MBTI INFJ, Socionics WTF?

[noid]

I suggest you read some info from http://www.wikisocion.org// (the static/dynamic stuff was not really a serious info to take into account, thats hard to set stuff in stone for this dichotomie. That was just an impression.), simple source organized like wikipedia.

At this moment from 2 last post my guess is most likely delta NF; I dont think you are Ni, and thats not for trolling current typing. But you should wait other opinion, Im not the boss of socionic typing

Also, how does 6w5 suggest no Fe?

Because (and thats subject to debate but thats my opinion) 6 are most often ESI (ISFj) and EII (INFj), and thats said from various source that 6 is a Fi enneatype (wikisocion, some enneagram description, ect...).

[Beautiful sky]

I'm proud of you, PistolShrimp, for not using your perception to keep adapting to others or the type which you are in MBTI and transferring meaning to Socionics. I'm very proud to say that you're a very mature ISFp and one who uses the correct methods of arriving to a type rather than just adapting to what others say. You know Ip's can be very adaptive and malleable mentally for having that perceptive ability and sometimes it goes so far as to adapt to such an extent where the self identification is lost and the Ip all it does is keep adapting. It's like someone who can go along with any situation but instead chooses to find, by the analytic method, their own self.

[PistolShrimp]

It takes some practice to tell between the two. You'd have to compare samples of your writing to samples of someone of a static type, then the differences will start to manifest.


IP types are more prone to synthetic thinking, IJ types - to analytical, so what you're saying is more evidence in favor of an IP typing.

Alright, thanks! I'll check out some posts by static types, too. Here is a conversation I had with my boyfriend on Facebook messenger today; he is a static type, so my interaction with him will probably give a clearer picture:

ILE:
[link to forum post about the trend of strong sexy women in video games and other media] interesting didn't have time to read though

jk I think it is retarded

but what do you think about the roles of women in games and how they are portrayed

Me:
wowwww there are a lot of butthurt misogynists on that forum!

women are objectified in games like they are in many other areas; their sexual appeal and utility take the forefront, and these
"empowered" women are a unique brand of sexy in their strength. also, almost any attempt to portray females in media like movies and
video games is very often met with criticism from different groups. she's too whiny/weak/clueless/domineering/strong/intelligent/girly/dykey
etc...

i think a lot of men have set expectations, both conscious and subconscious, of what women should be like, and when characters don't
meet these expectations they disapprove of them. those men in the forum have issues with the trend in gaming it seems because they see it
as women impinging on some sacred man cave of theirs.

i think the trend is a good one but implemented in a sloppy way, like affirmative action. "let's put more caricatures of strong women in games
to make up for years of horribly whiny princesses that always needed saving and hand-holding!" it seems forced and awkward.

personally, i think Jill Valentine in RE1 is a great example of how to do a strong female protagonist RIGHT in gaming, but they've sexualized her too in later games
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__...tinedevice.jpg

what do you think?

ILE:
fapfapfapfap

It is tough because I think feminine sexuality is a unique and valuable thing to represent. Really what is should come down to is personal preference
of the woman. You can act how you want.

I think there is an awkward gap that is really hard to describe between the mass display of hyped up sexuality in women and a completely gender
neutral woman. Is it misrepresentation, is it guiding them the wrong way, is it disrespectful disregard? What is often stems from is rather an often
subconscious attraction and admiration towards aspects of females. I think just calling all men that, say, inadvertently fantasize about a woman passing
in attractive clothing are wrong and bad in doing so. Of course there are blatant examples of "precision features" (ugh it feels odd saying that) that are
egregious and inspire disgust. For example, ads of very skinny women.

One example I actually feel is nicely done in a level form is Motoko from Ghost in the Shell. While initially you might say "oh she wears some wacky tight
clothing and jumps around", I think it is just freedom of license for a futuristic society. Also one could argue that it is a distraction for her foes.

I would say it is a losing battle trying to fight off all gender stereotypes, but there probably should be better education in recognizing them. (most kids
figure this out at the boys trucks girls dolls stage hopefully, in which they can freely decide).

I could talk about feminism all day probably

Me:
*eyeroll @ fapping*

Re: your justification of Motoko's outfit. Her character itself is interesting and well-done, yes, but I see the outfit as fanservice with a cyberpunk aesthetic
and think it's a bit disingenuous to say otherwise. Whatever, artistic license and all that. You can definitely interpret the choice in clothing however you want;
that's part of the problem in discussing this topic.

I think the more subtle aspects of feminine sexuality get short shrift in the media in favor of the more in-your-face easily accessible and marketable kind.
Feminine sexuality is incredibly dynamic and complex, but the media tends to turn it into a static caricature by focusing on the simple physical, visible aspects of
it- sexy clothes, nice tits/ass, etc. Where's the subtlety? Is it good to promote such one-dimensional role models of female sexuality?

