MBTI INFJ, Socionics WTF?

[Ryan]

I'm not sure I agree with LII walking a little bit like frogs, but body language can provide a lot of information about someone's type. I think the description is kinda of confusing since I don't know what it means by walking like a frog. I mean what WA said wasn't stereotyping, just relating some information she has heard and personal experience.

You said "Huge chance", and nothing at all indicate ESE.

I think the picture of him and the lack of willpower in completing projects doesn't let me think demonstrative.

http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin/content.php
If you want to research demonstratives.

I was talking about my own possibilities, silly ILE. Thanks for the link.

[PistolShrimp]

From what I've read so far, I identify with many bits and pieces of the IEI and LII descriptions, and some of the SEI ones. Why is IEI out of the picture, again? Because I'm not flashing all over this thread?

R u kidding? LIIs are Fe-dual seekers... they can have obnoxious emotionality per my understanding. Re: gait, I read somewhere that people were making an observation that LIIs can sometimes walk a little bit like a frog (which actually did ring true for an LII ex-coworker of mine), so maybe the "floaty, dancing" walk is consistent with LII.

And yes your bf does in fact sound alpha NT from what you described. I think either ILE or LII can start lots of projects and not finish them. EDIT: just looked at his pic above, and he does actually VI alpha NT too. ur right.

Your type isn't quite jumping out at me though yet, even with the extra pics. I could see you as LII possibly. So that would make you and your bf mirrors, which is why you dont feel it's duality. Same quadra though, so it's def a good relation anyway.

Hmm. I can see LII too, but based on this page (http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...rror-Relations), our relationship doesn't sound like a Mirror one. We are completely open with each other, and our relationship is plenty warm and caring. In fact, I wish I had much MORE intellectual stimulation (Ne food?) in our relationship, while descriptions of Mirror relations say they are almost solely an intellectual connection with little passion. My boyfriend is almost certainly ENTp, Ne subtype. His Ne is all over the place, and I love him for it. I'm just not sure we're mirrors, or identity for that matter as hkkmr suggested. I'll have to read some more though. I'm still incredibly confused about all of this.

You don't seem nearly as natural at it as F-egos are.

Even when you "chuckle" in your video, it's kind of awkward and deadpan.

Well yeah, I was monologuing into a camera for 15 minutes with birds staring at me. Shit gets awkward.

I'm not really sure how natural I am at it in a normal context; you could be right. INTjs/INTPs on YouTube seem more awkward, serious and inexpressive than I am, though. I get really revved up emotionally by a lot of things, and other people can tell when it happens by my face, gestures, etc.

He looks like a hobbit.

I got him from The Internet!

BTW, to the OP, you kinda of remind me of Ellen Page.

Heh, I've got that before and it's cool because she's hot. I think it's because we're both 24-25-year-old mousy girls who look like jailbait.

[Beautiful sky]

SEI are very strong and capable of Ti as LII are of Si; the difference is one is more inclined to constant analysis and the other would rather experience things on their own subjective sensory level. This analysis, which coins them as "ANALYST" is their motion to place things in categories. This is used to bring the elusive and sometimes out of control emotional response of Fe that reacts to things of external happenings back to a subjective/personal understanding and judgement.


This calls for an example:

If an Fe base type is emotionally moved by an external circumstance such as what impact Religion has made on society, it will first respond to it emotionally; the person will look as if they are consumed by the feeling processes of this response, being loud, judgmental, casting people who don't meet the model out, or grouping others.

Ti responds with placing religions into categories, and maybe even helping the Fe look at those categories with consideration that there are some they are responding inappropriately to.

This religion does this and this one does that and this one has evolved and this one...on and on.

You see, eventually and Fe base type will begin to judge against certain groups from weak conceptualization of these categories or who does what, when. This weaker Ti allows them to not analyze as well as Ti types, instead just respond emotionally.

[PistolShrimp]

[Suz]

From what I've read so far, I identify with many bits and pieces of the IEI and LII descriptions, and some of the SEI ones. Why is IEI out of the picture, again? Because I'm not flashing all over this thread?

Hmm. I can see LII too, but based on this page (http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...rror-Relations), our relationship doesn't sound like a Mirror one. We are completely open with each other, and our relationship is plenty warm and caring. In fact, I wish I had much MORE intellectual stimulation (Ne food?) in our relationship, while descriptions of Mirror relations say they are almost solely an intellectual connection with little passion. My boyfriend is almost certainly ENTp, Ne subtype. His Ne is all over the place, and I love him for it. I'm just not sure we're mirrors, or identity for that matter as hkkmr suggested. I'll have to read some more though. I'm still incredibly confused about all of this.

the only thing that really meant much to me socionically in what you said above is what I highlighted in bold. And i'd say that's mirror-like. You see his shortcomings but in a fond way. They say mirrors make the best advisors because of that. An identical is likely to see things the same way you would, a dual is likely to approve of anything you want to do because they think you're awesome because they're weak at the things you're strong at, activity--well i'm not sure how to fit them into this discussion, but a mirror will give you honest criticism that you feel you can accept and appreciate because you really have the same values and strengths just a different emphasis on them (as opposed to a socionic supervisor who will also criticize but in doing so will hit your POLR and thus cause a great deal of irritation).

