Subtype matching or not in duality and activity

[The Reality Denialist]

According Gulenko

people pair up: D&H, C & C, N &N
Aligns well with Helen Fisher's personality system.


While the subtype duality is D & N and C & H.

If we assume that N & N happens between introtim and extratim then there exist two subtype match (something like at least 50 % people) which also holds true with C & C introtim and extratim pairings.

[Rebelondeck]

The best pairing for a productive relationship seems to be an equal balance of input to output processes for the couple as a combined unit; for example, INTj-Ti with ESE-Si. However, this won't assure success because there are so many other issues that can override the positive effects of type matching.......

a.k.a. I/O

EDIT: Activity relationships seem to be marginal at best so subtype matches wont change the apparent cognitive disharmony by a significant amount......

[Bethanyclaire]

The best pairing for a productive relationship seems to be an equal balance of input to output processes for the couple as a combined unit; for example, INTj-Ti with ESE-Si. However, this won't assure success because there are so many other issues that can override the positive effects of type matching.......

a.k.a. I/O

EDIT: Activity relationships seem to be marginal at best so subtype matches wont change the apparent cognitive disharmony by a significant amount......

So I'm learning a bit more about subtypes atm and I noticed this comment by Rebel. So opposite subtypes are better? Why does this feel like it makes sense to me..

I think it can be quite hard to tell someone's subtype and that the subtypes can often look similar. I was just reading about SLE-se and SLE-ti and actually SLE-ti sounds a bit more like the quiet, mysterious, reserved guys I often go for..

[Stray Cat]

So I'm learning a bit more about subtypes atm and I noticed this comment by Rebel. So opposite subtypes are better? Why does this feel like it makes sense to me..

I think it can be quite hard to tell someone's subtype and that the subtypes can often look similar. I was just reading about SLE-se and SLE-ti and actually SLE-ti sounds a bit more like the quiet, mysterious, reserved guys I often go for..

It probably makes sense to you cause it's easier for you to listen to people who think they know what they're talking about than to gain the proper wisdom for yourself

[Bethanyclaire]

It probably makes sense to you cause it's easier for you to listen to people who think they know what they're talking about than to gain the proper wisdom for yourself

Nice. You’re kinda dopey yourself you know.

[Stray Cat]

Nice. You’re kinda dopey yourself you know.

Proof? Evidence? Or is this just a lame shaming tactic?

[Adam Strange]

Dammit Stray Cat, you sure your duals are the ones with Ti HA and not the ones with Te DS?
Bethany's post was essentially poking for Ti in the way one unconsciously pokes for their HA.

A thing about SLEs and ILEs is that they don't make us feel stupid when we indulge with our Ti. They support and guide the half-baked speculations to a conclusion.

On the other hand, Te egos, except the kindest ones, have reactions like yours,


and this is why my Ti has always been reflexively shy around them.

@chocolatte, just for the record, I'm not that kind. Remember, LIEs and SLEs have the same dimensional Fe and Fi and we therefore have the same levels of blindness to some things.

Instead, I've been trained since birth by my 3-week older IEI cousin to not touch the third rail. I used to say unintentional stuff to her all the time that she found really offensive, but eventually, I figured it out. Mostly.

So, it's training, and not anything intrinsic.

[Adam Strange]

So I'm learning a bit more about subtypes atm and I noticed this comment by Rebel. So opposite subtypes are better? Why does this feel like it makes sense to me..

I think it can be quite hard to tell someone's subtype and that the subtypes can often look similar. I was just reading about SLE-se and SLE-ti and actually SLE-ti sounds a bit more like the quiet, mysterious, reserved guys I often go for..

@Bethany, as a Te-subtype myself, my personal experience has been that I like working with an Se-subtype best, but I find the Fi-subtype to be the most comfortable.

[Bethanyclaire]

@Bethany, as a Te-subtype myself, my personal experience has been that I like working with an Se-subtype best, but I find the Fi-subtype to be the most comfortable.

