Results 1 to 31 of 31

Thread: Why is Fe manipulative?

  1. #1
    Dioklecian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    UK
    TIM
    ILI
    Posts
    4,304
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Why is Fe manipulative?

    Why and how do Fe people manipulate others, drive them crazy, control them, make them sick, make them hate, make them kill themselves and others?
    Well I am back. How's everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.

  2. #2
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Ich bin ein ubel glied
    Posts
    8,198
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Why is Fe manipulative?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Why and how do Fe people manipulate others, drive them crazy, control them, make them sick, make them hate, make them kill themselves and others?
    The thing I hate about , especially with people who are dominant is that they have a hugh tendency to go into overdrive and remember everything all the time about what people like to do, and then they expect for people to follow along with making people happy all the time making seem as though they are making up peoples minds for them.

    That irritates me to fuck when EXFjs do it ... I can't help but to think "Quit making up peoples minds for them, fuckwit!"

  3. #3
    Creepy-pokeball

    Default Re: Why is Fe manipulative?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Why and how do Fe people manipulate others, drive them crazy, control them, make them sick, make them hate, make them kill themselves and others?

    What are you going on about again... ?


    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    The thing I hate about , especially with people who are dominant is that they have a hugh tendency to go into overdrive and remember everything all the time about what people like to do, and then they expect for people to follow along with making people happy all the time making seem as though they are making up peoples minds for them.

    That irritates me to fuck when EXFjs do it ... I can't help but to think "Quit making up peoples minds for them, fuckwit!"
    My Fe remembers that rmcnew loves to be bitchy and denotes that for further usage.

    Seriously. I'm sick of people demonizing type XXXx every freaking random week. ..!.. bias

  4. #4
    Hot Message FDG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Bassano del Grappa, Via Rodolfi 35
    TIM
    ENTj
    Posts
    16,838
    Mentioned
    245 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I've never experienced anything similar with any Fe person. Your mother is BPD, nothing to do with being Fe.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

  5. #5
    Joy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    TIM
    SEE
    Posts
    24,507
    Mentioned
    60 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Why is Fe manipulative?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Why and how do Fe people manipulate others, drive them crazy, control them, make them sick, make them hate, make them kill themselves and others?
    this statement is very irritating.

    no one can MAKE you do anything. take a little responsibility for yourself.
    SEE

    Check out my Socionics group! https://www.facebook.com/groups/1546362349012193/

  6. #6
    Expat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    10,853
    Mentioned
    30 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Why is Fe manipulative?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Why and how do Fe people manipulate others, drive them crazy, control them, make them sick, make them hate, make them kill themselves and others?
    Because they're the Devil.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

  7. #7
    Creepy-

    Default Re: Why is Fe manipulative?

    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Why and how do Fe people manipulate others, drive them crazy, control them, make them sick, make them hate, make them kill themselves and others?
    Because they're the Devil.
    !!

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Ich bin ein ubel glied
    Posts
    8,198
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Why is Fe manipulative?

    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Why and how do Fe people manipulate others, drive them crazy, control them, make them sick, make them hate, make them kill themselves and others?
    this statement is very irritating.

    no one can MAKE you do anything. take a little responsibility for yourself.
    It is a totally valid question considering that Fe people can be pretty manipulative, annoying, and not really realise they are being manipulative and annoying.

  9. #9
    Creepy-pokeball

    Default

    Yay for circular logic.

  10. #10
    Joy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    TIM
    SEE
    Posts
    24,507
    Mentioned
    60 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Why is Fe manipulative?

    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Why and how do Fe people manipulate others, drive them crazy, control them, make them sick, make them hate, make them kill themselves and others?
    this statement is very irritating.

    no one can MAKE you do anything. take a little responsibility for yourself.
    It is a totally valid question considering that Fe people can be pretty manipulative, annoying, and not really realise they are being manipulative and annoying.
    But what does that have to do with a person going crazy, being controlled, becoming sick, being hateful, being suicidal, or being homicidal? The only way another person can influence you like that is if you let them.
    SEE

    Check out my Socionics group! https://www.facebook.com/groups/1546362349012193/

  11. #11
    Dioklecian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    UK
    TIM
    ILI
    Posts
    4,304
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Tonya Harding

    Well I am back. How's everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.

