I don't think you're autistic. As I said before, you remind me remarkably of my brother. He is not autistic. He can be a little slow sometimes, particularly when it comes to social situations, or real life practical matters; but I attribute it to him being an Intuitive Introvert.Originally Posted by mirrorsoul
My life's work (haha):
http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin/blog.php?b=709
Input, PLEASEAnd thank you
Ahem... Anyway, welcome
Haven't watched the whole video, but read through all the posts on this thread.
I just want to say: in general, when you're going through problems in life, it's tough to see and truly appreciate your strengths. And if you're not sure what your strengths are, it's tough to accurately pick your personality type.
I mention this because you don't seem confident about your sexuality. Which is a normal stage too, just saying. But you don't seem very confident about anything really.
I'd say stop trying to find your type right now, and try finding yourself.
Mirrorsoul,
How would you explain the role and purpose of marriage, in your own words?
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Dual type(as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
The thing is, for me... I've been looking for myself for a long time, and I don't have the first clue how to go about it. Personality type is what I've been drawn to, because it seems to offer the promise of helping me find myself.
I've been drawn to everything... astrology, typology, philosophy, religion... anything that could give me a clue as to who and what I am. But I don't know what to believe in.
I don't even understand what it means to find yourself... I mean, on a physical level, I already know what I am. I'm a collection of cells that began as a result of intercourse by my mother and father, and which slowly divided into specialized cells. I'm essentially a complex life process that takes in food and oxygen, and excretes waste products... just like everyone else. I am an animal that questions its own existence, and fears death. A being that, quite possibly, seeks order in what is actually meaningless chaos.
On a social level, I also know what I am. I'm Caucasian, a high school graduate, a person 3-4 years out of school who has no work experience, a citizen of the United States, a resident of Dallas, a member of my family, a dependent who lives with their parents, and a geek who is fascinated by computers and video games.
Even on a philosophical level, I know what I am. I'm a Humanist, a Utilitarian, an Agnostic, and probably more.
Now I feel like I'm on the final level... I need to find what I am on a level that only systems like Astrology and Religion (which I don't believe in), or Typology can help. Now do you understand why I want to find my type? Because... this is the only way I know of, to find who I am. I can't even conceive of an alternative.
It's either this, or I merely accept that I am not an individual in any meaningful way, cannot be defined, and move on with my life having given up on trying to describe my own nature. But if I do that... I would feel that I've lost an important part of myself.
Does that make sense?
Unhappiness is not knowing what you want, and killing yourself to get it.
What do you want out of life? Certainly you value and view yourself more than just a collection of cells, or just a high school graduate. I want to hear more about this line:
Why are you those things? What do you care about? What difference do you want to make in the world?
Maybe you can't even answer those questions yet. But those are for you to think about, on your journey of finding yourself.
Astrology and typology, even socionics here, can help you, but be very wary of buying into generalizations. I'm sure you've heard before the 'there are only 16 personality types, but billions of people in the world!' Try not to focus on learning more about the types, but learn more about yourself. As time goes on, and you get older, you'll learn more about yourself, and be happier.
Philosophy and religion can help too, but be careful into buying into something. Look inside yourself first.
You seem really down and gloomy, unsure of where to go. It's tough to find yourself when you remain inactive. Specifically, you mentioned you've been out of high school for 3-4 years with no work experience? Are you in college at all? Or just at home with parents, doing nothing?
Get a job, work, find something you hate. Sometimes the best way to figure out what you like is by process of elimination. What don't you like?
Anyway, I'm off for now, and I hope some of this helps. Good luck mirrorsoul, ttyl and take care.
That's a compelling question. I'll do my best to give the subject a fair treatment.
The original purpose of marriage was security. After all, without marriage, a woman would be left with a child to take care of, and no one to help support it. The purpose of marriage was to hold men accountable for the children they produce, and force them to take a role in protecting the family. The man would offer physical protection and income, while the woman would take care of the child. There was also often the practice of arranged marriages, to help cement the bonds between two families and make them closer allies. This also benefited society as a whole, allowing more children to survive, and potentially serve as soldiers, or any other role needed, allowing these civilizations to expand more quickly than those that didn't do this.
This original purpose, however, is less relevant in today's society. We are more civilized, marriage is more of a choice than a requirement, because there are social systems that give women the opportunity to have freedoms that they could not enjoy in the past. Also, our population is more than large enough as it is. Advances in healthcare, social welfare, etc.
There are still financial and practical benefits, but NOW... the primary purpose of marriage is companionship. People still want the security of a constant partner, someone who won't leave them. They want to feel loved, they want someone to trust and depend on. They don't just want a mate, they want... something more. They want to be understood completely, to find their "other half," if you will.
ftr my brother is ENTp and he fits that description perfectly, so I wouldn't say being introverted is part of it.
From the OP video I want to say Mirrorsoul strikes me as alpha irrational.
I've moved off EII after the "forum rules" or whatever thread, and I'm moved onto LII for mirrorsoul.
It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.-Mark Twain
You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.
Well, I'm not interested in killing myself just because I don't know what I want... I'm too curious. There will always be something for me to observe, someone out there to whom I can offer something.
I don't know what I want out of life... except for some vague notion that I want to be understood and accepted, and have freedom to be myself somewhere?
