What's your take on it.
Not the spiritual new age mumbo jumbo part but the "law" at its core.
What's your take on it.
Not the spiritual new age mumbo jumbo part but the "law" at its core.
If you see life and people as enemies, you treat them a certain way. Your action based on your belief changes how they interact with you. Stuff like that is important and overlooked.
ive always wanted to read those new age mumbo jumbo books like the secret or wtv it was, but never did. on the oher hand i dug onto the sciency aspects of cells, charges etc and super entanglement and in the end you go straight into quantum physics and that's the real mumbo jumbo... ye quantum says that matter is alive somehow, or as a famous guy said " the dream of a cell is to become 2 cells one day", and to do that... it has desires, attractions, and it can follow its call and become what it desires...
there are a lot of things missing in this post but i hope u can connect the dots
I do tend to think things can be imagined into being to some extent through focus mainly because the more one imagines something the more all the pathways leading in and out of it become clear, the more deeply one knows it, and eventually one may realize the emerging action paths that bring the imagined thing closer, and the closer it gets the more it starts to become real and reachable. People can probably be pretty intentional about this if they want to be, if they even know what they want. Really I would see not even knowing what one wants as being the more pertinent matter, as well as the potentially deceptive nature of desire.
That said, imagining or focusing on what one likes/wants can lead to numerous outcomes, many of which remain largely in the mind and don't connect with the outside world too strongly, although they may change one's way of interacting, one's minor choices, etc. and thus actually have an impact that ends up being noticeable after some time has passed, having led to a slightly different course than would have occurred otherwise. But there's an unpredictable element to this, and later one might look back after it's played out and notice the ways in which it didn't really lead to where one wanted (through this realizing what one wanted in the first place) because it wasn't rooted honestly enough in who one is and was really a "manifestation" of illusion or self-delusion from trying to fulfill what one needed in the wrong way. It won't necessarily be a mistake, it may be something one couldn't help, that it answered a question... but that would not necessarily mean it was worth its cost. There are just so many subtle ways to be foolish in life, and there is also really an extent to which a person (not being omniscient) can't know the full implications of whatever they are experimenting with inside themselves. If they could, then being human would be pretty dull since it's just sheer order and no chaos, complete predictability and linearity.
I find it interesting that the genie was used in the movie The Secret because genies in stories are always incredibly deceptive (and not necessarily because they are trying to be but due to how complex reality actually is) and the whole point of the story is often "be careful what you wish for." So it really is interesting to me that the 'law of attraction' is presented in such a straight-forward way as though one can just "ask the universe" for something and the universe will grant it, as though there is perfect clarity, as though one knows what they want in the first place, as though one cannot be deluded or misled by themselves, as though everything is so dreadfully linear. In this, it doesn't actually cover all the bases. It assumes desire alone is enough, that it cannot mislead, that it's always clear and straight-forward.
I agree more or less with this:
Okay, not so much with "all thoughts turn into things eventually" because I feel like that underestimates how thoughts really can just be in one's mind with little affect on anything outside of it... But still, I can see it loosely even so. There will be perhaps a scattering of minor things (for instance through how one's whims are affected) which end up creating a tributary (as mentioned before), and this can go along a spectrum from minor things to major things depending. But the rest I agree with because I mean being depressed all the time for instance feeds a worldview about how bad everything is, how hopeless, generating even more despair to dwell in, and so in that sense one has locked themselves into darkness (although it is not easy to leave). There are a lot of ways people forge their own fates, and they may have more power in this than they realize.In basic terms, all thoughts turn into things eventually. If you focus on negative doom and gloom you will remain under that cloud. If you focus on positive thoughts and have goals that you aim to achieve you will find a way to achieve them with massive action.
I don't believe, however, that I can "manifest" myself free parking spaces by "asking the universe," or free cups of coffee every morning, etc. That seems like a terrible interpretation of this "principle" as does expressing it as though "this is a great ancient secret NONE of you knew about, I bet NONE of you realized if you focus hard on a goal you might actually find a way to achieve it!" It seems a bit gimmicky. One doesn't need the genie to even do that.