Ta. And I think if people identify themselves strongly with a subtype it makes sense they would prefer a matching subtype. However, for people who feel more in the middle…maybe it doesn’t matter too much. I don’t know how strongly I identify with ni but definitely a little

[Adam Strange]

Ta. And I think if people identify themselves strongly with a subtype it makes sense they would prefer a matching subtype. However, for people who feel more in the middle…maybe it doesn’t matter too much. I don’t know how strongly I identify with ni but definitely a little

@Bethany, the thing is, an ESI-Se is moving towards an SEE, which is my Activity partner. I love to do things with the ESI-Ses whom I know, but I can't seem to close the distance with them. I've never slept with an SEE, either. Despite their beauty and overt sexiness, SEEs don't appeal to me in that way.

On the other hand, I'm OK with doing things with the ESI-Fi subtype and it's easier to be intimate with them, for some reasons unknown to me.

[Bethanyclaire]

The best pairing for a productive relationship seems to be an equal balance of input to output processes for the couple as a combined unit; for example, INTj-Ti with ESE-Si. However, this won't assure success because there are so many other issues that can override the positive effects of type matching.......

a.k.a. I/O

EDIT: Activity relationships seem to be marginal at best so subtype matches wont change the apparent cognitive disharmony by a significant amount......

I think the exact wording he uses is interesting.. ‘the best pairing for a productive relationship’ and ‘there are so many other issues that can override the positive effects of type matching’. Yes, it’s important for a relationship to be productive. However, it may not be the most important factor based on one’s own personal needs. I think the type of subtype you prefer may depend on the type of relationships you have with other people. If there is something lacking in your friendships or family life, (or even work life?) you man need it from a relationship. So productivity may not be best short term, even if it might be long term. Theoretically speaking. Life isn’t that long anyway..

[Disturbed]

All I know is that ILE-Ti vastly prefer the company of ESI-Se and LSI-Se and SLE-Ti over ESI-Fi and LSI-Ti and SLE-Se.

[Chillaxe]

All I know is that ILE-Ti vastly prefer the company of ESI-Se and LSI-Se and SLE-Ti over ESI-Fi and LSI-Ti and SLE-Se.

That's all you need to know in life.

[Lolita]

I hope you don't still don't believe you're an ESI. Fi from ESI is totally different and also very silent.

[ashlesha]

I hope you don't still don't believe you're an ESI. Fi from ESI is totally different and also very silent.

blocked, i've said i'm enjoying the food for thought, but that's not good enuf because u want me to submit. stupid. no more listening

[Lolita]

blocked, i've said i'm enjoying the food for thought, but that's not good enuf because u want me to submit. stupid. no more listening

Typical. You want to play into your delusions that you're ESI when I've already said you're nothing like ESI from the start and you're not my mirror. People here do not know what a real ESI is like and I told you already, that Fi DOES NOT CARE about the collective opinion of their identity. You're just another Beta who wants to be something else that you've idealized.

[Sol]

You want to play into your delusions that you're ESI when I've already said you're nothing like ESI from the start

ESI is close to correct LSI. Without IR effects to understand own type is not easy.
I notice, ashlesha expresses more emotionality than LSI should. I relate this to other factors, as her nonverbal fits to LSI good. But for her the difference is not evident, as VI needs skills. By common behavior the difference between T/F is not clear in her case and without nonverbal I'd could doubt or to mistake. It's more doubtful than common to explain by her common behavior which we know here on the forum why she has T. While it's doubtful to convince about types even in common situations, as interpretations are significantly speculative and we know a little about those people.

> Fi DOES NOT CARE about the collective opinion of their identity

From types factor point the situation is opposite. What is a type is logical region. So T types have higher criticism about types and lesser possibility to be misleaded by other people.
F types (especially base F) have more emotional relation to opinions, including in T regions where it's not appropriate. Compared to T types, F types easier accept opinions which they personally more like (Fi) or find more decent (Fe) and opinions which have people with such their emotional evaluations. And also people with F types show more than average of unreasonable negativism to logical region opinions which inspire more of negative emotions in them and to opinions which have people which are worse emotionally perceived by them.
So "people with Fi types CARE about the collective opinion about their type" higher than average and the most when want to keep emotionally pleasant relations with those people. Also for them is important to emotionally like those opinions in more degree than for T types, what may be by reasons as to think good IR with someone.
Se type would explain a scepsis about the a better. Situation when people have opinions about your inner psyche contents - Ne, to what Jung type relates too and psychology in general. Se types should lesser like to get "psychoanalysis" and such to have higher scepsis to opinions about their types. Then goes your emotional relations with people who expressed opinions, as if you'd got or wanted friendly relations with them - their opinion about your type would be become more weighty than for any of T types.