You criticizing your bf's degree of Ne, but still loving him for it, tells me that you think someone should just selectively use Ne (like you probably do). Among mirrors there is also the irrationality vs rationality difference which also leads to seeing things a little differently. Mirrors are still a very warm and open relation though!! I mean how else will they be able to give each other honest criticism?

what made you think that mirrors are closed off to one another?? They are the same quadra!


The thing about reading descriptions is that it's hard to tell how those general descriptions really manifest.

[Beautiful sky]

PistolShrimp, sounds like your BF is ENTp. Duals

[PistolShrimp]

SEI are very strong and capable of Ti as LII are of Si; the difference is one is more inclined to constant analysis and the other would rather experience things on their own subjective sensory level. This analysis, which coins them as "ANALYST" is their motion to place things in categories. This is used to bring the elusive and sometimes out of control emotional response of Fe that reacts to things of external happenings back to a subjective/personal understanding and judgement.


This calls for an example:

If an Fe base type is emotionally moved by an external circumstance such as what impact Religion has made on society, it will first respond to it emotionally; the person will look as if they are consumed by the feeling processes of this response, being loud, judgmental, casting people who don't meet the model out, or grouping others.

Ti responds with placing religions into categories, and maybe even helping the Fe look at those categories with consideration that there are some they are responding inappropriately to.

This religion does this and this one does that and this one has evolved and this one...on and on.

You see, eventually and Fe base type will begin to judge against certain groups from weak conceptualization of these categories or who does what, when. This weaker Ti allows them to not analyze as well as Ti types, instead just respond emotionally.

Thank you for the interesting example! I've found myself swept up into groups before to the point where I found my views so strongly warped by the group that I could not think objectively. For example, I followed around a bunch of Anonymous Scientology protestors for a photojournalism story assignment, but ended up getting so wrapped up in their views and chants that I wouldn't shut up about the dangers/stupidity of Scientology for weeks after, when previously I thought very little about Scientology. I snapped out if it eventually, and felt pretty embarrassed.

I feel like I can't really analyze things from a detached, cool standpoint very well; my emotions heat things up and stir my thoughts. I do tend to analyze everything and anything, but I can be very easily swayed by people who I perceive as knowing more than I do about a subject. If something feels off, I'll research a topic until I can confidently think for myself about it. I have a tendency to over-think instead of draw a conclusion and move on, and I get anxious or depressed when I'm alone with my thoughts for too long. I think I feel most at peace when photographing, reading, listening to music, writing, drawing, napping, etc. Perhaps LII types tend to feel/act this way. I feel too in tune with my body, the needs of others and the "emotional barometer" of an environment to fit the LII descriptions, and too nerdy, awkward, provocative and analytical to fit the SEI ones...

the only thing that really meant much to me socionically in what you said above is what I highlighted in bold. And i'd say that's mirror-like. You see his shortcomings but in a fond way. They say mirrors make the best advisors because of that. An identical is likely to see things the same way you would, a dual is likely to approve of anything you want to do because they think you're awesome because they're weak at the things you're strong at, activity--well i'm not sure how to fit them into this discussion, but a mirror will give you honest criticism that you feel you can accept and appreciate because you really have the same values and strengths just a different emphasis on them (as opposed to a socionic supervisor who will also criticize but in doing so will hit your POLR and thus cause a great deal of irritation).

You criticizing your bf's degree of Ne, but still loving him for it, tells me that you think someone should just selectively use Ne (like you probably do). Among mirrors there is also the irrationality vs rationality difference which also leads to seeing things a little differently. Mirrors are still a very warm and open relation though!! I mean how else will they be able to give each other honest criticism?

what made you think that mirrors are closed off to one another?? They are the same quadra!

The thing about reading descriptions is that it's hard to tell how those general descriptions really manifest.

I could see a Mirror relation a bit if it is like you described. However, from the Mirror Relations article on this site, three separate authors: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...rror-Relations

"Mirror partners are often good friends, spending time together is interesting, though in communication there is lack of openness and real warmth."
"Desire to learn from each other manifest. But warmth in these relations is lacking"
"Mirror relations usually lack warm atmosphere between partners."



Guess I'd have to see it in action between other people to recognize how it really functions. I'm probably too embedded in my relationship to view it objectively.

[PistolShrimp]

So after reading up a bit more, I feel stuck between IEI, LII, and SEI. LII seems to be the top guess in this topic, but it doesn't quite fit from the descriptions. Does anyone have a video of someone who is LII, or could anyone describe the LII types they know?

Also, I strongly relate to the IEI "mood" description on Socionics.us (http://socionics.us/practice/mood.shtml):
"wacky, goofy, dreamy, zany; interested in people's inner experiences and where people are going with their emotional life; mix of joy and melancholy"

That sounds just like how I perceive myself. LII seems too...detached and dispassionate.

[Anglas]

u no IEI

[Trevor]

Does anyone have a video of someone who is LII, or could anyone describe the LII types they know?

...

That sounds just like how I perceive myself. LII seems too...detached and dispassionate.

This is video of someone who is LII. She's unlike you, if you ask me.

[PistolShrimp]

u no IEI

OK. Why?

This is video of someone who is LII. She's unlike you, if you ask me.

-video-

Cool, thanks! She does seem unlike me in her mannerisms and way of speaking. Her use of Ti seems...quicker. I have to think longer before I speak.

