Member Questionnaire (luchoislurking)

[DEAD]

So you may have a *conscious* Te function? (In mental ring, Ego or Superego)

Does not go against EIE. Doesn't prove it either, sure.

I think I may have a conscious Te function, but also a conscious Fe function. Well, I am pretty sure that I have a conscious Extroverted Judging function pretty high up on my functional stacking for some reason, and a well developed Extroverted Perception function, which makes me seem like an ExxP, when I nightn't actually be one. I'm at the age for developing/defining my lesser functions, so I may have been using it a lot more than I thought I was.

Noo, Merry/Subjectivist is not about being in a "merry" emotional state. It's about seeing the fun (emotional aspects in general) as separate from work (activities in general), meaning Fe valuing, and also about seeing the world, situations in a relativist way (Ti valuing). Serious/Objectivist is the opposite.

Yeah, well, I don't see how work can be fun, if you hate it, but I can also see how it can be fun if you make it fun. If it's something you want to do, and aspire to do well in that field and become a big name. And I can be quite realistic if I wanna be, so what does that make me?

I also find Gamma rather natural, my two long term relationships so far were with two gammas (ESI and gamma NT), both relationships ended though.

My parents were both gamma introverts, I am on very good terms with my mom (ESI). I could go on with examples.

Theory says betas and gammas get along quite well when one-on-one, less if in a group made up of betas and gammas. I'm inclined to agree with that.

Yeah, I can get on especially well with Gammas, more so than the majority of Betas, lol.

Yah gammas get attracted to me too a lot. So you get along with IEIs, LSIs?

Some IEIs, and I am okay with LSIs, but we never speak a lot. I mean, I like you, Myst. You're cool




How do you identify beta NFs vs delta NFs?[/QUOTE]

Personally, I find BETA NFs to be a lot more humanitarian related, spiritual, messiah complex, can be arrogant, more spiritual and religious than Delta NFs, and are a lot more Extroverted about things they believe in compared to Deltas. [This doesn't mean I hate them. I don't, but this is the main vibe I have picked up off a lot of them].

Deltas are a lot more idealistic on their own terms/ beliefs, don't have as much as of a messiah complex and are usually less arrogant and a lot more introverted/toned down with their beliefs and expressing them. They tend to be a lot more playful somehow, lol.

I guess it's the typical Fi vs Fe argument, in a sense. Both can be insightful in their own ways, but both have their own drawbacks.

[Myst]

I have ruled out all Gamma, Alpha NT, and pretty much every Introverted type, lol.

ENFj-EIE used to be on the list, but I can't see it anymore, after trial and error.

I assume you meant you ruled out all Delta. That sounds quite like your opposing quadra, which would put you in Beta.

May I ask why you ruled out EIE?

I think I may have a conscious Te function, but also a conscious Fe function. Well, I am pretty sure that I have a conscious Extroverted Judging function pretty high up on my functional stacking for some reason, and a well developed Extroverted Perception function, which makes me seem like an ExxP, when I nightn't actually be one. I'm at the age for developing/defining my lesser functions, so I may have been using it a lot more than I thought I was.

That, if you are an extratim type which you said you are, would leave you as either Te or Fe leading type.

Yeah, well, I don't see how work can be fun, if you hate it, but I can also see how it can be fun if you make it fun. If it's something you want to do, and aspire to do well in that field and become a big name. And I can be quite realistic if I wanna be, so what does that make me?

I'm not sure where being realistic comes from in the context of Merry/Serious types, that dichotomy has nothing to do with that.

Yeah, I can get on especially well with Gammas, more so than the majority of Betas, lol.

Which gammas specifically or any of the four types are equally good?

Some IEIs, and I am okay with LSIs, but we never speak a lot. I mean, I like you, Myst. You're cool

Heh

Personally, I find BETA NFs to be a lot more humanitarian related, spiritual, messiah complex, can be arrogant, more spiritual and religious than Delta NFs, and are a lot more Extroverted about things they believe in compared to Deltas. [This doesn't mean I hate them. I don't, but this is the main vibe I have picked up off a lot of them].

Deltas are a lot more idealistic on their own terms/ beliefs, don't have as much as of a messiah complex and are usually less arrogant and a lot more introverted/toned down with their beliefs and expressing them. They tend to be a lot more playful somehow, lol.

I guess it's the typical Fi vs Fe argument, in a sense. Both can be insightful in their own ways, but both have their own drawbacks.

Maybe you are seeing the Se/Ne difference too.

I find the Delta NFs more arrogant in a way... I guess Beta arrogance just doesn't bother me as much :shrug

It's true it'd be hard to get along with all betas out there because there can be such differences in views etc.

[mu4]

EIE

When you do the loop thru the other 15 types we can confirm this.

[DEAD]

I assume you meant you ruled out all Delta. That sounds quite like your opposing quadra, which would put you in Beta.

Now it just sounds like you're just making up stuff now, so you can justify me as your dual I know I'm fabulous and all, but ... this isn't enough proof to justify EIE. I didn't rule all Gamma, because I know I am not like them, I ruled them out because of the strong Ne-Si influence, which I know I don't have. I might have a Te-Fi influence, but there is a good chance it's not Ne-Si, because I don't use Ne much at all [I find it quite confusing and tiring, sometimes]. I can relate to Si, and experience Si, but I don't use it as much as I would Se.

May I ask why you ruled out EIE?

HOW does one go from being supposedly ESTP in MBTI to ENFj in Socionics? That's a bit extreme. I can see someone going from ExTJ in MBTI to ExTp in Socionics, depending on enneagram etc, and one going from ExTP to ExTj. It seems like a big jump from someone becoming a thinker to an idealist, technically. I know that sometimes MBTI and Socionics can differ, but I can't see them differentiating THAT much, tbh.

That, if you are an extratim type which you said you are, would leave you as either Te or Fe leading type.

I didn't say I was one, I said that I think I lead with Te or Fe, and I think that would make sense, because I am developing my tertiary function, and am probably using it a lot, which is making this more complicated than it really is.

