Aggressors that are pussies.

[ENJoymENT]

...most women aren't attracted to my traits. I'm closed-off, non-transparent and I'm not a cheesing fratboy like floyd fucking mayweather. I'd even say I'm creepy, and I have no interest in changing my basic demeanor. A girl isn't going to feel comfortable around me and that's a dealbreaker.

You're right--a girl isn't going to feel comfortable around you AS YOU ARE NOW...in this phase you're stuck in. You are in an unsuccessful and self-perpetuating cycle, and it isn't working. You have generalized (erroneously--in my opinion) what you think women want, and then because that disappoints you, you are making them the enemy and refusing to attempt to give it to them. Why would you only want that kind of girl who WANTS the frat boy?? You are trying to emulate their "apparent" rejection of you, by bitterly doing the same thing back to them...exactly who is winning here? This is a phase--you can and you will figure it out. Ironically, the early 20s are a "perfect storm" where maturity and immaturity collide. Where idealism, loss of innocence, increasing responsibility and a desire to quickly find and establish one's place in the world combine and go haywire.

Try to remain as authentic and true to yourself during what is temporarily a crappy time for you. Resist things that try to turn you into something you know you're not, or else don't want to be. If EIE girl says "movies are boring", then say how you really feel in response: "if it's a good movie, I disagree that they're boring", or "me too but I was hoping we could do something together"--then you will get a true response instead of walking away without the information that will allow you to either proceed with her or move on. Speaking of movies...I'm very partial to Perks of Being a Wallflower, since I lived in Pittsburgh for 5 years. It has such a good message, and it applies to what you are going through.

Don't rule out other kinds of girls! Please believe that many don't want a frat boy--and in your case it could just be the timing, because most females in their late 20s want anything but! Maybe the EIE "event" was a fail because SHE's insecure, superficial, or image conscious and will only date frat boys. Maybe because a fellow Beta was a better match for her. Maybe you DO have your Socionics type incorrectly identified. Or maybe you're ESI and your weak Ni can't see the end of a very short frat phase of life that has a 4-year shelf life.

Maybe through time and when you work through some of this shit that's causing you distress and resentment, you will find you can connect better with more (female) people. We're not all going to end up with supermodel gods/goddesses as partners. And once you find your One, you won't WANT them to be. Look at Hollywood in order to see that beauty or "frat appeal" is not co-related to life and relationship happiness. Try to accept you are going through a difficult phase, cut yourself some slack. Many people later look back on their "younger selves" with regrets that they didn't realize they were beautiful and wonderful and just hadn't known it.

Just do your best so you can live without regrets

[xerx]

Dude, don't let other people have that much power over you (especially women, since their judgments strike deeper -- it's an impulse we're not socialized out of). You're fighting your own mind when you do all the work of projecting cynicism onto yourself.

Fallback and isolate yourself for a period, develop a creative talent, something substantial to fall back on to strengthen your self-image.

[lemontrees]

^ yeah basically.

i was walking down the street telling myself the exact same stuff just yesterday, only switch "women" for "men." (men are generally less selective initially, but it can be equally shitty from the other side)

the key is to really, truly feel that when you consistently let your self-esteem be so tied to projections of other people's neg perceptions of you, it's giving everyone else crazy amounts of unwarranted power. which isn't to say there isn't still the real, day to day responses of needing to be appreciated, to be desirable, etc, which is human and keeps ppl from becoming sociopaths. but there's a separate core that can ride those up and down waves.

(sry i'm self-therapizing a bit lol)

p.s. as far as i can tell, attractive men get rejected for sex and stuff all the time. also women can generally tell if all you feel for them is lust, some will go for it and others won't. a lot of it is the structures of desire and power dynamics between men and women, a lot of it is circumstantial.

edit: take my statements w/ a grain of salt actually, i'm still mostly a naive introverted shut-in

[wacey]

The first several times I had sex where with ugos. You have to crawl through the mud to get to the beach. You don't just get the hot chicks right off the bat if you are a virgin. Lower your standards and enjoy yourself a bit more for christ sakes. There are plenty of great second stringers out there! Is it them who is superficial, or is it you? Or, is it just plain old fear? Cause, that shit is universally felt by everyone alive, hot or not.

[wacey]

So, what is with all the hangups? Or better yet, what IS the hangup?

[Radio]

But it's all I care about. If I don't feel desirable I might as well not exist.

oh hey, welcome to E4-dom.

[darya]

oh hey, welcome to E4-dom.