As you know, the stereotypes run far deeper than trucks vs. dolls, though I always chose the Hot Wheels with my Happy Meal. Education leading to awareness
would help, but how would it be implemented successfully and fairly?

I really like talking about this stuff with you

ILE:
Yeah I feel people poorly execute examples for various reasons. For example, they might be conveying a different level of sexuality and it isn't the main purpose of
the piece. Actors and actresses may also portray it foolishly or improperly because sexuality has makes people judge in a hefty manner. For example if you show one time
a girl hooking up with a guy, a large audience will call her a slut...while others will think it is normal.

Additionally, sexuality is used as a hook to lure in an audience. For example you will say, oh a hot girl, I'll check this out...and it leads to something more complex and
interesting.

I'm proud of you, PistolShrimp, for not using your perception to keep adapting to others or the type which you are in MBTI and transferring meaning to Socionics. I'm very proud to say that you're a very mature ISFp and one who uses the correct methods of arriving to a type rather than just adapting to what others say. You know Ip's can be very adaptive and malleable mentally for having that perceptive ability and sometimes it goes so far as to adapt to such an extent where the self identification is lost and the Ip all it does is keep adapting. It's like someone who can go along with any situation but instead chooses to find, by the analytic method, their own self.

Whatever type I am, I am certainly malleable. I think this flexibility is compounded by my enneatype, as I'd guess 9 sx is especially prone to strongly desire merging with others by adapting himself or herself to others' needs. Still not positive on the ISFp typing as I see my relationship as more mirage than duality due to how much time we spend lazing around vs. doing stuff, and I'm not sure I'm / vs yet. Thank you for your input, though!

[Ryan]

Was he fapping at your input?

Keeping everything you have said before about him in mind, I'm almost certain that he is an IEE.

[noid]

Agree ! the ILE is an IEE, its what I see too.

[PistolShrimp]

Was he fapping at your input?

Keeping everything you have said before about him in mind, I'm almost certain that he is an IEE.

LOL, he was joke-fapping at the sexy Jill Valentine picture I linked to.

I can see why you'd say IEE due to our conversation, but I see him as Fi-PoLR way more than I do Fi-creative. His jokes and comments would offend a lot of people if he didn't censor himself. He also studied computer science, management and math in college, and repairs robots for a living, which is way more NT > NF as far as career choices go. He doesn't have the Fi focus on close relationships, and doesn't particularly care about helping others through their feelings.

This is what his Fi-PoLR looks like:

"I'm kind of awkward around support in emotional hard times because, you guessed it *KAZOO* I CONFRONT IT WITH HUMOR. Which means, oh your grandfather died? What did he do? Oh I see, he was a barber. Life sure didn't CUT him slack. I literally am spending time sitting here thinking about other funny puns but I really can't come up with any and I don't feel like spending time to. lol fuck. point proven. PEOPLE DO NOT RESPOND WELL TO THIS. (I usually hold my tongue and snicker inside at funerals)"

Agree ! the ILE is an IEE, its what I see too.

[img]frog[/img]

Bahaha, Foul Bachelor Frog.

Here is another quote from him that should help to disprove IEE:

"If I saw a man hit a woman in a bar, and did nothing to react besides leave the bar, what does that say about me? One could conclude that I am a coward, that I am evasive or that I am wise for avoiding conflict and potential harm. I could also be thought of as passive or an existentialist. I could even be seen as courageous depending on my exit as if I was going to return with someone of stature that could punish that person. Or I could be thought of as agreeing with violence against women. I could go on longer but I am just listing many examples to demonstrate through one rather simple action, on purpose or inadvertent, many such conclusions can be drawn about my person. And then the question is posed, what if I upon leaving I had no intent other than the subconscious and abrupt urge to leave at that time? For little or no defined reason at all?

That is why I don't like to base truths on conclusions. Really then though what do we have? At some level, yes conclusions are accurate enough to be truth or serve a point. I tend to lean away from emotional conclusions however because I find them to be shaky if you don't effectively know a person well (and even then...)."

[PistolShrimp]

Here is some shit I wrote about my job a few months ago. Looking at it now, I'm not sure what function is my strongest, but I think I see here...

Sometimes at work, I distract myself from the occasional urge to snort lines of powdered sugar after folding paper
boxes for four hours straight by working on a list of categories that bakery customers fall into. This is what I've
come up with so far. Let the pigeonholing begin!


Bakery Customer Taxonomy

The Native

Short, elderly and unmistakably Italian. Will ask for a pastry with an incomprehensible Italian name in order to test
the mettle of new bakery employees, who will either live up to the challenge by bullshitting magnificently or run
crying for help to the bakery manager.

Catch phrase: "Any Sfogliatelle today?"