ETA: I also tend to believe some circumstances are so limiting they will trap almost everyone who is in them (if not everyone) and that prayers will not save them. They may be aided in how they cope, but not with what they have to cope with. If there are pathways out, one will have to be one of the fortunate ones because the set-up will not allow that for everyone. However, that said, I wouldn't underestimate the collective power of people in such circumstances.
(quote taken from https://www.thelawofattraction.com/w...of-attraction/)
Last edited by marooned; 11-02-2020 at 12:20 AM.
I've heard the term applied to different things, so you'll have to be specific.
i'm fairly skeptical about this, not bc i don't think that water could be affected by things but i don't know what method is used or if it has been scrubbed effectively of bias and has been carefully conducted enough to weed out what is causal from what is random.
i'm also skeptical because i smell an agenda.
anyway, i do remember this was mentioned in The Secret.
i do tend to think that if very small particles are less subject to hard laws and can be affected by perceivers that is rather compelling... but what it means regarding human life is... less clear.
i mean, the argument is, see you are made of so much water and the water changes on the basis of your energy/intentions, therefore it is evidence of 'law of attraction genie' at work, and then... you can manifest yourself a free cup of coffee lol. a stranger will hand one to you with a very trustworthy smile.
Last edited by marooned; 11-02-2020 at 12:45 AM.
I think it's mostly a bullshit thing people use to scam vulnerable people into believing.
To be fair- it has some truth to it I guess but it depends on the context. Thoughts don't become things ((even when you think about them a lot)), although I think people who seek power and to be 'part of society' too much have a bad tendency to think that even though it's absolute bullshit to be honest. If my thoughts became things, the outside world would look A LOT differently lol. I mean it's true, you do have a vision of maybe a company you want to start to make money and you 'work for it' but there are all these other complicated things going on at the same time. How comfortable are you being with exploiting others for your own self-benefit, do you have the nature & right temperment for it, what do you realistically have to sacrifice or 'give up' to make this dream come true? It pays so much attention to the good but not enough to the shadow side.
It says the reason shitty things happen to you is you are a "vibrational match" to shitty things but the truth is that shitty things happen to good and positive people all the time. It harbors the annoying "just world" fallacy way too much. Being positive has nothing to do with it really because predators pick up on 'positivity' usually in order to knock you down. Avoiding the bad is a more complicated process, and you have to tap into some more Machellivain and real darker shit rather than just thinking you can flow to your desires being happy/pollyanna and aligned with it. That is absolutely ridiculous- what is more likely to happen you will just feel more hurt and humiliated all over again (and buy another self help book by Esther Hicks to compensate) which is exactly what they want you to do of course lol.
People don't feel like feeling sorry for anybody or actually genuinely help them because it's draining and we're all selfish assholes and we're all just busy with our own lives - but to just say to a cancer patient "You attracted this" is just kicking somebody when they are down and I don't think that sort of thing should be encouraged because it lacks compassion.
In my head I thought of a unicorn. then I drew one on paper. Then I tried to make it really good to sell to a publisher for money to make myself stronger. In my head I thought of a yellow ball and I kept thinking of a yellow ball day in and day out but nothing happened except for I neurotically thought of a yellow ball all day while everybody else was like "what are you doing weirdo, get a job." I envisioned myself as being a successful CEO company leader of yellow balls and I had a fantasy where I was respected for my yellow balls as they were made from natural trees that PC people really liked or something and gave me press conferences about, then IRL I remembered I have such a shy awkward personality and really don't like to 'schmooze' anybody and then I realized it was just a fantasy in my head after all... even though maybe the unicorn story was 'real.'
So sometimes thoughts become things, sometimes they don't- it's obviously complicated and yeah I didn't like the Secret simplifying it either lol. I know a friend that liked it and I'm not sure how 'good' it was for her, she gave me a hug and was nice and positive about it (and I like her too) but it was at a time in her life her outside world was kinda dark and negative. I think it sometimes gives us positive happy relief but I think in the end it's more beneficial to work ppl through the shadows than to just say 'think more positive things!' As the scammers themselves know it doesn't really work that way and they are just using it as a ploy to make $$$.
