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Thread: Unexpected intertype relations

  1. #1
    Dating my conflictors Megatrop's Avatar
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    Default Unexpected intertype relations

    This is the thing:
    I have a ENTj friend who's just graduated from college (Law) and is into tech, videogames and mmorpg. He has difficulty finding love since I know him (I didn't give attention to it until I entered college, because I had lost hope and interest very early in life).
    He used to be very energetic and optimistic and he liked to take the lead. He got some rewards from intellectual competitions and he was very good at math even though he didn't care about getting good grades.. he would instead have fun playing mmorpg and reading technical stuff.

    Some of you know me already (I'm an IT guy, musician and idealistic romantic with a deep-rooted desire for dualization).

    So, after 2 years without seeing each other, we met with a few school friends. For some inexplicable reason, we always enter into very personal topics just after starting conversation. This time it was no different.

    So as we were the first people to arrive at the meeting, we spent some time talking and opening up and the more we talked, the more I realized how much the same were our life struggles. And it seemed that we were both going through the same life lessons.

    Here are a few things we shared in common and became evident during conversation:
    - We are both idealistic about finding a partner, and we can't help but avoid less than optimal relations
    - We are both idealistic about money. We want to be rich basically
    - We are both suffering of an impact with the out of school world, where academic intelligence isn't as relevant.
    - We both had some degree of dualization during college. And we have traumatically learned to appreciate other types of intelligence.
    - We are both getting pessimistic about life in general
    - We both have had health and motivation problems during college
    - We both struggle to understand how unethical and careless people survive (mentally and physically) in the world
    - We both have had the tendency to monopolize events and situations in everything we participate (like wanting to be responsible for too many things and leaving little space for people not to be dependent on us) and are learning to let people grow.

    So, basically, we seemed to match point to point every thing we did/felt/experienced and learned during these years. And when he told me about the lessons he had learned, it was something that only both of us had experienced compared to other people we know. In fact, we are very similar at this moment in life. He actually couldn't tell me anything I didn't know already from these last 2 years. It seemed like my Identical relations (I know a few identicals IRL). And we were strikingly similar and weak at the same spots in most life situations.

    On the other hand, I could still notice that we differ in our leading functions, because he's clearly Te leading (he even VI like one, even though I don't want to rely on it for now), and it becomes evident when we're interacting with other people, which surprises me and makes me feel dumb (in a good way).

    So by descriptions I could easily tell that we have a quasi-identity relation, but that would make me an ENTp, which I'm sure I'm not at this point.

    So I have a quasi-identity (for the most part) relation with a non-quasi-identical. It is probably a mixture of Quasi-I and Benefit, to be more accurate.


    Have you experienced Quasi-identity with someone who can't be one (he's a thinker, whereas I'm a feeler)?
    I like to teach others, even though I consider myself to be the most ignorant person alive.
    So if I impose my opinions on you, don't take them as arrogance. It's just that I have a strong willingness to share knowledge.

    The more we focus on something, the clearer it gets, but all the rest of the universe gets blurrier. This applies to our thoughts, emotions, feelings, senses, etc. A great part of living can be summarized as the development of the ability to switch our attention to different aspects of our reality in order to achieve that which we want to see as a completely new kind of reality.

  2. #2
    Adam Strange's Avatar
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    I have met a number of Quasi-Identicals and while half the time we can get along great, the rest of the time we're thinking that the other person is just a complete dickhead. We eventually end up separating and being glad of it. Also, after initially spending a few hours together, there is absolutely no desire to ever seek the other person out for any reason whatsoever.

    I think that your friend, rather than being a Quasi-Identical, is actually a Dual and you guys are matching on values, which is something that Quasi's definitely do not do.

    The way you talk about the guy and how you instantly fell into a close convo when meeting again after two years is exactly how I feel about my Duals. There is a deep bond there with easy compatibility, and it's something that I don't get from any other type.

    Still, I'm not here to battle type you, but rather to just share my experiences.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Megatrop View Post
    he didn't care about getting good grades..
    It's not common for J types to do not care about grades. As they want to know good what they study, as in other case they study something other.

    > We are both idealistic about finding a partner, and we can't help but avoid less than optimal relations

    Anyone wants good relations. The problems are in overesteemation of the pair choice, needed efforts, external factors. Often people are simply blinded by a passion and suppose they may adopt, but when a passion reduces - stays not much, as people did not become good friends. They stay together but without much of good feelings to each other.

