chuckle because if not you completely failed to grasp the point I was trying to make.

Also fwiw he's not at a mall

[Warlord]

YouTube - Ultimate Warrior - Unstable Video

lol

"The normal people that walk everyday on the streets, we cannot understand" - Ultimate Warrior

It must be because they have too low energy levels

[Creepy-male]

Have you seen an ESE lately? Very explosive.

[1981slater]

Let me introduce you the only Frenchman with a sense of humour:

Remi Gaillard

[Blaze]

Have you seen an ESE lately? Very explosive.

tell me about it. i have a 12 year old ESE at home it's drama city. poor kid!

[Nexus]

Ne-ENTp?

[Absurd]

No wonder he looks tired. All the typing he must endure.

[Jarno]

ENTP-Ti is the general consensus

[Nexus]

I wonder if being ENTx / creative subtype is a requirement for revolutionizing physics

[Jarno]

I wonder if being ENTx / creative subtype is a requirement for revolutionizing physics

I guess it helps...

[jason_m]

Looking at his pictures and reading his writing, I thought ILI. After looking at this video, I think ILE. (There was even a hint of Fe in his expression at one point...)

Jason

[munenori2]

[meals]

Energy levels fluctuate and from my observation you can have two people of the same socionic type with, say, different enneatypes, or different social introversion/extraversion levels and you will end up with people with very different temperaments/energy levels.

[Jarno]

Einstein = ILE-Ti

I'm very confident of this typing.

[Amber]

LII-Ne