To all Supervisors and Benefactors

[Rebelondeck]

I've noted in a lot of the postings that the subject terms seem to imply to many that these types have a superior position over certain other types. However, the spin that I put on the concept is that each type has an inability to see the value in the way that certain other types think. In a sense, supervisors exhibit bigotry while benefactors have blind spots so would perception of the respective relationships be any different with alternate labelling?

a.k.a. I/O

[Adam Strange]

I've noted in a lot of the postings that the subject terms seem to imply to many that these types have a superior position over certain other types. However, the spin that I put on the concept is that each type has an inability to see the value in the way that certain other types think. In a sense, supervisors exhibit bigotry while benefactors have blind spots so would perception of the respective relationships be any different with alternate labelling?

a.k.a. I/O

Relabeling always changes perception, but only for a while.

When my (female) Benefactors are around, I feel like it it Christmas. I'm just happy to see them, and I also instinctively know that our relations are optimal at arm's length.
When my supervisors are around, I feel energized to do Si stuff, but I get the clear impression that they think I suck at it.
When my Beneficiaries are around, I feel like overlooking their flaws and helping them.
When my Supervisees are around, I feel like they have an extremely hard time doing things that I find to be simple.
These are asymmetric relations.

I think by relabeling these relations as being symmetric, you are going backwards, destroying information.

[Rebelondeck]

........I think by relabeling these relations as being symmetric, you are going backwards, destroying information.

They're certainly not symmetric but from a management perspective, I saw much condescension and impatience in relations of supervision - a bigoted attitude of let me do that for you, idiot. Eventually, most supervisees came to resent the so-called "help" and started think of the supervisor in a negative light. What I found most destructive about relations of benefit was an apparent blindness of the benefactors toward the beneficiaries perspective, which washed out any "help" they thought they gave. Ergo, I perceived dysfunction perpetrated by the supervisors and benefactors rather than one type supplying something valuable to another who should naturally "appreciate" it.

a.k.a. I/O

[Bertrand]

I don't know, I generally appreciate the help from my benefactors (and thus relate to them with sincere gratitude) and I know enough to be gentle with my supervisees. Both I keep at a distance, but we all get along wonderfully and they're some of my favorite/most effective colleagues to work with

I feel like if those relations are getting messed up its because someone has an over-inflated ego. If people are humble they should, in my experience, flow nicely in the workplace. I feel like the entire dynamic has to be predicated on the understanding that you don't know everything and neither does anyone else. thus you extend grace to those who need it and aren't resentful and likewise receive criticism in a productive fashion

conflictors, though, are another story--it just feels like they're blatantly working against you (you extend grace to them and they abuse it; try to accommodate their criticism and things get worse, not better, etc). i feel like even the most humble person will experience this, although they may not show it. I try not to show it and just avoid conflictors, not to "punish" them but because everything just goes smoother if we keep out of eachother's way

[Rebelondeck]

@Bertrand

I agree that on an intermittent basis, these relationships can seem quite positive but over time, many seem to die due to a thousand cuts; either one party writes off the other or the other develops resentment or both. I'm sure that interaction is quite different among individuals where ego doesn't get in the way; I guess I've had to deal with a lot of prima donnas in scientific fields but I've also seen the trend in a number of personal relationships. Inherently, these relations do have high potential for very specific sources of friction.

a.k.a. I/O

[Tigerfadder]

So with model G in mind (energy model) it seem that supervision somehow goes that information travel from supervisor to supervisee but energy travels from supervisee to supervisor.

[Rebelondeck]

@Tigerfadder

I'm not convinced of the energy model, which seems to be an attempt to rationalize outcomes. I'm more basic: one partner has something the other needs but may not want so we have various supply and demand scenarios. People don't like to feel indebted; few will continue to give away something for free; few like being given something they don't really want; and few like having nothing valuable for payment......


a.k.a. I/O

[Tigerfadder]

@Tigerfadder

I'm not convinced of the energy model, which seems to be an attempt to rationalize outcomes. I'm more basic: one partner has something the other needs but may not want so we have various supply and demand scenarios. People don't like to feel indebted; few will continue to give away something for free; few like being given something they don't really want; and few like having nothing valuable for payment......


a.k.a. I/O

rationalize outcomes?

As far for the rest of it, it what I heard of psychopathology. "scientific study of mental disorders". Demand and supply etc, narcissistic supply. It is not the same thing.

[Rebelondeck]

rationalize outcomes?

None of the existing models are based on an actual information processing control system that would be able to provide rationalization of input/output processes and their observed outcomes. Socionics, MBTI, etc. are using various classification models to explain behavioural observations originating from a yet to be defined control system; the energy model being one. I doubt that energy really has meaning for this system although the system can affect energy resources in the body. And, any aspects that can't be quantified should be discounted......

a.k.a. I/O

[Tigerfadder]

None of the existing models are based on an actual information processing control system that would be able to provide rationalization of input/output processes and their observed outcomes. Socionics, MBTI, etc. are using various classification models to explain behavioural observations originating from a yet to be defined control system; the energy model being one. I doubt that energy really has meaning for this system although the system can affect energy resources in the body. And, any aspects that can't be quantified should be discounted......

a.k.a. I/O

Go chase your system of input output! tbh I am still not sure what you are looking for.

[Rebelondeck]

Go chase your system of input output! tbh I am still not sure what you are looking for.

I'm not looking for anything; I have had a system for years that has been sufficient for my needs. I think Socionics should adapt a hard-science model but I couldn't care less if it didn't.

a.k.a. I/O

[The Reality Denialist]

Beneficiary: It is bit draining to go in full creative mode. Also lack in PoLR department makes it very biting indeed.
Benefactor: I'm bit like being a very capable clown in bouncy castle to them. While capable in their department (which they like to verbalize) the suggestive department is mightily lacking making proper collaboration very hard
to keep up with pace. Semi duals are relaxed in this department.

Supervisee: Base just comes out and they are totally flabbergasted but sometimes amused. It can be as simple as making a solution (liquid) based on some seemingly irrelevant references. Also manipulation of creative is sometimes seen as improper application by them.
Supevisor: Everything seems to go OK but they make it sound it is completely opposite. then they can do stuff which is completely foreign to me.

[Delilah]

Maybe there's a tendency to stray from your original meaning, but is that necessarily a bad thing? I'd say the labels convey your meaning but conflate other notions maybe it's a matter of whether you're satisfied with that ?

[Chae]

When my (female) Benefactors are around, I feel like it it Christmas. I'm just happy to see them, and I also instinctively know that our relations are optimal at arm's length.
When my Beneficiaries are around, I feel like overlooking their flaws and helping them.

Awehhh