What do you think of me being Beta?

[The Ineffable]

Fe-HA is acting like an ass to make people laugh, the way i see it anyway.

And that's not all. The Conqueror is not only a clown (Fe-HA), but he is also an oustanding quantum physics scientist (Ne-Role)! NeFe Ego.

[Leader]

This is SLE:






If you identify with this, then you are SLE.

[Suz]

SLE-Ti, any 'caregiving' or 'SLI' resemblances can be explained away by her being SP first and people like WA not being able to tell the difference between that and Si.

I appreciate this feedback! thanks!

[DividedsGhost]

@Jessica

Which dual pair do you think you relate to when threatened, personally offended, or under stress:

1. You have convictions about how other people should behave or seem to require that other people treat each other with a certain level of predictable respect.
or
2. You have a desire to make sure people are getting their needs met or seem to require that other people are not being mistreated in some way.

[EyeSeeCold]

What do you think of me being Beta?

"Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn"

hah

Probably Beta > Delta

[Park]

@Jessica

Which dual pair do you think you relate to when threatened, personally offended, or under stress:

1. You have convictions about how other people should behave or seem to require that other people treat each other with a certain level of predictable respect.
or
2. You have a desire to make sure people are getting their needs met or seem to require that other people are not being mistreated in some way.

I'd choose one over two, myself.

edit: Meh, I don't know. #2 sounds like an ESE, more caregivery and Ne/Si, so that's probably your option for Delta, but either way I don't think that's what I focus on when threatened or under stress.

[jessica129]

@Jessica

Which dual pair do you think you relate to when threatened, personally offended, or under stress:

1. You have convictions about how other people should behave or seem to require that other people treat each other with a certain level of predictable respect.
or
2. You have a desire to make sure people are getting their needs met or seem to require that other people are not being mistreated in some way.

1

[Galen]

Given your vocal preference for ENFps in the past ISTp would have to be the case. I think you're just depressed and angsty, which puts you in an unhealthy state of mind and distorts your self-perception type-wise. Not that I'm pinning this exclusively on you, because I find that people tend to change their type when they're not in a good mental state.

[Absurd]

I find that people tend to change their type when they're not in a good mental state.

Cough.

[jessica129]

Yeah but the thing is, I don't think I was in a good mental state AT ALL when I typed SLI haha so you're right in that but now that I'm getting better (even if I do still come across as a sad and lonely (HAHA) person, I still feel 1000 x better than I ever did a year ago), I don't identify with SLI at all.

[Galen]

Yeah but the thing is, I don't think I was in a good mental state AT ALL when I typed SLI haha so you're right in that but now that I'm getting better (even if I do still come across as a sad and lonely (HAHA) person, I still feel 1000 x better than I ever did a year ago), I don't identify with SLI at all.

I think I've asked you why you don't connect with it before, and I don't remember specific answers but there was something about not identifying with caregiver/infantile dichotomy. You don't strike me at all like 8w9 in any case; you just don't have the same overt brashness that 8s have when under the sort of stress you've talked about.

Also, people keep putting me in delta but there has to be something to the fact I get along much better with Betas and that I find Beta NF's more appealing than Delta NF's.

Stop making Shaun White and Cher cry.

[Suz]

Yeah but the thing is, I don't think I was in a good mental state AT ALL when I typed SLI haha so you're right in that but now that I'm getting better (even if I do still come across as a sad and lonely (HAHA) person, I still feel 1000 x better than I ever did a year ago), I don't identify with SLI at all.

aww jessica... i'm sorry i didn't mean to put it that way I regret that choice of words... I'M actually the sad and lonely one...

[Wittmont]

Jessica is SLE.

[jessica129]

I think I've asked you why you don't connect with it before, and I don't remember specific answers but there was something about not identifying with caregiver/infantile dichotomy. You don't strike me at all like 8w9 in any case; you just don't have the same overt brashness that 8s have when under the sort of stress you've talked about.
Stop making Shaun White and Cher cry.