The Old Faithful

Invariably elderly and male. May be large and bearded or small and bespectacled. Orders fruit-filled breakfast
pastry at approximately 99.9% frequency.

Catch phrase: "Are those fig squares?"


The Expectant Mother

Orders six pastries (all chocolate) and rubs bulging belly in an exaggerated manner as if to justify her purchase.

Catch phrase: "This is a bad place to be when you're pregnant!"


The Mother

Evolves from The Expectant Mother. Accompanied by one or more toddlers who proceed to inhale all of the free
sample cookies and press their faces and hands all over the recently-washed glass pastry cases. Gets each child
several cupcakes, half-moons and/or M&M cookies. Often seen attempting to juggle a newborn in one arm and five
boxes of pastries in the other.

Catch phrase: "Get down from there, Bobby!"


The Husband/The Boyfriend

Often a proxy for The Expectant Mother or The Mother. Enters bakery with a look of sheer panic on his face at six o' clock
at night. Buys a cake and asks bakery employee to write "Happy Birthday" or "Happy Anniversary" on it, searches for a
greeting card while he waits, then proceeds to the flower shop next door.

Catch phrase: "Thanks, you're a lifesaver!"


The Fresh Prince/The Fresh Princess

Easily identified by an obsession with pastry quality and freshness, coupled with a complete lack of comprehension about
the frequency of pastry production. Often complains to apathetic bakery employees about a stale pastry he or she bought
weeks ago.

Catch phrase: "Was this bread pudding made today?"


The Joker

When asked what they would like, The Joker always answers "I'll have one of everything," causing bakery employees to force
awkward chuckles and pretend that they haven't heard that one a hundred times before.

Alternative catch phrase: "Do you have anything low-carb?"


The Artist

Orders an impossibly complex or weird cake that the bakery employee must first clear with the cake decorator or else face her wrath.

Catch phrase: "I'd like a marble cake with whipped cream frosting, lemon and yellow creme filling, chocolate shavings on the top and nuts
on the side, and a drawing of the Eiffel Tower in pink frosting on the top, please."


The Chocolate Mousse Cake Addict

Typically middle-aged and Indian. Almost always orders chocolate mousse cake, and appears disappointed when the cake case
contains none. Often gets hopes up upon seeing chocolate cake with fudge frosting in the case, only to face further disappointment
when told that it contains no mousse. Will on occasion order whipped cream cake with pineapple filling instead.

Catch phrase: "What type of cake is this?"


The Walking Heart Attack

Weighs 300 lbs or more. Appears uncomfortable upon entering the bakery section. Orders large lobster tail or
four cannolis then looks side-to-side with shifty eyes before leaving.

Catch phrase: "I really shouldn't eat this..."


The Hunter

Enters bakery on a mission, with head held low, muscles tensed and eyes focused on the pastry cases as he
or she prowls from one end to the other. Completely oblivious to eye contact and offers of help unless desired
pastry is not found.

Catch phrase: "Do you have any cannolis? I don't see them in the case."


The Lurker

Polar opposite of The Hunter. Wanders the bakery aimlessly, taking free sample cookies while waiting for a
sandwich from the deli. Alternatively, the Lurker makes a quick run into the bakery, causing bakery employees
to stop whatever they're doing to help, and then disappears without a trace before the employees can say a word.
Often a Flip-Flopper in disguise.

Catch phrase: "I'm just looking."


The Flip-Flopper

Perpetually indecisive and often talking on the phone. Will order five pastries, then change order to ten, then back to five
again, then back to ten, forcing bakery employees to fold several boxes or attempt to Tetris ten messy pastries into a box
meant for five. Their catch phrase "I'll just pick and choose as I go along" strikes a potent mixture of frustration and fear in
the hearts of bakery employees.

Alternative catch phrase: "I'm not sure what I want. Could you tell me what this is? And this? And this? And this?"


The Pizzeria Regina/ The Papa Gino

Female or male, though the Pizzeria Regina is far more common. Appears to own his or her own pizzeria, or to be secretly
feeding a small Italian army.

Catch phrase: "Can I have five pounds of pizza dough?"


The Dyscalculia Sufferer

Either blissfully unaware that "a couple" typically means "two," or completely incapable of counting. Close relative
to the Flip-Flopper.

Catch phrase: "I'll have a couple of pastries- maybe fifteen or so."


The Bread Winners/The Bread Losers

Separated only by their success in their sole goal of purchasing bread, the Bread Winners and Losers are constantly at odds.
The Winners have learned to strategically call in a bread order ahead of time, while the Losers have yet to realize that there will
probably be no more fresh scali bread or dinner rolls left at 6:30 on a Saturday night.

Winners catch phrase: "I'm picking up two round breads sliced, under Bruno."

Losers catch phrase: "Do you have any more rolls out back?"