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Thread: Can an autistic be an ethic??

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    Default Can an autistic be an ethic??

    Hi!

    I just want to hear your opinions about this. Mine is that they can, because I believe that Jungian preferences have more to do with personal importance than with innate skill.

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    Autism is a spectrum, and I think (and doctors do too) I have a low level of autism, yet I'm pretty confident that I'm a feeler. But even though I'm a feeler I do stuff that aren't very common for them, like saying embarrassing or hurtful stuff, but I'm naturally a nice and very likeable person
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    if you look at it from a socionics perspective, it most likely is an excessive focus on specific functions regardless of your type, so yeah, autists can be ethical types too.

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    Default Can an autistic be an ethic??

    Yes. Being an ethical type doesn’t mean you’re incapable of logical abilities and being a logical type doesn’t mean you’re emotionally clogged up. It’s about differences in approaches and motivations. If anything, I think autistic types tend to be Fi leads if they’re ethical since they’re stuck in their inner world.


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    I am autistic

    Typing myself was tricky

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    Self-typing is always tricky. There’s always bias operating.

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    I was diagnosed with an autism spectrum disorder and I'm an ethical type.

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    of course. it's likely some big names in 'ethical literature' were on the spectrum somewhere, even.

    autism and art are not at all incompatible
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    I don't know.
    If you mean an F type, I'd say F will be problematic for autistics because F at some point or depth involves rapport with other people, which will be a harder point for autistics and make them more of a Jungian T.
    If you mean can they be ethical minded or a feeling type in a general sense, but not a socionics or Jungian sense, then yes. But I suspect the two are a bit different now.
    Or maybe they can be a feeling type in their inner world and to themselves, but a thinking type with other people. Probably complicates things a bit. But maybe that's everyone.

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    It seems to do a lot of perception. It is like world really shatters in front of you into patterns and only way to deal with is to focus attention to specifics. Therefore mb Ni with super retard hyper sensitive Si (mb super ego block).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chin Diaper 007 View Post
    It seems to do a lot of perception. It is like world really shatters in front of you into patterns and only way to deal with is to focus attention to specifics. Therefore mb Ni with super retard hyper sensitive Si (mb super ego block).
    You haven't met an autistic person have you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alomoes View Post
    You haven't met an autistic person have you?
    I think I have few. They seem to take in more than they can handle and it seems intense for them.
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    People on the spectrum are as much different as people outside of it. Personally I have met autistic females who were very much concerned about their personal relationships, they really wanted to have friends and partners, to be loved and accepted, but they just didn't know how to make the rapport sometimes. Or they did know, they were very iniciative in making contact, but were little awkward afterwards. Or they functioned pretty well in social sphere, so much you wouldn't probably didn't even notice they were autistic, but this camouflaging was somehow draining for them and they needed to recover before able to function socially again. Some of them were trying to fit in and make themselves "normal", some of theme resigned with trying to do so, accepting themselves for who they were, other didn't bother to pretend something from the very beginning and just were themselves without any censorship. A lot of them genuinely cared for their friends, loved-ones, pets, were passionate about supporting global causes and issues in order to help fight injustice. And I also have met those who were full of hatered to other people outside the spectrum and didn't want to have anything in common with neurotypical population in general or were just perfectly happy with there interest and didn't really need anyone else in their lives nor they care so much about other people. I believe a lot of those is mainly defence mechanism - some autistic people in contrary to what is popular opinion have very strong inner feelings, they are sensitive to rejection and defensless in front of cruelty. They are more fragile in a sense. There were a study that autistic peopel are actually too much emphatetic - so much it's hurtful for them.

    To answer your question, I believe there are people on the spectrum who are ethical/feeler types, but they will probably look different than their neurotypical counterparts. This "autistic overlay" there will be allways present. I was thinking about that as having 16 MBTI/16 socionics types inside the autistic spectrum independently from types meant for "normal and healthy" population (but, where is the line between normal and not normal?).

    Btw. there is even "micro typology" for females on the spectrum - see Tania Marshall website if you are interested: https://taniaannmarshall.wordpress.c...me-in-females/
    And in terms of psychological diagnose there are also few distinguishable types, each of them with different manifestation in behaviour - active subtype, social-but-awkward type, rule subtype etc. (or at least there were these classifications while I was interested about this topic few years ago, but these things are changing quickly, so maybe they there are new terms for it altogether...), and I also think there are some of those more fitting with T attitude, some with S, some with F... But really, everything is possible, even inside the spectrum.
    Last edited by Sachmet; 02-12-2021 at 05:36 PM.

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    I think so.
    Most of my friends are neurodivergent and some of them are ethical. I think when in the womb, if the mother has high serotonin (or estrogen), this increases the likelihood of the child having autism.

