Quasi-Identical Relations: Stories and Experiences

[FoxOnStilts]

Have you seen this play out? Have any ideas on how it might play out? How well do you think this would work and, overall, what would your prediction be?

I have a friend in this quasi-identical relationship right now and it just looks like a ticking time-bomb to me.

[silke]

My survey of quasi-identical threads on Rus. speaking socionics forums left me with an impression that introverted Quasi types are able to coexist, but there's some disengagement and disaffection between them, lack of synergy and energy (e.g. "returning home each heads to his or her own corner"). While among extroverted types Quasi relations are much more explosive and don't last as long even as friendships. These were a few stories posted by IEI-EII and LSI-SLI long-term couples who were able to make their relationships work out, but I don't remember seeing any stories of extroverted couples of Quasi types living together. Friendships between introverts Quasis are also quite common.

Gulenko has mentioned that Quasi-Identical types view each other as benefactors, hence in the beginning Quasis may admire and over-value each other, be extra friendly and receptive (unlike benefit, however, these relations don't feel asymmetric). Each person excels at something that is out of reach for another, thus initially one's quasi-identical is quite impressive. It is only later that these relations become irritating and annoying.

One of the reasons for this growing irritation is a lot of time gets wasted in trying to persuade each other in what feels like the obvious to you. Sometimes you and your Quasi actually agree and have same values, but the way your Quasi puts it is not easy for you to understand. This creates a faux-disagreement, which is not really a disagreement but a problem in how you and your Quasi have phrased things. Once you have managed to understand that they were saying, you may discover you were saying the same thing. There was no disagreement from the very beginning. However, getting to that point, having to decipher what Quasi-Identical is saying, takes up too much mental energy and feels draining, not to mention loss of time, to the point where there is no wish to get into deeper discussions and arguments with them, or even read what they have written (in case of Quasi authors). However, this very instance that Quasis communicate so differently may initially create a "veil of mystery" and push them to connect and get to know each other.



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I'll translate something tomorrow from the QI discussion threads and post it here.

Edit: These are some of the more informative posts on QI relations discussions from the Russian socionics forums. If I see any others and have time to translate them I'll add them on at this link: Wikisocion - Quasi-Identical Relations


To summarize the positives and negatives of QI relations.

The positives:

• Quasi types are in the same club and on the same side of "Aristocatic - Democratic" dichotomy. This creates some commonality in how friendships are formed and how discussions are approached, making it easy to start a conversation. The Quasi seems like a non-threatening yet interesting conversation partner.
• Victor Gulenko has described quasi-identical relations as "mutual execution of the request" which means that Quasis seem similar to Benefactors. This means that at least initially there could be admiration of one's Quasi, a sense that he is talented in some inaccessible and unachievable to oneself way. The Quasi may seem interesting from a distance with an illusory feeling of similarity and oddness about the other person, which is intriguing. Thus the Quasi seems to be gifted in a way that you are not, and yet they are so similar to you (and often play the same social role).
• In quasi-identical relations people are motivated to become more outgoing. Gulenko classifies Quasi-identity relations as "extroverted", meaning that they improve in presence of external influences.
• These relations work well with the same "arrangement" as Conflict relations: division of responsibilities, territory, chores, finances, i.e. clear differentiation of "yours-mine", such that Quasis are able to do things separately from each other and run into fewer misunderstandings in the process. This cultivates personal qualities tied to responsibility and self-reliance in both.
• Static / Dynamic trait coincides. One partner (static) brings stability to these relations, while the other (dynamic) introduces more continuity and flow to their experience.
• Tactical / Strategic trait also coincides. One of the partners sets an objective, while the other comes up with the methods of getting there (provided that both agree on the goal). Having common goals is a very important factor in keeping these relations together.

