Help me determine type

[kingslayer]

This is Se "letting them feel my presence" (Se is more about presence, energy, etc)

You are definitely SLE

You have that protective nature and your words have a lot of values behind them.

I think so too, I just tend to doubt it at times because I can become withdrawn and I get very timid and afraid of failure in those states. Which is foreign to my usual daring and confident nature, but sometimes it happens so often it makes me think the confidence could have been a front. Hence the confusion.

Here’s a good definition of Se “Introduction to Se

Extroverted sensing is an extroverted, irrational, and static information element. It is also called Se, F, volitional sensing, or black sensing. Se includes the ability to attain high level of awareness of the physical aspects of one's reality, to know how much physical force or power is latent or required, to be able to accurately estimate properties of material sort. Types that strongly value Se are much more comfortable taking concrete actions to change their physical surroundings. This may at times be perceived as disruptive and abrasive, particularly by Ne-types who feel that abrupt changes in their physical surrounding ruins their balance. In Se-quadras, interaction takes a more blunt and direct forms, resulting in a much strongly impacting physical atmosphere than Si-valuing types prefer. Se-types enjoy discussing possibilities but only if there is concrete gain from it, or it holds the potential to impact the "the real world". Unlike Si, which is about one's subjective sensory experience (how intense or enjoyable it is), Se is about achieving an object of desire. It gives one the ability to influence, bend, and push concrete situations and people in order to achieve such an object, rather than to subjectively assess the situation one is in.”

Yes when you travel if you are indeed and Se base you would be trying to gain awareness of your surroundings (you can see how that involves little talking and much observation giving way to confusion about one’s type). As far as pushing and bending that also comes with the degree knowledge that they feel comfortable in. My SLE friend is quite strongly assertive in the areas which she has a lot of knowledge otherwise she’s watching and learning and usually not in a combative mode.

Hmm.. I do sound a lot like the description there. I don't like to push people for no reason though. However, if I were in a leadership position at work, I would have no issue and would find it easy to get people to do their work. I am all about having fun too though. I'm not constantly pursuing objects of desire, though I tend to do this as well. Such as my dream of moving to California. I entertain the shit out of my co-workers everyday with funny stories/jokes and I love to joke and laugh with people I enjoy being around and to smoke pot and watch funny or interesting things (I also enjoy dark television and movies a lot) can that be related to Si or this common for Se types as well? I guess I have an incorrect predetermined image of an Se ego and that's why I made this thread haha.

Clearly, You're not new here, but You're new to me, so welcome, mate!

I'd have to get to know You more to hand out a typing confidently, but I can certainly double down on Your being an Enneagram 8 primary, and a very 2 Integrated one at that (A healthy 8). I've not seen a more explicitly justice championing 8 before--justice not in the abstract, but in the immediate sense of using Your own strength to come to the aid of others, putting cowards in their place for the greater good, etc--so Your OP was a very refreshing read. I think it's easier to infer Your Enneagram placement moreso than Your type, as You speak much of motivations, which Enneagram largely governs; there is of course pretty strong correlations between the two systems, but Your Socionics type isn't as clear to me as Your Enneagram. Your discipline and assertiveness is clear, the latter reflected in no small part by Your Enneagram.

At a cursory glance SLE-Se and LSI-Se seem the most likely to me. It may also be worthwhile to read on SEE and ESI, for deduction's sake, if nothing else. Eliminating possibilities is important so we can focus on the probable. At the very least, Your being an Se valuer seems clear, and Se ego seems highly probable.

For Reference:
SLE Overview - SLE Subtypes
LSI Overview - LSI Subtypes
SEE Overview - SEE Subtypes
ESI Overview - ESI Subtypes

If You could do us all a favor - this is a test I often recommend peers. Be sure to leave it set to the "Extended Socionics Test" , and pay mind to and be as precise as You can with the sliders. I have studied this test a good deal, and even small differences are reflected in the results. The test is broken into three parts, each dynamically changing contingent upon Your answers, to pinpoint Your valued IEs. No test is perfect, but it can point many in the right direction at the least, and my own results have been very consistent. Post Your results in the thread when You're able.

