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Thread: Typology Random Thoughts

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    Te is the drive.

    Good explanation that i can hook into.



    A little better makes better more

    The good news in knowing you are wrong is you are right

    When slicing the pie, 22 over 7 is your true bread from heaven

    To experience is simple, to explain is divine



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    A copy of my thoughts about meaning of peoples' traits and their intentional actions in establishing good friendship relations, love in a pair.
    I see sometimes is over-accented 1st or 2nd part. Influence both significantly.
    You have some better possibility to control what you do being in pair relations, though your resources have limits. Than to have a wider variety of people, 1) who you may know good enough to evaluate their friendship possibility, and 2) who are available to make a pair.
    Strict aim on duality is reasonable in ages common for making pairs <25 yo. When people have no stable pairs, have more resources for new communications. Mb it's possibly to simplify by typology services and meetings sites.
    When you'll get an interest to someone, - try to become good friends before thinking to become a pair. During some monthes evaluate how is it easy and how good you both feel, how good may cooperate in this kind of relations. Then you'll more correctly understand long-time perspective being in a pair with this human.

    =
    Love/friendship is a state of being united with other human in one. By minds and lifes, where interests and deals of other human are perceived and cared same as your own. It's same what parrents feel to own children, except in a pair additionally exists sexual attraction to born children and both people are equal in caring about each other (while a parrent has more abbilities). In this state people are accented on "we" and not on "me". This state can be in more or lesser degree. Love state helps to feel emotionally pleasant and inspired for activity. Arises productivity of pair cooperations. Makes sexual attraction higher, especially after a time, when without good friendship this strongly reduces after ~3 years. Gives people higher possibilty to exchange by skills and knowledge, to make both wiser.

    Partly love state is a "choice" - the result of intentional efforts to tune to other human in a compassion, to know what he needs and to care about his interests, to help him in he deals, for making him happier.
    And partly love depends on what traits you and other human have. There is significant difference in people, which leads with who for you to have love state easier and harder. When in friendship relations you are feeling lesser of pleasant and need to do more efforts, - those are harder. Some of these traits are general and some are specific for 2 people. There are traits which predispose or oppose a human to be good friend for you, what supposes to care good about your interests from his side, what should be mutual for the stability and usefulness of relations. To some degree friendship possibility you may evaluate by initial sympathy to a human, by intuition and instincts, by what good and useful for you see in him. But more meaningful is what you are feeling in factual relations, - how much your perceive each other a equal parts of a pair, how happy and strong feel in it.
    An example of specific traits for 2 people are Jung types. Where good IR make easier to establish good friendship, and also are harder IR. For good friendship other human should be able to help you where you need it more, hence he should be strong there. And should to have similar preferences in life values, to like the same. Duality IR give the most of this. In worse IR both will need more efforts to get and do comparable usefulness, may feel negative effects of IR.
    Example of general trait is other human intelligence, the optimum of which is close to own (much higher adds a risk to reduce relations stability). If a human has too low intelligence - he'll care worse about your interests, will be worse useful in cooperations; hence you'll be feeling worse in relations and for you will be harder to have a wish to care about him in return, also he'd worse may use usefulness of what you do for him. If a human has higher egocentrism (individualism), - by biology and external influence - he'll care worse about you and you'll feel worse, it will be harder to establish good friendship with him, where both would feel good enough. Egocentrism is higher in today mass culture which is based on individualistic and competing ideology of capitalism; on supporting of negative, lesser trustful, redundantly aggressive perception and relations with other people. People have lesser correct understanding and worse initial abbility to be good friends, to feel love. They affraid to interact more, to be honest and open, to trust, they easy lie and hurt without good reasons, have lower compassion to needs of others. It should be hard to establish love state in today culture, even when a human is easy by many traits for good friendship.
    =
    Last edited by Sol; 11-24-2023 at 01:54 PM.

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    I like interacting with ENFJs. At least the ones I know. We are on the same wavelength.

    I don't know any men in the type. At least I haven't identified them as of yet.