    - We are both idealistic about money. We want to be rich basically

    accent on money relates to Se value. Si types mainly want "enough" to live good

    > - We are both suffering of an impact with the out of school world, where academic intelligence isn't as relevant

    "academic intelligence" is an advantage, may give a lot if it's used

    > - We are both getting pessimistic about life in general

    the perception depends on emotions which you have at now. you may live the same and to think it good, if you feel good there. good pair may give emotional support and if you have no it - you perceive the world darker than many others

    - We both struggle to understand how unethical and careless people survive (mentally and physically) in the world

    People near are a part of the life, while the perception is not objective as noticed above.

    > - We both have had the tendency to monopolize events and situations in everything we participate (like wanting to be responsible for too many things and leaving little space for people not to be dependent on us) and are learning to let people grow.

    The wish to control too much of details may relate to your possible LSI type. Mb your pal has S type.

    > So, basically, we seemed to match point to point every thing we did/felt/experienced and learned during these years.

    You may have more similar types, than you think. IEE is not your type, at least.

    > Have you experienced Quasi-identity with someone who can't be one

    what you describe more reminds mirror, identity, comparative
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

  4. #4
    Jo Lande's Avatar
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    Possible mistyping aside, the only thing I can think of is factors outside of Socionics. There have been studies that talk about how people relate more to others who are similar to themselves. Growing up in a similar community, culture, upbringing or social status can massively influence how well you get along with others, regardless of type. Judging by your post, Megatrop, I would say your similar life experiences helped you close the distance faster than would otherwise be the case.

    I can't speak for Quasi-Identicals since the only ILI I know well enough drives me up the wall too much for me to give an objective assessment, so I will just give two examples of intertype relations that differs from the norm.

    My one cousin who was a LII, rest his soul, reminded me of how terrible my life could've been. Like me, he was often in his head and very aloof, but always kind and polite around others even if he didn't really care. The few times I talked to him, he had such a bright an imaginative world. However, he was involved with the wrong crowd, dealing in drugs and getting involved with gangs. Despite this, he would spend most of his time resting in his car, but over time he became more and more withdrawn. He wouldn't eat or sleep or get up anymore. He hardly bothered to take care of himself before, but it was worse at that point. One day he just killed himself. Nobody knows what was going through his mind, though most speculate that pressure from the gangs got to him. To be honest, I was not the kindest person and looked down on him a lot whereas he saw me as a stuck-up rich girl who acts like she's white. If I were in his shoes, I wonder if I would've been any different than him. I'm privileged enough to have the finances to maintain my lazy lifestyle. If it weren't for that, I wouldn't have made it in the world.

    The second is also a cousin, though he is a SEE that comes from a Se-dominated family. His brother, an LSI, is the most stubborn little Napoleon I have ever met and we're always getting into arguments where neither will back down. His sister, an EIE, is a manipulative gossip who's always looking for, and creating, conflict so she can go snitch to her SLE mom. The two brothers are constantly at each other's throats with the sister goading them on and their mother always comes in to whack them both. Despite this, I strangely get along well with the SEE brother. He's about the same age as me, but he always respects me when I tell him to do something. He might not understand me when I get too deep into a topic, and we do have a lot of misunderstandings, but he never questions me and we agree on a lot of things. From a Socionics perspective, I can only think that maybe he got used to being Ti-whipped by his mother or he respects me too much to use his Se. Maybe he is a weird, Se-focused IEE, though he doesn't strike me as an intuitive. Too close-minded and obsessed with wealth and status. I think there are outside factors when it comes to this.

  5. #5
    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megatrop View Post

    So I have a quasi-identity (for the most part) relation with a non-quasi-identical. It is probably a mixture of Quasi-I and Benefit, to be more accurate.
    I don't really understand how you got to this conclusion. The ITR descriptions should always be read with the real experience of ITR in mind. Otherwise you're just gonna link it to irrelevant stuff.
    A true sense-perception certainly exists, but it always looks as though objects were not so much forcing their way into the subject in their own right as that the subject were seeing things quite differently, or saw quite other things than the rest of mankind. As a matter of fact, the subject perceives the same things as everybody else, only, he never stops at the purely objective effect, but concerns himself with the subjective perception released by the objective stimulus.
    (Jung on Si)


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    Dating my conflictors Megatrop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    I don't really understand how you got to this conclusion. The ITR descriptions should always be read with the real experience of ITR in mind. Otherwise you're just gonna link it to irrelevant stuff.
    We seem like identicals (same strong and weak spots and same energy levels) but I'm sure we're not, comparing to the ones I've met and compared to who he used to be in the past. I was basing on the fact that people could think we're the same type from a distance, based on how we are going through life and what we know and talk about. In fact, people describe me in real life like someone who's ILE, the ones who don't know my true essence.