--
I'm fairly certain my mom is an SEI. She has been a nurse for 30 years, an advocate for proper self-care, became a Reiki master recently, is a great host of parties, very domestic, also prone to need space and privacy. I don't think I'm an SEI because I'm not as selfless as she is. She will overextend herself in helping people, while I really enjoy helping people but will fall back when I know they're demanding too much. She also places much more significance on the past and tradition than I do. She has always said I am "wise beyond my years," and that she is a "young soul" in comparison.

I still have no idea what type I am, despite all of the help you guys have given me. Guess I need to keep reading! Unless someone wants to interview me or something. I was a journalism major, I can take it.

[Anglas]

You don't look like XXFx type

[PistolShrimp]

You don't look like XXFx type

Fair enough, thanks.

--------------

LII profiles make the type sound autistic.

I really don't have trouble getting along with people, making small talk, etc. I am warm and approachable unless in a bad mood, though somewhat shy and awkward. I enjoy having close, meaningful relationships with people; this is a key focus of my life. I make acquaintances easily, and people tend to open up to me and ask for advice.

Could anyone help me to understand how Fe as a dual-seeking function would manifest in an INTj compared to the Fe creative function of the SEI?

[d1ffe7]

LII profiles make the type sound autistic.

I really don't have trouble getting along with people, making small talk, etc. I am warm and approachable unless in a bad mood, though somewhat shy and awkward. I enjoy having close, meaningful relationships with people; this is a key focus of my life. I make acquaintances easily, and people tend to open up to me and ask for advice.

Could anyone help me to understand how Fe as a dual-seeking function would manifest in an INTj compared to the Fe creative function of the SEI?

hahha. they make ILIs sound autistic too. being a logical doesn't necessarily mean you're unfriendly or incapable of being social/empathetic/whatever other emotional things normal people do, it's just not a primary mode of thought. As far as Fe DS vs. Fe creative, i would just try to read as many Fe descriptions as you can and try to understand it. for SEI, it's wouldn't be your primary mode of thought, but secondary, and something you could supply to other people really easily, without necessarily wanting a WHOLE lot in return. for LII, that means you can use it, and like when other people use it a lot as their primary mode of thought. it's hard to simplify, but after reading it a worded a bunch of times it all came together for me eventually.

for the record, you definitely seem LII to me thus far. SEI second. you remind me a lot of a good friend of mine. she's LII as well, and she's not socially inept either. she's much more artsy, creative and friendly than i am, haha. she typed herself INFx in mbti too, i believe.

[PistolShrimp]

hahha. they make ILIs sound autistic too. being a logical doesn't necessarily mean you're unfriendly or incapable of being social/empathetic/whatever other emotional things normal people do, it's just not a primary mode of thought. As far as Fe DS vs. Fe creative, i would just try to read as many Fe descriptions as you can and try to understand it. for SEI, it's wouldn't be your primary mode of thought, but secondary, and something you could supply to other people really easily, without necessarily wanting a WHOLE lot in return. for LII, that means you can use it, and like when other people use it a lot as their primary mode of thought. it's hard to simplify, but after reading it a worded a bunch of times it all came together for me eventually.

for the record, you definitely seem LII to me thus far. SEI second. you remind me a lot of a good friend of mine. she's LII as well, and she's not socially inept either. she's much more artsy, creative and friendly than i am, haha. she typed herself INFx in mbti too, i believe.

Good to know, thanks! I'll have to read some more about , then; I'm not sure if this is what I seek in a significant other. Glad to hear that being logical doesn't mean you're a robot. I've also found SEI descriptions to make them sound like simple-minded hedonists, so I've realized that the descriptions aren't the best way to type myself haha.

---------
Here are some of my photos that I am proud of; perhaps they can help to show you guys how I perceive the world. I've always struggled a bit with the technical aspects of photography, but I think I naturally find good moments or details to capture that other people might miss. Photographing people in candid shots is sometimes difficult because I don't want to impose on them or make them feel uncomfortable, but when I spend time with them I eventually blend into the background and can get natural shots.

[PistolShrimp]

Edited the first post with a bunch of brain vomit that may or may not help in typing me.

Also, is it useful to compare myself to my ILE boyfriend in order to determine my type, as I am sure of his and know how we interact?

I'm going to try on the LII label for now, though it doesn't seem like a perfect fit. I'm always open to more opinions or suggestions.

[tejing]

You're definitely not an LII. Valuing is not the same as preferring it. Remember, we value what we lack (which is part of the basis for dualization). If you were LII, would be something that permeated every aspect of your life. I believe you're an SEI... and I'll explain why.

First of all, your descriptions of your past are full of sensory information, and in your video, you "talk with your hands" in a way that suggests to me that the concepts at hand are fundamentally connected to sensory information for you. This is consistent with a dominant function because the dominant function is generally how we store most of our information. (as a dominant , I generally remember things as logical patterns and structures.) Also, your fascination with perception itself fits with this. Many of the interests you list are interesting for reasons.

Second of all, your tendency to take responsibility for the state of the social interactions around you (making sure people aren't left out, setting up events, etc) is fitting with a strong conscious . The way you like to challenge social norms fits with being your creative function rather than your dominant function as well, always providing new material for your dominant function to sort, filter, and incorporate.

The way in which you value fits with it being your mobilizing function, and your sarcastic humor fits with in a demonstrative position.