I'm not sure where being realistic comes from in the context of Merry/Serious types, that dichotomy has nothing to do with that.

Let's just forget about merry/serious and quadras for a moment, and focus on the individual case in hand, instead of using generalizations. They get you nowhere. If I was to use the whole Quadra Values thing, then I would be going nowhere, because I relate to both Alpha and Beta values.

Which gammas specifically or any of the four types are equally good?

I can get on well with them all, tbh. We just click, for some reason.

Maybe you are seeing the Se/Ne difference too.

I find the Delta NFs more arrogant in a way... I guess Beta arrogance just doesn't bother me as much :shrug

It's true it'd be hard to get along with all betas out there because there can be such differences in views etc.

I find humans in general arrogant sometimes.

I find myself arrogant too.

EIE

When you do the loop thru the other 15 types we can confirm this.

Gee, thanks (!)

[Myst]

Now it just sounds like you're just making up stuff now, so you can justify me as your dual I know I'm fabulous and all, but ... this isn't enough proof to justify EIE. I didn't rule all Gamma, because I know I am not like them, I ruled them out because of the strong Ne-Si influence, which I know I don't have. I might have a Te-Fi influence, but there is a good chance it's not Ne-Si, because I don't use Ne much at all [I find it quite confusing and tiring, sometimes]. I can relate to Si, and experience Si, but I don't use it as much as I would Se.

No I'm not making up stuff and I never stated it was conclusive to your typing. Just mentioned it as a tidbit.

HOW does one go from being supposedly ESTP in MBTI to ENFj in Socionics? That's a bit extreme. I can see someone going from ExTJ in MBTI to ExTp in Socionics, depending on enneagram etc, and one going from ExTP to ExTj. It seems like a big jump from someone becoming a thinker to an idealist, technically. I know that sometimes MBTI and Socionics can differ, but I can't see them differentiating THAT much, tbh.

That just depends on how you conceptualize ESTP in MBTI and EIE/ENFj in Socionics.

Overall linking stuff to MBTI is nowhere near as relevant as focusing on Model A itself.

Or, you can try and link it with MBTI but then with a full understanding of both systems and especially the ways the typology fans try to apply them.

Let's just forget about merry/serious and quadras for a moment, and focus on the individual case in hand, instead of using generalizations. They get you nowhere. If I was to use the whole Quadra Values thing, then I would be going nowhere, because I relate to both Alpha and Beta values.

Devil's in the details for this one.

[DEAD]

No I'm not making up stuff and I never stated it was conclusive to your typing. Just mentioned it as a tidbit.




That just depends on how you conceptualize ESTP in MBTI and EIE/ENFj in Socionics.

Overall linking stuff to MBTI is nowhere near as relevant as focusing on Model A itself.

Or, you can try and link it with MBTI but then with a full understanding of both systems and especially the ways the typology fans try to apply them.




Devil's in the details for this one.

I just don't see how I am Fe-base, and Ni-Creative....

[Myst]

I just don't see how I am Fe-base, and Ni-Creative....

You used to see it though, what happened since then?

[DEAD]

HYPOTHESIS:

Today we are going to find out my "best fit in Socionics" through a range of tests. We are also gonna find out if these tests results stay consistent, and how many different Quadras my results are spread over. We are going to measure reliability, predictability and consistency.



METHOD:

Okay, so I done three different tests from three different sources. In the majority of the tests, ESTp came out top, but the majority of those questions were general questions and never really got to the core of things:


FINDINGS:



In the first test, ESTp topped ISTj, ENTp, and ESTj, all of which are from different Quadras [Beta, Alpha and Gamma]. They were all within close proximity of each other [within 15%], and the top two valued Se/Ni, whilst the bottom two valued Ne/Si. Delta and Beta are opposing Quadras, yet they are closely measured as being in my top four possible types, which is what I find ironic.



In the second test, it shows that I am a flat out ESTp, with no proper calculations or alternative types. Up in the right hand corner, and in the image, it shows the "strength" of each preference, but I wouldn't trust it as a reliable source, because this test is based on the E/I S/N T/F P/J dichotomies of basic Myers-Briggs testing.



In the third test, I tested as an ESTj [Delta] first, instead of an ESTp [Beta]. I scored 245 points for ESTj, then ESTp on 235, and finally, ENTj [Gamma] with 230 points. In this test, we are shown the possible points out of 400 which we can be for that given Sociotype. Then, we are given our probable types in order of what we scored within each Sociotype out of the possible set points available within each of the 40 questions [which translates as 10 points per question]. Those ten points from the answers are then sorted amongst the 16 types to give you a score for each.



CONCLUSION:

Even though each test gave at least one result from each Quadra, I think it gives us a rough idea from the averages what my type is likely to be, but I wouldn't trust it as fact, until I go deeper into myself and question who I really am, then I can't see much progress being made. After all, I can't be two/three different Sociotypes. Can I? There is only one definite type that fits, and my goal is to find it, and keep searching for it, no matter how long it takes.

[ @Myst - You might want to read this. Enneagram could be making me look like an SLE, but I'm not sure.]

[Myst]

CONCLUSION:

Even though each test gave at least one result from each Quadra, I think it gives us a rough idea from the averages what my type is likely to be, but I wouldn't trust it as fact, until I go deeper into myself and question who I really am, then I can't see much progress being made. After all, I can't be two/three different Sociotypes. Can I? There is only one definite type that fits, and my goal is to find it, and keep searching for it, no matter how long it takes.

[ @Myst - You might want to read this. Enneagram could be making me look like an SLE, but I'm not sure.]

Yeah sounds like you should do more self-observation. Tests only give the output based on what you gave as input.

[tejing]

You strike me as very similar to my brother in law who's an SLE.

[DEAD]

Yeah sounds like you should do more self-observation. Tests only give the output based on what you gave as input.

Yeah. They are only as truthful as the answers put in.

You strike me as very similar to my brother in law who's an SLE.