"You want to play into your delusions that you're ESI when I've already said you're nothing like ESI from the start and you're not my mirror."

You seem overesteemate the importance of speculative opinions. While allow emotions where it's not appropriate.
Fi types tend to hold more polite. If you "don't care" about what other people think and feel to the degree of being so rude with them - you don't use strong traits of SEE. It's sad. Even in talking with T types, to establish or not ruin good emotions helps to convince, - they are just lesser sensetive to this. Good logical arguments (better than "you're nothing like") and positive emotions is what helps to convince people.
For understanding correct types and having relatively good arguments needs to read books about types and to watch how people near you behave according to their types. The more of typed people and more communications with them - the better you'd understood types to talk about them. Also, I'd recommend to use only normal theory close to basics of Jung, as other theory (which is much used by Gulenko, for example) is doubtful to be correct.

[Lolita]

ESI is close to correct LSI. Without IR effects to understand own type is not easy.
I notice, ashlesha expresses more emotionality than LSI should. I relate this to other factors, as her nonverbal fits to LSI good. But for her the difference is not evident, as VI needs skills. By common behavior the difference between T/F is not clear in her case and without nonverbal I'd could doubt or to mistake. It's more doubtful than common to explain by her common behavior which we know here on the forum why she has T. While it's doubtful to convince about types even in common situations, as interpretations are significantly speculative and we know a little about those people.

Yeah, in your warped Beta God-complex LSI mind. LSI wants to be ESI because they know they don't have Fi to scale psychological distance and they act out like a whiny lil bitch Fe way when people don't follow their bullshit rules. LIKE YOU.

> Fi DOES NOT CARE about the collective opinion of their identity

From types factor point the situation is opposite. What is a type is logical region. So T types have higher criticism about types and lesser possibility to be misleaded by other people.
F types (especially base F) have more emotional relation to opinions, including in T regions where it's not appropriate. Compared to T types, F types easier accept opinions which they personally more like (Fi) or find more decent (Fe) and opinions which have people with such their emotional evaluations. And also people with F types show more than average of unreasonable negativism to logical region opinions which inspire more of negative emotions in them and to opinions which have people which are worse emotionally perceived by them.
So "people with Fi types CARE about the collective opinion about their type" higher than average and the most when want to keep emotionally pleasant relations with those people. Also for them is important to emotionally like those opinions in more degree than for T types, what may be by reasons as to think good IR with someone.
Se type would explain a scepsis about the a better. Situation when people have opinions about your inner psyche contents - Ne, to what Jung type relates too and psychology in general. Se types should lesser like to get "psychoanalysis" and such to have higher scepsis to opinions about their types. Then goes your emotional relations with people who expressed opinions, as if you'd got or wanted friendly relations with them - their opinion about your type would be become more weighty than for any of T types.

WRONG. You act like your understanding of socionics is what socionics is. Typical LSI shit. You're NOT Te lead, you IGNORE Te because you favor whatever bullshit you arbitrarily come up with in your mind, rigidify the process and then say you know the rules and others don't. You forgot that I saw you AGREE with DarkAngelFireWolf69's LSI typing for Ashlesha.

"You want to play into your delusions that you're ESI when I've already said you're nothing like ESI from the start and you're not my mirror."

You seem overesteemate the importance of speculative opinions. While allow emotions where it's not appropriate.
Fi types tend to hold more polite. If you "don't care" about what other people think and feel to the degree of being so rude with them - you don't use strong traits of SEE. It's sad. Even in talking with T types, to establish or not ruin good emotions helps to convince, - they are just lesser sensetive to this. Good logical arguments (better than "you're nothing like") and positive emotions is what helps to convince people.
For understanding correct types and having relatively good arguments needs to read books about types and to watch how people near you behave according to their types. The more of typed people and more communications with them - the better you'd understood types to talk about them. Also, I'd recommend to use only normal theory close to basics of Jung, as other theory (which is much used by DarkAngelFireWolf69, for example) is doubtful to be correct.