What you said about "thinking outside the box" fits with as your suggestive, or dual-seeking, function. You like being presented with novel perspectives and ideas, but have difficulty providing that for yourself.

[PistolShrimp]

You're definitely not an LII. Valuing is not the same as preferring it. Remember, we value what we lack (which is part of the basis for dualization). If you were LII, would be something that permeated every aspect of your life. I believe you're an SEI... and I'll explain why.

First of all, your descriptions of your past are full of sensory information, and in your video, you "talk with your hands" in a way that suggests to me that the concepts at hand are fundamentally connected to sensory information for you. This is consistent with a dominant function because the dominant function is generally how we store most of our information. (as a dominant , I generally remember things as logical patterns and structures.) Also, your fascination with perception itself fits with this. Many of the interests you list are interesting for reasons.

Second of all, your tendency to take responsibility for the state of the social interactions around you (making sure people aren't left out, setting up events, etc) is fitting with a strong conscious . The way you like to challenge social norms fits with being your creative function rather than your dominant function as well, always providing new material for your dominant function to sort, filter, and incorporate.

The way in which you value fits with it being your mobilizing function, and your sarcastic humor fits with in a demonstrative position.

What you said about "thinking outside the box" fits with as your suggestive, or dual-seeking, function. You like being presented with novel perspectives and ideas, but have difficulty providing that for yourself.

Thanks for the input! Very helpful.

Could you please explain how you use to organize things into patterns/structures in daily life? That's one part of descriptions that I can't really wrap my head around. I'm not sure if I do this so naturally that I'm oblivious to it, or if I'm not particularly good at it. I am pretty critical/skeptical in general, if this has any bearing. I also can find lapses in other people's logic pretty well.

I do know that my ILE guy has a nice way of calming me with logic when my anxiety gets the best of me. He'll talk me through things step-by-step, and explain why my fears are unfounded. Even though I know this in the back of my mind, his guidance helps. Perhaps this points to SEI over LII, too.

[Absurd]

Socionics.

[PistolShrimp]

Socionics.

As an example of organizing things (people, cognitive processes) into patterns/structures? OK, I can see that. Would an LII be likely to approach Socionics differently from an SEI, though? I see it as an interesting theory, but I know that ultimately if it holds any water things will happen accordingly whether I study it in detail or not.

[tejing]

Thanks for the input! Very helpful.

Happy to help :-)

Could you please explain how you use to organize things into patterns/structures in daily life? That's one part of descriptions that I can't really wrap my head around. I'm not sure if I do this so naturally that I'm oblivious to it, or if I'm not particularly good at it. I am pretty critical/skeptical in general, if this has any bearing. I also can find lapses in other people's logic pretty well.

I do know that my ILE guy has a nice way of calming me with logic when my anxiety gets the best of me. He'll talk me through things step-by-step, and explain why my fears are unfounded. Even though I know this in the back of my mind, his guidance helps. Perhaps this points to SEI over LII, too.

I thought for a while about how to explain my use of in everyday life, but after a while I realized that it's easier to highlight the differences in inner workings in the context of the "big stuff" that happens to us psychologically, so I'm going to go ahead and run with that idea.

I've been diagnosed with severe clinical depression. Fortunately medication has worked quite splendidly for me, but before I was diagnosed, I reached the point of being suicidal. What's interesting about the way that worked inside me is this: I spent large percentages of my internal energy pondering philosophy and how it related to the question of whether I actually had any reasons not to kill myself. I continued not to find any solid logical reasoning against the course of action, and though a small part of me was frightened by this discovery, it was by no means a large enough part to stop the action should I have become logically convinced it was the correct one. Were I more self aware, I might have been able to ascertain (logically) why my musings were focusing in the directions they were, but I was not directly aware of being sad or stressed. It took others to point out to me that these things were the source of my issue, and I needed to treat them as such.

That situation is essentially the opposite of the one you describe where you sometimes need external to help you control the failings of your . I needed external to help me control the failings of my focus. So in essence, yes, that does point toward SEI over LII as well.
EDIT: Also, note that for an SEI, is an unconscious function, so it makes sense that you would be unaware of how it interacts with your everyday life, and though it's not the weakest unconscious function, it's not one of the stronger ones either. Generally you would use it sporadically and not always perfectly, but fairly well considering it's not your main focus.

[PistolShrimp]

I thought for a while about how to explain my use of in everyday life, but after a while I realized that it's easier to highlight the differences in inner workings in the context of the "big stuff" that happens to us psychologically, so I'm going to go ahead and run with that idea.

I've been diagnosed with severe clinical depression. Fortunately medication has worked quite splendidly for me, but before I was diagnosed, I reached the point of being suicidal. What's interesting about the way that worked inside me is this: I spent large percentages of my internal energy pondering philosophy and how it related to the question of whether I actually had any reasons not to kill myself. I continued not to find any solid logical reasoning against the course of action, and though a small part of me was frightened by this discovery, it was by no means a large enough part to stop the action should I have become logically convinced it was the correct one. Were I more self aware, I might have been able to ascertain (logically) why my musings were focusing in the directions they were, but I was not directly aware of being sad or stressed. It took others to point out to me that these things were the source of my issue, and I needed to treat them as such.