This might also be fun to evaluate

You seem like a great man, Kingslayer. I hope this is of some assistance, and I'm lookin' forward to how this shakes out. Best of luck, lad.

Haha you give me too much credit, but thank you! That's good to hear about my health. I use to be rather unhealthy and have been working hard through my life to become a mentally healthier and stronger person everyday. You seem like a cool guy too.. Is this kind of nice behavior another poster asked if I fall for ? Cuz I like this guy judging from this post haha. As for the subtypes you have sent. In no particular order I relate a lot to ESTp-Se, ISTj- Se and even ISFj Se. However I do not relate much at all to either ESFp subtype description or the Ji subtypes. Maybe I am ESTp, becausee that would make you my dual and I'm really enjoying the way your post is written. I love abstract things, but don't understand them as well I'd like and always appreciate someone who can help me with that. I've taken this test before and scored ESTp, but I'm retaking it now for the sake of sharing the specific results.

You do sound roughly like an Se leading type, or possibly Se mobilizing. Some things might actually point more to SEE, like the idea of cutting jerks down to size. But if you're really having trouble I'd suggest doing the questionnaire in my signature.

That's interesting.. I can be ESFp, I don't know. I don't always cut jerks down to size. I would love to do it to all the ones I meet but that can become dangerous and exhausting. If they try to manipulate me or push me around I shut that shit down fast though, in fact I usually just let them think they are manipulating me while mentally taking notes on their behavior and thought process and in turn manipulate them myself without ever verbalizing any of the information or distaste I truly have for them. I definitely enjoy to my assert myself in an environment though. I don't think Ti-polr is me though. I have been complemented many times in my life on my logical reasoning skills by people. Math was also the only subject I was ever good at without trying. I could study for history and get a B or study for science to not fail (wasn't my strong suit other than environmental science), but math I would just show up to class, space out or talk with the person next to me then get an A on most tests. I was never in advanced math courses, just the regular ones but I always coasted through them without trying. Is that normal for ESFp? I read ti-polr are not good at algebra and that was my bread and butter. I'm not saying I'm a trig or calc wiz but I was always able to grasp arithmatic and algebra very quickly and easily. I've also been told to be an attorney by many people close to me due to my "ability to play games with people" and "twist and spin arguments before the opponent has a chance to analyze it" Also very guilty of overanalyzing to a fault at times. I will answer the questionnaire shortly and post it with my test results from the other link.

A good example of how I think is, I remember in College our geology teacher taught us about the 3 types of rock, so he took us out around campus to observe different rocks we have. I don't remember the terms for it, but they were BIG rocks rooted in the ground. Much larger than people.. The first rock was one kind, the next rock was one of the others. At each rock he asked us which one we think it is and no one guessed the first two right including myself. So we get to the third and he asked which rock we think it is, and I mentioned the only one we haven't seen yet. He asked very good how do you know? and I respond because its the only one you haven't showed us yet. and he laughed along with the class and said that's good that you think with logic to determine that but we need to actually figure out how to determine it. So that's basically the kind of logical reasoning I use. I think that's more Ti > Te? I didn't remember any facts, I just figured well he showed us Rock type #1 and #2 and this is the third rock and there's 3 types sooo... this is rock #3.