    I could have compared to Identity too, but that is too unlikely to be the case.
    I like to teach others, even though I consider myself to be the most ignorant person alive.
    So if I impose my opinions on you, don't take them as arrogance. It's just that I have a strong willingness to share knowledge.

    The more we focus on something, the clearer it gets, but all the rest of the universe gets blurrier. This applies to our thoughts, emotions, feelings, senses, etc. A great part of living can be summarized as the development of the ability to switch our attention to different aspects of our reality in order to achieve that which we want to see as a completely new kind of reality.

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    Rebelondeck's Avatar
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    The best indicator of good inter-type relations is being able to work together without outside intervention on a common objective that is very important to both of you. Good communications and common goals or activities by themselves say nothing about achieving them as a team. I've seen so many seemingly close friendships at work go down the toilet after they were assigned to the same project. Even with straight-forward goals, I wouldn't put any money on an IEE-LIE pair without an arbiter in charge.

    a.k.a. I/O

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    Adam Strange's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    The best indicator of good inter-type relations is being able to work together without outside intervention on a common objective that is very important to both of you. Good communications and common goals or activities by themselves say nothing about achieving them as a team. I've seen so many seemingly close friendships at work go down the toilet after they were assigned to the same project. Even with straight-forward goals, I wouldn't put any money on an IEE-LIE pair without an arbiter in charge.

    a.k.a. I/O
    I really agree with the first sentence, @Rebelondeck. I think it borders on the profound.

    I also agree with the last sentence. I know (and like) a few IEE's, and I work with a couple of them, but I really want to put someone between us at work. I have no interest in trying to adjust myself to whatever it is that they need to get motivated.

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    Smilex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megatrop View Post
    This is the thing:
    Here are a few things we shared in common and became evident during conversation:
    - We are both idealistic about finding a partner, and we can't help but avoid less than optimal relations
    - We are both idealistic about money. We want to be rich basically
    - We are both suffering of an impact with the out of school world, where academic intelligence isn't as relevant.
    - We both had some degree of dualization during college. And we have traumatically learned to appreciate other types of intelligence.
    - We are both getting pessimistic about life in general
    - We both have had health and motivation problems during college
    - We both struggle to understand how unethical and careless people survive (mentally and physically) in the world
    - We both have had the tendency to monopolize events and situations in everything we participate (like wanting to be responsible for too many things and leaving little space for people not to be dependent on us) and are learning to let people grow.
    A technique I use with my patients is that I emphasize all the things that I know I have similar to the patient. If you know the types and how they actually work, you can pick any two types and point out the similarities.

    Here...
    - We are both idealistic about finding a partner, and we can't help but avoid less than optimal relations
    You both value the sphere of social relations 'Fi'. Is this weird? No. It is to be expected.

    - We are both idealistic about money. We want to be rich basically
    You both have gamma-delta attitudes. As expected.

    - We are both suffering of an impact with the out of school world, where academic intelligence isn't as relevant.
    Not socionics-related. If you train in one thing and the are measured with another, you're expected to have trouble. You share a common life experience. Good for you.

    - We both had some degree of dualization during college. And we have traumatically learned to appreciate other types of intelligence.
    Not socionics-related. Just a common life experience.

    - We are both getting pessimistic about life in general
    The normal state of mind of the gamma-delta extrovert.

    - We both have had health and motivation problems during college
    Health is not really strongly socionics-related in young people. Sickness starts to usually catch up with you as you age based on your life choices. Anyway, low internal motivation is again very expected of gamma-delta extroverts.

    - We both struggle to understand how unethical and careless people survive (mentally and physically) in the world
    Again, high appreciation of Fi.

    - We both have had the tendency to monopolize events and situations in everything we participate (like wanting to be responsible for too many things and leaving little space for people not to be dependent on us) and are learning to let people grow.
    Just two beings of extrovert temperament.

    There's no mystery here.

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