That situation is essentially the opposite of the one you describe where you sometimes need external to help you control the failings of your . I needed external to help me control the failings of my focus. So in essence, yes, that does point toward SEI over LII as well.
EDIT: Also, note that for an SEI, is an unconscious function, so it makes sense that you would be unaware of how it interacts with your everyday life, and though it's not the weakest unconscious function, it's not one of the stronger ones either. Generally you would use it sporadically and not always perfectly, but fairly well considering it's not your main focus.

Sorry to hear about your battle with depression; sounds like it was a rough ride for you.

I too suffered from depression and suicidal thoughts, back in high school; never diagnosed because I was convinced that medication wasn't the answer for me. It's interesting to contrast your experience with mine; for me, depression was a very physical experience. I primarily focused on how heavy, sluggish, fatigued, numb and just plain "stuck" I felt, and thought that I could fix it by resting, listening to music, writing poetry, etc. I didn't attempt suicide because I knew any method would hurt too much (physically), and hurt my family and friends too much (emotionally). I could have used someone to see through the fog and point out alternative methods for dragging me out of it.

If I am actually a sensing type my mind will be blown, as I've considered myself an intuitive of some sort for YEARS.

[d1ffe7]

I think I'm reconsidering SEI now after reading your last post. Full of sensory descriptions. Could you describe your relationship with your boyfriend?

[PistolShrimp]

I think I'm reconsidering SEI now after reading your last post. Full of sensory descriptions. Could you describe your relationship with your boyfriend?

Sure thing! I love talking about him, haha.

My boyfriend and I met on an online dating site in January. I got a metric fucktonne of messages from guys, and he was the first and only guy I decided to go on a date with. The adorableness of his message won me over; he joked about building couch forts and pretending to have laser pistol hands and other silly nerdy things. I won him over by quoting cyberpunk novels and just generally being myself. Also, we both drive baby blue Geo Prizms (different years), and I found this coincidence so hilarious that I just had to meet him. We went bowling on our first date and hit it off after some initial awkwardness. I thought he had friend-zoned me because he didn't seem to flirt at all, and wasn't sure if I'd hear back from him or not. I was wrong; we had our second date the day before Valentine's Day. He had learned the basics of knitting and made me a white scarf (he said from "snowman hair" haha) which I found adorable even though it was way too long, and I brought him cookies from the bakery I work at. At the end of our date he asked, "Wanna make out?" when we were in a busy parking garage. I laughed in his face; the mood was all wrong! Wasn't offended, though; just told him to try again at a better time, and not to ask permission.

When we started dating, my boyfriend was unemployed and I was working a crappy job. Falling in love gave him the motivation to better himself, and he soon scored his dream job as a robot repairman. His company shipped him to France for six weeks when we'd only been dating for a few months, and the distance was difficult but drew us closer. We sent romantic e-mails back and forth daily (I initiated the chain), chatted on Skype, and sorted out some misconceptions we'd had about each other. He said that he wasn't sure he could've made the trip if he weren't dating me; the simple thought of me was enough to help him get through the loneliness of traveling abroad solo.

Additionally, his confidence in me helped motivate me to pursue a different career path by securing a grant writing internship with a local non-profit that works with farmers' markets.

When together, my boyfriend and I love to go out to eat at one of our few favorite restaurants, and occasionally try new places. Live music is fun on occasion; we usually agree on what bands to see. We watch cartoons/anime, play video or board games or Magic: The Gathering. I get bored with sitting around after a while and either nap with him or go out for a walk or something else. For example, one lazy Sunday I spontaneously decided we should check out the MIT Museum because my guy is passionate about robotics and MIT is all about that stuff. We went and really enjoyed ourselves; he while seeing the robots and telling stories of how he'd read about those same robots as a child, and I while watching videos of the robots in action and checking out the crazy awesome hologram art and kinetic sculpture exhibits. We also just cuddle and have long talks about everything and nothing sometimes. Backrubs and sex are good, too. He also tries to teach me how to longboard but I'm afraid of hurting myself, and I want to learn swing dancing with him but he's afraid of failing at it.

I feel like I am a ballast for him, and he is an inspiration for me: he sees levels of potential in me and different shades of my personality that I didn't know existed, and isn't shy about letting me know this. He adores my independence, my ability to challenge him mentally and soothe him physically, and I adore his optimism, openness, inventiveness and sense of humor. Sometimes he says ridiculous things that we both know are ridiculous, and I just lightly pat him on the face and smile. He pulls me out of my head when I'm worrying too much with a joke or a little teasing. I also take him seriously when need be, while others tend to always consider him a joker. We are often on the same thought-wavelength, too, like one time when he told me that pleasing me pleases him and I said vice versa, and we both randomly thought of the image of an ouroboros at the same time. It's kind of freaky sometimes!

Our fights are pretty trivial. The last thing we fought about was video games, when I started playing a game he had played for years. I played poorly but was having fun, and he wanted to take over and help me out, but I told him that wouldn't help me out and he got frustrated. I also felt like I wasn't getting enough intellectual stimulation from him and he felt inadequate because of this, but I realized what I really wanted was more intimate conversations and we quickly fixed the problem.

So that's our relationship; generally great with some bumps here and there that get worked out fairly easily by talking them through. He is my best friend.