[Exodus]

That's interesting.. I can be ESFp, I don't know. I don't always cut jerks down to size. I would love to do it to all the ones I meet but that can become dangerous and exhausting. If they try to manipulate me or push me around I shut that shit down fast though, in fact I usually just let them think they are manipulating me while mentally taking notes on their behavior and thought process and in turn manipulate them myself without ever verbalizing any of the information or distaste I truly have for them. I definitely enjoy to my assert myself in an environment though. I don't think Ti-polr is me though. I have been complemented many times in my life on my logical reasoning skills by people. Math was also the only subject I was ever good at without trying. I could study for history and get a B or study for science to not fail (wasn't my strong suit other than environmental science), but math I would just show up to class, space out or talk with the person next to me then get an A on most tests. I was never in advanced math courses, just the regular ones but I always coasted through them without trying. Is that normal for ESFp? I read ti-polr are not good at algebra and that was my bread and butter. I'm not saying I'm a trig or calc wiz but I was always able to grasp arithmatic and algebra very quickly and easily. I've also been told to be an attorney by many people close to me due to my "ability to play games with people" and "twist and spin arguments before the opponent has a chance to analyze it" Also very guilty of overanalyzing to a fault at times. I will answer the questionnaire shortly and post it with my test results from the other link.

A good example of how I think is, I remember in College our geology teacher taught us about the 3 types of rock, so he took us out around campus to observe different rocks we have. I don't remember the terms for it, but they were BIG rocks rooted in the ground. Much larger than people.. The first rock was one kind, the next rock was one of the others. At each rock he asked us which one we think it is and no one guessed the first two right including myself. So we get to the third and he asked which rock we think it is, and I mentioned the only one we haven't seen yet. He asked very good how do you know? and I respond because its the only one you haven't showed us yet. and he laughed along with the class and said that's good that you think with logic to determine that but we need to actually figure out how to determine it. So that's basically the kind of logical reasoning I use. I think that's more Ti > Te? I didn't remember any facts, I just figured well he showed us Rock type #1 and #2 and this is the third rock and there's 3 types sooo... this is rock #3.

That does seem like strong Ti

[kingslayer]

This is Se "letting them feel my presence" (Se is more about presence, energy, etc)

You are definitely SLE

You have that protective nature and your words have a lot of values behind them.

I disagree lol, I think You sound like an admirable man, but it's SLE nature to downplay his own goodness, because his Dual does not require overt expressions to read someone's ethical standing and potential. There's a time and a place for anger and aggression, and You wear it well, and commit it to worthy cause, that is what an honorable man does, as how one wield's his strength is more significant than whether or not he has strength. Yes, SLE is very amenable to being positively ethically evaluated. Having it reinforced that he is a good person is an important part of SLE/IEI duality:

"To the ESTp it is also important that he is perceived not only as he appears to be, but also as he could potentially be if he's treated and related to well. It is important that he is received and evaluated not only as he is, but also taking into consideration his positive ethical potential. (Precisely what his dual, the IEI, sees and evaluates well.) The SLE doesn't bring up immediately how he can be good, but speaks about this in hints and sometimes in jest. He is sufficiently prudent to not talk of this openly and directly. In addition, it seems out of place and inappropriate to him to voice praises to himself (since he is subconsiously oriented at his dual who sees this well)."




SLE, as I thought. Interesting You got TI subtype. Massive Beta Quadra values result hahah, similar to my own:

My Socionics Result 1.jpg


I'm unsure just how new to Socionics You are, but I'd be happy to provide a crash course on some of the subsystems, since You seem to have a grasp of the basics. The popular model of Socionics most of us are tacitly using here on the forums is called Model A. The +/- component is an addition onto the standard IEs (Information Element, known as "Functions" in MBTI) that augments their temperament/nature, and is a component of Model B, Bukalov's Signage. Bukalov's Signage is also present, AFAIK, in Model G (Gulenko's model), which handles and emphasizes elements in Model A distinctly. Finally, here's a link on functional dimensionality ,and (just for some added flavor and fun) have an article on functional semantics.

Bukalov's Signage:
Socionics Functiona + -.jpg

Signage correlation to type:
Socionics Functional Model.png

Triangles are Intuition
Circles are Sensing
Squares are Thinking
Steps are Feeling
White is Introverted and black is Extroverted

If there's anything I can do to help, message me anytime. I'll add You to my contacts, and of course I can respond to anything else here. You want basic or more in-depth teaching on anything Typology related (Including other systems, eg. Enneagram, Instinct Variant, MBTI, Temperaments, Astrology, etc) I've got social media, skype, or whatever You prefer. Throw me a line sometime if You're down.