Well my reasons are plenty..I'm about to dumb this down because that's how I prefer to do things so get ready.

I don't identify with Delta values whatsoever. Nothing. Everything they value, I don't. I value everything Betas value. Everything. I don't give two shits about Si related things (at least not enough for it to be my leading function). I am far more attracted to Beta NF's than Delta NF's. I much prefer Fe to Fi and most of my relationship problems have to do with lack of Fe. If I were supposedly SLI, why on earth would I crave Fe so much if that were my POLR? Why would I need it? Why would a relationship end because of lack of it? Why don't I like the majority of the Deltas here and get along with all of the Betas? What speficially about my personality possibly points to valuing Delta over Beta? Is it because I was a dumbass and typed myself that for 5 years because I was in a blackhole I couldn't get out of? Probably. I respect your opinion Galen, but honestly I really have a hard time seeing where you guys are coming from --it feels like you're just going off my own SLI typing and not even giving it a second thought because you have some image of me you've made up. If you disregard that self typing and looked at who I am as a whole and what I've just said here, if it still points to Delta, then I honestly think the idea you have of Socionics is fucked.

I'm not an 8? Have you read anything about 8w9? The description is basically my life story as is the SLE-Ti description. But this isn't a personal attack against you and your typing...you just don't know anything about me and that's ok.

[DividedsGhost]

I'd choose one over two, myself.

edit: Meh, I don't know. #2 sounds like an ESE, more caregivery and Ne/Si, so that's probably your option for Delta, but either way I don't think that's what I focus on when threatened or under stress.

I was thinking of an SLE's HA behavior for 1 (empirical neurosis) and an SLI's HA behavior for 2 (empirical neurosis). I left it ambiguous enough so that the answer wouldn't be biased, although maybe my generalizations are too general.

Does it change if you were only offended?

1

That would match up with SLE then. Not saying you are though, just that this is how my categorizations (which you might be interpreting completely different from what I have in mind) are lined up with.

[Galen]

Well my reasons are plenty..I'm about to dumb this down because that's how I prefer to do things so get ready.

I don't identify with Delta values whatsoever. Nothing. Everything they value, I don't. I value everything Betas value. Everything. I don't give two shits about Si related things (at least not enough for it to be my leading function).

What is Si to you then? Just saying "Si-related things" is a meaningless generalization that could mean just about anything the reader wants to interpret.

I am far more attracted to Beta NF's than Delta NF's.

Like who?

I much prefer Fe to Fi and most of my relationship problems have to do with lack of Fe. If I were supposedly SLI, why on earth would I crave Fe so much if that were my POLR? Why would I need it? Why would a relationship end because of lack of it?

Again, how do you define Fe? These are just more haphazard generalizations.

Why don't I like the majority of the Deltas here and get along with all of the Betas?

I get along with plenty of Betas just fine. A good number of deltas on here are boringsville anyways.

What speficially about my personality possibly points to valuing Delta over Beta?

You've said yourself back in a long-ago ENFp thread that you had no issue with any of the ENFps posted. And if you're still crushing over Shaun White and Cher then that'd have me think something Delta, or at least not Beta ST.

Is it because I was a dumbass and typed myself that for 5 years because I was in a blackhole I couldn't get out of? Probably. I respect your opinion Galen, but honestly I really have a hard time seeing where you guys are coming from --it feels like you're just going off my own SLI typing and not even giving it a second thought because you have some image of me you've made up.

I barely know you aside from what little interaction I've had with you. The only image I have of you is someone bogged down in circumstances outside of your own control, which doesn't really amount to much type-wise. I do know that you've gone through this whole thing before multiple times, and each time you type-shifted you described yourself in accordance to whatever you believed yourself to be at the time.

If you disregard that self typing and looked at who I am as a whole and what I've just said here, if it still points to Delta, then I honestly think the idea you have of Socionics is fucked.