Can you tell me a little bit more about those similarities. If you don't mind?

[Beautiful sky]

When does your hot temper come out?

[DEAD]

When does your hot temper come out?

Whenever it has to, but I don't see how this has much to do with EIE vs SLE, tbh. Not every SLE is a jerk, and not every EIE is a dogooder.

[Beautiful sky]

Whenever it has to, but I don't see how this has much to do with EIE vs SLE, tbh. Not every SLE is a jerk, and not every EIE is a dogooder.

When does it have to? When was the last situation? I'm not looking at either of those types

[DEAD]

When does it have to? When was the last situation? I'm not looking at either of those types

Any type can have a bad temper. Any one indvidual can lose their temper, frequently from any type. Temper tantrums don't give an indicator into types anymore than an image does.

If you really want to get to the core of the OP, and help them, you should ask relevant questions related to the questionnaire.

[Beautiful sky]

Any type can have a bad temper. Any one indvidual can lose their temper, frequently from any type. Temper tantrums don't give an indicator into types anymore than an image does.

If you really want to get to the core of the OP, and help them, you should ask relevant questions related to the questionnaire.

I should (?) How interesting of you to state what actions I should take! I follow my own line of questions. I don't see anything type related in thay type of questionair.

[DEAD]

I should (?) How interesting of you to state what actions I should take! I follow my own line of questions. I don't see anything type related in thay type of questionair.

But how often does me loosing my temper got to do with anything? A simple question like that can't determine your type. And I already answered it above.

[Beautiful sky]

Do you put forth your emotions a lot especially when in public in such a way where you don't care about being heard and found out? Like public display of emotions?

[DEAD]

Do you put forth your emotions a lot especially when in public in such a way where you don't care about being heard and found out? Like public display of emotions?

No. I could care less. We all have public displays of emotions from time to time, whether we realize it or not is another thing.

[Beautiful sky]

But how often does me loosing my temper got to do with anything? A simple question like that can't determine your type. And I already answered it above.

Not how often but in what situation or circumstance. For example due to my weak Se I can't get someone who insists on stalking me to leave me alone but due to the demonstrative Se of LSE they can get aggressive and use abrasive language and hostile threats to get others to back off.

[Beautiful sky]

No. I could care less. We all have public displays of emotions from time to time, whether we realize it or not is another thing.

True enough. My ex ESE used to speak very loudly sometimes excessively disturbingly and he never cared who heard him when he was upset neither did he care about how others would perceive him. I don't think that you are ESE based on what you say. EIE is another issue.

[Beautiful sky]

Do you realise you are equating being stalked to type - and suggesting some types are helpless to prevent it. Then you are raising the subject of you being stalked. And the solution is to shout at them eg what LSEs do, but... You can't shout? Or maybe if one really is being stalked a phone call to the police may be in order.I am just wondering why you give out controversial messages?

That's not what I meant. I meant there was a time where I couldn't get someone to leave me alone but my bf did. I don't know what happens honesyly. How I'm not affective in that area. I'm just not.

[tejing]

Can you tell me a little bit more about those similarities. If you don't mind?

Actually, not really... it's a pure thing I can't articulate very well. I could give a blow by blow description of what about your answers makes me think SLE, but instead I'll say this... you initially said you identify most with SLE, and identify some with a number of other types. Don't overanalyze. Anything, however natural and familiar, will seem alien if you concentrate on it for too long. For example, if I take a random word, think about it for a while, say it in my head repeatedly, in a surprisingly short amount of time I find that I am overcome with the feeling that something is out of place with that word, like maybe it's spelled wrong or slightly mispronounced. The same thing can happen with your socionic type.

[DEAD]

True enough. My ex ESE used to speak very loudly sometimes excessively disturbingly and he never cared who heard him when he was upset neither did he care about how others would perceive him. I don't think that you are ESE based on what you say. EIE is another issue.

Hey, thanks anyway I don't think I am ESE either. I actually think I am Si-PoLR. I resonate with it in its most simplistic form.

EIE is another issue? How come?

Actually, not really... it's a pure thing I can't articulate very well. I could give a blow by blow description of what about your answers makes me think SLE, but instead I'll say this... you initially said you identify most with SLE, and identify some with a number of other types. Don't overanalyze. Anything, however natural and familiar, will seem alien if you concentrate on it for too long. For example, if I take a random word, think about it for a while, say it in my head repeatedly, in a surprisingly short amount of time I find that I am overcome with the feeling that something is out of place with that word, like maybe it's spelled wrong or slightly mispronounced. The same thing can happen with your socionic type.

Thanks anyway. Ne is quite confusing to my mind structure sometimes. I am pretty sure my Mum is ESE, and her scattering of ideas, and not focusing on one and implimenting it annoys me. She has good ideas, don't get me wrong, but 9/10, she never gives them a second thought or develops them into an end product.

That frustrates me. I see that as a form of laziness. I do love Ne-users and their functional usages, and I understand how to use Ne as a function, but personally, I can't use it for long periods of flow. It disrupts the flow of my conscience. It turns the river into lakes, and makes my thought pattern sail off its original course into some unnesecary, unrelated territory.

Yeah, overanalyzing things makes it worse. So does overcomplication. It convinces you that you are a different type to what you really are, lol.

[Myst]

Thanks anyway. Ne is quite confusing to my mind structure sometimes. I am pretty sure my Mum is ESE, and her scattering of ideas, and not focusing on one and implimenting it annoys me. She has good ideas, don't get me wrong, but 9/10, she never gives them a second thought or develops them into an end product.

That frustrates me. I see that as a form of laziness. I do love Ne-users and their functional usages, and I understand how to use Ne as a function, but personally, I can't use it for long periods of flow. It disrupts the flow of my conscience. It turns the river into lakes, and makes my thought pattern sail off its original course into some unnecessary, unrelated territory.

Yeah, overanalyzing things makes it worse. So does overcomplication. It convinces you that you are a different type to what you really are, lol.