Not necessarily.

[Amber]

ofc not, that's surely positive outlook

[Amber]

Positive Outlook sp/so (syn-flow) thread:

http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...rst-Old-people

Guess on which emotion the OP is fixated. Looks like indolence and sloth huh.

[darya]

I am aware that he's all envy, there's just many things off for him being 4w3. 9 is what he self-types, not my impression of him.

[Kill4Me]

suede cuts too deep a vein in his posts for a 9. his energy has a more bleeding quality to it than 9w1s do.

9s, for all their introspection, don't go beyond the point of comfort....their introspection is more numbed out and self-insulated. like a big, pillowy wall.

not as fleshy...that's where sloth mainly shows up. and yeah, he's too cold and realistic in his self-assessments/assessments for a positive reframer.

A sorta "take no mercy on myself"....(starfall does a similar thing when she has introspected on the board).

[darya]

suede cuts too deep a vein in his posts for a 9. his energy has a more bleeding quality to it than 9w1s do.

9s, for all their introspection, don't go beyond the point of comfort....their introspection has a more numbed out, self-insulated quality. like a big, pillowy wall.

that's where sloth mainly shows up. he's too cold and realistic in his self-assessments/assessments for a positive reframer (starfall has a similar quality, at times).

I agree. His posts and realistic/cynical views of society and its expectations remind me of Starfall's too (also the advice she gave him how to approach his problems was very adaptive, rational and overall 3-ish). Don't know where to draw the line between 3 and 4 with Suede though.

[Velvet]

But it's all I care about. If I don't feel desirable I might as well not exist. Feeling asexual or like a sexual non-entity feels like a death sentence to me. There's nothing else that I really value in myself. If I didn't sometimes like what I see in the mirror I would've killed myself a while ago because I'm a waste of space and have little else to live for. Most everything else in life is shit for me. That's how important it is to me.

I understand... it's a long walk, it seems like it gets better with age. Did you think about following a kind of confidence training or something of a sort? Maybe read books about gaining more power. Or find an interest/passion and become good at it, this can help to build your charisma as well.

[Kill4Me]

I agree. His posts and realistic/cynical views of society and its expectations remind me of Starfall's too (also the advice she gave him how to approach his problems was very adaptive, rational and overall 3-ish). Don't know where to draw the line between 3 and 4 with Suede though.

its a close one to draw between 3w4 and 4w3....

the difference ime is 4w3s are comfortable seeing themselves as the inferior, un-charismatic, low testerone, beta male.

"there's something wrong with me" is more like a point of pride....and they relish more in their self-proclaimed defects.

the more sx the 4 has the more they intensify that persona. with Suede, there's more shame and discomfort over it...he's not relishing. it's more like lament.

[Beautiful sky]

If an SEE wants to be captured they can play any role. They can play the morally upright person, they can play the role of a good worker witb good ethics, they can play the role of the self contained and outright model mate especially to an LSE who dictates behavior and watches for them. What they can't play is doing it indefinitely. The playing itself can be aggressive move putting the competion out of the game by their need to be the most visible role. It hurts people like me who move despite external cues expressing my values and living my values even when the delivery goes without notice of how it will be received by others. It's all well...there's a saying "a man who gives you up is worth not having." p

[Ian Rust]

People are too fucked up these days to form relationships. It's just a fact, accept it and move on. The relationships that do form are empty, based on lies and ultimately fall apart, they're not even worth being jealous over or raging about. Literally forget about it.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

ignore girls like that and go more for the moralistic motherly types that will give non alpha male black drug dealers more of a chance.

No sense in getting yourself worked up because most people are common basic bitches only driven by their most basest of impulses.

observe how women behave. Though I believe all women want the asshole, the more motherly type will at least give the nerd a fighting chance. If the girl is feminine but at least can do physical chores herself pretty well you have more of a chance. Because she isn't so heteronormative.

But if it's like some lazy IEI girl who is hot but just passively stands there like some dumbfuck while the SLE bully throat fucks her- YOU HAVE NO CHOICE. Just move on. There is no sense hating these people. There just isn't.

my very existance is a fact that kind-hearted str8 nerdy guys make it. Though I think women have kids with bisexual men in order to create gay men to make clothes for them, while they have sex with the hot asshole for their own personal amusement. It's all a grand manipulative scheme. Those women. What are we gonna do with them? don't let it get u down bro.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

here is a little song I wrote:

Look at the heteros shoot basketball and play
They are so boring, common drab and gray
So many gay men hate themselves but guess what-
I'm glad to be gay

Look at the heteros spit and shout
What this time, are they fighting about?
I don't care, I'm queer
I'm glad to be gay

Heteros are bullies and dumb
condescending, shitty and numb
Even if they aren't like k0rp
They just condescendingly give you advice
And make you d0rp
When it's not asked for, and they do it very badly
Unlike Sassy Gay Friend

I'm sooo glad to be gay!