And I mean take for instance a really rich dude that has everything he wants in life and is living high but in reality is a horrible sexual predator and the authorities find out about this and he loses everything. He didn't attract the negativity- like how they would spin it, he really was positive and thinking happy thoughts that worked for him. So yeah it was pretty bullshit when Esther Hicks told this rich yuppie that visited her "you already have it all" when he asked her about the life beyond his stupid Te wealth.
I mean I know this is harsh and campy and probably too BnD ish but in my next post I will repost my "Law of Distraction" 16types Adventures story so you guys can see what she's really like in a fun and entertaining way lol.
None of you understand law of attraction at all.
It's not something you consciously will. You have zero control over it.
It's also not about perception malfunction or false beliefs. This is something medical science tells people because they haven't began to solve the hard problems of consciousness and they are operating under the paradigm of mechanistic universe.
Ester Hicks is a predator and a Charlatan.
The content of what she says by and large is true.
Somewhat true yeah of course, I admitted there was some truth to it. But 'by and large' is too big of a stretch to me, it has never been that way for me- I think when you really utilize it the way it's supposed to be, there's nothing really big and grand about it. It's another system of the universe interloped/checked and balanced with many other systems etc. In fact you realize that what the thing holding you back from the true positivity, the narcissism of it all instead of genuine positivity which tends to be more subtle, specific, less-vague and low key.
idk about “pure energy”, when it gets too mumbo jumbo-y i kind of stop reading and assume its bullshit
there is definitely something very real and tangible about affirmations, that stuffs my shit
not exactly Laws of Attraction, just good old self affirmation w/ a bit of magic
edit: One more useful note: I have found that affirmations work even if you don't believe they will work and don't put any faith in the process..I've had rather a number of readers ask me in recent months for tips on affirmations. Affirmations? Yes! ;-) Those were one of the standard working tools of the New Thought movement of the late 19th and early 20th centuries, and have been borrowed -- not always intelligently or productively -- by the New Age movement and pop psychology more recently. They've been neglected and, indeed, often derided by the more overtly magical end of contemporary pop culture. There's a rich irony here, because sigil magic -- currently one of the most fashionable methods in the avant-garde end of occultism -- is simply a variation on the same method.
Like most magical practices, affirmations make use of an ordinary human habit to get results that don't have to be ordinary at all. Most of us talk to ourselves in the privacy of our own heads, and that self-talk plays a large role in reinforcing our self-image and our views about the world. Very often, that works to our disadvantage. How often have you berated yourself inwardly in the wake of some failure or other, saying "Why am I so stupid?" or what have you. That reinforces a negative self-image and makes it more likely that you'll behave in ways that correspond to your conception of what "being stupid" amounts to.
The subconscious mind listens to such things. To a very real extent, it operates on the principle uttered by the Bellman in Lewis Carroll's madcap epic poem The Hunting of the Snark: "What I tell you three times is true." You can turn the same principle to your advantage by the simple expedient of working out something to repeat to yourself that moves you toward what you want in your life, rather than simply keeping you down in the doldrums.
You use affirmations by choosing a simple declarative sentence that expresses your goal and repeating it to yourself, over and over again, at least a hundred times a day -- yes, I mean that! -- and preferably more often, It's especially valuable to repeat an affirmation many times whenever you catch yourself getting into negative self-talk, but don't just do this; repeat it often, and then repeat it some more.
There are certain rules for affirmations I recommend, which we can modestly call the Seven Laws of Affirmation. Here they are:
1. Change yourself, not the world. The single most important cause of failure in affirmations comes from trying to get the world to cater to you, rather than adjusting yourself to face the world more successfully. You can say "Lots of money comes to me" all you want; the money isn't listening, and you'll simply talk your subconscious into expecting money that won't arrive, with bankruptcy as the usual result. (I've seen this happen many times.) Instead, use something like "I see opportunities to make money wherever I go." You will, too, and if you take advantage of those opportunities, the money will come.
