Money - or 'Te' - Does Anyone Else Identify?
Does anyone else here identify with me about this:
I gamble; I bet on sports games; I like to win money at poker; I would love to be a millionaire or win the lottery; I therefore really enjoy money - BUT - the 'business logic' - i.e., banking, accounting, finance, entrepreneurship side of things is really quite dry, and I don't really enjoy it or identify with it..
Anyone else identify?
???
Last edited by jason_m; 06-10-2019 at 07:15 PM.
I think liking money and disliking paperwork is the norm?
It is dry though. Being an entrepreneur can be fun though, depending on what you're doing. But I love to predict what's going to make money in the stock market. I recently bought a lot of Tesla stock after it dropped ~33%. I think their demand will come and they'll figure out how to cut overhead costs and it'll all be okay. Guess I'll see in a year or two.
Androgynous Robot Dreamer - Not really human, but good at pretending.
Originally Posted by Number 9 large
I like the idea of having money, just so that I can spend more. I like the idea of the exchange of money for goods and services. The power of deciding which charities/parties get the biggest donations. The security of not having to worry about those pesky outliers like potential family illness and other kinds of disasters.
More than hard work I appreciate gains with the least amount of effort.
They're nice fantasies. But I don't act on those desires.
Planning ahead (with stock markets etc) so I never need to worry about the future is a contradiction.
Working harder now so I don't need to work in the future is equally insane.
I don't gamble because I know no long term good can come of it.
At the end of the day, the best time to start enjoying the present is now.
Part of me worries that if through some miracle I won a fortune, I'd be less happy because I'd feel obliged to dedicate the rest of my life to manaing it. And that's no way to live. 😟
I like the idea of having more money in order to create stuff with it (=more work).. and many people might see it as very counter-intuitive but that is the way I roll.
As for gambling no way. Probability... However you can cash in by creating betting bots (like in sports) that work in confines of probabilities... and save yourself from hard work.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
I dislike gambling and the "business side" but I wouldn't mind winning the lottery.
I know Te types are really good at finding what WORKS in the real world; this applies to making money.
I think a survey said ENTJs are often the richest
INFPs are the poorest (sorry guys lol)
I’ve never gambled or have felt like it. But I like money because it makes me feel more secure and I can buy stuff I like with it lol
As far as the business side, I feel like accounting as a career would be a slow death for me. It’s one of the ones I find least appealing.
Last edited by Aster; 06-10-2019 at 09:05 PM.
Im not willing to take strong risks like gambling for money. Entrepreneurship is better, but eh, I'd want a pretty sure bet and a backup plan.
I work in a bank desk job lol, and accounting kind of stuff is in my skillset, which makes me feel good wrt competence and productivity if not, you know, thrills. But I'm talking about organization and efficiency... not math. Math is a weak point...
Of course I like money, but I have a more slow and steady if not very exciting thing going on.
money - Se
I am the opposite: give me analytics, economics, or actuarial science and I can work wonders; now give me clerical/office-esque types of work, and I stink it up like crazy...
No, I don't really identify with those things at all.
I don't gamble, I don't bet on sports games, I don't like to play poker, and I never wanted to be a millionaire.
I did want to win the lottery, but that is kind of a fairy tale.
I enjoy money to the extent that it makes my life easier in some ways. For example, I can usually pay my bills without sweating and I can hire people to do work that I don't want to do. I can also buy toys if I want, but I almost never want.
I don't really like accounting beyond seeing the bottom line, which tells me how I'm doing and if I have any extra cash that month. If I do have extra, I usually just reinvest it because I don't buy very much stuff. I live in a small house in a quiet neighborhood and drive a three-year old Honda. It was the first car I bought that was less than ten years old. I don't have a TV and don't listen to the radio. I get movies from the library and I don't buy much food, because I eat almost every meal in restaurants because I travel a lot and I suck at cooking.
The entrepreneurial side of things is interesting, not for the purpose of making money, but rather for the purpose of doing something new and interesting.
When I had no money and no easy way to get more of it, I would do a lot of things myself, like rewire my house or repair the engine in my car. However, I'm now in a position where I'm making more than electricians and mechanics and it has made me very aware of the time value of money. Now I almost always prefer to pay a professional to do stuff that I could do if I had to, but that I might not want to.