Update: I'm actually a very Introverted-looking EIE afterall hahah. No matter, as Beta NF and Beta ST are wired for each other, and they get along wonderfully regardless.

That does seem like strong Ti

firstly I wanna apologize for not being on here, I got pretty busy with life and barely had time to browse this forum let alone construct a post addressing all of you. However I do wanna thank you all for your time and participating in helping me as well!. ESTp seemed plausible for me, however after reading more descriptions of each type and using the Oldham description, I have concluded along with 2 close friends and my girlfriend that I am ISTp and she is actually my dual ENFp. Our relationship is very similar to what ENFp/ISTp duality is and I also relate to the description on sociotype.com I never really related to the ESTp functional description but I related to the SE subtype description heavily. While with ISTp, almost every functional analysis is pretty on point with my personality and the 3 previously mentioned people agreed.

if anyone disagrees or has any insights/questions I'm all ears, but for the first time since I started reading socionics I feel like the type I have identified with feels right with me. ESTp sounded right and I thought it fit, but some parts don't. It also kinda just never felt right to me hence the creation of this thread. ISTp sounds AND feels right though.

are you sure you might not be delta NF lynx? we seem to be getting along pretty well for conflictors lol

my username is also named after Jamie Lannister in Game of Thrones - one of my favorite characters, along with the Hound and Jon Snow... Pretty sure Jamie is ISTp and this forum seems to agree on the game of thrones thread, but all 3 are definitely fi-valuers. Seems odd for Fi-polr to enjoy Fi-Valuing character's so much lol.

[kingslayer]

That does seem like strong Ti

As for the questionnaire in your signature... I'm going to post the ones I answered so far and fill the rest in as I can, I didn't realize how long it was when I starred it. I don't have a lot of time right now. For some reason I only saw the 2nd half of the questions yet had all copied so my answers are mostly halfway down.

What do you study or do for a living? How did you come to do that? What do you like or dislike about it?

I studied marketing, I never really cared for it. but I took lots of business courses in high school and the teacher who I had was my absolute favorite. She thought I would be great for marketing so I took her word basically because I highly respected her. I work in a bank right now though, in sales and service. I don't like it at all. My boss is cool but his bosses are always trying to pressure him and us to get sales. The pressuring doesn't work well on me because I know they can't actually fire me as long as I hit the minimal goal, but I just hate the whole sales culture and everything. Plus theres lots of idiots in this company who think they're slick but are just sociopaths. Nothing intelligent about them, just the lack of shame allows them to rise to power in such a grimey corporation.

What are your values, and why?

What else do you do on a daily basis? What are your interests and hobbies? Why do you do them?

Describe your relations with family and friends. What do you like and dislike about them?

What do you look for in friends? In romantic relationships?

What conflicts have you encountered recently with other people? Why did they happen? Which kinds seem to happen on a regular basis?

How would your friends describe you?

What do people generally see as your strengths? What do you like about yourself?

What are your weaknesses? What criticism do you often face from others? What do you dislike about yourself?

In what areas of life can you manage well on your own? In what areas of your life would you like help?

What things do you dislike doing? What things do you enjoy more than others?

What goals, aspirations, or plans do you have for the future? How did you come to have them?

If you had enough money to live comfortably for the rest of your life without working, what would you do with your time?

What traits do you find endearing that others might dislike? What traits are considered positive/neutral by others but tend to annoy you?

What kinds of things do you do to manage and/or beautify your environment (your room, your house, etc.)? What do you think of daily chores?

How do you behave around strangers?

How do you react to conflict? What do you do if somebody insults or attacks you?

What is one common misconception that people have about things? Explain why it is wrong.

What did you do last Friday?

If you are doing a video you can stop here or choose from the rest of the questions as you like.
If you are answering in writing, please answer ALL questions.