    A little better makes better more

    The good news in knowing you are wrong is you are right

    When slicing the pie, 22 over 7 is your true bread from heaven

    To experience is simple, to explain is divine



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    That stupid Gulenko Socionics test types me LSI 80% of the time, and ILI the other 20% of the time (this test)

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    I don't think I'll ever fully relate to any Sociotype lol. I know most people can't 100% relate to any Sociotype because we're all more than just labels, but I honestly don't relate to any element/function as a base element. Surprise surprise, amirite

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuno View Post
    That stupid Gulenko Socionics test types me LSI 80% of the time, and ILI the other 20% of the time (this test)
    I'm happy to announce that out of the very many online tests I've taken I've never gotten a single S type.
    [Today 03:36 AM] anotherperson: this forum feels like the edge of the internet

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    Same here. I made somewhere between 30 and 40 tests and had not a single result as sensing type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HolyKnowing View Post
    I'm happy to announce that out of the very many online tests I've taken I've never gotten a single S type.
    I usually get typed EII by tests, by like 80-90% of them, and the other 10% tend to type me SEI or ESI. I don’t really care about being an S or N type, but a LOGICAL type??????? No…

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuno View Post
    I usually get typed EII by tests, by like 80-90% of them, and the other 10% tend to type me SEI or ESI. I don’t really care about being an S or N type, but a LOGICAL type??????? No…
    What about IEE?


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    Quote Originally Posted by necrosebud View Post
    What about IEE?
    Sometimes IEE appears as a second option, but I’ve never been typed IEE by any Socionics test, nor have I ever been typed ENFP by any cognitive functions test. I know that my weakest function (according to tests) is Se. I can’t see myself being EII though

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuno View Post
    Sometimes IEE appears as a second option, but I’ve never been typed IEE by any Socionics test, nor have I ever been typed ENFP by any cognitive functions test. I know that my weakest function (according to tests) is Se. I can’t see myself being EII though
    what do you think of IEE for yourself?


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    Quote Originally Posted by necrosebud View Post
    what do you think of IEE for yourself?
    I have an IEE coworker who fits the Sociotype.com IEE description 100%, and I get along with her extremely well, but there’s a very obvious difference between her and me when we do things. Her presence is more powerful and outgoing than mine, and she quite literally always has new ideas running through her head, and she’s always talking about them with others to see what they think.

    I know she might be an extreme example, but I don’t really relate to that very much. It’s not like I schedule everything I do, but my life has a calm routine to it. I’m also noticeably calmer and softer when I do things—sometimes even shy and nervous. I do have some ideas running through my head and I like to “vent them out,” but I still don’t think my Ne comes out that much.

    I teach art, so it’s a little embarrassing. I’m very good at giving students technical advice… like, how to improve the human anatomy or the shading in an artwork, for example; but when it comes to coming up with new ideas for an artwork, I can never quickly come up with ideas unless someone else helps me. Therefore I always have to start prodding my student for ideas so we can then brainstorm a concept together.

    My IEE coworker though… she’s got ideas bursting through her like a waterfall. So amazing.

    Btw you strike me as the quintessential EII

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    “When logic and proportion
    Have fallen sloppy dead
    And the White Knight is talking backwards
    And the Red Queen's off with her head
    Remember what the dormouse said
    Feed your head” ― Gulenko

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    Quote Originally Posted by Socionics Is Not A Cult View Post
    “When logic and proportion
    Have fallen sloppy dead
    And the White Knight is talking backwards
    And the Red Queen's off with her head
    Remember what the dormouse said
    Feed your head” ― Gulenko
    "The king must die so that socionics can live."
    my ideas about socionics:

    https://soziotypen.de/thoughts-on-socionics/

    the section will be updated ever other month or so

    https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...-(IEI-edition)

    this is a VI thread with IEI examples

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    Quote Originally Posted by Socionics Is Not A Cult View Post
    “When logic and proportion
    Have fallen sloppy dead
    And the White Knight is talking backwards
    And the Red Queen's off with her head
    Remember what the dormouse said
    Feed your head” ― Gulenko
    All this time I thought she was saying “remember what the doorknob said”

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    @Sol Do you only love Delta women or do you love women from any Quadra?? Because I like men from any Quadra; I can’t say I have much preference.

    edit: I’m not particularly close to a lot of men but all the men I get along with best are usually Beta STs, Alphas, and Delta STs. Gammas might scare me a little, now that I think of it

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    “Socionics is merely the continuation of politics by other means.” ― Gulenko

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuno View Post
    Do you only love Delta women or do you love women from any Quadra?
    Jung type are not strict dependency for this, but a predisposition. In me and in general.

