Yes
No
I'm not sure.
It doesn't matter
Do you believe in God?
...and why, or why not?
I am always curious about what people believe and, even more interestingly, why... but it's not something you can ask most people you're not friends w, and even then things can get contentious.
Hopefully there won't be fights, but I really want to know people's stances :-)
"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is." - Yogi Berra
lolOriginally Posted by jaein
I really would like to hear people's explanations, but the poll is anonymous, so if you want to answer the question without elaborating, at least no one will know who said what.
"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is." - Yogi Berra
Yes
Because of guidance and values. Connection to our community and the global community as well. For LOVE about all things and compassion. All those things that we're deem human
-
Dual type(as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
Sure lots of them as concepts and for inspiration.
http://www.godchecker.com/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conceptions_of_God
Most people I know who are Christian believe in god because they were taught to. It was ingrained and they really can't explain why other than what they were taught. This is what I have determined based on conversations.
Incidentally, I have never dreamt of the Christian god even though I was raised Christian. I have however dreamt of the Christian Satan and demons on many occasions thanks to the focus on hell that I was exposed to in my search for "god" in the Christian faith. I even went the whole born again christian route even though I was baptized as Greek Orthodox. That really upset my mom for awhile but after years of disagreements on god she and I have agreed to let each other be. Primarily because she does not focus on the negatives like hell. she believes in a loving god who answers her prayers. I will never tell her I don't believe in god again because it hurts her feelings and I am not sure if I would call what I believe in "god". It is a universal multi-dimensional force of creation, for lack of a shorter term. I don't believe that force has any personal feelings or preferences in how creation evolves itself and has probably gone through many changes of forms even before there was what we now call the universe. IOW I don't know but I have ideas. It has no emotions and is not human in any way.
Last edited by Aylen; 03-04-2016 at 07:15 PM.
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
I believe in God (I'm a christian) and it would be a huge stretch to call my upbringing nurturing in terms of religion. Still, I don't think I'll help with the whys. Grace. Sure, but it's not an explanation that's at all helpful in this case, I suppose.
It feels true. Do you know Schiller's song "I feel you"? It's a lot like that. Even when I didn't believe in God, I still loved God. So hey, why fight it? ;>
I call myself batyote and I fight crime at night.
yes
I do believe in God but I do not believe in a creator God.
Deism?
No idea what that is I am going to go look it up....
No, no God started nor created anything. There is no phenomenon outside of basic physics and chemistry that has given rise to life on planet Earth. There was never a Creater God.
God is a aspect of human consciousness, shared by each person, and is a birth right as a species of great ape with massive brains. God is a conceptualization of this awareness and is a cultural endowment of countless generations before us. In some instances this conceptualization has given form to a societal framework on which we base our necessary beliefs in the parts of our minds that is boundless. These ideas of a creator God are artifacts, even derelicts from another time when the conceptualization was still a widespread illusion. This illusion has simultaneously led to all kinds of harmful endemic delusions as well as many gracious, noble, beneficial and fulfilling acts both at the individual and societial levels. The Crusades juxtaposed to the good work of feeding less fortunate come to mind.
Man's rationality has freed the collective societies from the bondage of such beliefs (but not fast enough) That we have come to this perdiciment is a consequence of 10,000 years of cultural indoctrination in the belief of a separate individual identitity. This was the original fall from grace, self-awareness, from the unselfconcious yet unified awareness within ourselves that we now call God.
In my view does knowing this take away from the personal experience of God? Not at all. It only serves to illuminate the incredible inhereted lineage of our biological selves and the responsibility that follows as an awakened creature in a bizarrely terrifying Universe. A Universe empty of anything except our own perceptions projected onto its canvas. Knowing this experientially was both terrifying and beautiful.
As one forumite quoted to me not long ago "God is all to human".
Last edited by wacey; 03-04-2016 at 10:26 PM.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism
Yes I have read that now thank-you. And no, I do not subscribe to this amalgamated merging of God and rationality. That is just a transitioning philosophy from one belief into another to increase the comfort of the believers at that time. A creator God that created the Universe and then left it hands off is simply a more subtle and nuanced concept whose roots are firmly planted in the original creator myth. This is just another mythology, albeit an eloquent one. If the Religious could not have their creator in life on Earth, then the next best thing was that he created it and then left it to circumstance, of which those to he also happened to have created.
Man's nature and selective evolutionary pressure gave us the ability to reason, not God.
The Universe exists and we are only now probing its mysteries. It was not created, it just is by virtue of its very nature. That it exists is both cause and effect alone.
That is a tough one for the Religious to grapple with. Because if there is no creator..then who is running the show?
The really scary and freeing part is...no one.