Unless we want this to collapse into an infinite "no u" loop there's no possible way to continue this argument on this point. What I will say is that from what you've posted just in here, I don't see any reason to call you any type because your speech is so bogged down in empty variables that aren't being explained. Or I could just wait a couple months for you to change your type back to ISTp, as you've been known to do in the past.

I'm not an 8? Have you read anything about 8w9? The description is basically my life story as is the SLE-Ti description. But this isn't a personal attack against you and your typing...you just don't know anything about me and that's ok.

I'm very familiar with the E8, and I figure if you had the self-assuredness of an 8 then you wouldn't be looking for external confirmation of your sociotype in the first place.

[jessica129]

Omg Galen. Really? NO U DEFINE SI!!! No really. Define Si, define Se, define Fi and define Fe because our idea of it must be completely wrong. You're really going to base my type off the fact I want to fuck Shawn white? Ok cool, didn't know socionics was that simplistic. I'm done trying to convince you you're not seeing the bigger picture, I dont care enough.

[Galen]

Omg Galen. Really? NO U DEFINE SI!!! No really. Define Si, define Se, define Fi and define Fe because our idea of it must be completely wrong. You're really going to base my type off the fact I want to fuck Shawn white? Ok cool, didn't know socionics was that simplistic. I'm done trying to convince you you're not seeing the bigger picture, I dont care enough.

I've written a bunch about the IEs, lemme try to find my posts. That is, if you care.

Si: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...l=1#post814767
Se: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...l=1#post814771
Involved IEs in general: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...l=1#post809395

Your turn

[jessica129]

Well I'm not reading an essay on each IE. I've done research, I know what they are and just because I don't write a page explaining in detail why I think I value one IE over the other, I think it's bs that you don't think I'm "educated" enough about them because while I dont claim to be all knowing and because I don't live breathe and eat socionics like some ppl here, I sure as hell know the difference between Fi POLR and Fe POLR and Si leading and Se leading. I'll define that if you want to define it first.

[Park]

Does it change if you were only offended?

No. And I don't think 1 and 2 are mutually exclusive, either.

Here are my thoughts on each.

I don't run around with a desire to make sure people's needs are being met, especially not in critical situations. That is, unless these people are close family or people I care about, in which case I do make sure their basic needs are met, and assist them in having the rest of their needs met when I can. But this reduces to a very small circle of people, and is definitely not something I pay much attention to in critical situations. I do dislike when people are being mistreated, and fight against it if I percieve that certain limits have been exceeded. (This is somewhat similar to option #1.)

I do have certain convictions about how people should behave and treat each other, and these are likely to come out in critical situations, because they are related to basic ethical principles to which I am sensitive, and bugs me when they are broken. (I relate this to Fi mostly.)

[717495]

Yeah it's like... you're just SLI lol. I know you want it to be explained out in perfect stereotyped Socionics terms like you value comfort and productivity, but as far as real function cognition, we have been progressing them from Jung the best we can and have good examples to share, you just have to keep open ears, even though I think Jung is detailed enough to grasp. Maybe try to join in something more intimate like the mibbit chat and get clearer context as themes are being thrown around. But as far as being Beta ST it's just not looking likely, you don't remind me of any Beta STs. Everyone else is just saying you're SLE because you want to be, like woofwoofl, maritsa, and others will agree with any self-typing, you just have to twist them the right way with the right words or attitude.

[jessica129]

I've written a bunch about the IEs, lemme try to find my posts. That is, if you care.

Si: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...l=1#post814767
Se: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...l=1#post814771
Involved IEs in general: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...l=1#post809395

Ok so how do you explain me identifying much more with your description of Se than Si? I guess I'm just stupid and very unaware of myself.