    Jung type/IR is 1 of factors for the abbility to make close friendship cooperation, where with duals it's easier than with other types. You may to feel love to any human (compassion, unconditional acceptance, attitude to care about interests of other one as about yourself), but to support relations according to this feelings will be easier or harder depending of IR. Alike you have same strong/weak function and want to care in this region about other human, but your skills are objectively not good and you need to do more efforts for same result than would be in better IR, so you'll care worse or will feel worse being exhausted (in 1st case you'll feel worse too, as the return relation will be worse).
    Then, a human can be liked for different traits related to friendship and those help to have better friendship. In some cases those traits may overweight IR and a human with worse IR can fit better friendship abbilities. For example, a human having much lower IQ will be harder to cooperate with, hence you'll feel worse.

    About IR and quadras. The common approach for good IR is supplementing functions, which exist with types of 3 quadras. Good IR: duality, activation, semiduality. Neutral closer to good: mirage. Relatively negative: orderer, suborderie.
    Other types may have own relative advantage. For example, activation has same E/I and this trait in them is lesser pleasant than in conflictors. If you'll try to be close friends - activators will be better by overal types traits. But in some situations a conflictor mb be prefered, alike when you'd want lesser talky and loud human near.

    If to talk about preferences in people of other sex, - then this is also linked with physical traits. Most people are good from this point, but it's possibly to imagine when sometimes sexual charm overwheights better IR. Mb even after years of relations.

    > Because I like men from any Quadra; I can’t say I have much preference

    To notice better difference of IR effects may need to have better typing accuracy.
    Then the influence of IR will be more - the more of personal attraction and sympathy you expect to feel, to feel more energized and having more inner harmony in interactions, the more you try to be close friends and tune to other human with a compassion. While with surface approach you accent on physical/sexual, not personal part where IR influence.

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    are you supposed to get psychologically scarred or suppressed when you spend too much time around the opposite quadra? Especially if you are outnumbered?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Socionics Is Not A Cult View Post
    “When logic and proportion
    Have fallen sloppy dead
    And the White Knight is talking backwards
    And the Red Queen's off with her head
    Remember what the dormouse said
    Feed your head” ― Gulenko
    Racist.

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    What helps me form some stability to be grounded or *staked, is just reviewing what happened yesterday. Like here on the forum, i'll look back at my wall and see what transpired and reflect. I've always felt a certain memory is weak and it is hard to back diary as i call it in 1st person experience. It's more an over the top recollection, detached.

    I've always said yesterday is yesterday, and the day before is .....?. It forms an historical presence to connect with.

    * pivoting points in identity



    A little better makes better more

    The good news in knowing you are wrong is you are right

    When slicing the pie, 22 over 7 is your true bread from heaven

    To experience is simple, to explain is divine



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    Negative IR effects should be lesser with lesser accented functional attention and lesser accented Jung type.
    Influence on weak nonvalued function has 2 parts: 1) arising attention to weak function, 2) negative IR effects as function's side is nonvalued.
    If the attention on weak function is strong enough, then small functional balance significantly would reduce IR effects, including of negative IR. While positive effect of arised weak function presence in the consciousness would be kept.
    It's possibly to suppose that negative/positive IR effects in the sense of complimenting/opposing functions should exist meaningfully only until some level of weak function activation. That the devision on positive/negative IR is appropriate only at not high level of weak function activation. 4 types which have both opposite by strenght functions, which in common are related to principally different sides of being pleasant or harder to deal with, after some point of weak functions activation should noticably reduce this difference between them and after some stronger level of activation to loose this difference as meaningful.