  12. #12
    Olga's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Aylesbury
    TIM
    ESI
    Posts
    1,690
    Mentioned
    49 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    May be because Fe is about playing with emotions, seeing what you can do with it, power to manipulate in a way Ne is power to analyse and play with an obect. Fi is not about playing emotions but directing them the process related to the development and future. That is why ESFJ is comminicator and IFSJ is guardian. I don't know why I come to the conclusion that introverted functions are about development, motion in a direction and future.
    School of Associative socionics: http://socionics4you.com/

  13. #13
    implied's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    7,747
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    joy, tonya harding kinda looks like your ex in that picture.
    6w5 sx
    model Φ: -+0
    sloan - rcuei

  14. #14

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    601
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Fe dominant types knows how to flatter people and make them feel special so when they try to make them do something, it seems like it's for the people's benefit and good interest instead of the Fe's idea. And the other people are so attached to how the Fe types make them feel, they probably want more.
    INFP

  15. #15
    Dioklecian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    UK
    TIM
    ILI
    Posts
    4,304
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dreamer
    Fe dominant types knows how to flatter people and make them feel special so when they try to make them do something, it seems like it's for the people's benefit and good interest instead of the Fe's idea. And the other people are so attached to how the Fe types make them feel, they probably want more.
    Exactly, and how does fear and anxiety fit in with this?
    Well I am back. How's everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.

  16. #16
    Rick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Former USSR (global nomad)
    TIM
    IEE
    Posts
    2,050
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Strictly speaking each type is manipulative or potentially manipulative, but in its own way. Each uses its own weapon to get people around them to submit to their will.

  17. #17
    Dioklecian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    UK
    TIM
    ILI
    Posts
    4,304
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick
    Strictly speaking each type is manipulative or potentially manipulative, but in its own way. Each uses its own weapon to get people around them to submit to their will.
    EXACTLY WHAT I HAVE BEEN TRYING TO POINT OUT IN THIS FORUM AND PEOPLE WON'T LET ME!

    THANK YOU
    Well I am back. How's everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.

  18. #18

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    601
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    For each person, there's always those you can manipulate to either do stuff or think what you want them to think but there are those who can see right through you.

    I know an INXP who I think is more INTP who I can convince who I am. I try to convince people how heartless I am sometimes, I don't know why, but it makes me feel strong and in control. But anyway, I can convince him how I like to play games and he seems to agree.

    But with the ESTP I knew, I always feel like I'm like...not in control. There's nothing I can do to win. I can come up with something clever but he'll always be one step ahead of me. That is really frustrating. :')
    INFP

  19. #19
    Joy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    TIM
    SEE
    Posts
    24,507
    Mentioned
    60 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    joy, tonya harding kinda looks like your ex in that picture.
    She so does!!!
    SEE

    Check out my Socionics group! https://www.facebook.com/groups/1546362349012193/

  20. #20

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    1,246
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    But with the ESTP I knew, I always feel like I'm like...not in control. There's nothing I can do to win. I can come up with something clever but he'll always be one step ahead of me. That is really frustrating. :')

    Absolutely! You hit the nail on the head. It gets wearing.
    Entp
    ILE

  21. #21
    Dioklecian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    UK
    TIM
    ILI
    Posts
    4,304
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze
    But with the ESTP I knew, I always feel like I'm like...not in control. There's nothing I can do to win. I can come up with something clever but he'll always be one step ahead of me. That is really frustrating. :')

    Absolutely! You hit the nail on the head. It gets wearing.
    Do they do it on purpose?
    Well I am back. How's everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.

  22. #22

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    i forgot
    Posts
    558
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze
    But with the ESTP I knew, I always feel like I'm like...not in control. There's nothing I can do to win. I can come up with something clever but he'll always be one step ahead of me. That is really frustrating. :')

    Absolutely! You hit the nail on the head. It gets wearing.
    Do they do it on purpose?
    They don't want to be controlled. More than that, they WANT to be in control, they want to have the right responses, and so I guess, yea, they do it on purpose. But I think that after you do something for a while it becomes kinda natural, so you aren't really "conscious" that you are doing it.
    thing.