WRONG again. Your rigid system is bullshit. You don't even understand Jung or socionics and just want to impose your bullshit rules. You're boxed in with you think and you want to box others into it, just like every other LSI. You support Kassie's delusions because you already recognize she's LSI like you who feed off their delusional Ti and feed off it when they get Fe validation. Reality means nothing to you. Betas only live in their fucked up minds and want to suck everyone into their world. If something doesn't fit into your system, then it's wrong. NO. That brain dead cow is not ESI and you'll never be LSE. You're fucking scared to get typed by DarkAngelFireWolf69 because you'll come out as LSI and you'll have a fucking mental collapse like all the other Betas in denial because it doesn't validate your stupid system.

[Lolita]

My 1st subtype is normalizing, which is what I am most of the time. I'm either creative or dominant as my 2nd subtype, I'm leaning more towards C. I don't think I have what it takes to go from N sub to D and maintain it for longer durations outside of emergencies.

[marooned]

Yes the LSIs are so jealous and emo. Totally an emo type. SEE on the other hand isn't emo and image conscious with their SeFe. Lol.

PS I don't wanna say the emotions of LSI aren't intense, I'm not trying to put down my dual!

[PinKDiGiT18]

This is my experience, can’t speak for anyone else:

As an EII-Ne, I observe there is greater harmony and subconscious complementarity of actions/life rhythm with LSE-Si than there is with LSE-Te. You put us in the same room and it’s like that’s exactly the environment we were designed to be in. It’s very comfortable and uniquely psychologically satisfying - so ideal that it is, in a sense, boring.

LSE-Te is a different story. Still undoubtedly my duals, but from the get-go you can perceive a disruption in rhythm. Where I expect greater attention to Si matters, LSE-Te focuses less on that and more on supporting Te aims any way they can. So it’s immediately less comfortable; and by the same token, much more alluring. I have also found that it’s almost impossible for the Si-subtype to offend me, while the Te-sub and I have a much more difficult time getting along. I think there is greater opportunity for growth of partners when the subtypes are irrational-rational, but for pure psychological comfort, rational-rational/irrational-irrational dual pairs are definitely the winner.

Edit because I forgot about Activity: I’ve only had close relationships with SLI-Si and I consider that possibly my best Intertype other than duality. Lots of fun and implicit understanding. I’ve had a couple SLI-Te friends but the relation is extremely tense at a close psychological distance and touches my weak spots much more than the other subtype, or most types.

[Stray Cat]

I'm SLE-TI

I prefer INFP-Fe & ENFJ-Ni

ENFJ-Fe use too much Fe. INFP-Ni can be great so long as they can appreciate Se rather exclusively focus on their Ni.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

I like SLE-Se better over all probably but I still like SLE-Ti. Same with LSI.

[Bethanyclaire]

I was wondering how confident people feel in categorising individuals into the two different subtypes? Do you usually decide on one or the other? How often do you think of someone as having no subtype or being somewhere in the middle? Do most people even out as they get older? Sorry should probably make a new thread for this..

[Stray Cat]

I was wondering how confident people feel in categorising individuals into the two different subtypes? Do you usually decide on one or the other? How often do you think of someone as having no subtype or being somewhere in the middle? Do most people even out as they get older? Sorry should probably make a new thread for this..

I don't buy DCNH. Pretty easy thing with creative vs base subtypes, though

[Bethanyclaire]

Yes, I mean the two subtype system. (More thoughts on DCNH later). In his book, Gulenko still refers to the two subtype system (if I’m correct in my understanding) which I found interesting (describes how they look physically and sometimes comments on ITR dynamics relating to subtype).

I guess you need to have typed quite a lot of people to have a clear idea in your head of which each subtype might look like by noticing some key differences which stand out. Or learn more about how to spot the functions (hard lol).