[Galen]

Well I'm not reading an essay on each IE. I've done research, I know what they are and just because I don't write a page explaining in detail why I think I value one IE over the other, I think it's bs that you don't think I'm "educated" enough about them because while I dont claim to be all knowing and because I don't live breathe and eat socionics like some ppl here, I sure as hell know the difference between Fi POLR and Fe POLR and Si leading and Se leading. I'll define that if you want to define it first.

When did I say you weren't educated? I don't claim to be all-knowing either, but you asked me to define them so I did.

Ok so how do you explain me identifying much more with your description of Se than Si? I guess I'm just stupid and very unaware of myself.

How's that? I'm looking for some semblance of detailed explanation here, and if you're not gonna write one then I'm not going to bother.

[717495]

I think it's more of she needs real context and examples, because she said she's read many descriptions and they didn't help, and there are like no LSIs here, or really anyone that interesting/stimulating to talk to in delta here.

[ashlesha]

if you identify with what you see as beta and get along best with people you type beta then that's what "works" and if socionics doesn't work for you then whats the point? there's really no point in seeking confirmation from people who will type you want they want for their own reasons if what you've settled on makes sense to you.

[Radio]

Everyone else is just saying you're SLE because you want to be, like woofwoofl, maritsa, and others will agree with any self-typing, you just have to twist them the right way with the right words or attitude.

Says the person who copies every single one of Ashton's typings and can't hold an original opinion to save his life.

[jessica129]

if you identify with what you see as beta and get along best with people you type beta then that's what "works" and if socionics doesn't work for you then whats the point? there's really no point in seeking confirmation from people who will type you want they want for their own reasons if what you've settled on makes sense to you.

True, true. This thread is pissing me off, it was a mistake. Pointless.

[717495]

Says the person who copies every single one of Ashton's typings and can't hold an original opinion to save his life.

That's incorrect. I dunno why someone else thinks that or spreads this around, I probably have them on ignore. But Galen, Ashton, eunice, myself and a few others have a very close and clear understanding of this stuff I think, so we agree on a lot. I probably have the closest understanding to Ashton because I've talked to him the most out of all of them.

[Morcheeba]

You remind me of an ISTp I used to work with, thats my input anyways.

[Radio]

But Galen, Ashton, eunice, myself and a few others have a very close and clear understanding of this stuff I think, so we agree on a lot.

SURE. Yeah, that's it, thanks for clarifying.

I probably have the closest understanding to Ashton because I've talked to him the most out of all of them.

It's fine if you have concordance with someone, and it's fine if your understanding matches with someone else's, but there's no excuse for the blatant arrogance you display towards others when you can't even back up your claims or provide any sort of reasoning for your typings, or provide any sort of material from which we can approximate your understanding, or provide anything other than empty declarations followed by "lols I don't know" so despite whatever that goes on in your mind or whatever genius you're ruminating upon, unless you can substantiate your typings with, you know, content, your full-of-shitness just keeps increasing. So in light of that, you have no right to bring down other people for agreeing with someone's self-typing because at least they're explaining their reasoning and being original; much more credible than you going "squaaawk! ISTp because squaaawk! lol I said so lol" and then pretending like there's a deeper analytical reasoning behind them, when there's none.

Take this from me: YOU ARE PRETENTIOUS ARROGANT AND FULL-OF-SHIT WITH NOTHING TO CONTRIBUTE EXCEPT PARROT ASHTON AND SOMETIMES GALEN.

YOU BRING SHAME TO EII KIND.

[Absurd]

That's incorrect. I dunno why someone else thinks that or spreads this around, I probably have them on ignore. But Galen, Ashton, eunice, myself and a few others have a very close and clear understanding of this stuff I think, so we agree on a lot. I probably have the closest understanding to Ashton because I've talked to him the most out of all of them.

With all due respect and no offence intended whatsoever, but you sound like apostle Peter, Galen is John and eunice is James. Those three apostles were closest to Jesus I mean Ashton.

[Park]

YOU BRING SHAME TO EII KIND.