I actually have my own formula: I like the Detroit Tigers, but they never win. Therefore, step 1. is to bet against the Tigers. Step 2.: I subscribe to Sportsline for $10 a month. They have a good data scientist there. I just use what I think is his best pick for option 2. I then go to my local casino and place 2 bets for $2. (The minimum amount and number you can bet).
- Now, because the Tigers often lose, I get compensated for betting against them.
- Also, I used to spend hundreds of dollars on popular science books - at a much faster rate than I would read. I now just buy what I can read. (E.g., one book per week.) And I actually save money, because I only bet about $14 per week - some of which I win back.
- So: about -$30 per week on sports betting and books (-$10 on betting and -$20 on books) vs. -$100 on books, and it actually gives me some incentive to watch the Tigers games (now rooting against them, but still happy when they win...)
Last edited by jason_m; 06-10-2019 at 10:28 PM.
Gambling is one more addiction that causes people to waste their lives seeking the next dopamine hit. I avoid gambling like I avoid heroin (aka zero tolerance).
Let me make it clear: for me, having money is not simply about getting all kinds of 'stuff.' (However, I can understand why some people would want that.) For me, it would be about having that kind of 'luck', 'success' or 'fortune' that being a millionaire or even successful investor would have. I need a modicum of comfort, but it can be overdone. However, to be that fortunate or that successful is something to be really proud of. It doesn't require a mansion or butler to be satisfied with it...
Also, business logic can be interesting when: it involves some quantitative element. I love economics. I find business analytics really useful and interesting. Quantitative finance intrigues me. Even investing in the stock market is interesting. I guess it's just the element of bookkeeping/clerical work that I've been exposed to recently that has gotten me down...
EDIT: I just realized: it's not the comfort or practical centres of my brain that are activated by getting money but the reward centres. Right? Like when you ace a test in school, you feel some 'bliss' because of a dopamine release... Winning/making money is the same exact thing... And I'm sorry to tell you, accounting work doesn't give me some big dopamine hit, all right?
Last edited by jason_m; 06-11-2019 at 11:35 PM.
I get really depressed if I’m broke. Money actually improves my mood substantially, as sad as it may seem. I’d like to be a millionaire. Winning the lottery would be nice but not the way that I’d prefer to become wealthy. I’m sure after a while it might loose some of it’s charm and cause it’s own set of problems though.
According to some sites that I ran my dna through, some people carry genes that make them more prone to things like gambling. My risk was very low.
Probably Se genes
Since you dont value money can you give me yours
Gambling is stupid unless you have odds greater than 50%
Business wise, I really don't care. I'm busy doing other things. What I do care about though, is management. Too many people make up BS rules to increase productivity. Too many people cheat. And they all get canned in a fair world. Sadly, the world is skewed to their side slightly, as if everyone cheats, nobody has a reason not to. Good thing I don't cheat.
Still, I think of it this way. If you did a study on it, you should care, if you do a study on it, don't care, or don't care to do a study on it, you're different from me. I don't know what the difference is, it could be the word study is grating to you, but how I found myself mostly is that after consuming the amount of information I have, you'd be best to just work as a manager for 12 on a salary of 100k with a total living cost of 200k in a 12 year period amounting to 16k a year. You can get the cost of living down further by leaving the country, but I doubt you want to.
Taking longer to make 1 million will get you better cost of living and investing well will either lengthen or shorten time to millions.
The reason why I will likely not do this is twofold. 1. Why? 2. I don't need a million dollars right now.
I am planning going to work on getting a six figure salary, and then supplanting that hobbies in my free time though. If I do well at data science, which I should, it should be easier for me to get that number than a lot of other people. Sadly, I'm almost locked out of other more profitable but riskier jobs as long as I have a data science job, but I'll deal with that latter.