    In application to marriage pairs, it's supposed that people establish friendship relations. What supposes deep compassion when minds contents and lifes of two people become as joined. In such conditions information exchange and personality traits influence become the most intensive. Where function strenght is different, the weaker functions of both become more activated. With deeper compassion joining the activation of own weak function develops to level comparable in other human. This process reduces Jung type accentuation and hence IR effects related to the devision on complementing/opposing functions variants.

    Hypothetical method which tune consciousness on deeper love state should improve compassion level in pairs, by what arise the activation of weaker functions when those are strong at other human.
    On initial stages the arised information exchange will arise negative IR effects. After some time, with the reduction of Jung type accentuation, negative effects of IR will start to reduce and later may become not meaningful. Quicker deep compassion level will be developed - easier the process will be completed.
    This can be a way solve bad IR problems in pairs with types of opposite functional clubs.
    In such process as positive factors will be: 1) reduced Jung type, 2) improved skills in weak functions, 3) positive emotions and better cooperation with being in friendship pair of love state.
    For types having some of functions of same strenght, the process will be limited to functions differing by strenght. For all types will be 3rd positive factor.

    Love may win against negative IR.

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    My favorite quadra is probably the Gamma quadra. I'm very fond of ILIs, SEEs, and ESIs.

    Although I might get along very well with some Beta quadra people such as IEIs and SLEs, but I find myself admiring the Gamma quadra people. They're similar to me yet different from me at the same time, how admirable!

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    Last week, I randomly met two female LIEs. One was a bank manager, the other worked as a cashier in a health food store while getting an Economics degree from the U of Michigan.

    Prior to that, IIRC, in June, 2014, I met a female LIE who manages a division of General Electric, and I met a female LIE University professor in Lansing in Aug, 2020.

    They really are rare.

    For the entertainment of the male ESIs out there, here are a couple female LIEs on Youtube.





    For the record, female LIEs all look alike to me. They all look hard, even when they are looking hot.

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    I just argued with an LSI who thinks he's SLI

    Te ignoring Fe seeking moron.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chriscorey View Post
    I just argued with an LSI who thinks he's SLI

    Te ignoring Fe seeking moron.
    Who was it?



    A little better makes better more

    The good news in knowing you are wrong is you are right

    When slicing the pie, 22 over 7 is your true bread from heaven

    To experience is simple, to explain is divine



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    Yeah I gotta throw out the idea of me being 1F for good. I think I’m SEI but neither 1F nor 2F fit me. No description of 1F nor 2F fit me at all, and I can’t really go through mental hoops trying to make it make sense anymore. I’m definitely either 3F or 4F

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuno View Post
    Yeah I gotta throw out the idea of me being 1F for good. I think I’m SEI but neither 1F nor 2F fit me. No description of 1F nor 2F fit me at all, and I can’t really go through mental hoops trying to make it make sense anymore. I’m definitely either 3F or 4F
    I type myself FLEV. I always want to decide on the physical aspects of my life. I always have comments about how something looks and feels specially when it comes to my environment, and I never listen to any comment about how I should dress/arrange things lol. When it's about something material that I want I just light up and get it, I can never not be comfortable in the way I want. I type intuitive though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by one View Post
    I type myself FLEV. I always want to decide on the physical aspects of my life. I always have comments about how something looks and feels specially when it comes to my environment, and I never listen to any comment about how I should dress/arrange things lol. When it's about something material that I want I just light up and get it, I can never not be comfortable in the way I want. I type intuitive though.
    Your posts DEFINITELY strike me as 1F. You seem to enjoy partaking in all that the physical world has to offer, including food, money/finances, physical possessions, luxuries, etc. I really admire 1F and 2F people. They have ease in areas that I’m always trying to understand better as I continue my life. It’s strange that I should be so unfamiliar, anxious, and helpless when it comes to the world around me. I always wonder how this happened to me lol.

    3 people on another website have typed me as FEVL and I cannot for the life of me understand why! Especially considering that FEVLs are considered very physically forceful… like no!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuno View Post
    Your posts DEFINITELY strike me as 1F. You seem to enjoy partaking in all that the physical world has to offer, including food, money/finances, physical possessions, luxuries, etc. I really admire 1F and 2F people. They have ease in areas that I’m always trying to understand better as I continue my life. It’s strange that I should be so unfamiliar, anxious, and helpless when it comes to the world around me. I always wonder how this happened to me lol.