Ni>Ne

For example, if I take a random word, think about it for a while, say it in my head repeatedly, in a surprisingly short amount of time I find that I am overcome with the feeling that something is out of place with that word, like maybe it's spelled wrong or slightly mispronounced. The same thing can happen with your socionic type.

That's a silly parallel. It's a completely different phenomenon.

[DEAD]

Ni>Ne

How much greater than Ti is it then?

[Myst]

How much greater than Ti is it then?

You were pretty much talking Dynamic stuff above, so...

[DEAD]

You were pretty much talking Dynamic stuff above, so...

Yeah. I am a dynamic dynamo. I descend space and time.
Well, most of the thoughts I have actually involve time in some way. And time manipulation.

[DEAD]

Anyone else have anything else to add?

[Aylen]

Yeah. I am a dynamic dynamo. I descend space and time.
Well, most of the thoughts I have actually involve time in some way. And time manipulation.

Anyone else have anything else to add?

[DEAD]

Wow, that used to be my favorite song as a kid. I've imagined the imagery in those lyrics so many times. It's wonderful. A wonderful tribute to his Mother also. He has a load more. I also like Soul Sister.

[DEAD]

[Muddy]

Take my opinion with a grain of salt because I'm still relatively new and I'm having some trouble determining my own type as well, but you sound SEE-Se to me. SEEs from what I heard very often mistypes themselves as SLEs. SLEs typically have a cold terminator vibe to them, you are more scattered and gusty. You don't strike me as EIE either, EIEs are a "victim" type and you have clearly shown you are a more assertive type. (7,3, 8 are all assertive enneagram types) The Fe others are getting from you may just be a demonstration, SEEs have very strong Fe.

[DEAD]

Take my opinion with a grain of salt because I'm still relatively new and I'm having some trouble determining my own type as well, but you sound SEE-Se to me. SEEs from what I heard very often mistypes themselves as SLEs. SLEs typically have a cold terminator vibe to them, you are more scattered and gusty. You don't strike me as EIE either, EIEs are a "victim" type and you have clearly shown you are a more assertive type. (7,3, 8 are all assertive enneagram types) The Fe others are getting from you may just be a demonstration, SEEs have very strong Fe.

Really? Interesting. I never considered SEE, simply because I don't think Fi is my creative function. I know I have Fi somewhere and can use it, but I can't see it as one of my strong points.

And not everything is by the book, tbh. EIEs can be 7, 8 or 3 too. Not all of them are Bronies that shit out rainbows, lol. But yeah... I could be any type, lol.

[Muddy]

One thing you can do if you haven't already is try to compare the Ej temperament (includes EIE) with the Ep temperament (SLE ,SEE).

EJ temperament

The EJ temperament, or linear-assertive temperament, was identified by Viktor Gulenko and includes the four rational extroverts (one in each quadra): ESE, EIE, LIE, and LSE. Each of these types is also dynamic.

Typical characteristics:

• proactive
• restless
• difficult to relax unless tired
• walk tends to be quick-paced and "purposeful", as well as stiff
• "calmly energetic" with few intense variations in the level of energy during the day
• inclined to fidget when forced to remain inactive for long periods

EJs are both dynamic and rational, so they see reality as in continuous, gradual, often imperceptible change. At the same time, an EJ has his own views of what reality "should" be. This inclines him to be quick to take action, normally using his leading function, in order to make sure things will remain, or become, as they should be, before change can get too far.

As extroverts, EJs tend to feel that it is up to them to initiate contacts with other people, whether in the context of establishing or maintaining a relationship. They will not necessarily act on that, though, and sometimes wish others would take over this role.

Perception of other temperaments:

• EP: EJs see EPs as unpredictable and moody, and therefore a bit irritating, but also as extremely energetic once they do focus on doing something, as well as the source of initiatives that may be worthwhile.
• IP: EJs see IP as unpredictable, moody, as well as too passive and unreliable, especially if they are required to show initiative or even reciprocity.
• IJ: EJs see IJs as solid, reliable, and reassuringly predictable, and usually not inclined towards being the first to take the initiative in taking action.

EP temperament

The EP temperament, or flexible-maneuvering temperament, was identified by Viktor Gulenko and includes the four irrational extroverts (one in each quadra): ILE, SLE, SEE, and IEE. Each of these types is also static.

Typical characteristics:

• flexible
• mobile
• impulsive, shifting from apparent inactivity to bursts of energy, often several times a day, showing impatience during them
• walk is energetic but "cat-like"
• often seems optimistic and open-minded
• inclined to fidget when forced to remain inactive for long periods
• entertains people easily and naturally

EPs are both static and irrational, so they perceive reality as mostly not changing, and when it does, it's in abrupt "leaps" from one state to another. An EP is bothered by the lack of change, especially as seen through his leading function, since his personal preference is for change. That makes him impulsive, with sudden bursts of action, energy, or even just thought, as he tries to get his perceptions "moving".

As extroverts, EPs tend to be feel that it is up to them to initiate contacts with other people, and EPs in particular tend to feel quite natural in that role.

Perception of other temperaments:

• EJ: EPs perceive EJs as active but too restless and nervous, slightly annoying due to a lack of sense of spontaneity.
• IP: EPs perceive IPs as pleasantly flexible and responsive to their initiatives, sometimes too unpredictable but for that very reason never boring.
• IJ: EPs perceive IJs as too predictable and boring, too unwilling to do things on the spur of the moment.

Also check out this SEE description and see if it sounds anything like you.



SEE (ESFp, Se-Fi): POLITICIAN

SEE's gaze is rapidly moving, cursory, noticing everything. Their eyes have one common distinguishing feature - they jump from object to object, not keeping on anything for long. They look at the interlocutor attentively, as if sympathizing, but not for very long. If made to hold their gaze, SEE starts to blink frequently.

The mimicry of face is mobile, expressive, sometimes nervous, sometimes relaxed, but it always reflects SEE's relation to situation well or the role that he has to play. If his internal state opposes this role, his smile becomes transfixed. Frequently his mouth seems slightly capricious, eyes - somewhat rounded.