So yeah, either your environment is pretty crap, or you're not LIE. That's my honest opinion. What can I say?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrenology
An optimist - does not get discouraged under any circumstances. Life upheavals and stressful events only toughen him and make more confident. He likes to laugh and entertain people. Enters contact with someone by involving him with a humorous remark. His humor is often sly and contain hints and double meanings. Easily enters into arguments and bets, especially if he is challenged. When arguing his points is often ironic, ridicules the views of his opponent. His irritability and hot temper may be unpleasant to others. However, he himself is not perceptive of this and believes that he is simply exchanging opinions.
http://www.wikisocion.net/en/index.php?title=LIE_Profile_by_Gulenko
My dad's parents used to own 100 acres of land in Boulder Colorado and a small restaurant. They blew it all on gambling and were reduced to living in a trailer by the time I came to the scene. So yeah don't gamble unless the odds are stacked in your favor which is never the case in any gambling establishment.
i'm bad with money because i don't understand financial anything, i could say that it's te polr, or i could say it's because financial literacy is actually a real thing that isn't taught in schools like learning to read or do basic math. but it's also that i don't have an innate understanding of these financial things, like with some things in life, even knowing nothing about them, they just make sense, and financial stuff doesn't. it's a source of deep pain in my head, trying to manage it... i don't really gamble or anything, but i'm in debt, and trying to comprehend all the fine print of such things and what to DO with it is something that exhausts me fast mentally. it's an area of life that i can like barely see, like i'm viewing it from a long distance away, and complex things are happening in its realm, but i don't know what those things are... it's a blurry in the background thing but if it starts getting into slightly sharper focus it hurts because i'm immediately overwhelmed.
i really do think it's somehow Te bc it's not like a static system like some kind of math that relies on Ti... it's a moving machine of horrifying logic created by Te types lol. and also it's in their best interest to keep it "mysterious" because it's actually all unreasonable for most ppl by necessity - it is designed for the precious few not for the many. sometimes i feel like Je often makes things overly complicated and adds in all this clutter and for Te doms, it's adding in more and more processes and technicalities until it gets to the point that a lot of people can't interface with the information. which is really only to the benefit of those creating all the excessive processes. however, i mean there are many players in creating the Te nightmare, including people with 2D unvalued Te who can glimpse it all and then add to it in a terrible blundering way. i suspect all of the 2D Te types are creating messes in the realm but i can't easily distinguish their more bad/fake Te focus from the actual Te focus. and ofc there is always a creative vs. lead tension imo with these information elements. the aims of Te lead and Te creative actually are not the same.
and honestly i can't say for sure i enjoy anything about money. throughout childhood it was a source of pain for my family, and anything purchased for fun had the flip side of guilt and worry. so i mean there is a terrible relationship with it in my mind. most associations with it are negative, whether earning it, spending it, or having/not having it. and i just feel pain at the very word. and this orientation hasn't really changed even though it will fluctuate... it's like the entire area is ruled by pain and i hate to say it but i think the past holds it down (the anchor is back there). but still i feel helpless about it, so it's the helplessness...
eta: also by fluctuating i mean that i go through phases where i purchase things that probably people would say i don't need, and i will overspend for a variety of reasons (convenience, preference, just not being aware it's overspending, unable to keep up with some area in which i'm being ripped off on a bill but it's so hard to think about the bills, or subscribing to something while it's free and later forgetting about it) but my mood on it is really what is fluctuating. i mean i can gleefully purchase something and it ups my spirits, but also i can descend into dark feelings about it all, and i am generally materially overwhelmed and i would probably like to get rid of a lot of my belongings because i feel like they are weighing me down and i'm in this hell where cleaning/organizing/maintaining has become so overwhelming i just know i need to have fewer things and then maybe the overwhelm would decrease to a less blinding level and i might feel like i can function, even if just a little. i also have anti-materialism ideals in which i just want to be a spirit or something, that phase in and out of all of this. so anyway there are a lot of things going on and even if the core resonance frequency is pain not everything in motion around it is pain, and it can cycle from hurting more to hurting less, to just delighting in chaos and things i like.
Last edited by marooned; 06-13-2021 at 11:55 PM.
^ @inumbra, it sounds like the way you feel about money is exactly the way I feel about maintaining my health, going to doctors, and choosing clothes.
I think life would be better if health care was free and everyone could wear rags and not be looked down upon.