[Stray Cat]

Yes, I mean the two subtype system. (More thoughts on DCNH later). In his book, Gulenko still refers to the two subtype system (if I’m correct in my understanding) which I found interesting (describes how they look physically and sometimes comments on ITR dynamics relating to subtype).

I guess you need to have typed quite a lot of people to have a clear idea in your head of which each subtype might look like by noticing some key differences which stand out. Or learn more about how to spot the functions (hard lol).

I can tell type & subtype with no doubts at all. It isn't something I'd brag about. Def useful as it makes interactions smoother. Once I nail someone's type (& subtype), I listen. It's pretty easy from there. I got a degree in comparative psychology. I tend to be patient with this type of sh*t

Type & subtype don't change BUT a self actualized person can temporarily switch subtype.

[Beautiful sky]

I never paid attention to subtype. I would say that my husband is more Si now but he’s also E6 so he’s like a balanced Te and Si

[Bethanyclaire]

@Stray Cat yep I can type people well enough, but up until now I’ve used enneagram classifications for dividing people into categories further than core sociotype.

‘Type & subtype don't change BUT a self actualized person can temporarily switch subtype.’ This makes sense to me!

[Bethanyclaire]

I can’t imagine someone not having any discernible subtype..but I can imagine a lot of people with weak or moderate, maybe less with strong.

Who are these people with no subtype?

[Bethanyclaire]

From sociotype.com:

There is no single universally accepted subtype notation system; however, one's subtype is generally added following the person's type; e.g., ESE-Fe... This notation however fails to describe the strength of the subtype--it's position along the socionics circle. Therefore, sociotype.com adds a numerical notation that denotes the strength of the subtype, e.g., ESE-2Fe. The range is set between 0 and 3:

• 0: no discernible subtype
• 1: weak subtype
• 2: moderate subtype
• 3: strong subtype

[Disturbed]

I get along better with EIE-Fe males than EIE-Ni males but not by much. I try to avoid EIE females, I can't always tell which subtype is which, but I think EIE-Fe females prefer LSI-Se males. I really don't want to wind up in a long term romantic relationship with a Beta though, I'm really kind of afraid of it. If my appearance were ok, I could have a relationship with an SEE-Se or an ESI-Se or an ILE-Ti, but my appearance is too terrible for them (and for EIE females really, they're pretty concerned with appearance).

But for LSIs, though, I get along better with the Se sub. However, they get pretty irritated with me; I get pretty irritated with LSI-Ti.

[Bethanyclaire]

I think perhaps Rebel was saying that in an ideal scenario, people of opposite subtypes would be able to learn more from each other in the long run. But I know he didn't think it was a good thing to have a strong subtype, so perhaps two people of opposite subtypes can only be a good thing if they're only slightly off the centre. People with not much subtype can probably switch sides quite easily too. My good IEE friend seems like a fi subtype but I do think I learn more from her than my IEE-ne friend. They are both good friends but I feel like I am challenged more to develop my weak points around the IEE-fi. With the IEE-ne I have more political talks and convos where we muse about the meaning of life. With the IEE-fi we talk about every day stuff and I feel myself being challenged to be a better person and fight harder for myself. In the past I had a very close IEE-ne friend and also a reasonably close IEE-fi friend (I think fi but it's not obvious). The IEE-ne let me down ultimately, I think we took our friendship for granted because it felt so easy. The IEE-fi and I drifted apart.

[adage]

I think perhaps Rebel was saying that in an ideal scenario, people of opposite subtypes would be able to learn more from each other in the long run. But I know he didn't think it was a good thing to have a strong subtype, so perhaps two people of opposite subtypes can only be a good thing if they're only slightly off the centre. People with not much subtype can probably switch sides quite easily too. My good IEE friend seems like a fi subtype but I do think I learn more from her than my IEE-ne friend. They are both good friends but I feel like I am challenged more to develop my weak points around the IEE-fi. With the IEE-ne I have more political talks and convos where we muse about the meaning of life. With the IEE-fi we talk about every day stuff and I feel myself being challenged to be a better person and fight harder for myself. In the past I had a very close IEE-ne friend and also a reasonably close IEE-fi friend (I think fi but it's not obvious). The IEE-ne let me down ultimately, I think we took our friendship for granted because it felt so easy. The IEE-fi and I drifted apart.