The negatives of Quasi-Identical Relations:

• Many of those who have experienced these relations commented that they are more suitable for light conversation and leisure discussions, and that it's better to not meet every day. Deeper engagement and discussion prompt Quasis to realize how different they really are, which creates a distance between them. At worst, this spills out into small-scale conflicts and bickering and futile attempts to persuade the other to change his point of view; at best - a kind of bemusement and disbelief in the other's point of view ("heh, he/she can't be serious...").
• When more serious discussions do happen, QI partners can't make much headway in terms of persuading each another. There is a sense of beating one's head against a wall, that the other person simply doesn't get it no matter how well you explain yourself. At the same time, QI partner's reasoning seems besides the point, his arguments seem insubstantial, lacking in weight and persuasive power, sometimes confusing, seemingly only tangential to the situation, which prompts Quasis to dismiss each other's arguments.
• After a lengthy interaction, a sense of boredom, annoyance, and stagnation in friendship or relations begins to accumulate. Quasis expand excessive energy in trying to explain themselves and understand each other, such that there's a feeling of being drained or "extinguished" in a sense after such conversations. If this is a romantic pairing, one or both of them may feel that there is no forward momentum and no sufficient spark in their relationship. These relations in romantic form are more acceptable for older people who value stability and who don't have other options.
• If Quasi-identical relations have taken a downturn (which is more common at work, where Quasis may compete for the same role/position in a group), there may be devaluation of each other's intellectual abilities and potential, attempts at discreditation, nagging criticisms, disbelief that anyone would listen to this person and take them seriously, feelings of envy, jealousy and amazement when one's QI partner is successful, receives praise and awards, and earns the trust and ear of other people. In some cases, this prompts suspicions of foul play on their part, that they are being disingenuous, simply faking it or lying to others. Thus quasis may suspect or even openly accuse each other of cheating, because they can't clearly see each other's motivations or follow each other's reasoning.
• Differences in Rationality / Irrationality let themselves be known in these relations. Rationals voice more complaints in this regard.
• Differences in Process / Result trait also manifest. Process types are less accommodating at close personal distances but more accommodating at large personal distances. The reverse is true of Result types (more about this). To put it succinctly: one's quasi-identical's manner of interaction is different from what one expects. Result types tend to resent their Process type partners for being kinder and more yielding around strangers and 'outsides', while being harsher with them in close company.
• There are differences in romancing and courting styles. Sensing couples ("aggressor"-"caregiver") were more vocal about these incompatibilities than Intuitive pairs ("victim"-"childlike"). The later seemed to mostly overlook this possibly due to weak sensing.

[FoxOnStilts]

My survey of quasi-identical threads on other socionics forums left me with an impression that introverted types are able to coexist, but separately i.e. returning home each heads out to his own 'territory', while among extroverts they are much more explosive, not as viable or long-lived. These were several mentions of couples like IEI-EII and LSI-SLI who were able to make it work, but I don't remember seeing descriptions of quasi-extroverted couples.

I'll translate something tomorrow from those threads and post it here.

thank you that would be awesome! That's the impression I have so far. It is volatile so far, so I'm sort of expecting an explosion.

[xerx]

Don't know about EIE-IEE specifically, but quasi can seem like a good relationship... at first, because of perceived commonalities.

From what i understand, sooner or later they start getting on each other's nerves for lacking (polr) the other's dual-seeking function.

Communication should get progressively more annoying because one partner's leading function is the other's demonstrative, which can get bland pretty quick. It isn't as satisfying as the input towards your creative function from your mirror.


Contrary has better long-term prospects, ime.

Where did they meet (if i may ask)? Was it at an event geared toward a quadra-nonspecific NF audience?

[FoxOnStilts]

Where did they meet (if i may ask)? Was it at an event geared toward a quadra-nonspecific NF audience?

Not even. They work together. IEE is a server and almost done with a degree in secondary education (about to start student teaching) and the EIE is a line cook at the same restaurant (national chain selling 10$ "gourmet" burgers). I'm expecting it to fall apart in a couple of months when she starts student teaching because she'll have ridiculous hours early in the morning and he's often not off til 1am.....either that or they'll move in together.

I'm just not looking forward to it because the IEE is my bestie/roommate and she's being very needy about everything so far (I think because she's worried about how it will be when she starts teaching, but who knows).