2. Avoid the language of entitlement.For closely related reasons, avoid as you need not mere plague the kind of affirmation that starts "I deserve..." or that fixates on how wonderful or special you are. That sort of thing will simply make you vain, arrogant, and clueless. Choose something that motivates you to act and change, not something that inflates your ego and encourages you to sit on your precious pink rump contemplating your supposed wonderfulness.
3. Focus is a source of strength. Especially at first, don't try to change your whole life at once. Choose something specific, aim an affirmation squarely at that, and keep at it until you get results. Then go on to the next. For the same reasons, one or two affirmations at a time is enough. If you have a flotilla of different affirmations, none of them will get enough attention to matter.
4.Put affirmations in the present tense. For example, "I am strong" rather than "I will become strong." If you put something in the future tense, the results will always be in the future for you, never in the present; you'll always be traveling, never arriving. The one variation here is that if you want to be changing in a particular way, rather than arriving at a particular goal, you can use the imperfect tense -- "I am becoming" and so on. Emil Coue's famous affirmation "Every day, in every way, I am getting better and better" used this approach.
(Nearly everyone, when they encounter this rule, asks, "But what if the affirmation isn't true?" Of course it isn't true; if it was true, you wouldn't need an affirmation. An affirmation is a spell, not a simple statement of fact; put another way, it's a tool, not a truth. See rule #6 for getting around the discomfort that comes from knowing that you haven't achieved yet what your affirmation will bring you.)
5. Use positive language. For example, "I am strong" rather than "I am not weak." New Thought teachers used to say that the subconscious doesn't hear negative particles such as "not" and "no," so if you say "I am not weak" your subconscious hears "I am weak." More generally, affirm what you want, don't try to negate what you don't want. They're affirmations, after all!
6. Use your imagination. This is one of the things that most often gets left out of the formula, and explains many of the failures of the method. As you repeat the affirmation, imagine that it's true. If you're using the affirmation "I am strong" to try to build strength of body and mind, imagine yourself strong, in mind, in vitality, in muscle. Feel the potency of your will, the life force surging through your veins, muscles rippling in your limbs and torso. Imagine the emotional state, the overwhelming confidence of knowing that you're the biggest, strongest, toughest son of a gun in the whole county. You don't have to believe that this is true; imagine that it's true. The more vividly you imagine it, the sooner it will become true.
7. Keep at it! Affirmations take time to work. You're probably going to have to overcome the mental inertia of a lifetime of negative self-talk, and that won't happen instantly. Your subconscious mind will also very probably throw up roadblocks, trying to distract you from your affirmation or convince you that it won't work and you should go back to wallowing in misery instead. Ignore the distractions and keep at it, and the results will come.
A useful note: A lot of old-fashioned New Thought practitioners got very good results by doing two affirmations, one general and one specific. The general affirmation was done first thing in the morning: you get up, you go to a window (preferably open to fresh air), you stretch thoroughly, and then you breathe in and out twenty times or so, slowly and deeply, timing the repetition of your general affirmation to the rhythm of your breath. Then at other times of the day, you use your specific affirmation as often as you like. For example, there was a while when the general affirmation I was using -- once common in certain Druid circles -- went like this: (on the inbreath) "I am one with the One Life of the Universe;" (on the outbreath) "it flows through me to accomplish all my worthy desires." The specific affirmation then varied depending on circumstances. It worked well, too.
Another useful note: don't talk about your affirmations. "To know, to dare, to will, and to be silent" applies to this as to all magical practices. Talk about them and you diffuse your power. Remain silent and focused, and your power grows.
Imagination and repetition are much stronger than belief.
Last edited by Tzuyu; 11-02-2020 at 06:26 AM.
A story has it that there was that succesful LoA guru who said that you manifest only to realize that it won't make you happy, or sth like that.