No. The idea of a bearded sky daddy watching me touch myself is ridiculous.
LSI-Se 836 Sp/Sx
Every time you touch yourself, baby Jesus cries.
Well, God isn't even a man, no assignment if you will.
The problem with god is that he has no weaknesses. It makes no sense to me for a magical being that is omnipotent, omniscient, and eternal, to somehow just pop into existence with such incredible traits built in. God is just an anthropological construct, wishful thinking. For those who have a feeling connection with God, such as Maritsa, why does God have to exist to form connection, values, and love? Why can't we just form such things on our own without a god?
Because if it is not in servitude to others, then it is in servitude to the self. God fills in the gaps, when you can't see who or how you're serving others.
No. Sure, I know that it's irrational to outright deny god's existence, but I also don't have any reason to believe in a god (I was raised as an atheist). Also, the question itself is problematic, because the answer completely depends on your idea of what constitutes "god". Is it an actual being, some form of primal energy or something else? Is he omnipotent or not? Does he exist within the universe/dimension or outside of it? Religions tend to have very different concepts of god.
But it makes sense that people invented god at some point. It is a way to find convincing answers for the basic questions of our existence. But you don't really "need" him anymore (at least for the most part), considering all the things we know today. Humans can be explained by natural laws, our feelings have a purpose. Both our bodies and mind are subject to evolution. Morality is subjective and religion has been a tool to control people almost from the beginning.
At some point, you will eventually delve into the realm of philosophy where some faith is needed to continue, but this is inevitable.
„Man can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.“
– Arthur Schopenhauer
Because it has never been validated to me through my thoughts or experiences and everybody who believes in god acts like a crackpot.
Yes because patterns.
Oh, to find you in dreams - mixing prior, analog, and never-beens... facts slip and turn and change with little lucidity. except the strong, permeating reality of emotion.
I do not believe in god or any supernatural entities, as I only believe there is merit in limiting myself to that which is capable of being observed (i.e. natural phenomena). I am perhaps even more certain that a moral god does not exist, which is probably a more important conclusion.
Yes. I have two reasons, the first being observational and the second being personal.
1) Observational: There is far too much evidence that God exists.
Morally, we all know it's wrong to lie, steal, cheat, murder. We all believe in justice. We all desire to extend compassion. These come from God in perfect balance.
"Yet the LORD longs to be gracious to you; therefore He will rise up to show you compassion.
For the LORD is a God of justice. Blessed are all who wait for Him!"
Isaiah 30:18
Creation is just too complex in its micro and macro design to have happened on its own.
"The Heavens are telling of the glory of God;
And their expanse is declaring the work of His hands."
-Psalm 19:1
Logically, all things creations have a creator. All designs have a designer.
"In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth."
-Genesis 1:1
2) Personal reasons: I've had prayers answered and things occur in ways that are unexplainable.
-I was crying one day. I prayed for Jesus to mow my lawn because I was too sad. As I went outside to get started, my neighbor, who is this disgruntled old man that had never come over before, came over and told me to go inside my house. He pointed at his chest and he said "I'm mowing your lawn." I tried to split the yard with him and he pointed at his chest again and repeated himself.
-I was once moved to pray in the middle of a jog. I veered off into the woods to pray. When I stood back up, I realized I'd knelt in a patch of poison ivy. I never had a reaction, even though I've had reactions in the past.
-I once prayed for something to do on a quiet Wednesday. I felt God telling me to visit an elderly woman on the street that I had never met. When I walked over there, she was crying in her living room. She was lonely and upset, and it was her 86th birthday.
I have several pages of these types of things recorded in a journal. I could go on. There's just too much in my mind and experience to even doubt.
My reasons for entrusting my heart & soul to Jesus are too numerous to write here, however I'd be willing to discuss in detail at any time. And for the record, I considered other religions. In fact, I studied religions in college. China and Japan religions were the most fascinating to me, and that class ultimately became my favorite, as it was taught by a professor who had once practiced as a buddhist monk.
Last edited by applejacks; 03-06-2016 at 03:54 AM.
And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and gone tomorrow, won't he more surely care for you?- Matthew 6:30
Not all of us.
How about this explanation:
(First off: Let's assume human traits are (at least in part) hereditary. This is not such a strange thing to assume, as children do tend to resemble their parents not only physically, but also regarding their personalities.)
Over the course of history, people always had to rely on cooperation with fellow humans. Sometimes to a greater, sometimes to a lesser extent, but it was always necessary. However, some personality traits (for example lying, stealing, cheating, murdering) proved to be problematic in the community and people were aware of that. As a consequence, people who excessively made use of these destructive actions were shunned and had smaller chances to find a mate and have children. And even if they managed to reproduce, their children (if they resembled their parent regarding their personality) would have a difficult time as well to be included in the community, mate and reproduce.