[Iris]

IEEs are awesome. Every IEE I know is so full of personality. I love the way they look at things. But that Si Dual seeking is a problem for me. When I am around them, I initially view their Si needs as an interesting problem to be solved (hopefully without too much effort on my part.) After the second wave of dual seeking, I say, Hmm this need is still here, What the heck? I try to solve the problem again. But inevitably the Si problems never go away or shift to some other Si need. Then I start to feel like I want to get away from the neediness. Because I can't fix it permanently. If I can't remove myself from the situation, I endure it grimly, trying not to show my true feelings so as not to offend. But the IEE is so sensitive, they can probably feel the unvalued attitude I have toward their problem, even though I am trying to be polite. I think I am EIE. But have been told that I am not a very effective one.

[glam]

with long-term & deeper interaction with EII, i find that it's easy for us to end up quarreling over relatively "minor" details, despite both of us drawing the same general conclusion over the matter at hand. "minor" in quotes because upon reflection afterwards, the arguments do often seem unnecessary, though during the actual disagreements, defense of your own perspective make the differences seem quite "major".

it becomes very wearing, and necessary to spend time away from each other.

[anndelise]

with long-term & deeper interaction with EII, i find that it's easy for us to end up quarreling over relatively "minor" details, despite both of us drawing the same general conclusion over the matter at hand. "minor" in quotes because upon reflection afterwards, the arguments do often seem unnecessary, though during the actual disagreements, defense of your own perspective make the differences seem quite "major".

it becomes very wearing, and necessary to spend time away from each other.

I would say that from an outsider's perspective, this seems to fit well my NiFe bro and FiNe mom's relationship.

They get along great when they are together but need breaks from each other. If they don't get that break, a slight misunderstanding on either's side can spiral into a kind of spat, ending in ill feelings and one or both running away from the situation. They seemed to hold a resentment for a bit, and then the relationship would resume moving back onto good grounds.


Regarding OP...it'd be scarier to see two extroverts like that.

[Iris]

Regarding OP...it'd be scarier to see two extroverts like that.

It's very polite, really. To a point. I try really hard, then some of my Beta harshness comes out and offends the IEE's Fi. Then she protests and I am shocked that she cares so much about what I just said. Then I feel immature and like I have no manners but I bluster and make excuses for myself. Ugh. Then I apologize. (But I secretly really think she is way too sensitive.)

[anndelise]

It's very polite, really. To a point. I try really hard, then some of my Beta harshness comes out and offends the IEE's Fi. Then she protests and I am shocked that she cares so much about what I just said. Then I feel immature and like I have no manners but I bluster and make excuses for myself. Ugh. Then I apologize. (But I secretly really think she is way too sensitive.)

Is it a comfortable politness or a forced one?

I know that with NiFe's I have to be careful of what I say, as it easily leads to misunderstandings and arguments. I constantly feel as if I'm walking on nails around them. "Beta harshness" with "Delta over-sensitivities" sounds like an apt description.
I'm glad to hear that apologies work with FeNis, cuz even when I try to apologize to my NiFe friend, the apology gets accused of being patronizing or some other negative thing. I haven't been able to get one to come out right even once, yet.

Edited to add, ugh, sorry for the tangent, feel free to ignore it. I'm more curious about the first question.

[xerx]

anyway, quasi is mentally draining and unfulfilling. you usually play mental gymnastics to frame your quasi's points in a way that's interesting to you, and you can't offer your quasi what s/he wants or needs.

[Iris]

@anndelice it's polite all of the time for me because that is my default mode from my upbringing. It's hard for me to notice when it crosses the line into forced when I am listening to protracted unsolvable dual seeking. After the first few "fixing" attempts I am ready to get out of there because it's just too much of a polr hit. But I feel like I need to be sympathetic. Here is this nice interesting person with this unsolvable Problem. Of course the right thing to do is to engage in active listening (but I really want to run screaming out of the room.) Having an understanding of a POLR hit helps me a little, but not enough to help me want to endure an ongoing caregiving situation.