I just had an interior decorator go through my clothes, and if something HAD A HOLE IN IT OR WAS STAINED, she threw it out. I lost 2/3 of my wardrobe.
ahaha i agree. strangely i am not so sensitive about wearing rags. i remember my last supervisor told me i couldn't wear some of my clothes to work anymore bc they had holes in them, and i strangely had no reaction. normally i feel so oppressed in the workplace, and i will feel oppressed by things that block self-expression as well, but i guess i've reached this point in life where well, clothing costs money and i can't manage the money, and um i rarely replace my clothes (this is part of "searching for venus" really because i'm not expressing myself the way i ideally like to) and somehow i can just be detached from it. i was somewhat annoyed at not being able to wear the clothes with holes i guess bc clothing costs money, but i mean, meh, i just couldn't be concerned enough about it. i didn't feel anything like humiliation about my bad clothing being pointed out and i guess it's that to me clothing is in the realm of self-expression and i don't care if it has holes, but i'm not really expressing myself through my clothes currently bc they fell out of my priorities as something i can't manage, so i just dimmed the lights in that area and i guess it didn't feel "oppressive" lol bc i intentionally dimmed the lights years ago and with that intention i accepted all its consequences, so the consequences are not painful, they just are what i kind of expected though i didn't specifically expect anything. it's also mb my anti-materialism wanting to be a spirit sometimes thing, like i feel like all of me that is holy is not bound by my clothes, though she shines much more brightly when she can express herself more dramatically through attire and so that unfulfilled need is the actual thing that hurts.
really my work clothes are like a statement of how much i don't like work haha, they are crappy office clothing bc offices have a crappy implicit dress code lol, and so it's like your norms are met by my attire, but let's not pretend it's cool. /hides passive-aggressively/ that they gather holes and what not are a symbol of decay, that i am not well. and that's simply the truth.
in part rags can match my clothing identity - i liked the grunge style in high school i recall in part bc it was more like rags.
but where i'm going with this, to me, clothing is so important for expressing one's self that there really should be as few bars on what to wear as possible... my Fe valuing can't stand the blocking of self-expression, and doesn't like people being funneled into norms ("you can express yourself but only in these 3 acceptable ways we suggest!"). and that ofc includes ppl not wanting to express themselves through their clothes or not giving a shit, that should be allowed too (because it's actually still self-expression lol).
I don't think Te-doms really enjoy those things per se ((some might, I mean there are people who weirdly enjoy boring things)) they are just probably excellent at them regardless. I mean everybody has things they don't necessarily enjoy or get some satisfaction out of but nevertheless it comes easy to them. I think Te being the opposite of Fe, if Fe is entertainment and fun then Te would be serious and business-like.
I was usually smart in school. But the "Te classes" I got Cs and Ds instead of As like I normally do. It just didn't come easy to me and sometimes the Te teacher would be like 'okay don't worry. I am going to go slow so you understand this!' (/teacher goes slow and I still don't get it...) lolol
The part of how Te is always changing and always in motion via the people who are orchestrating from it on top - yeah that type of thing trolled me too. I pick up static Ti facts a lot better than that. Te is also counter-intuitive in this annoying way. And because it's intrinsically related to Fi - one day something could be sacred to Te the next day it's like horribly offended and creates all these legal rules against it or something and to a strong Fe/Ti valuer who is based on a more eternal all-around fairness pov it's just like wtf no.
Despite being Te polr, I have an excellent credit score which is probably more of a Ti thing anyway- and I always keep in mind how the Gamma NTs of the world are out to fuck you over and of course I don't trust their Machiavellian little power play thing where they say 'this deal will be a big win for both of us!' Obviously of course, I know it will be a much, much bigger win for them than it will be for me if I 'bite' and buy whatever it is their selling. I suppose I use my Ni to sorta circumvent my shitty and horrible Te. Obviously LIEs are good at both that's why they supervise us.
ETA: To be fair, Gamma NTs usually have intentions that do actually align more with my own values (shared Se/Ni valuing) even if I can see through their 'Mutual win' bullshit, it's really of course Delta Te that is horribly offensive to me and the most opposing to my own goals and values/views.
I usually do like a lot of what LIEs offer. With the exception of Bill Gates (assuming he is in fact LIE for sure and not Delta) He designs computer software for Delta old people because it's like he wanted to be accepted into Delta Heaven but they won't take him there cuz they can sniff out his Se creepiness. You try to ass kiss to your progressive quadra- it works well for you for a long while in the external sense but it seems in a personal way that all turns to shit as it gets revealed to be over time what a fraud you really are.
Last edited by Hot Scalding Gayser; 06-14-2021 at 04:14 AM.
I see the Te as just being the pursuit of what is profitable, useful. For example, someone who values Te will seek to study which will allow him to maximize his profit even if it means not studying what he is passionate about.