    3 people on another website have typed me as FEVL and I cannot for the life of me understand why! Especially considering that FEVLs are considered very physically forceful… like no!!
    What type are you considering as of the moment?

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    It looks like high agreeable Big 5 thinking types move into these empathy - sympathy feeling zones with a lower threshold trigger, meaning they get here quicker in the presence of others. That's the qualifier: high agreeable behavior in the presence of others. I.e., no personal investment into it, they are still egocentric by nature, they never write books about it.

    The flip-side in the F department and low agreeableness is having the feeling ego of human relations in the forefront, the color of ethics, but acting skeptical and calculating. It is like a melding of T & F halves in both example types. It is as if the knowledge of it is there in full sophistication of all the F terms, but the actual feeling may not be there mobilizing them.

    If the feeling were there, they should be agreeable in output in the usual sense, you'd think, hence there must be a vacuum in here in the head space.

    Seems oxymoron contradicted.



    A little better makes better more

    The good news in knowing you are wrong is you are right

    When slicing the pie, 22 over 7 is your true bread from heaven

    To experience is simple, to explain is divine



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    Quote Originally Posted by one View Post
    What type are you considering as of the moment?
    If I’m being honest, I’m not sure, but I always come back to ELFV.

    A few tests (2 in-depth tests, in particular) type me as FEVL often, but their results indicate that my Physics placement is rather ambiguous, so I don’t know how much I should believe these results. I’m starting to think PY is really not worth the trouble if I’m apparently such a weird case. Maybe I should just pick one type that I think fits me best and move on, instead of finding the “perfect” type for me

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    I mean, I can't be E9 core after being diagnosed with "Anxiety Disorder" severe that is.
    So let my Enneagram self-typing be consistent with that diagnosis and give myself an E6 core type (for now..) !







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    Quote Originally Posted by godslave View Post
    I mean, I can't be E9 core after being diagnosed with "Anxiety Disorder" severe that is.
    So let my Enneagram self-typing be consistent with that diagnosis and give myself an E6 core type (for now..) !






    Not gonna lie, you’ve always struck me as a head Enneagram type, probably sp6. But that was just my vibe! You know yourself better than me hehe

    Edit: Love that gif by the way

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    Quote Originally Posted by godslave View Post
    I mean, I can't be E9 core after being diagnosed with "Anxiety Disorder" severe that is.
    So let my Enneagram self-typing be consistent with that diagnosis and give myself an E6 core type (for now..) !


    < snip>



    Good news it wasn't anything worse. Like you were speculating at one time.

    Last edited by Expansion; 12-02-2023 at 03:42 AM.



    A little better makes better more

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuno View Post
    Not gonna lie, you’ve always struck me as a head Enneagram type, probably sp6. But that was just my vibe! You know yourself better than me hehe

    Edit: Love that gif by the way
    Thank you very much Kuno ! I've always thought that 6 might be my core type, in fact I've mentioned somewhere in this forum that I was not quite sure about the 9 typing. Anyway, SP6 and 694 trifix makes sense. Even if when push comes to shove...




    I discovered, thanks to this forum, that I like making funny gifs ! I'm glad you like it too !

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    In line with the topic of enneagram subtypes, I’m going with @necrosebud 's method of typing, where you first figure out the core enneatype you identify with and later the instincts you identify with. The Naranjo inspired method of finding your instincts is not helping me. I’m either so/sp or sp/so, but I think I relate more to so/sp, so therefore I am so/sp 9w1

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expansion View Post
    Good news it wasn't anything worse. Like you were speculating at one time.

    Thanks Expansion ! Yes, I was speculating a lot !