However, if a person instinctively resented stealing and murdering, they would be regarded as a positive influence on the community. This would cause them to have less problems finding a mate and the support of the community. That means that their attitude towards destructive behaviors would, at some point, dominate over the more uncritical or indifferent opinions. And because many people share these sentiments, it appears as if god has ingrained these values in our minds. But in fact, our moralities would just be the result of trial & error over the course of millions of years.
„Man can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.“
– Arthur Schopenhauer
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
I believe in appleyacks.
Ever had an actual conversation with God?
I meant to reply to this awhile back and got sidetracked. I talk with God all the time. He doesn't speak back through burning bushes, but He does speak. I hear Him when I read scripture, and sometimes I hear Him when I'm running or praying. I remember the first time I heard Him, in fact.
I had climbed the Peak, which is a local mountain hike that overlooks five states: Tennessee, Kentucky, North Carolina, Virginia, and West Virginia. I sat on the top of the mountain and decided to meditate / pray, whatever. I wanted to do something "spiritual", although I wasn't really Christian at the time. I always loved reading about and contemplating eastern religions and studies.
So I sat in the stillness, overlooking the mountains and trees. I heard a voice, soft, still, and quiet in the corners of my heart.
SEEK
I don't know how to explain it. The word almost echoed around me - not audibly, but internally - as if my heart mirrored the acoustics of the valleys all around me.
I came down the mountain and was still confused over what had happened. I was moved to find a Bible. I hadn't opened a Bible in years at that time. I didn't have one, so I downloaded an app that had some random 30 day Bible study. I opened to the first page, and there was Jeremiah 29:13 at the top of the page:
"You will seek me and you will find me
when you seek me with all of your heart."
That scripture is the same scripture that my mother made and framed with needlepoint on the day that I was born. It's the same scripture that I opened to directly the next time I sat down in a church and opened a Bible for the first time.
This is just a small excerpt of many conversations and things that only fuel and ignite my faith.
And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and gone tomorrow, won't he more surely care for you?- Matthew 6:30
I think there is a real danger with ideologies that say things like "Seek and ye shall find". There are many competing religions that say words to that effect, and they cannot all be true (they could indeed all be false): I think that kind of mantra is objectionable itself, but is basically geared to indoctrinating people. If the religion does not respect those who don't actually find anything, after years of searching, or if it does not respect those who find an answer that is contrary to the tenets of the religion, what value does the statement have?
You quote Corinthians, which says that Love "is not self-seeking" (amongst other things), but this seems contrary to a religious text which tells you that god is a jealous god, that you must worship god, that you must seek and find him (rather than the other way round), that god is Love, that you must fear and love god, etc.
And I think there is real danger in the ideology of secular humanism, when clearly we are deeply, deeply flawed people.
I would agree that there are competing religions out there, and I would agree that they all cannot be true. But you cannot say that one isn't true simply because another has used the same statement or one similar statement. That in itself is not grounds to say something isn't truth.
You bring up both good and difficult examples from the Bible. I will try to answer them in order. I have only a little time right now, but I do want to address these, and not because I want to debate. It's because I love God and I think so many people don't understand who He is, or what His heart is. But trust me. My inner enneagram 9 does not enjoy debating. So please understand that I'm not responding just to "fight" this out with you. These are passages that should be analyzed, because on the surface they seem cruel and harsh. But that's not who God is.
Numbers 31: This is a hard passage for any of us with warm blood, but first understand that God takes no pleasure in destroying anyone.
"Do you think that I like to see wicked people die?' says the Sovereign LORD. 'Of course not! I want them to turn from their wicked ways of living!" -Ezekiel 18:23
However, the wages of sin is death. God has wronged nobody. We've all sinned and we all deserve death. That's important to understand. Second of all, God did not even spare His own people when they sinned by taking up pagan wives in chapter 25, which He had forbidden they do. He forbid it to protect the messianic line that would offer salvation to any and all. The Jews were a short covenant to bring about Christ. God needed a Sanctified group of people to do so. And in this case, the entire culture of people in Numbers chapter 25-31 were so evil and sinful that God could not tolerate it longer, and they were turning God's people to idolatry. Their evil was passing down from generation to generation. God's plan and purpose all along was the birth and sacrifice of Christ Jesus so that ALL would have the option to access grace through His sacrificial blood.
Deuteronomy: God is not pro-rape, nor is He letting a rapist off easy. Rape is one of the most vile, disgusting, and heart-wrenching acts of evil out there. God hates rape. Rape is absolutely cruel and to even think of a rapist, in present day, marrying his victim is absolutely horrifying. This seems beyond cruel to us because we know to value a woman far above and beyond her sexual history, and we do not treat women as property. But they did not back then. Women could not even own property in that time. Yet this was not because of God's design.