  23. #23

    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    320
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    we need to make a thread where each of the functions are described from the pov of someone who has that function as polr. for example ixtp would contribute to a definition of Fe, etc. it would be like the 'mud baths' but for funtions.
    THE BEARD HEARD HIS MOVEMENT AND MADE AN ATTACK RUN BUT DID NOT ACTUALLY ATTACK HIM

    viva palestina

  24. #24
    Darth Slavius godslave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern France
    TIM
    694 sp/sx
    Posts
    2,780
    Mentioned
    141 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Fe suggestibility (?). I think that's an illustration of what some people have in mind when they say that Fe can be manipulative. I would say that here we have a HD Fe at work so it's rather sophisticated and used in conjunction with other IEs. Note how Rhea used her body language (leg rubbing) at circa 1:35 when Mark expressed a little resistance it seems like an erotical move to cancel Mark's analytical resistance and make him focus on positive emotions :



    I suspect just from this interaction that Rhea might be EIE-ish (?)

    Last edited by godslave; 10-15-2022 at 01:52 PM.

  25. #25
    Clarke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2022
    Location
    On Semi-Hiatus.
    TIM
    EII/SLI- HN
    Posts
    358
    Mentioned
    25 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian View Post
    Why and how do Fe people manipulate others, drive them crazy, control them, make them sick, make them hate, make them kill themselves and others?
    I have some theories for why they do this, and how they do this. I'll list them below:

    How:
    -They use ethical manipulation on logical people (who are vulnerable to ethical manipulation).
    -They can sense feelings somehow, and can therefore see the pathway to influence those feelings.
    -They sense a weakness in Fe vulnerable or weak people, and exploit it.

    Why:
    -They think that it's ethically correct somehow.
    -In the case of an EIE, they might get a feeling of power from doing so (Se valuing).
    -The drama makes them feel emotions, which they like.

    Edit: I think that alot of times, Fe users might be manipulating other people to do bad things or making them sick because of their unawareness of the other person. I think that it's possible that Fe users simply assume that the other person will interact with reality in the way that they think that everyone does. But this might not be relevant to the original post, since it sounds like it's referring to a negative version of Fe. A sort of evil person who uses Fe to accomplish some kind of personal goal, or fulfill some kind of personal need.
    Last edited by Clarke; 10-15-2022 at 09:13 PM.

  26. #26
    lavos's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Inside the Windfish's egg
    TIM
    LIE
    Posts
    1,703
    Mentioned
    79 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    They tamper (or attempt) with your emotions, causing you to like them and want to support them, or do what they ask of you. Mostly beta +Fe is manipulation.

  27. #27
    Clarke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2022
    Location
    On Semi-Hiatus.
    TIM
    EII/SLI- HN
    Posts
    358
    Mentioned
    25 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dreamer View Post
    For each person, there's always those you can manipulate to either do stuff or think what you want them to think but there are those who can see right through you.

    I know an INXP who I think is more INTP who I can convince who I am. I try to convince people how heartless I am sometimes, I don't know why, but it makes me feel strong and in control. But anyway, I can convince him how I like to play games and he seems to agree.

    But with the ESTP I knew, I always feel like I'm like...not in control. There's nothing I can do to win. I can come up with something clever but he'll always be one step ahead of me. That is really frustrating. :')
    I think that SLE's would be a somewhat terrifying enemy. You can always try to think of contingency plans to deal with them, but they'll keep persevering anyway.

    Strangely, I identify with your need to pretend to be heartless to feel in control. Although, in my case, I tend to actually think that what I'm saying is true. I think I generally like to be a good person though, according to some standard of ethics.

    Edit: I think I missed the point of the post when i typed this. I've kind of always had the sense that I could portray a sort of shell of myself to try to convince people that I was a certain way. The shell fit the role and purpose of what I was portraying myself as. I'm not sure I can really do it much anymore, and I don't even know if it was really effective before. I do know I convinced one person on the internet that I was an interesting person. And not female.

    I think that generally, it was much easier for me to do this online. In person, I felt more self-conscious.

    I think I chose which personality shells to wear based on personality archetypes that were extreme versions of my own self, or that were mimicked versions of other people.
    Last edited by Clarke; 10-16-2022 at 02:46 AM.