Motions are confident, flexible, unconstrained. Behavior is variable: sometimes intimate-sincere, sometimes cautioning with light touches or embraces, at other times haughty-mocking with one-ups and ambiguous jokes, but is most frequently it is protectively benevolent. The gait is elastic, demonstrative, sometimes disorderly. SEE frequently changes his feeling of measure and then his helpfulness, talkativeness, and familiarity can seem exasperating.

TACTICIAN (Se-ESFp)
The sensory subtype resembles an emotional, gusty and nervous person. Behind their anxiety and sincere discomfort the constant thirst for vigorous activity appears. Undertakes too much and thus wastes much energy in vain. Despite their efforts to be diplomatic, they often seem critical and categorical. Sometimes indignant but nonetheless does not forget to give compliments. While on one hand they are able to look down on the interlocutor and touch him/her with their prickly jokes; on the other hand can be very kind and willing to prove their kind nature if necessary. Possess good artistic abilities with which they amuse visitors. Usually thin and conscious of figure, periodically playing sports. Eyes are often small or deeply planted. Gestures display impatience and movements are nervous, gusty. Often change their pose; their gait appears weakened/shaky; speech tends to be either muffled or rapid.

[DEAD]

One thing you can do if you haven't already is try to compare the Ej temperament (includes EIE) with the Ep temperament (SLE ,SEE).

EJ temperament

The EJ temperament, or linear-assertive temperament, was identified by Viktor Gulenko and includes the four rational extroverts (one in each quadra): ESE, EIE, LIE, and LSE. Each of these types is also dynamic.

Typical characteristics:

• proactive
  
• restless
  
• difficult to relax unless tired
• walk tends to be quick-paced and "purposeful", as well as stiff
• "calmly energetic" with few intense variations in the level of energy during the day
• inclined to fidget when forced to remain inactive for long periods

EJs are both dynamic and rational, so they see reality as in continuous, gradual, often imperceptible change. At the same time, an EJ has his own views of what reality "should" be. This inclines him to be quick to take action, normally using his leading function, in order to make sure things will remain, or become, as they should be, before change can get too far.

As extroverts, EJs tend to feel that it is up to them to initiate contacts with other people, whether in the context of establishing or maintaining a relationship. They will not necessarily act on that, though, and sometimes wish others would take over this role.

Perception of other temperaments:

• EP: EJs see EPs as unpredictable and moody, and therefore a bit irritating, but also as extremely energetic once they do focus on doing something, as well as the source of initiatives that may be worthwhile.
• IP: EJs see IP as unpredictable, moody, as well as too passive and unreliable, especially if they are required to show initiative or even reciprocity.
• IJ: EJs see IJs as solid, reliable, and reassuringly predictable, and usually not inclined towards being the first to take the initiative in taking action.

EP temperament

The EP temperament, or flexible-maneuvering temperament, was identified by Viktor Gulenko and includes the four irrational extroverts (one in each quadra): ILE, SLE, SEE, and IEE. Each of these types is also static.

Typical characteristics:

• flexible
• mobile
• impulsive, shifting from apparent inactivity to bursts of energy, often several times a day, showing impatience during them
• walk is energetic but "cat-like"
• often seems optimistic and open-minded
• inclined to fidget when forced to remain inactive for long periods
  
• entertains people easily and naturally

EPs are both static and irrational, so they perceive reality as mostly not changing, and when it does, it's in abrupt "leaps" from one state to another.An EP is bothered by the lack of change, especially as seen through his leading function, since his personal preference is for change. That makes him impulsive, with sudden bursts of action, energy, or even just thought, as he tries to get his perceptions "moving".

As extroverts, EPs tend to be feel that it is up to them to initiate contacts with other people, and EPs in particular tend to feel quite natural in that role.

Perception of other temperaments:

• EJ: EPs perceive EJs as active but too restless and nervous, slightly annoying due to a lack of sense of spontaneity.
• IP: EPs perceive IPs as pleasantly flexible and responsive to their initiatives, sometimes too unpredictable but for that very reason never boring.
• IJ: EPs perceive IJs as too predictable and boring, too unwilling to do things on the spur of the moment.

Also check out this SEE description and see if it sounds anything like you.



SEE (ESFp, Se-Fi): POLITICIAN

SEE's gaze is rapidly moving, cursory, noticing everything. Their eyes have one common distinguishing feature - they jump from object to object, not keeping on anything for long. They look at the interlocutor attentively, as if sympathizing, but not for very long. If made to hold their gaze, SEE starts to blink frequently.

The mimicry of face is mobile, expressive, sometimes nervous, sometimes relaxed, but it always reflects SEE's relation to situation well or the role that he has to play. If his internal state opposes this role, his smile becomes transfixed. Frequently his mouth seems slightly capricious, eyes - somewhat rounded.

Motions are confident, flexible, unconstrained. Behavior is variable: sometimes intimate-sincere, sometimes cautioning with light touches or embraces, at other times haughty-mocking with one-ups and ambiguous jokes, but is most frequently it is protectively benevolent. The gait is elastic, demonstrative, sometimes disorderly. SEE frequently changes his feeling of measure and then his helpfulness, talkativeness, and familiarity can seem exasperating.

TACTICIAN (Se-ESFp)
The sensory subtype resembles an emotional, gusty and nervous person. Behind their anxiety and sincere discomfort the constant thirst for vigorous activity appears. Undertakes too much and thus wastes much energy in vain. Despite their efforts to be diplomatic, they often seem critical and categorical. Sometimes indignant but nonetheless does not forget to give compliments. While on one hand they are able to look down on the interlocutor and touch him/her with their prickly jokes; on the other hand can be very kind and willing to prove their kind nature if necessary. Possess good artistic abilities with which they amuse visitors. Usually thin and conscious of figure, periodically playing sports. Eyes are often small or deeply planted. Gestures display impatience and movements are nervous, gusty. Often change their pose; their gait appears weakened/shaky; speech tends to be either muffled or rapid.