Hm, Idk what Rebel meant, but this post got me thinking.

Since he said strong subtype is not a very good thing, maybe having opposite subtype would sort of force people to naturaly go toward less imbalance between base abd creative, making subtype less strong.
The matching subtypes would be more "comfortable" and not help people achieve balance as much, maybe even accentuate subtypes even more.
But idk.

[Toro]

The effect that subtype has on ITR is negligible. No matter the subtype the dimensions are the same, the functional blocks are the same, the valued functions are the same.

[Bethanyclaire]

But isn’t there something appealing about the opposite subtype..I mean EIE-ni is damn hot. Sei-fe is damn hot. There’s some facts for you or is that just coz I’m a IEI-ni and I want what I can’t have.

Is there something about Estp-ti that means I’m less likely to get bored of them..is there a bit more push/pull in the interaction, also kinda like Adam was saying, and Rebel..you get more done together, you achieve more. Is there some satisfaction in that.

edit: right so if I think about it the two people I’ve loved the most in life, outside of family, are my childhood best friend (female EIE-fe) and a male SEI-fe. The former was platonic. I don’t know what yet, but I think there is significance in this telling me that perhaps, both subtypes (for duality anyway) are equal in their attraction.

[Stray Cat]

But isn’t there something appealing about the opposite subtype..I mean EIE-ni is damn hot. Sei-fe is damn hot. There’s some facts for you or is that just coz I’m a IEI-ni and I want what I can’t have.

Is there something about Estp-ti that means I’m less likely to get bored of them..is there a bit more push/pull in the interaction, also kinda like Adam was saying, and Rebel..you get more done together, you achieve more. Is there some satisfaction in that.

edit: right so if I think about it the two people I’ve loved the most in life, outside of family, are my childhood best friend (female EIE-fe) and a male SEI-fe. The former was platonic. I don’t know what yet, but I think there is significance in this telling me that perhaps, both subtypes (for duality anyway) are equal in their attraction.

The purpose of duality would be functional complimentation and/or functional balance. According to theory, and with you being an IEI-Ni, the SLE-Se would be most ideal in bringing you out of your shell or, perhaps, getting you out of a funk. A psychologically self actualized SLE-Se would bring the most psychological comfort, in general, to an IEI-Ni. However, if any type engages in self-loathing, their true psychological type doesn't manifest and, thus, that person might not appreciate their dual.

An IEI-Ni and SLE-Ti likely regurgitate similar or obvious information due to both of having boosted Ni and Ti functions. It's also the reason some suggest that an LSI-Se could be a better compliment to the IEI-Ni than the SLE-Ti

In terms of some sort of compatibility over the long haul, opposite subtypes would probably either bore each other or have issues related to life rhythms. IEI-Ni are very irrational, a bit free spirited in going with their flow and SLE-Ti have a slight bent toward some sort of stated rationale for behavior.

It's your life, obviously and you can pursue whomever you like

[Armitage]

It's also the reason some suggest that an LSI-Se could be a better compliment to the IEI-Ni than the SLE-Ti

I would assume that a LSI-Se would still exhibit more Ti, than a SLE-Ti, though, because otherwise the LSI could not have been a LSI, since their hallmark definition is primary Ti.

This also makes sense to me. If you assume that an LIE-Ni has strengthened Ni and is therefore similar to an ILI-Te, then you could assume that an ESI-Se with enhanced Se is moving towards being an SEE-Fi, and an ILI is Dual to an SEE.

For me it is like this, because I generally find ESI-Fi's too soft and squishy compared to ESI-Se's, who I look up to for their bravery and speed of action. The force of will of ESI-Se's can be a clashing point, but even if we clash about it, I find it sexy to rebel against their drive with them doubling down in response. It's paradoxical, but somehow it's highly attractive to me.

If I wanted a partner who pushed me to do more stuff, but who went home with another person, I'd choose the ESI-Se.

Why would you not desire to go home with the ESI-Se?

[Adam Strange]

Why would you not desire to go home with the ESI-Se?

@Armitage, you read that wrong.