Go to your death camps straights
You deserve it- I'll lock the gates
I don't have to be 'equal' to you
Equal would mean that I get to be as shitty to you
As you are to gays all those years!

So fuck being nice to straights
Stand up to them and make them shake
It's time for the gay movement to actually quake
We are too nice and passive and get some balls fags
For Heaven's Sake

I'm soooo glad to be gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay!


/bows

[lemontrees]

^ really just reinforces my longtime theory that you are E1 (disintegrated to E4)

anyway it can help to remember your standards are arbitrary lol

[may]

Like I'm constantly scolding someone or something which feels gay.

ahahahaha!!

[may]

umm.. yeah. : (

guess I'm supposed to be frowning, right.

[may]

ahah, not a lot I guess. I just laughed out loud at that part of the quote.
And then after I wrote that I was I was laughing, I thought I shouldn't be since everyn was being so srs.

[may]

neway, guess I'm supposed to be encouraging you.

So:

108-nyd.jpg

tumblr_mjk8mwEBe31qz6f9yo1_1280.jpg

You'll make it, dude! : ) (or whatev?)

[Beautiful sky]

ignore girls like that and go more for the moralistic motherly types that will give non alpha male black drug dealers more of a chance.

No sense in getting yourself worked up because most people are common basic bitches only driven by their most basest of impulses.

observe how women behave. Though I believe all women want the asshole, the more motherly type will at least give the nerd a fighting chance. If the girl is feminine but at least can do physical chores herself pretty well you have more of a chance. Because she isn't so heteronormative.

But if it's like some lazy IEI girl who is hot but just passively stands there like some dumbfuck while the SLE bully throat fucks her- YOU HAVE NO CHOICE. Just move on. There is no sense hating these people. There just isn't.

my very existance is a fact that kind-hearted str8 nerdy guys make it. Though I think women have kids with bisexual men in order to create gay men to make clothes for them, while they have sex with the hot asshole for their own personal amusement. It's all a grand manipulative scheme. Those women. What are we gonna do with them? don't let it get u down bro.

Positivist rant/
There's a lot of good in good relationships...not being alone, companionship, doing things together, better sex, etc... and SLE are generally caring mates

[Beautiful sky]

The Se part of SLE gets to my feelings a lot and makes me sad. It doesn't create an atmosphere of trust and love for me. For example yesterday I was in emense pain and I asked for narcotic pain killers jokingly and this sle friend said "boh if that doesn't make you sound like a junkie" that was not the response I want that would make me feel good. What I'm looking for is care. something like "did you take anything for that?" If I'm not proactive then it's okay to say "if you're not willing to do anything about it then don't complain" but Se just points out properties and makes oddball and uncomfortable determinations that are directed at the person nearby.

[Amber]

Dude, ur English is killing me.

on topic: Se ego tends to despise forms of weakness in another and in Beta it can take the form of clearly expressing that through overt jokes and pushing the person around if they're "caught in the act".

[Beautiful sky]

Dude, ur English is killing me.

on topic: Se ego tends to despise forms of weakness in another and in Beta it can take the form of clearly expressing that through overt jokes and pushing the person around if they're "caught in the act".

Stop looking for weaknesses I'm typing on a phone.

[Myst]

If you don't have this sort of demeanor, straight women basically don't want you and it's just like, suck my fucking dick. All of you.






There's this paradox with me, where it's like I'm so attracted to feminity, that I don't bother trying to emulate the men they're attracted to because I find them tedious, hence 20 year old girls thinking I'm an asexual pussy. I value certain masculine traits, a lot, but I pick and choose what's relevant to me and girls won't give a fuck unless you try to be like the hodgetwins. You basically have to be a cheery fuckboy to get a girl my age.

I will never understand this way of thinking. It's so obviously not in touch with reality. Just fyi, that guy you posted pics of was never my type.