As I mentioned here , Te as money is not a good definition
This argument is mainly about Te PoLR but it shows you how bad this definition is in practice
As for the gambling you do, it seems normal for someone who has Te and Ni in one ego block especially LIE ( ILI are excepted to be more careful ) , but your hatred of accounting and banking things seems like an unvalued Te because Te is about skillfully dealing with systems and the external environment logically (of course, in addition to facts but facts are part of external systems in general), however , if you're also bad at these things, consider weak Te
Souls know their way back home
Sure can be Te
-
Dual type(as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
I think pure gambling is more a Se thrill seeking, with Ni directing it - like how do you think things are going to play out intuitively based on what's happened before.
I suppose gambling could also be Ne, where somebody sees a new change or something completely different taking place and gambles on the potential consequences. Such as when sports teams trade players to match their roster. You can't really analyze them based on the past anymore, now it's a matter of what potential do they have in their new team/role.
But I guess you could also learn to play the odds, such as counting cards or something like that, but then it's probably more Ti in that case.
Banking, accounting, finance, those are all things Te types will be good at if they think it will help them. They will know them and how to best manipulate them to get what they want or the desired outcome. So they usually end up with more money. They are also more able to play the promotion game at companies because of this. So they end up with more money. It's weird, it's not that they are necessarily better at business, but they are just good at taking advantage of systems and working it to their favor. In an ideal world, their success would mean giving back to the world as well, but that's not really how that works (unless their Fi values it). Unfortunately, it's more of a narcissistic working in their favor, and sometimes they help other people... In a way, if EII are ethical humanists, LSE needs them to balance their greed and narcissism. And similarly with ESI/LIE. Except I think ESI helps LIE live more in the moment and be less cautious.
Gambling is +Ne, which has to do with everything that involves crapshoots. LIE's have got bad rap for gamblers, but it isn't my case nor other LIE's I've known, because actually the LIE type with creative +Ni, tries to steer outcomes to what they desire, in the least crapshoot way as possible (actually controlling the process and the outcome--they sometimes do this in a seemingly somewhat magical fashion). Gambling offers no control over outcomes. So I think most of those "gambler LIE's" are actually ESE's (like that one that probably messed with Stratievskaya who is one of the bad rap creators).
Last edited by lavos; 04-04-2023 at 09:17 AM.
Then, the angel asked her what her name was. She said: "I have none"
Money is just paper that gets devalued over time due to inflation. Money is just a tool you don't love money you love the feeling it gives you when you spend it.
IMO, it's not very appropriate to name Te as "algorithmic logic" or "bussiness logic". The content of Ti thinking and Te thinking may not actually differ. They only differ in the value, in the criterion of judgements.
just because someone wants money doesnt make them Te. in fact, Te types may not find gambling particularly "pragmatic". Te is just focused on making sure one has the resources to live comfortably (not Si "comfortably", but without being stretched thin).
These aren't really relates to Te things Te is about efficiency.
No.
Sure, but not by gambling, betting, playing poker, or anything similar.
No, I find your realization to be nonsensical and unrelated to Te or anything resulting from its utilization. Furthermore, I like entrepreneurship and would choose to get involved in banking, accounting, or finance, over gambling any day, even though these are not things I find particularly compelling.
And just like some of the other posters pointed out, Te is about pragmatism and efficiency more than anything else. As a self-typed SLI, I'm not always the most efficient person because I sometimes prioritize other things (e.g. quality, attention to detail, comfort, pleasure, etc.), but at the same time I am not wasteful and generally spend my time, energy, money, and other resources very effectively and deliberately. The way I go about earning money is through honest and hard work, intelligent decision making, and practical application of acquired skills and knowledge. On that note, while Ti egos might enjoy acquiring knowledge for the sake of it (e.g. become scientists in order to understand, explain, and expand on it), Te egos would do the same motivated by its potential practical application, the tangible problems it can solve, etc.
Last edited by Park; 04-14-2023 at 10:46 AM.
“Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”
Why should we force doctors to work for free?
Why do cities force construction workers to build roads for free?
Which city is this? isn't slavery illegal.
Free healthcare doesn't mean doctors work for free, the same way construction workers don't work for free to build roads even though we don't pay them directly. It's from our taxes. Nothing to do with slavery.
The doctors probably would get pay by our tax money, so don’t be worry.
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