What is your biggest accomplishment? Losing a ton of weight and transforming my mind. I use to be overweight and a pushover when I was younger. My father would abuse me then I would go to school and get bullied by certain people (not everyone as a whole, although I felt rejected) Until I became bigger and wiser. I lost a lot of weight at age 16.. I started smoking pot at 15. selling it at 16 along with the weight loss. my new status as a drug dealer and discovery that I was good looking under the fat started earning my respect from my peers. I began becoming more confident. I felt the power I had as a dealer because not only did I sell weed but I had the best shit of anyone I knew thanks to my cousin was 20 introducing me to connections his age from out of town. I just find this transformation as my biggest accomplishment. I use to roll over and let people say to me whatever they want if they were stronger than me, but funny enough I was rarely physically bullied. Usually just ganged up on and made fun of. Nowadays if someone tries something like that on me, I turn the bully into the victim fast. Ever since I have been working out consistently, not taking shit from people and did continue to sell weed all through college and highschool but stopped shortly after graduating college because being arrested was too much a risk. I just think that point in my mind when I said "enough is enough' and followed through on it and is my biggest accomplishment.

What is something you regret? Not standing up for myself or getting myself out there enough as a youngin.

Who do you admire, and why? Hmmm.. In real life? I don't know, everyone has flaws. I think some people are Tupac (stood up for what he believed regardless of where it could have and did lead him) George Patton (just a bad ass motherfucker although anti-sematic and abusive) err. I really can't think of many I try not to idealize real people much since everyone has some flaw or shit they're trying to hide. Fictionally I look up to someone like Tony Soprano, I have a lot of similar rage/vulnerability issues as him and think it takes a lot of strength for him to lead the organization he does with the trauma and damage he has. I don't know this is tough for me, I don't admire many people. I appreciate and respect people and love what they are doing but to admire someone seems like selling yourself short and looking at them through rose colored glasses. I did admire Lebron James before, but his recent attitude has really put me off. I liked that he was from the complete gutter of Cleveland raised by a not good mother in extreme poverty and was able to turn himself and his name into a corporation and powerhouse.

What's been on your mind? Has anything been worrying or concerning you? What problems have you encountered lately? I got a bill in the mail for damages on my car lease shortly after returning it and its higher than what they quoted me at. It's been worrying me because I feel this is unjust and I have to call them and argue with them like I did on my last lease. It worked but caused me so much stress and anxiety that I try to not think about it. I constantly worry about stupid shit that no one should. Things so silly I don't even wanna write most of them.. I'm a little paranoid from smoking pot at night but this morning I went and made sure my front door was locked literally 3 or 4 times. I'm worried my cop is a neighbor and the door has swung open from the wind before with the top lock isn't locked so I don't want him snooping upstairs and finding my shit. Granted when the top lock is locked the door is fine. I just literally check it 2-4 times every morning due to stupid paranoia that I know is completely irrational but cant help in myself lol.

What are your religious or spiritual beliefs and why do you hold them? Athiest. I think all religion is bullshit and a tool for control. I enjoy spiritualty though, I think people can be greater than what we are or how we treat each other.

What are your political beliefs, and why? To what extent do you care about politics? I don't really give a shit about politics. Haven't voted ever except in the most recent state elections. My friend is a huge history/politics buff he usually keeps me in the loop of what both sides are up to here in America and I make my own judgments from there.

Would you ever be interested in starting a business? Why or why not? What role would you play in it? What kind of business would it be? I would love to, I think about it all the time. I would love to start a personal training from home and meal prep business. I know a shit ton about weightlifting and nutrition from my own experience, researching and taking courses. I went through a big physical and mental journey myself and would love to help others on theirs. Low operating cost, doing something I love and enough money to keep me set for the future would be a dream.