Personally, I can relate a lot to the ENFj description on both Wikisocion and Sociotype. But I can also relate to aspects of SLE, too:

[URL="http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=EIE"]Sociotype

I can't relate to SEE a lot [related points highlighted in purple], but I can relate to some aspects of the EJ and EP temperments [highlighted in green], which is a pain in the ass. But I also relate that to the fact that I am young, and have a mild case of ADHD.

[DEAD]

I'm not perfect in typing, better wait for another "good" opinion from masters in this forum, but personally I said you're SLE.

You judge yourself **E, and mostly dominant identified in ego is Se. Ti for creative just because on how you do self-observation.

If you think you can related to EIE, be careful, maybe it just your Id, not your ego.

Se ego? How did you get Se as my ego? Curious. It could work, but I would like to know the thinking behind it.

Ti creative? Isn't that systematic stuff?

[DEAD]

From your member questionnaire, your TIM, and interaction with another member. (Plus a little Ne "crazy thing" from me to wonder who you are). I'm not thinking.

Erm.. okay
And I dunno. Ne thing? Ne sounds like the ne-my. Nah, kidding. I prefer Ni anyday

[DEAD]

Since you're all confused about my Socionics type, I have decided to do the 40Q Questionnaire, taken from Personality Cafe, in the bid for clarity.

Feel free to ask more questions if you need to. I am up for it.

Taken from: http://personalitycafe.com/whats-my-...l#post10742210

BLOCK ONE


1. What is work in your opinion? Why do people go to work? Are there any parameters where you can distinguish whether you can do this work or not?

What is work? Work is the effort you use to achieve a goal/purpose previously laid out in your mind, or in the case of a job, the company/employer's mind. Work is also rewarded by some form of pay, whether it be money or kind acts etc. It is seperate from fun, from the aspect that you don't need any specific effort to carry out goals for fun, as fun is leisure and requires little to no effort to complete, compared to work.

People go to work for various reasons. One of the most common reasons is to support themselves/family finanically, and to earn a living to buy goods [luxury or not], so they don't die unnessecarily, because of the way modern society is structured.

The parameters are in my mind. Personally, I believe that I am able to do 95% of the work set out infront of me, if I focus on it, and put my mind to it, and iognore the doubts in my mind. Work is usually simple enough to do, even without adequate knowledge. That's what the internet is for, lol.

2. How do people determine the quality of work? How do you determine such quality? How well you can determine the quality of any purchase, do you pay any attention to it?

How do people determine the quality of work? Through a number of various reasons, to be honest. Some of such may include: Longetivity, Value for money, Strength of product, Hours worked on it, Materials used, Adequate tools, Practicality, Reviews, Reliability etc.

I myself use a number of those factors specified above to test the quality of a product. But I also like to test the time it takes for one of those factors to falter. And how it faltered, and what could be done to improve the given product in a practical manner.

I think that I can determine a product's quality relatively well through both experience, and comparison to other like products. I pay enough attention to the product to know if the above factors are reliable enough to form a high quality product.



3. There is a professional right next to you. You always see that you can’t perform the way they do. Your feelings, thoughts and actions?

It depends on how experienced that 'professional' is, how much knowledge they have applied on their specialized area, how succesful they are in their pursuits and how reliable the information presented is. You can't always take a professional as the whole truth, because sometimes they can be as flawed as a beginner in their area, in some aspects. It depends on when/how they became qualified, because information is changing all the time, and so are boundaries. Some information is invalid for it's time and some isn't. Anyway, we'll go with this professional poker player and trust they know what they are doing:

I am sitting beside Chad Thundercock, a professional porn star by day, and a professional poker player at night. I am watching how he wins every game, and how he knows the board like the back of his hand. I am sitting here, whistling and wondering how to improve my game to be as good as he is. I feel a excited, entertained but a little uncertain. I really want to win at least one game, and win wnough money to stay in Vegas for the week.

At the interval, I ask him for some tips on how to improve my game. He looks at me, suspiciously. I tell him that I'll buy him something to eat and drink from the money I win, if he teaches me well enough. So, he teaches me enough, and I somehow manage to win three games. I have enough money for a meal wih Chad, and I can stay in Vegas for the whole week. I end up winning a car and some leftover money out of the whole scenario, and plan to go back next year to win more.


4. If you struggle to do something, what can you say about such a task? Tell us your next steps and give examples. Compare with actions of others in a similar situation.

If I struggle to do something on a to-do list I' ve made, and I am finding it near impossible to do, I will skip that one and come back to it again later. But if it's a task I am doing in a classroom, which involves research/doing things, and there are several other students who are more able to do things, then I will ask them for help. If they don't respond, I'll ask the teacher for help. And as a last resort, I will Google it. But as helping people is a part of a teacher's job, I wouldn't expect things to go that far.

How can I compare my actions to someone in a similar situation? Everyone has different ways of doing things, and asessing each individual method in a room full of 30 students, and remembering the comparisons is near impossible.


5. You need to build a pyramid exactly like in Egypt. Your thoughts, feelings and actions?

"Are the aliens returning?"
"This is pointless."
"What do we need to do this for?"
"I have better things to be doing."
Basically, if things have no meaning/point to them, and they don't benefit society in any way long term or not, I won't do them, especially if they are to benefit things in the wrong manner. If they do however, I am more than happy to help out and get things rolling. I would measure the dimensions, and determine which materials we would need, how much and the time taken to build it etc.

BLOCK TWO


1. General to specific, specific to general – what does it mean? Give examples.


A general to specific topic would start off as a broad range of the topic, e.g food, and then it would go down to the different types of food groups (meat, diary, vegetables etc), and then it would go into the specific types of food in e.g vegetables, and then a specific vegetable e.g lettuce, and then specific types of lettuce, as shown here:

Specific to general, would be reverse of that: (specific lettuce types, gradually expanding out to the topic of food).