  28. #28
    persimmonism's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2020
    TIM
    IEI-Fe(C)
    Posts
    801
    Mentioned
    57 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Isn't Te also manipulative?
    Or anything in the creative slot, by definition?

  29. #29
    Pendulum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2022
    TIM
    the hanged man
    Posts
    44
    Mentioned
    12 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Manipulation isn't necessarily something that's done purposedly and/or with outer goals in mind. Fe concerns moods, emotional expressions, demonstration, preferences, feelings, etc. An Extravert who's strong in it will use it to impact its environment, whether they want it or not, the simple action of putting your feelings out there is influential. Your mood affects the room and the louder you are the higher your effect. Now, imposing your will on others, that's part of what Se is. A lot of people seem to think of Se as a bulldozer, an obvious brute, but it's not cookie cutter like that. It can often times be subtle, subliminal even. Se recognizes the forces at play, the authority. Being strong on it doesn't make you agressive, it makes you headstrong and stubborn, because you're able to resist others' influence while trying to impose your own. Of course, it also recognizes strength and hierarchy, it will yield to those with higher power. With that in mind we can see that actively manipulating someone towards a desire purpose through emotions and suggestion is actually Se being realized by Fe, much like bureaucracy, another form of domination but instead through rules and systems, is Se being realized by Ti.

    It takes a certain affinity with these elements to be a natural at it, which is why it's types like SEE and EIE who are known for it.

  30. #30
    Hot Scalding Gayser's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    The evolved form of Warm Soapy Water
    TIM
    IEI-Ni
    Posts
    14,946
    Mentioned
    662 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    dunno it's easy to manipulate others by telling them what they wanna hear. Growing up I was super naive and thought ppl could respect and love ppl if they were only honest lol. It was quite stupid.

    for example, if I was around a violent and sadistic homophobe who was deranged and crazy & he also had "Power" over me in some way (whether Te or Se or even Fe, but I probably have the upper hand with that one naturally) - I wouldn't lead with 'I'm gay' (believe it or not) I would instead say how disgusted I am of ******s with him just so the creepo would leave me alone. I actually had to do this many times in my life lol. Obviously it still works to an extent cuz I'm still alive. If u are too honest and NOT manipulative- you are just a corpse.

    PPl often manipulate others for their own protection, because in the real world many ppl wanna torture u in a dungeon like Cercei and completely get away with it. U need to manipulate so ur not put in that position.

    ppl manipulate their bosses so they get more money and a raise. Ppl try to manipulate their spouses so they be more like how they want them to be etc.

    Illuminati Lizards manipulte u to buy some shitty product u don't really need to make them better and u weaker while pretending that ur both benefiting. ((its true to an extent, but of course not as much as they claim)) The world is obviously ran and fueled by manipulation. Ppl say ' ur being manipulative' like its a bad thing. Well then stop whining and create a non shitty world where we didn't have to manipulate one another for our own survival cuz in this world u clearly do?

    Yeah some ppl probably don't have to manipulate, they can just brute force their way thru everything cuz of sheer power - but you DUMBASS- I have 1D Se and Te.

  31. #31

    Default

    I'm really against manipulation - not to be confused with influence. It's one of my strongest values. I define manipulation as something like...deceiving and controlling another in order to get what you want, even when it is at someone else's expense. Brainwashing another in order to have control over them. Those kinds of things. It is not the harmless sales pitch, that is mere persuasion. The manipulation I'm talking about is typically a form of abuse. It's when a narcissist says things in order to diminish your trust for others, increase your trust in them, in order to isolate you from everyone so that they have more control; it's when you say, "I remember you putting a gun to this person's head" and they gaslight by saying, "that wasn't a gun, it was my two fingers and hand in the shape of a gun" when you clearly recall it being a gun (and yes, gaslighting is real, that is an actual example of it, not these petty things people commonly say is gaslighting because they overuse the term when someone disagrees with them). There's an aim, a scheme, a goal, with the motive being very harmful.

    None of that is exclusively Fe. Any type can manipulate. Logical types tend to be logically manipulative, and ethical types emotionally manipulative. Psychopaths tend to be logically manipulative, for example. Here's some logical manipulation.

    Last edited by Fluffy Princess Unicorn; 10-19-2022 at 01:10 AM.


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •