Human Condition

[Simon Ssmall]

There is no "right" or "wrong"... there is only what "is".

Wrong. Some things are clearly right or wrong but you simply do not know how to differentiate between them as you are not a Fi type.

[Simon Ssmall]

Killing is wrong. Praying is right.

[Creepy-]

Wrong. Some things are clearly right or wrong but you simply do not know how to differentiate between them as you are not a Fi type.

Fi-based judgments are subjective.

[Simon Ssmall]

So you think killing is right?? And how can praying be wrong? Use logic mister and answer me that.

[Creepy-]

So you think killing is right?? And how can praying be wrong? Use logic mister and answer me that.

I don't believe killing is right. I don't believe prayer is either right or wrong, but you won't see doing such, because I don't think it does anything.

[Creepy-]

By the way: before you claim I do not value Fi, tell me how I value Fe.

[Jinxi]

By the way: before you claim I do not value Fi, tell me how I value Fe.

Tough guy. Stop acting so tough.

This is what he's written to people on other forums:

Every time I write like this, I feel like I am saying "Farewell" forever. Farewell to myself, farewell to the world. I am so ready... This is truth. One of the only truths I have ever known. The world is insignificant, and everything fades away... we are as a light which has dimmed long ago, waiting only to be snuffed out...

You are right about at least one thing, and that is that we must connect to something greater than ourselves. That is where true meaning is ascertained. Flow... the ability to move... I know not where I go when I die or even the next day, but it shall happen as it will. I have surrendered myself.

I think you might actually be INFJ. It is great talking to you. Farewell for now. I hope that we might meet one day, whether in this realm or in the next... petty things shall become extraordinary... can you even imagine...? Death is life.


Truthfully, Puffy, I have doubts that we are of the same type... we have like goal, but the methodology is entirely different. I can't operate under axioms. We are uncertain- but it is possible that we may be certain. I believe truth exists. Maybe not meaning, but truth. Heh, truth has to exist. But there are questions which plague my mind...

I can't accept your axioms. Everything works in a duality. There must be balance and harmony in everything... I'm not crazy. It has to be all the rest of them...

We must learn to accept reality for what it is, for what truth it imparts. Choice can't exist. Responsibility does. Always a paradox, or a contradiction. The Universe does not deal in things so obvious as axioms. We must learn to accept that the canvass is empty, and that even if we delude ourselves to think we have the ability to colour it, the reality is that there is none.

It is still beautiful, though.

[Simon Ssmall]

By the way: before you claim I do not value Fi, tell me how I value Fe.

I dont need to, it is enough for me to know you do not value Fi. Fe is not my element so I better dont try to explain it for you as Fi is easier. Fi types are the ones who believe in goodnes of hearts in people. Fi people are the types you see in humanitarian care and they are kind and nice. Praying helps, you simply do not see it as you live in the realm of "now" and "here". You need an intuitive dual to make you let go of your guard.

[Jinxi]

I dont need to, it is enough for me to know you do not value Fi. Fe is not my element so I better dont try to explain it for you as Fi is easier. Fi types are the ones who believe in goodnes of hearts in people. Fi people are the types you see in humanitarian care and they are kind and nice. Praying helps, you simply do not see it as you live in the realm of "now" and "here". You need an intuitive dual to make you let go of your guard.

You got it. The guy's not an Fi type.

[EyeSeeCold]

Tough guy. Stop acting so tough.

[Simon Ssmall]

More alpha action EyeSeeCold?

[Creepy-]

Tough guy. Stop acting so tough.

And from where do you draw that assumption? I was just asking a question.

I dont need to, it is enough for me to know you do not value Fi. Fe is not my element so I better dont try to explain it for you as Fi is easier. Fi types are the ones who believe in goodnes of hearts in people. Fi people are the types you see in humanitarian care and they are kind and nice. Praying helps, you simply do not see it as you live in the realm of "now" and "here". You need an intuitive dual to make you let go of your guard.

How often do you see xLI's who actually are in humanitarian care or are particularly kind? Because they are Fi valuing as well. And I don't think they have those tendencies. Also, I don't think Fi can be reduced to believing in the goodness of men, especially in the Super-Id. Super-Id functions are weak. The person does not look for complete comprehension or complexities in his Super-Id functions, only basic understanding.

Fi is Fi, but it becomes something different when placed in functions. Also, whether it is +Fi or -Fi has an effect.

I can see what you mean about prayer, now, though I don't think any positive effects could be attributed to God (I am biased, though, because I lean towards Deist principles with relation to God). At any rate, there is no way I am a Sensing type. Neither Si nor Se is in my Ego. If you deny this, this it is clear to me that you do not have enough information. If you, however, have specific examples of me being sensing, please show me.

[DividedsGhost]

Okay, how about this. Since we are nondeterministic, then consider what that means on an abstract level.

If we take one nondeterministic (unpredictable) person (or entity) and leave them to interact with the world without any other nondeterministic people, then we could say that all this person has to deal with is deterministic data. So for them they can shape the deterministic (predictable) world and form their own order of this world. They are free to make their life in the world as motivationally meaningful, interesting, and comfortable as they see fit for themselves.

Now if we put more than one nondeterministic person in the world and have them interact with the other person to some degree, then the theoretical order of the world that each person would have had if they were the only living being in the world would be diminished because they now have to deal with the unpredictability of the other person. So as we add more nondeterministic people into this world and have them interact more often, we expect to see a theoretical decline in the motivationally meaningful, interesting, and comfortable life they can thus create for themselves.

Then it stands to reason that their world would have some balance in terms of interaction with other people that would be needed in order to make sure that a person finds their life motivationally meaningful, interesting, and comfortable.

So if you think of a theoretical one-dimensional line representing this, then on that line you would have two extremes at both ends: meaningless and meaningful. It's easy to think of meaningless if we think about a population of human beings that is very large, say Japan for instance, when a person in Japan goes about their daily life they will have to interact quickly with many people with little time to understand themselves in relation to other people or other people in relation to them. This breeds stress and confusion, and when chronic leads people to see their lives as not motivationally meaningful, interesting, or comfortable; they don't have the predictability needed to create enough order. And then on the meaningful end we would have ourselves with the ability to remove ourselves from people when we feel it has been enough and is causing too much confusion and stress and find things about the world that are interesting and make life motivationally interesting, as well as comfortable, while obtaining enough order to allow this to happen.

So essentially the idea is to interact with others within a reasonable range, but not over that. And of course, everyone has different ranges and reasons for such, but this give some basic from which to gauge those ranges in yourself and other people.

So what I'm proposing is that due to the existential dilemma of existing in a world with other people, we substantiate the theoretical model in our subjective reality as best we can, and at least in this way we have at least some abstract objective concept from which to gauge the ethical considerations of the subjective choices we make in life, while at the same time it's not going to tell you how to define your choices or live your life or how you think certain people should be treated.

Does anyone understand this? Or care too?

[crazedrat]

Except that people are not completely unpredictable. Also nature is not completely predictable. A tiger can show up out of nowhere and maul you to death. What you're describing happens to some degree but it's not going to create this spectrum you're imagining. The most you could really say is people make the world more complicated, but I dont even really agree there. Living in nature, away from civilization, is complicated and difficult. Really brutal.