[darya]

@suedehead, I'll never understand what you're talking about. From your pictures you're a very good looking guy. It just seems like you're lacking in confidence, which is the main issue here. Girls can smell fear from a mile away. You can be an ugly motherfucker and still get girls if you have excellent confidence. Just don't allow girls scare you , otherwise you're giving them the power. I've noticed that a lot of younger guys have this problem. Once guys start getting a little older they finally seem to get it.

Just wanted to write exactly this. Suede please stop hallucinating about your physical shortcomings.

[aisa]

@suedehead visually you're hot, the thing that's not hot is that you keep complaining about your looks, when in fact you're way above average. It sounds like a supermodel saying "Oh, no... You should see me without make up. I'm a fricking monster." as an answer to a compliment. It sounds like a way of fishing for more compliments. It gets old.
You don't want to be a dumb jock, then don't. Simple. Hot girls don't only date jocks. And if you meet only such combos - then maybe you just haven't yet met enough people.

[darya]

It sounds like a supermodel saying "Oh, no... You should see me without make up. I'm a fricking monster." as an answer to a compliment. It sounds like a way of fishing for more compliments. It gets old.

I don't think he's doing that. I think there's some sort of body dysmorphia in play. It's like being anorexic and everyone telling you you look like a twig, but when you look in the mirror you see a hippopotamus.

[aisa]

I don't think he's doing that. I think there's some sort of body dysmorphia in play. It's like being anorexic and everyone telling you you look like a twig, but when you look in the mirror you see a hippopotamus.

What I was aiming at is that there is no physical problem. I agree that it's about self-perception.

[darya]

I can work on myself as much as I want to, and I have for stretches, but I'm just a really needy person at heart. Honestly, most everything else in life is either shit or ephemeral, and I always come back to this one obsession/blindspot.

Would you be if happy if you'd find a girl to be in love with and she'd return the favour : )? Or would anything but playing the field and being good at it leave you unhappy?

[darya]

I don't think you don't try. I'm just trying to figure out what would be the solution and what exactly would make you happier.

[darya]

Oh

[Myst]

What do you view as being the reality of it then. @Myst whenever I see a girl out with a boyfriend it's always some charming, 6'4, athletic, smooth Fe-valuing, Sx/so fuck with tattoos, piercings and a fucking taper fade/pony tail.

I simply don't believe you on that. Unless you live in some small village where there's only two girls total who are hanging out with a boyfriend.

The reality is that there's a lot more types of guys who have girlfriends.

I'm tired of seeing the same fucking shit whenever I go to the gym and I wish I could strangle one of them. I can't get the body I want quickly enough, my face and gaze are plain-looking, I think I look effeminate or pathetic to women. I'm only 5 fucking 11. I carry fat on my lower body like a female. I'm fucked.

Stop crying about your fat, start a proper training plan and diet and understand it takes time.

Also, this isn't a prerequisite to getting a girl.

@suedehead, I'll never understand what you're talking about. From your pictures you're a very good looking guy. It just seems like you're lacking in confidence, which is the main issue here. Girls can smell fear from a mile away. You can be an ugly motherfucker and still get girls if you have excellent confidence. Just don't allow girls to scare you, otherwise you're giving them the power. I've noticed that a lot of younger guys have this problem. Once guys start getting a little older they finally seem to get it. When I was 20 I was in awe of older guys for this reason. You have to be relaxed and confident around girls. Oh, and funny. Always have a sense of humor.

Where's the pics, I'm curious now

[Satan]

trying to meet people in bars isn't easy.

[Satan]

What do you view as being the reality of it then. @Myst whenever I see a girl out with a boyfriend it's always some charming, 6'4, athletic, smooth Fe-valuing, Sx/so fuck with tattoos, piercings and a fucking taper fade/pony tail. I'm tired of seeing the same fucking shit whenever I go to the gym and I wish I could strangle one of them. I can't get the body I want quickly enough, my face and gaze are plain-looking, I think I look effeminate or pathetic to women. I'm only 5 fucking 11. I carry fat on my lower body like a female. I'm fucked.

i think it's probably in the way you act. some guys really do act pathetic to women, especially in bars. maybe you should just observe for a bit.

most of the more successful guys make it look effortless. but it's more that they know how it works.

[Satan]

I can work on myself as much as I want to, and I have for stretches, but I'm just a really needy person at heart. Honestly, most everything else in life is either shit or ephemeral, and I always end up coming back to this one obsession/blindspot. I don't know how to live with it. I think it's the only thing I genuinely care about and everything else I do is just a means to an end, even things that seem completely unrelated on the surface.

are you sure you're not a victim.