[Creepy-]

You seem Alpha or, if not, possibly Delta, though I would be more inclined to go with the former because your responses to many questions seem to indicate that you are Fe valuing. Not ESE and in fact I don't think extroverted at all, so I'd say you are either SEI or LII. If delta, then EII. I don't see that being too far out of the realm of possibility. Introversion seems fairly obvious to me, the rest are just formed from what I think you are not (not very good practice, I know). Rationality/Irrationality is the one I have the hardest time identifying, which is why I didn't go one type or the other in Alpha.

At any rate, I'd say there is at least a good consensus that you are alpha.

[GuavaDrunk]

I've found myself swept up into groups before to the point where I found my views so strongly warped by the group that I could not think objectively. For example, I followed around a bunch of Anonymous Scientology protestors for a photojournalism story assignment, but ended up getting so wrapped up in their views and chants that I wouldn't shut up about the dangers/stupidity of Scientology for weeks after, when previously I thought very little about Scientology. I snapped out if it eventually, and felt pretty embarrassed.

I feel like I can't really analyze things from a detached, cool standpoint very well; my emotions heat things up and stir my thoughts. I do tend to analyze everything and anything, but I can be very easily swayed by people who I perceive as knowing more than I do about a subject. If something feels off, I'll research a topic until I can confidently think for myself about it.

I really relate to this, first time I've seen it written out so. I self-type IEI ftr, so it could be related to Fe-Cre/Ti-HA, if you turn out SEI.

[Absurd]

As an example of organizing things (people, cognitive processes) into patterns/structures? OK, I can see that. Would an LII be likely to approach Socionics differently from an SEI, though? I see it as an interesting theory, but I know that ultimately if it holds any water things will happen accordingly whether I study it in detail or not.

What?

[PistolShrimp]

What?

Uhh I meant uhhhh...Socionics. Huhuhyeahhhh.

[PistolShrimp]

I asked the e-Magic 8 ball if I'm an SEI and it said:



Guess that settles it, then!

[PistolShrimp]

Copying this over from another thread I posted in, talking about Renin dichotomies here:

"...I relate more to Judicious than decisive, though I relate to some aspects of both. I have a hard time getting motivated to act, spend a lot of time preparing to act, tend to get distracted/take long breaks when I'm working on something, but tend to feel more satisfied when I've completed something worthwhile and can start on something else. I hate being rushed through or pushed into things. Also, when I was in college, I usually procrastinated on my work by cleaning my workspace or napping before starting.

As far as Aristocratic/Democratic, I try to understand people as best as I can on a case-by-case basis. Even when it comes to personality typology, I recognize the variants within a particular type and try not to generalize. I typically define myself by qualities such as my skills, talents, interests, goals, hobbies, etc., and not by groups I associate with. In high school, I had a definite group of friends that I associated with the most, but I also got along with people from other groups regardless of their social status.

Evolutory/Involutionary is tough for me to determine. I would guess that I'm more of an Evolutory(Process?) type. I like to complete one thing before starting another, be it a book, game, movie, etc. I can multitask but I don't do well with it. I get annoyed sometimes when my boyfriend sends me tons of YouTube videos to watch when we chat on AIM because he'll send me more videos while I'm still watching the previous one he sent."

Also, I've been reading about the Romance styles, though don't know how helpful they are in determining type. I'd say I'm a mix of Caregiver and Victim types, probably more Victim; Infantile doesn't sound like me, which would point away from LII typing. My ex was a definite Victim type, and his hot-cold behavior in our relationship drove me batty.

[Suz]

Sure thing! I love talking about him, haha.

My boyfriend and I met on an online dating site in January. I got a metric fucktonne of messages from guys, and he was the first and only guy I decided to go on a date with. The adorableness of his message won me over; he joked about building couch forts and pretending to have laser pistol hands and other silly nerdy things. I won him over by quoting cyberpunk novels and just generally being myself. Also, we both drive baby blue Geo Prizms (different years), and I found this coincidence so hilarious that I just had to meet him. We went bowling on our first date and hit it off after some initial awkwardness. I thought he had friend-zoned me because he didn't seem to flirt at all, and wasn't sure if I'd hear back from him or not. I was wrong; we had our second date the day before Valentine's Day. He had learned the basics of knitting and made me a white scarf (he said from "snowman hair" haha) which I found adorable even though it was way too long, and I brought him cookies from the bakery I work at. At the end of our date he asked, "Wanna make out?" when we were in a busy parking garage. I laughed in his face; the mood was all wrong! Wasn't offended, though; just told him to try again at a better time, and not to ask permission.

When we started dating, my boyfriend was unemployed and I was working a crappy job. Falling in love gave him the motivation to better himself, and he soon scored his dream job as a robot repairman. His company shipped him to France for six weeks when we'd only been dating for a few months, and the distance was difficult but drew us closer. We sent romantic e-mails back and forth daily (I initiated the chain), chatted on Skype, and sorted out some misconceptions we'd had about each other. He said that he wasn't sure he could've made the trip if he weren't dating me; the simple thought of me was enough to help him get through the loneliness of traveling abroad solo.

Additionally, his confidence in me helped motivate me to pursue a different career path by securing a grant writing internship with a local non-profit that works with farmers' markets.