I very much would like to go home with an ESI-Se, but she would probably not want to go home with me.

I find ESI-Se women to be more mercurial and impulsive and, unfortunately, less psychologically stable than ESI-Fi women.

I originally called ESI-Fi women “nesters” and ESI-Se women “the sports model” because of the impression I got from each type. The ESI-Fi give the impression of stability and home-making, while the ESI-Se give the impression of female Amazons, ready to fight at the drop of a hat.

I once went out with an ESI-Se and for the first few minutes, she was in a total panic. She was scanning everywhere for any sign of danger and she looked like she was on the verge of screaming hysterically. I engaged my “I’m an e8, I’ll take care of everything calmly, there’s nothing to be afraid of”, and spoke to her in normal, calming terms, and she stabilized and calmed down.
Weeks later, I asked her why she was in a panic, and she said, “I wasn’t in a panic, I just didn’t know who you were. Who is this guy?”
@FDG, another LIE, is married to an ESI-Fi and he said that the ESI-Ses that he dated were psychologically unstable. I wouldn’t go quite that far, but they seem to see danger and threats at every turn. I have no problem with that, personally, and I find the ESI-Ses to be sexier and more fun, but I happen to like instability.

I assume that this instability and constant doubting of relationships would lead them to have a Plan B in their relationships. Hence, they would be more likely to impulsively go home with someone else.


I’ve dated three women whom I would classify as ESI-Se. They were all beautiful and admirable and so much fun and I didn’t sleep with any of them, and that was not for my lack of trying. They were always coming and going, looking and backing away. “Come here, get away.”

I’ve dated three women whom I’d classify as ESI-Fi, and I slept with two and not the third only because she was too young. ESI-Fi observe you silently from a distance, evaluate you, then pull you into their nest to make eggs with. Now go out there and find some resources so we can raise these ducklings.

[Armitage]

LSI-Se do exhibit more Ti than SLE-Ti but how each type communicates or what they exude will be different

Examples, please?

Subtype will be pertinent to psychological attraction because an LSI-Se will resemble an ESI-Se moreso than any other type. As a result of that, ESI-Se may attract EIE-Ni types quite strongly.

An LSI-Se would behave akin to an ESI-Se even more so than an EII-Fi, despite the ESI and EII sharing their primary function?

I find ESI-Se women to be more mercurial and impulsive and, unfortunately, less psychologically stable than ESI-Fi women.

Definitely, I can confirm this with the ESI-Se guys too.

I originally called ESI-Fi women “nesters” and ESI-Se women “the sports model” because of the impression I got from each type. The ESI-Fi give the impression of stability and home-making, while the ESI-Se give the impression of female Amazons, ready to fight at the drop of a hat.

Yes, they do, I find their strength and bravery impressive.

I wouldn’t go quite that far, but they seem to see danger and threats at every turn. I have no problem with that, personally, and I find the ESI-Ses to be sexier and more fun, but I happen to like instability.

They tend to have trust problems, indeed.

I assume that this instability and constant doubting of relationships would lead them to have a Plan B in their relationships. Hence, they would be more likely to impulsively go home with someone else.

As long as you give them no reason to doubt the relationship, things should be fine.

I’ve dated three women whom I would classify as ESI-Se. They were all beautiful and admirable and so much fun and I didn’t sleep with any of them, and that was not for my lack of trying. They were always coming and going, looking and backing away. “Come here, get away.”

That's because you're doing it wrong, you were trying to lead them into your house, but you should follow them. They decide the right time and place, and what we do is provide suggestions, so we suit their Ne-POLR by handling that for them. And they want us to take care of Te too, but in their way. How we handle Te and if we listen to them informs their Fi character judgement of us.

I’ve dated three women whom I’d classify as ESI-Fi, and I slept with two and not the third only because she was too young. ESI-Fi observe you silently from a distance, evaluate you, then pull you into their nest to make eggs with. Now go out there and find some resources so we can raise these ducklings.

Yes, once you have met the trust level you're in and they then clearly pull you in. They're loyal, kind, and very warm. ESI-Se's always have some lingering doubt, and thereby inspire me to show the best of me every day. They're passionate, self-confident, and headstrong.