What kind of work environment do you prefer? What do you look for in a job? I look for a job with freedom to act independently. I don't need much management or supervision to be productive. I enjoy being lazy and not doing shit, but I know what to do to be productive. I just chose not to a lot of the time lol. I work in a bank right now in sales and service, I don't need my manager reminding me to get sales, in fact it annoys me when he tries to motivate us. We have some stupid weekly meeting where we go over our numbers and strategies to help "motivate us" and I'm just like this is stupid we have the same goal and follow generally the same tactics to get there everyday these meetings are a waste of time to me.

What is or was your favorite school subject and why? Math and history. I like math cuz I can bullshit around and get good grades still, while history was just always interesting to me. I find wars so intriguing.

How do you approach responsibility? What do you tend to expect of others? I am responsible in my own needs. I am stingy and good with money. Though if I Decide I want something, the price tag is usually not enough to hold me back (I only decide I want things that are within reason of my money though) I've never taken a loan to buy something. But I have taken a trip or 2 I couldn't pay off immediately and am paying down my credit card debt for it right now (0% interest on my card is what allowed me to make these purchase though)

Where did you go on your most recent vacation? What did you do there? How did you like it and why? Los Angeles. My third time there, I fucking loved it and can't wait to live there. Love how the weather feels, sun and stmopshere. Everyons is friendly and better looking too. I just feel so at home there. Felt that way since the second I walked out of the airport on my first trip. Soon as the weather hit me and I saw how chill everyone around me was I felt at home.

What were you like as a kid? How have you changed since you were a child?

What was your high school experience like?

Talk about a significant event from your life.

Do you like kids? Why or why not?

If you were to raise a child, what would be your main concerns, what measures would you take, and why?

Ever feel stuck in a rut? If yes, describe the causes and your reaction to it.

How do you see other people as a whole? What do you consider a prevalent social problem? Name one.

What do you do if you're not getting what you want? What approach do you use? I can keep pushing, trying to find a different way of tackling the obstacle instead of directly or in the same way. It depends on the context to me.

ou comfortable taking leadership roles? In what areas? Why or why not? Yes, I have my eyes on the goal. I find it pretty easy to keep everyone on track towards the goal. I worked as expo in a restaurant before (control what food goes in and out of the kitchen to the table) it's all about taking charge of the kitchen and making sure the food is coming out properly and on time and taking charge of the servers to make sure they are running it out to the tables. I also find myself as a leader in conflicts often. I don't mind letting someone else take charge if I see they know what they are doing, but if you are incompetent or I decided I don't like you, I would prefer to lead.

How often do you get angry? What kinds of things make you angry? I can get angry at anything. I use to juts wake up angry sometimes and had to work to stop being so. I think when people are trying to take advantage of me or push me around I get mad. Honestly though, I just get mad at things if I'm already mad. It's hard for people to make me mad unless I was already in a mind state that was willing to get mad, otherwise good luck.

What is the best thing that happened to you during the past week? My moms birthday dinner. We all went out, the family her friends my cousins dad grandma etc. we had some really delicious food, lots of good conversation and vibes across the table, it was a great time.

What is the worst thing that happened to you during the past week? I got sick. Fucking hate being sick lol.

What is the purpose of life? What do you find personally meaningful in life? I think everyone has a different purpose. I want to just do whatever the hell I want within reason. I think life has meaning when you figure out what you want out of it and go for it. Whether that's becoming a president or joining the army or w.e, to each his own, my personal meaning will be found when I can find something not too time restraining to fund all the things I wanna do and places I wanna travel to.

What is the most interesting place you have been, and why? Los Angeles. I been to Europe and all around America and Canada and the Bahamas but something about LA juts smacked me in the face as home. I was so amazed how the culture and atmosphere are so different than the east coast. I felt like I was in a different country but it was still America. It was beautiful.

How do you dress or manage your appearance? I don't like to overdo it. Though I enjoy to look nice. I think buying/wearing designer shit is silly. I like nice clothes but would never spend an obscene amount just make strangers think I'm High status or whatever nonsense. Anyone who talks to me knows what I'm about I don't need my clothes to show it. My eyes usually do.

Do you like surprises? Yes.