When together, my boyfriend and I love to go out to eat at one of our few favorite restaurants, and occasionally try new places. Live music is fun on occasion; we usually agree on what bands to see. We watch cartoons/anime, play video or board games or Magic: The Gathering. I get bored with sitting around after a while and either nap with him or go out for a walk or something else. For example, one lazy Sunday I spontaneously decided we should check out the MIT Museum because my guy is passionate about robotics and MIT is all about that stuff. We went and really enjoyed ourselves; he while seeing the robots and telling stories of how he'd read about those same robots as a child, and I while watching videos of the robots in action and checking out the crazy awesome hologram art and kinetic sculpture exhibits. We also just cuddle and have long talks about everything and nothing sometimes. Backrubs and sex are good, too. He also tries to teach me how to longboard but I'm afraid of hurting myself, and I want to learn swing dancing with him but he's afraid of failing at it.

I feel like I am a ballast for him, and he is an inspiration for me: he sees levels of potential in me and different shades of my personality that I didn't know existed, and isn't shy about letting me know this. He adores my independence, my ability to challenge him mentally and soothe him physically, and I adore his optimism, openness, inventiveness and sense of humor. Sometimes he says ridiculous things that we both know are ridiculous, and I just lightly pat him on the face and smile. He pulls me out of my head when I'm worrying too much with a joke or a little teasing. I also take him seriously when need be, while others tend to always consider him a joker. We are often on the same thought-wavelength, too, like one time when he told me that pleasing me pleases him and I said vice versa, and we both randomly thought of the image of an ouroboros at the same time. It's kind of freaky sometimes!

Our fights are pretty trivial. The last thing we fought about was video games, when I started playing a game he had played for years. I played poorly but was having fun, and he wanted to take over and help me out, but I told him that wouldn't help me out and he got frustrated. I also felt like I wasn't getting enough intellectual stimulation from him and he felt inadequate because of this, but I realized what I really wanted was more intimate conversations and we quickly fixed the problem.

So that's our relationship; generally great with some bumps here and there that get worked out fairly easily by talking them through. He is my best friend.

I dont see why you thought this wasn't duality... sounds like duality to me...

I'm not against the SEI typing for u, PistolShrimp! THe only thing i was leaning towards before was Ne/Si quadra for you.

[PistolShrimp]

I dont see why you thought this wasn't duality... sounds like duality to me...

I'm not against the SEI typing for u, PistolShrimp! THe only thing i was leaning towards before was Ne/Si quadra for you.

Well the descriptions make duality seem like this magical mystical relationship, and ours doesn't feel that way. We get bored, have unproductive spurts frequently where I wish we would do more interesting things but can't think of what to do. I get irritated sometimes by his immaturity; I wish we could have serious discussions more frequently, as I know he is perfectly capable of them. Our relationship is far from perfect but it is great most of the time; we respect and love each other, have fun together, have similar worldviews, communicate well, etc. Just not sure it's duality.

[Creepy-]

Well the descriptions make duality seem like this magical mystical relationship, and ours doesn't feel that way. We get bored, have unproductive spurts frequently where I wish we would do more interesting things but can't think of what to do. I get irritated sometimes by his immaturity; I wish we could have serious discussions more frequently, as I know he is perfectly capable of them. Our relationship is far from perfect but it is great most of the time; we respect and love each other, have fun together, have similar worldviews, communicate well, etc. Just not sure it's duality.

You shouldn't trust the descriptions, as they are ridiculously glamourised. Duality could merely be seen as a relationship in which both partners complement each others' weaknesses and enjoy being around each other for that fact. Perhaps there is more, but this is, in my opinion, a good way to explain it without invoking all that wishy-washy and idealistic nonsense.

[PistolShrimp]

You shouldn't trust the descriptions, as they are ridiculously glamourised. Duality could merely be seen as a relationship in which both partners complement each others' weaknesses and enjoy being around each other for that fact. Perhaps there is more, but this is, in my opinion, a good way to explain it without invoking all that wishy-washy and idealistic nonsense.

This is helpful, thanks! I could possibly see duality if that is what it is like when you strip the idealism away.

---------------------------------

Here is a video I recorded last night where I answer some questions I stole from another thread. It is way longer than I intended it to be (Jesus CHRIST) and I certainly don't expect anyone to sit through 30mins of my rambling, but I answered the questions off the cuff so my answers are natural. Perhaps watching bits and pieces can help reveal my type. I'm still leaning more toward LII than SEI right now, but I could see either one.

Also, I love how YouTube picks the most hilariously bad thumbnails for my videos. I don't normally look like a sad puppy.