God designed women to be cherished and loved the way Christ loved and died for the church. He designed men to love women so strongly that they would die for them. God says a woman is "more precious than jewels; And nothing you desire compares with her." (Proverbs 3:15). So God, in His great love for women, gave one of two consequences to rapists a) if she's engaged, a man has already gave his word to care for her and make sure that she is provided for. Thus, the rapist was stoned. Or b) if she's not engaged, even though God wants to stone the rapist for what he did, He also wants to make sure she is cared for and not completely abandoned to starve without home and provision.
And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and gone tomorrow, won't he more surely care for you?- Matthew 6:30
What danger would that be? Why would being "deeply, deeply flawed people" especially negatively affect the "ideology of secular humanism", when religion is also man-made, but has the added factor of being built on obscure sand that does not allow itself to be reasoned with, and which treats this life as of little or no value compared to the afterlife?
I did not suggest that this was the case: I raised the contradicting religions because there are many which say "seek and ye shall find". That I happen to find them all false is of secondary significance to my point.
Your view does not actually detract from the fact that the god of the Old and New Testament destroys many things, and threatens eternal suffering on humans. Regardless of whether or not god takes pleasure in destroying people, he is still described as fundamentally evil. I would actually say that a god that takes pleasure from causing unnecessary suffering would be less evil than a god that takes no pleasure from carrying out the same act.
I do not believe in god, so whether or not we deserve death has no significance to me personally. I would say however that a god that states that the infiniteness of death is a just punishment for a finite amount of sin committed during a mortal lifetime is fundamentally evil. One that says that you must also suffer for eternity on top of the death is even more evil, if that is possible.
God is pro-rape, because he allowed the Hebrews to have sex-slaves, and obliges someone who has been raped to marry their victim. It was codified into their laws. I do agree with you about rape being fundamentally evil however.
God is also pro-slavery, both in the way he endorsed it as a practice for the Hebrews (what would now be considered a war crime, along with genocide and mass-rape), and in the way that he described believers as slaves to their master in heaven.
I love this. Thanks for sharing it. It gave me the chills up and down, and warmed my heart at the same time.God is good. Yes, if we seek Him, we find Him. You went on the mountain and in your heart you sought a spiritual experience, a seeking you did not state out loud, but just kept in the silence in your heart, and He who loves you and knows your every thought and every desire knew that, and He gave you your desire, through a special gift, a word, one word that had and would have special meaning to you, and would lead you to where your heart wanted to go. I love it. God does not intrude, but He waits for the smallest opening of our heart. And He speaks to people in so many different ways, in every different way, and its always delightful to hear of how He speaks to another. Also this is an example of how God's actions and His words to us are perfect simplicity. Truly, perfection.
"A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........
"Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
attitude acceptable to today's standards." - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"
.
.
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I believe in love. I think if God exists it's Love and we humans warp that in so any ways
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
You claim not to believe in hell, so you do not believe in the Abrahamic god. The Abrahamic god said you should fear it: it would be very odd to fear love.
No, because it really just doesn't hold up against modern science. (speaking mainly against christianity since it is the most relevant here in USA) :
The earth is clearly not 6000 years old, as carbon dating, fossil records and general study of the earth show.
Numerous contradictions in the bible that can read about here- http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/contra/by_name.html
General absurdity in the bible, like people living to be 900 years old. (I'm pretty sure your brain would run out of memory capacity after 300 years)
Genetic records of animals show no bottleneck in the genepool that would of had to of happened after the great flood
How it happens to align itself a little too conveniently with the interest of ancient societies and governments, like forbidding adultery for example.
The fact the there how been thousands of religions that contradict the others' existence. If so many seemingly convincing religions have to be bullshit then there is nothing to say that they can't all be bullshit.
Last edited by Muddy; 03-06-2016 at 01:35 PM.
Catholicism treats much of that as allegories and parables
All of those mentioned in the post are less implausible than god.
/chases you with a stick
Go do some yard work or something lol
Goddidit.
It is oxymoronic to say there is evidence of the supernatural. Any such observation would by definition be a natural phenomenon, and there is no reason to think that nature can be transcended.
The Abrahamic texts are full of situations which would be classified as lying, stealing, cheating, and murder if they were ordered by another god, or by a person of a different religion. You only have to remember how the god of the Old Testament rewarded Jacob after cheating his brother of his birthright, and how that god ordered the genocide of neighbouring tribes so that the Israelites might steal their land. Or how Jesus lied when he said he would not go to a feast, but then went anyway, or how god is even recorded as making others lie for his own purpose.
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