Then again the process can get an overthinker/desirer to experience lack of internal turmoil without the use of drugs (because apparently one has to stop thinking about what they want/ act as if it has already manifested in order for it to manifest). Maybe experiencing such a state has value in and of itself and can set the foundation for deeper understanding (for anyone who needs it). We may have different parts in us that benefit from different approaches until integration occurs (more or less ) E.g. there is the LoA approach according to which you can get what you wish for and the nondual approach (the only name I know for it so far) that facilitates the understanding that the seeker is the sought/loving what is (see Katie Byron).
Last edited by Kalinoche buenanoche; 11-02-2020 at 07:13 PM.
The only thing about LOA that makes it work is the emphasis on positivity and optimism. I would not advise listening to subliminals, though.
Magick for normies/dummies.
Look no further than the Kyballion if you want the origin of what is called nowadays "the law of attraction". Specifically the Principle of Mentalism. Without the fluff, and without the annoying sense of fabricated positivity.
There are also several prominent scientists studying this phenomena. In the old days it would be known as divination, telepathy, "spooky action at a distance". There is finally a psychological component, via the pattern seeking mind.
I'm sure a lot of people here can relate to synchronicity and serendipity moments:
--Noticing the clock at 11:11 "coincidentally"
--Thinking about some song, and later noticing it comes on
--Meeting someone randomly in a coffee shop that "just happens" to be hiring for the job you want
I think *some* of it has to do with the RAS:
Our brains are incredibly complex. We can sift through billions of bits of data at any given time. And somehow, so we don’t short circuit, we have to organize that information. The Reticular Activating System helps with that.
The Reticular Activating System (RAS) is a bundle of nerves at our brainstem that filters out unnecessary information so the important stuff gets through.
The RAS is the reason you learn a new word and then start hearing it everywhere. It’s why you can tune out a crowd full of talking people, yet immediately snap to attention when someone says your name or something that at least sounds like it.
Your RAS takes what you focus on and creates a filter for it. It then sifts through the data and presents only the pieces that are important to you. All of this happens without you noticing, of course. The RAS programs itself to work in your favor without you actively doing anything. Pretty awesome, right?
In the same way, the RAS seeks information that validates your beliefs. It filters the world through the parameters you give it, and your beliefs shape those parameters. If you think you are bad at giving speeches, you probably will be. If you believe you work efficiently, you most likely do. The RAS helps you see what you want to see and in doing so, influences your actions.
Some people suggest that you can train your RAS by taking your subconscious thoughts and marrying them to your conscious thoughts. They call it “setting your intent.” This basically means that if you focus hard on your goals, your RAS will reveal the people, information and opportunities that help you achieve them.
If you care about positivity, for example, you will become more aware of and seek positivity. If you really want a pet turtle and set your intent on getting one, you’ll tune in to the right information that helps you do that.
When you look at it this way, The Law of Attraction doesn’t seem so mystical. Focus on the bad things and you will invite negativity into your life. Focus on the good things and they will come to you, because your brain is seeking them out. It’s not magic, it’s your Reticular Activating System influencing the world you see around you.
Articles and sketchy YouTube videos suggest many ways to train your RAS to get what you want, but I find this method to be the most practical:
1. First, think of the goal or situation you want to influence.
2. Now think about the experience or result you want to reach in regards to that goal/situation.
3. Create a mental movie of how you picture that goal/situation ideally turning out in the future. Notice the sounds, conversations, visuals and details of that mental movie. Replay it often in your head.
Of course, in reality these things aren’t as easy as they sound, but I do believe that our Reticular Activating System (RAS) can be trained. It’s about visualizing what we want, and then letting our subconscious and conscious work together to make it happen.
The idea is: If I can hear my own name in a crowd of thousands, can I also tune my brain to focus and attract the things that matter to me? I’m fairly certain I can. This is why I keep my Big List with me wherever I go, and reread it often. I have to continually refocus and remind my brain what matters and what doesn’t.