2. What does “logical” mean? What is your understanding? Do you think that it correlates with the common view? Is it is easy for you to be logical?


Logic has various definitions, therefore it is subjective. To one person, what they find logical, another personal might poke holes at it, and find it to be illogical. It is a personal line of reasoning found inside one's own mind, or in their environment.

Do I think it correlates to the common view? Not sure. I think that everyone will have some variations from the standard defintion in one's mind. After all, logic is subjective.

Is it easy for me to be 'logical'? It depends on which defintion you go by, and why I need to be logical, and what is if importance to be logical with.


3. What is hierarchy? Give examples of hierarchies. Do you need to follow it? Why or why not? Give example of hierarchy of systems, what is it?

Human hierarchy is the arrangement of society, according to class and abilities. It's a form of controlling society. Do I need to follow it? Does anyone need to follow it? No, not at all. Everyone has free will, and this is a violation of our free will. It's unfair to everyone, especially the poor. Through hierarchy, the rich get richer and poor get poorer. It keeps us all under the control of corruption, and benefits the people who are corrupt. Especially the kings and queens, who have been plotting humanity's downfall since the beginning of time.

To me, a simple example of hierachy in modern society would go something like this:


Top men (Elite)
|
Politicians and Imporant Figures (Puppets)
|
Government (Upper class)
|
National Government (American/British)
|
Local Government (Your county)
|
Lower Class People (Victims)
|
Homeless



4. Choose one of the following tasks and give a detailed answer. Explain your choice:
- How notions of “flatware” and “spoon” relate to each other?
- If A is not B, and B is not C, therefore A is C. Is it correct? Why?
- Choose one of the following terms and classify it: musical styles; means of transportation; taxes; fuel materials; animals.
- What is classification? How does classification work? What is it needed for and where is it applied? Give example.
- “The vegetable is not what is here shown. For a vegetable existed ten thousand years ago, therefore this here is not a vegetable”(Diogenes Laertius). Find logical fallacy.
- Analyze famous phrase of Socrates: “I know that I know nothing”. Is it logical?

Since I have no idea what is going on here, I'll take a chance and try explain the last one, since it seems the easiest:

I think that it is both logical and humble, because he is admitting that although he knows a lot of things and has a vast amount of knowledge on the things he knows, that he will never truly know anything in his lifetime compared to the amount of information available out there. Life is short, and we are capable of learning a lot of things, but one will truly never know everything there is to know, as we are only human, and that in realizing that you know nothing, you are realizing true knowledge, and that in reality, you don't need to know much more than that, in a sense.

5. Do you frequently feel the need to structure information? For what purpose? How do people usually do it? How do you do it?

Only when I have to, e.g for a Powerpoint presentation on a subject for work/school.

There are various different ways in which people structure information: through their minds, through notes, through PowerPoint presentations, through graphs, through charts, through physical organization e.g on a whiteboard etc. There are too many methods to mention, imo.

Personally, I like to use flowcharts, Powerpoint presentations and graphs, as to keep people's information of the important points, and so they can learn something in a simple manner, without wanting to nod off in the middle of it.

BLOCK THREE


1. Can you press people? What methods do you use? If so, how does it happen?

Yes, if I have to.

What methods do I tend to use? Blackmail, negotiation, force, and violence.

It happens in various ways, and it depends on the situation's difficulty and which tactic works best for the given situation.

2. Are there strategies of attack? Can you use them? When is it justified? Do you think it’s ok to occupy someone else’s territory? In what situations?

Yes.

Yes.

It's justified when someone who is in control abuses that control, and you know you can do a better, fairer job. If the area is undiscovered, and needs developed. If someone is attacking me, or someone needs attacked.

3. How do you protect yourself and your interests?

Erm... by force mostly.

4. Describe your behavior in the situations of opposition and if you have to use some force?

Fight them, kick their shit in. Make them not want to come back. Teach 'em a lesson. Hit them where it hurts.

5. Do others think of you as a strong person? Do you think you are a strong person?

Yes, people have called me a strong person before, in school. They said I can withstand a lot.
I guess so.


BLOCK FOUR



1. What is beauty? Do you change your opinion about beauty? Does your understanding correlate with the generally accepted notion? What goes beyond the generally accepted notion?


Beauty is subjective. To one person, it may be external, and to another internal. Some say that beauty is in nature, other knowledge. Beauty is indefinitive.

Nope, never. To me, it is too subjective to define.

What is the generally accepted notion?

I dunno?

2. Is there a template of understanding what beautiful means for everyone to use? Is there such a term as “classic beauty”? If so, what is it?

No? I don't think so...

3. How do you create your comfort and coziness? How do others evaluate your skill in doing so? Do you agree with them?

What even? I don't understandd this question. Erm, I guess my talking and making them feel at ease? Dunno.

4. How do you pick your own clothes? Do you follow fashion? Why? Do you know how to select clothes for different types of figures?

No.
No.
'Cause I don't find it interesting.
For work people yes, ordinary people, no.

5. Tell us how you’d design any room, house or an office. Do you do it yourself or trust someone else to do it? Why?

If it's in my own house, I would keep the theme minimalistic and as simply laid out as I possibly could. I hate loads of clutter, and bright, loud confusing clashing colors. It makes no sense at all, and is very distracting. I would have as little storage facilities and objects as possible, but make things easily accessible.

I would prefer to do it myself, but if it someone else volunteered to do it, and were reasonable and done everything I asked of them exactly the way I wanted it to be designed, then I see no reason not to let them design it.

Because this is my home, and my personal design I have planned out for a long time. I want it to match my tastes.



BLOCK FIVE


1. Is it acceptable to express emotions in public? Give examples of inappropriate expression of emotions.

Of course. Emotion is a natural part of being human. Everyone exposes emotions [staged or not] at some part of their life, even psychopaths. Most people end up exposing a lot of emotions in public, regardless of it being 'inapropriate/ comfortable' or not.