1) What aspect of your personality made you unsure of your type? 1:30-3:20
2) What do you yearn for in life? Why? 3:20-4:48
3) Think about a time where you felt like you were at your finest. Tell us what made you feel that way. 4:48-7:28
4) What makes you feel inferior? 7:28-9-15
5) What tends to weigh on your decisions? 9:15--10:55
6) When working on a project what is normally your emphasis? Do you like to have control of the outcome? 10:55-12:12
7) Describe us a time where you had a lot of fun. How is your memory of it? 12:12-14:56
8) When you want to learn something new, what feels more natural for you? (Are you more prone to be hands on, to theorize, to memorize, etc) 14:56-16:48
9) How organized do you to think of yourself as? 16:48-18:06
10) How do you judge new ideas? You try to understand the principles behind it to see if they make sense or do you look for information that supports it? 18:06-19:05
11) You find harmony by making sure everyone is doing fine and belonging to a given group or by making sure that you follow what you believe and being yourself? 19:05-20:18
12) Are you the kind that thinks before speaking or do you speak before thinking? Do you prefer one-on-one communication or group discussions? 20:18-21:09
13) Do you jump into action right away or do you like to know where are you jumping before leaping? Does action speaks more than words? 21:08-21:46
14) It's Saturday. You're at home, and your favorite show is about to start. Your friends call you for a night out. What will you do? 21:46-22:15
15) How do you act when you're stressed out? 22:15-22:44
16) What makes you dislike the personalities of some people? 22:44-24:04
17) Is there anything you really like talking about with other people? 24:04-25:15
18) What kind of things do you pay the least attention to in your life? 25:15-25:50
19) How do your friends perceive you? What is wrong about their perception? What would your friends never say about your personality? 25:50-27:11
20) You got a whole day to do whatever you like. What kind of activities do you feel like doing? 27:11-27:59
21) In a classroom setting do you ever find yourself helping other people out with projects or homework when you see their struggling? Do you do this to make yourself feel more comfortable? 27:59-28:52
22) Any peculiarities that you have noticed about your personality? 28:52-29:55

[mu4]

I still think any Ne ego is still good for you.

What kinda of food do you like?

[tejing]

I watched the whole thing (you were wrong at the end it seems, hehe) and I believe everything matches up with my earlier assessment as .

[PistolShrimp]

I watched the whole thing (you were wrong at the end it seems, hehe) and I believe everything matches up with my earlier assessment as .

Haha awesome, thanks for sitting through that; I really appreciate it! Are there any reasons in particular re: the video that make you say SEI over LII?

I still think any Ne ego is still good for you.

What kinda of food do you like?

OK, thanks! I'm definitely not ILE, and I'm not ego so that leaves LII still, which I could see. Why would you say ego over ?

As far as food, I like the delicious kind. I have a gluten intolerance so I had to change my diet a lot, but I love what I eat: mostly grass-fed/pastured meats, salmon and cod, vegetables, nuts, occasional fruit, potatoes, rice, butter. Extremely dark chocolate (90%+) and red wine are my guilty pleasures. Sushi and Thai curries are also amazing. I cook my own food most of the time, and go out to eat with my boyfriend a couple of times per week at one of our favorite restaurants or a new place. He recently took me to a place by his work where we had the most amazingly tender pork belly drenched in a chocolate sauce...I'm salivating just thinking about it haha.

[Ryan]

I think LII is quite obvious.

PistolShrimp, trace all the times you said "in general" in the video, that's your Ti. Once you recognize the nature of the function in speech, you'd be able to pick up on it.

Take a look at this if you haven't already.
http://www.wikisocion.org:80/en/inde...roverted_logic

These are the examples of Ti that I found in your posts:
#1 I know that ultimately if it holds any water things will happen accordingly whether I study it in detail or not.
#2 So that's our relationship; generally great with some bumps here and there that get worked out fairly easily by talking them through.
#3 I typically define myself by qualities such as my skills, talents, interests, goals, hobbies, etc., and not by groups I associate with.
#4 I usually procrastinated on my work by cleaning my workspace or napping before starting.
#5 I get irritated sometimes by his immaturity; I wish we could have serious discussions more frequently, as I know he is perfectly capable of them.

[PistolShrimp]

I think LII is quite obvious.

PistolShrimp, trace all the times you said "in general" in the video, that's your Ti. Once you recognize the nature of the function in speech, you'd be able to pick up on it.

Take a look at this if you haven't already.
http://www.wikisocion.org:80/en/inde...roverted_logic

These are the examples of Ti that I found in your posts:
#1 I know that ultimately if it holds any water things will happen accordingly whether I study it in detail or not.
#2 So that's our relationship; generally great with some bumps here and there that get worked out fairly easily by talking them through.
#3 I typically define myself by qualities such as my skills, talents, interests, goals, hobbies, etc., and not by groups I associate with.
#4 I usually procrastinated on my work by cleaning my workspace or napping before starting.
#5 I get irritated sometimes by his immaturity; I wish we could have serious discussions more frequently, as I know he is perfectly capable of them.

OK, so I have one LII saying there's no way I'm LII, and another saying it's obvious that I'm LII. Who should I believe??

Thank you for the interesting link! I use the and words/phrases more than anything, actually. The words and statements seem dry as fuck; do LIIs really talk like that?

If I am LII, which I do think is possible, I feel like a weird one. It's hard for me to see dual-seeking or hidden agenda. I also feel uncertain about my logic and conclusions a lot of the time :/

[Ryan]

OK, so I have one LII saying there's no way I'm LII, and another saying it's obvious that I'm LII. Who should I believe??

Thank you for the interesting link! I use the and words/phrases more than anything, actually. The words and statements seem dry as fuck; do LIIs really talk like that?

If I am LII, which I do think is possible, I feel like a weird one. It's hard for me to see dual-seeking or hidden agenda. I also feel uncertain about my logic and conclusions a lot of the time :/

You're welcome.

Not necessarily. Functions interact with each other, so you will rarely find a comletely Ti statement in ones speech, normally - in LIIs' case, you are bound to find Ne/Si elements as well in their speech.

As for your last sentence, I believe you're thinking in the realm of Te + Ni. Uncertain or cautious? In any case, you're capable of making decisions, even for a group, by your own admission.