I think it is about withdrawal of projection. When we project we are not able to see the world for what it is, and projections tend to be self-fulfilling. If I see the world as dull and people as boring then I wont be willing to get to know them, or it might even be impossible and I will stay isolated and just giving more food for the projection.
And how can I deal with my own negativity if I only see it in other people?
From a type perspective it might have to do with the inferior function (see Jung).
The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.
(Jung on Si)
As much as I agree with both your ideas, I don't think it goes far enough. Synchronicity as literal physics is being theorized today. [consciousness changing via causal - acasual physical reality]
Dean Radin phd.
Its not all in your mind.
ESTj(?) chatting with INTj
I know not a single one of you all watch this, but I put it up anyway.
Another unusual INTj using Ti to explore law of attraction and coincidence.
I know I ranted about this a lot but I also wanted to say that,
If you go to a new situation all piss-y and negative and outwardly hostile- which doesn't just include being aggressive, mean and toxic yourself - but overly expecting other people will be that way to you first without any evidence of that - then yes your experience will most likely be unpleasant - because yes in a sense people do reap what they sow and the 'law' will work there fine as intended. But really, it's too blame-the-victimy because sometimes people are just sadistic and horrible cunts no matter how you act or what your mood is. It wants to just blame the victim because it doesn't have the balls, time or energy of truly stopping a perpetrator. And also if a person is naturally toxic or dark themselves the 'law' works a bit differently because bad things are reflected differently in a person that's toxic and narc as opposed to one that is empathetic.
It's kinda like a teacher or parent being harsher with their student/child that is more moral because they are the ones that will listen better to it whereas a truly toxic person just gets off on all fighting/arguing no matter what. That is part of why the world feels unfair if you are nice and kind lol.
And there is limits to the law and there is lots of other things that are happening around it. You're not just going to get everything being purely positive cuz like I said before that is just a way to make you naive prey to the wolves of the world. What happened more likely is that the 'victim' themselves learned how to better effectively manipulate and one-up the people that were giving them grief to begin with. Then that in turn, ironically made it so they could lighten up more - because they learned how to be sadists themselves and not victims lol. They just didn't really simply change their attitude about it to be purely positive because that is too pollyanna-ish, weak and naive. It's not marketed that way though - because it's too gritty and realistic for the sappy message they want to portray.
I think the core is pretty simple- like attracts like, birds of a feather flock together. I don’t think opposites actually attract but more like it wants to idealize and fantasize attraction of something so very different without understanding that if there’s no real common ground to fortify any bond, then there’s nothing to stand on.
The scientific and metaphysical claims behind the Law of Attraction are bogus and, at times, downright incoherent. For example, the idea that a thought will steer you toward a physical situation or object because the two (your thought and the physical thing) are similar to each other and like attracts like is wrong on one count and only partially true on the other. As far as like attracting like, this is decidedly untrue in many cases. For example, a pair of identical sheets of paper are unlikely to display the slightest degree of attraction to each other, and I am typically put off by people who are very similar to me rather than drawn toward them. And as far as thoughts being like objects, that's just bad metaphysics. Thoughts are immaterial, whereas objects are real. There is no sense in which they are like each other aside from the fact that they can have loosely similar effects on a subject (e.g. the thought of a flower can produce a somewhat similar experience, although one that is different in key respects, to a real flower). So if the law of attraction works at all--it may or it may not, I do not know for sure, although its obviousness as a possibility combined with the fact that few people practice it seems to be pretty good evidence that it doesn't work--it certainly isn't a result of the mechanisms described by the theory.
Type me here: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...nnaire-(Nunki)
You are told to keep your eyes on the road while driving.
You are told to look into the corner you are taking, rather than straight ahead.
You steer where you look.
This is LOA.
It is about mastery of the mind via emotional suggestion. The path to one's willpower, taken by the heart's desire. If you can direct your desires, you can control your mind. When you control your mind, you are empowered in your world. The outcome will match your desire, always. Be careful what you wish for.
I’m trying it again lol.
seem nonsense to me (I'm Te user). This is idealism?
Usually clash with IEIs because they believe in metaphysics too much