    I probably have some psychological comorbities though. I haven't exposed the whole book of my life to my shrink. I've highlighted some significant events, however I only vaguely alluded to "serious traumas" without any other details.
    Lack is the Muse of all Poets

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuno View Post
    In line with the topic of enneagram subtypes, I’m going with @necrosebud 's method of typing, where you first figure out the core enneatype you identify with and later the instincts you identify with. The Naranjo inspired method of finding your instincts is not helping me. I’m either so/sp or sp/so, but I think I relate more to so/sp, so therefore I am so/sp 9w1
    I know there's diff overarching 'theories' perhaps or so they might be represented wrt the instinct but I kinda approach them as approximating a similar underlying idea

    one-to-one makes sense when you have 'laser focused intensity' ie it is an energetic orientation that permeates general behavior not just interpersonal orientation, which makes sense when you look at it as "(romantic)pair bonding" bc that's kind of natural focus of control for the sexual instinct, "us against the world" sort of idea. And yeah idk if Naranjo's are indeed meant to be "archetypes" (which is like an overarching stereotype, the most exaggerated obvious or typical representation - if that is what archetype is) I kind of don't think it is necessarily the same as real world people and their personality, and differences may not necessarily just be accounted for by something as like health level for example

    but then I also like and prefer the sort of approach where you can see where each aspects applies to you bc again amalgamation and not an archetype and also dynamically changing personality, potentially perception of self but with a hopefully static "I"

    all that is to say (people like to discredit it lol but) your fixes and other aspects of your personaloity determine the overall and so one sx 4 might not be anything like another sx 4, they may have some similarities - say intense comparison (in the sense of desirability) with others (over literally the smallest triggers - he looked at another with what might be romantic interest, and you are also interested in him (would cause me dissociation from the pain and fear it evoked when I was an adolescent, and I am not exaggerating), flirted with her, maybe she has some things that make her attractive (beyond just looks, could also be talent) and you assume you are 'repulsive', doesn't seem to want to get as close to you or even think about you as you do him ) for sexual 4s and (when not particularly healthy or when characteristically 4ish) "coming up short" and some intense self loathing following that. But that doesn't mean one is "competitive" or wants to "best others" some 4s can be more defeatist there is also an involuntary aspect to sx that we are very aware of

    oky I am rambling I will end it here


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    Quote Originally Posted by necrosebud View Post
    I know there's diff overarching 'theories' perhaps or so they might be represented wrt the instinct but I kinda approach them as approximating a similar underlying idea

    one-to-one makes sense when you have 'laser focused intensity' ie it is an energetic orientation that permeates general behavior not just interpersonal orientation, which makes sense when you look at it as "(romantic)pair bonding" bc that's kind of natural focus of control for the sexual instinct, "us against the world" sort of idea. And yeah idk if Naranjo's are indeed meant to be "archetypes" (which is like an overarching stereotype, the most exaggerated obvious or typical representation - if that is what archetype is) I kind of don't think it is necessarily the same as real world people and their personality, and differences may not necessarily just be accounted for by something as like health level for example

    but then I also like and prefer the sort of approach where you can see where each aspects applies to you bc again amalgamation and not an archetype and also dynamically changing personality, potentially perception of self but with a hopefully static "I"

    all that is to say (people like to discredit it lol but) your fixes and other aspects of your personaloity determine the overall and so one sx 4 might not be anything like another sx 4, they may have some similarities - say intense comparison (in the sense of desirability) with others (over literally the smallest triggers - he looked at another with what might be romantic interest, and you are also interested in him (would cause me dissociation from the pain and fear it evoked when I was an adolescent, and I am not exaggerating), flirted with her, maybe she has some things that make her attractive (beyond just looks, could also be talent) and you assume you are 'repulsive', doesn't seem to want to get as close to you or even think about you as you do him ) for sexual 4s and (when not particularly healthy or when characteristically 4ish) "coming up short" and some intense self loathing following that. But that doesn't mean one is "competitive" or wants to "best others" some 4s can be more defeatist there is also an involuntary aspect to sx that we are very aware of

    oky I am rambling I will end it here
    Don’t worry, I always enjoy your rambling even if I don’t always have a lot to say in response, because I feel like your statements can be pretty self-explanatory, since you thoroughly articulate all your thoughts and leave no stone unturned, no loose ends. Very 2L of you, haha.

    I think that typing by way of archetypes, which I also think is a very exaggerated representation, isn’t very helpful because most people are not archetypes and are more complex than that. The natural complexity of human personality is also why I think typology shouldn’t be taken TOO seriously, although sometimes I almost do that myself.

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