Except that he probably isn't EII. And I'm not saying this only because I don't like him.

[717495]

SURE. Yeah, that's it, thanks for clarifying.



It's fine if you have concordance with someone, and it's fine if your understanding matches with someone else's, but there's no excuse for the blatant arrogance you display towards others when you can't even back up your claims or provide any sort of reasoning for your typings, or provide any sort of material from which we can approximate your understanding, or provide anything other than empty declarations followed by "lols I don't know" so despite whatever that goes on in your mind or whatever genius you're ruminating upon, unless you can substantiate your typings with, you know, content, your full-of-shitness just keeps increasing. So in light of that, you have no right to bring down other people for agreeing with someone's self-typing because at least they're explaining their reasoning and being original; much more credible than you going "squaaawk! ISTp because squaaawk! lol I said so lol" and then pretending like there's a deeper analytical reasoning behind them, when there's none.

Take this from me: YOU ARE PRETENTIOUS ARROGANT AND FULL-OF-SHIT WITH NOTHING TO CONTRIBUTE EXCEPT PARROT ASHTON AND SOMETIMES GALEN.

YOU BRING SHAME TO EII KIND.

You'll have a better chance if you cool off a bit and quit your presumptuous scampering and fool's logic. "Four people agree closely with one another on specific matters. Only some of them don't know what they're talking about." Are you trying to make yourself out to be a dodo? An argument about backing up claims holds no ground on how I do things. Maybe you're just not used to working with something objective like a database of examples, based from a solid source or not, that has to be explained from the ground up, not hold some petty analysis on how "oh this is how you could be this type but ooh there's also this so maybe you could be that type." Don't be a noob; stretch your mind deeper.

[Radio]

Baaaaa

That's nice.

[The Ineffable]

...

...

[Korpsy Knievel]

Jessica, instead of attempting to find a best fit within a dubious psychological schematic I think a better question to ask yourself is: "What insights have I gained from viewing myself as an SLI, SLE, hokey-pokey dancer, Zimbabwean bobsled team captain, or any other categorical type?" That's something immediately knowable to you that doesn't require the validation of people who can only offer guesses at the contents of your head.

[Absurd]

What time is last supper?

[jessica129]

Jessica, instead of attempting to find a best fit within a dubious psychological schematic I think a better question to ask yourself is: "What insights have I gained from viewing myself as an SLI, SLE, hokey-pokey dancer, Zimbabwean bobsled team captain, or any other categorical type?" That's something immediately knowable to you that doesn't require the validation of people who can only offer guesses at the contents of your head.

Yeah I know.

It's funny how betas think I'm beta and deltas think im delta. I must be loved.

[woofwoofl]

Says the person who copies every single one of Ashton's typings and can't hold an original opinion to save his life.

That's incorrect. I dunno why someone else thinks that or spreads this around, I probably have them on ignore. But Galen, Ashton, eunice, myself and a few others have a very close and clear understanding of this stuff I think, so we agree on a lot. I probably have the closest understanding to Ashton because I've talked to him the most out of all of them.

All 79 of your typings were identical to Ashton's. Shortly after I called you out on this, your typings in the spreadsheet mysteriously vanished.

A big thank-you from me to aestrivex/niffweed17 for saving the evidence:

http://www.socionics.ws/wiki/index.p...ex/spreadsheet

[Absurd]

All 79 of your typings were identical to Ashton's. Shortly after I called you out on this, your typings in the spreadsheet mysteriously vanished.

A big thank-you from me to aestrivex/niffweed17 for saving the evidence:

http://www.socionics.ws/wiki/index.p...ex/spreadsheet

Oh crap. Polikujm, I mean Peter, you didn't use your functions to see in the future it seems. Calling korpsey on isle 5. Calling all squad cars. Danger, Will Robinson! Danger!

I think there is another guy called Peter as well.

Nice one, though, woofwoofl.