    Ok I found something to support that:
    https://raypeatforum.com/community/t...-autism.30089/
    (high estrogen gives a baby face, by the way, you can usually visually tell someone's autistic, also estrogen increases copper and serotonin)

    I think ethics with autism can come off as logical types superficially, from a distance. Just because of increased social reticence (it is hard to find other autistic people to be friends with and who don't laugh at you, lol), but they will be altruistic/sensitive to the feelings of others (fi) and emotionally expressive/excitable (fe).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yesein View Post
    I think ethics with autism can come off as logical types superficially, from a distance. Just because of increased social reticence (it is hard to find other autistic people to be friends with and who don't laugh at you, lol), but they will be altruistic/sensitive to the feelings of others (fi) and emotionally expressive/excitable (fe).
    Agree. I think this also can work the other way around - when the logical type tries to fit in and camouflaging himself into more sociable acceptable according-to-(social)norm person and wilingly supressing his logical aproach in order to be more appropriate (eg. emotionally responsive and expressve, attentive to others...). When he does that around others a lot while at the same time not letting anyone to see their inner logical/thinking/detached/analytical... world behind the people-person mask, plus if this individual is somehow soft in expression or appearance, it's easy for others to mistaken this person as an ethical type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lolita View Post
    Yes. Being an ethical type doesn’t mean you’re incapable of logical abilities and being a logical type doesn’t mean you’re emotionally clogged up. It’s about differences in approaches and motivations. If anything, I think autistic types tend to be Fi leads if they’re ethical since they’re stuck in their inner world.
    Are you sure you are not describing your dual?
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    It is certainly possible.

    But I disagree that certain types are more autism prone than others. People who have a general idea of what autism is like are simply more likely to spot it in certain sociotypes. I think autistics who are introverts and/or 1D Fe are more likely to be recognized as autistic by common folk (and professionals, actually). It is also supposedly true that autistic females tend to be a bit different from autistic males in ways some of which make it harder to spot and diagnose them. Apparently many people find autistic traits to be of a more masculine nature, and so any present femininity can obscure autistic traits. Being people-oriented and emotive is a good example of this. Funnily enough, these “feminine” traits are quite Fe-ish, so I think being an extrovert and/or Fe ego type makes autism harder to spot.

    In my case, my creative Fe allows me to, to an extent, mask my autism more or less successfully when I need to. However, my strong introverted tendencies often give me away. I like to think, as incorrect as this probably is lol, that my Ti sort of “bleeds” or “leaks” into my other functions like Fe. I say this because even my Fe can be a bit dull unless I’m really going in on the theatrical side of Fe. I probably come across as ILI/LII to moat people . This made it hard to type myself by intertype relations because my supervisees were treating me like their conflictor. It turns out I am just their probably-too-polite-to-them autistic supervisor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeliMeat View Post
    It is certainly possible.

    But I disagree that certain types are more autism prone than others. People who have a general idea of what autism is like are simply more likely to spot it in certain sociotypes. I think autistics who are introverts and/or 1D Fe are more likely to be recognized as autistic by common folk (and professionals, actually). It is also supposedly true that autistic females tend to be a bit different from autistic males in ways some of which make it harder to spot and diagnose them. Apparently many people find autistic traits to be of a more masculine nature, and so any present femininity can obscure autistic traits. Being people-oriented and emotive is a good example of this. Funnily enough, these “feminine” traits are quite Fe-ish, so I think being an extrovert and/or Fe ego type makes autism harder to spot.

    In my case, my creative Fe allows me to, to an extent, mask my autism more or less successfully when I need to. However, my strong introverted tendencies often give me away. I like to think, as incorrect as this probably is lol, that my Ti sort of “bleeds” or “leaks” into my other functions like Fe. I say this because even my Fe can be a bit dull unless I’m really going in on the theatrical side of Fe. I probably come across as ILI/LII to moat people . This made it hard to type myself by intertype relations because my supervisees were treating me like their conflictor. It turns out I am just their probably-too-polite-to-them autistic supervisor.
    Would you also that professionals might try to diagnose troubled (1D Fe people or otherwise ostracized people) as autistic wrongfully?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chin Diaper 007 View Post
    Would you also that professionals might try to diagnose troubled (1D Fe people or otherwise ostracized people) as autistic wrongfully?
    I suppose that depends on the professional. A lot of people, even some professionals, are still stuck with a more classical understanding of autism. By that I mean the idea of autism that is often easily confused with lower dimensional Fe (mostly Asperger's syndrome), and leads to threads like like this lol. Supposing such people may often be wrongfully diagnosed is an interesting hypothetical, but I find it unlikely. The tests for the diagnosis process are pretty rigorous so, sort of like a driving test, a single crucial negative can mean you fail even among many other positives. However, it would not be surprising in the slightest if it were the case that such people are often referred to to get professionally tested for their 1D Fe idiosyncrasies, only for them to leave the test correctly undiagnosed in troves.

    Overall, I still think it is much more likely that Fe egos (and probably just as likely Se-doms now that I think about it) go wrongfully undiagnosed even after being tested. But that also depends on the profundity of the autism and acumen to adjust socially.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeliMeat View Post
    Overall, I still think it is much more likely that Fe egos (and probably just as likely Se-doms now that I think about it) go wrongfully undiagnosed even after being tested. But that also depends on the profundity of the autism and acumen to adjust socially.
    Yep. People say that I'm logical so I can't perceive things "weird". I myself got the schizotypal personality style diagnosis. It was very fitting cognitively.
    It really makes dissonance. Others: But you do not do new age stuff.
    Me: Yup but I have never told you my weird religious expriences that I shared to no one (I just perceive weirdly but I'm not in psychosis). Besides new agey stuff is communal hence it is even contradictory.

    [That said Gulenko's ILE profile is like directly from highly functional schizotypal life]
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    Schizotypal. Whoo. I was diagnosed with Aspergers, ADHD, and Schizoaffective. Still probably ILI by all the definitions of ILI or even possibly LIE.

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