If someone is celebrating something, then joy would be the most appropriate emotion, not anger or sadness. If someone was protesting, anger would be the most appropriate emotion, and if someone had died, sorrow would be most appropriate emotion, and mourning the most appropriate action.

2. Think of such negative emotional states as sadness, gloom, and despondence.
- Can you, at your own will, enter these states? If not, then when do you feel them?
- How long can you stay in such states?
- How can you withdraw from them?
- Can they be pleasant, soothing?
- How do you feel after you have experienced them?

Yes.
As long as I need to/ like.
With ease.
Depends on why I was sad.
Relieved/normal (depends on if I am acting, or not. Or I have to enter this state, because someone died etc).

3. How quickly can you change emotional state? To what side – positive or negative?

Very- depends on the environment, and the people in what environment. How they feel/are acting. I can adapt easily to suit those given conditions, if I want/need to.

4. What emotional state is usual for you? Does your internal emotional state correlate with what you show externally?

Usually happiness joy/ nonchalant/ anger.

Yes, usually. If I am angry, it shows. If I am happy, it shows etc. I can hide my emotional states, but it's unhealthy and makes me worse. I want to express myself freely, and what I feel. Without caring who's watching.

5. Tell us about your moods over the last day.

Um.. happy-excited-tired-chatty-excited-tired-nonchalant-happy-tired-hungry-alert-bored-adventurous-tired.


BLOCK SIX


1. Tell us how did you build relationships with others over the last day.

Spoke to people, had fun with them, got to know our common interests.

2. What is sympathy? When do you need to express it? When is it advised not to? How do you express it?

I dunno, but I express it when someone dies or they lose their job.

When someone doesn't die or lose their job?

"I'm sorry to hear."

3. Are there any standards of behavior or interpersonal relationships in the society? If so, do you adhere to them? Do people always have to maintain them? Why?

I guess so. I guess people have different standards of behaviour, especially when dating.

When I have to, to get somewhere with people.

If they want to get along with those people, yes.

Because that's what they want.

4. What does moral mean? What is immoral? How do you understand these terms and does your understanding correlate with the others? How can you evaluate the correctness of your own understanding?

Moral- something good, poor, the right thing to do.
Immoral- The opposite

Through other people's understanding. So, whatever they say, my 'morals' are mostly based off that.

Morals are subjective. To one person, what is right, could be wrong to another person.

5. Somebody is giving you a negative attitude – what is your reaction? Could you show your own negative attitude toward someone else? If so, how? Could you feel ill-disposed towards somebody for a long time? How easily do you forgive people?

It depends on the situation, but it's usually:

"Meh, whatever"
"Why are you like this?"
"Leave me alone."
"Don't be so pessimistic!"

Sometimes, if they deserve it, but not usually.

I try not to be.

Fairly easy.

BLOCK SEVEN


1. Is there a meaning of life? In what? Is it the same for everybody?

Yes, I believe that everyone has their own purpose in life, whether it be a minister, firefighter, singer, actor etc. I believe that everyone is good at something, and willd find their purpose in life before they die.

Nope, everyone's purpose is different. If we all had the same purpose, society wouldn't be able to function properly.

2. When you meet a stranger, what can you say about them right away? How do you know what this person is all about? Does it take long to understand someone’s traits?

It depends on their outer apperance.

Their job, their motives, their appearance.

Not overly, especially if they're obvious.

3. What is imagination? Do all people have imagination and can fantasize? What is your fantasizing like?

Imagination is visualisation in your mind that extends to all corners of your brain.

Most people do.

I dunno? Mostly visualisation of the future, with the odd dirty fantasy thrown in there.

4. What do you think of people (or yourself) who distinctively stand out in a crowd, differ from others? What is a measure of such distinction, how can this difference be feasible and how not?

Erm... I don't really think about that much, but I guess it's okay.

5. Ideas do not have to be correct in order to be good. What’s your attitude towards this statement?

True, but I think it's better to focus on one main concept and develop that to the best you can, instead of loads of useless ideas that will never get done. And anyway, what is a correct idea? You mean an idea that can be implimented into reality?


BLOCK EIGHT

1. How people change? How do you feel about those changes? Can others see the changes?

Psychically, mentally and emotionally
If they're good, I feel good. If they're bad, then I don't like them.
It depends on how observant they are, and how much pattern following they have been doing.

2. What is time? How do you feel time? Can you waste time?

Time is the fluid which keeps the universe flowing, and the planets spinning. It is necessary to the development of civilization in the universe.
In my mind, in the air and signs around me.
Yes, if I have nothing planned/ to be doing/ nowhere to go, basically free time.

3. Do you need help creating forecasts and determining how something will end? Do you trust those forecasts?

Not overly, it comes naturally to me, with a good sucess rate, usually.
Yes, they are pretty accurate most of the time.

4. Are you normally late? How do you react if someone is late?

I try my hardest not to be. It lets everyone down, and things are spun off course.
It depends on how late they are. If they are early, then I am fine. A little over time, I start to wonder where they are. Super late and I am pissed off.

5. Imagine the situation where you agreed to meet with someone. Your feelings and actions:
a) 20 minutes before the meeting starts,
b) 5 minutes before the meeting starts,
c) it is time for the meeting to start, but the person is not here,
d) 20 minutes after the meeting start time and the person is not here,
e) more time and the person is still not here…

"Yes, I can wait on them, I'll go get myself a coffee whilst I wait and think some more, or watch the people around me."
"... I do hope they're coming soon."
"Where are they?"
"WHERE THE HELL ARE THEY? WHY ARE THEY LETTING ME DOWN?!"
"UGH, THEY WILL KNOW ABOUT THIS? DID THEY FORGET THIS WAS ON? DO PEOPLE HAVE NO CONCEPT OF TIME? WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM? HOW COME I CAN BE ON TIME, AND YOU CAN'T?!"

[Myst]

Lol you clearly like Se. I'd say Si fail on the other hand

Seems merry/subjectivist Ti/Fe valuing as well.