Hmm... interesting. Well, I'm Agnostic, because I don't feel that religion is literally correct, but there's no way to prove it... so I'm open-minded about it. I'm a Humanist because I'm opposed to Social Darwinisim, and want society to move in the direction of being concerned with the welfare of all people, and treating them in a fair manner. I'm a Utilitarian, because I feel that the good of the majority is more important that that of a minority, and think that the greatest amount of happiness is something that is important to achieve. I often donated money to charities when I had a job working for my father.Why are you those things? What do you care about? What difference do you want to make in the world?
Well, I'm actually trying to get a job... in fact I started a thread about that. But I've decided to start volunteering so that I can get experience and references. It's something rewarding to do at least, won't leave me inactive.Astrology and typology, even socionics here, can help you, but be very wary of buying into generalizations. I'm sure you've heard before the 'there are only 16 personality types, but billions of people in the world!' Try not to focus on learning more about the types, but learn more about yourself. As time goes on, and you get older, you'll learn more about yourself, and be happier.
Philosophy and religion can help too, but be careful into buying into something. Look inside yourself first.
You seem really down and gloomy, unsure of where to go. It's tough to find yourself when you remain inactive. Specifically, you mentioned you've been out of high school for 3-4 years with no work experience? Are you in college at all? Or just at home with parents, doing nothing?
Get a job, work, find something you hate. Sometimes the best way to figure out what you like is by process of elimination. What don't you like?
Anyway, I'm off for now, and I hope some of this helps. Good luck mirrorsoul, ttyl and take care.
That seems to be a common typing for me... my mother says that, from the descriptions, ILI sounds like me now, after life had taken a lot out of me, while ILE sounds like me as a child... and Maritsa and another person suggested SEI. Lots of others are suggesting LII... so it's beginning to look like I might be Alpha rather than Delta.
Hmm... I'm going to consider Alpha vs. Delta more carefully, because I was previously leaning Delta.
I'm going with lonely ENFj.
ENFjs can usually be reasoned with. ENFps.. no. That's what I based my guess on. But I'm about 25 percent sure of that guess.
Yeah.. maybe get tested for it. There are ways to help deal with it.
He doesn't need tests.
He's transgendered.
He's jobless but is okay with it.
His mother drives him around but he's okay with it.
He keeps getting rejected but doesn't think anything's wrong.
His parents hate him and he doesn't know why.
He's asexual.
He has no friends.
No one wants to be friends with him.
He doesn't want to help himself.
No one wants to read about people who haven't done a thing since the end of high school. In his case, it's 4 years. 4 years. 4 years of inactivity and indolence. 4 years that he's been a burden to his parents.
Well, when you put it like that...
Maybe I SHOULD commit suicide. You make it sound like it would be selfish if I didn't.
I really don't know what keeps me going... I suppose it's just instinct. I'm not really thinking of the people I'm burdening, I guess.
I'm sure there are some labor camps for people like you. Just move to China.
Well, if they've got something for me to do... sure. I'll do it.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programme...ht/4115535.stm
The Iranians are doing it right. Move to Iran and become a muslim.
What you seek is a change of your true identity as a woman. This you will not find with today's technology. Sex change operations only change what you appear to be on the outside. Any satisfaction you gain from it will be quite superficial, as your body's physical identity has not been changed. Butchering yourself (if you were planning on going that route) will not magically change you into a woman.
Also suicide is illogical, and compared to the average human being, your life situation isn't too bad. The world is going to shit for a lot of people and there is no time to gripe about which pair of genitals you received. Coming to terms with your real physical identity instead of your ideal/unattainable physical identity would be a positive step forward. Socionics will help you locate your strengths so you can use them to make the world better for yourself and all else. I don't have a good guess for your type yet but NF seems a safe bet.
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
If you read his original typing thread as linked here, he clearly values Ne+Si> Se+Ni. He is without a doubt either Alpha or Delta, and not Beta or Gamma. No way for ENFj.
I've reflected on some recent comments, and I feel that I would like to set the record straight regarding some assumptions people have been making about my life story.
The first one is, my parents are actually divorced and live separately. I was going between their homes for awhile, but now I mostly live with my mother. My father is the one who isn't nice to me, though I don't know that he doesn't LIKE me. He just tends to hurt my feelings and frustrate me. My mother does care about me, very much, and I get along fairly well with her.
For the first half of 2008, I was in community college. But I failed remedial Algebra, and I gave up on college. So, I spent a few months applying for jobs and doing nothing, and then I took a job working for my father in Mansfield... for all of two and a half months. There was a situation with his dogs... his dogs freaked me out, and I quit so I wouldn't have to live with him and be around his dogs.
After that, it was pretty much 2009. This is the year in which I REALLY did almost nothing. I started applying for jobs again, got depressed at the lack of them. Along with the fact that an Internet friend who I'd been leaning on for emotional support abandoned me. I know that for the better part of the year, I did nothing except play World of Warcraft, post on forums, and watch Japanese anime online. I gave up on my job search for the most part, just became introverted, resigned, and gloomy... not wanting to be disturbed from my little world. I believe, though, that at some point during this year... I tried to get a CCNA certification from my community college. I almost got it, but I had problems because I couldn't grok the binary math involved in networking. Everything else, I was good at... but it wasn't enough.Besides, the field ended up being a bit too technical and tedious for me, and I'm not sure I could have done well in it anyway.
After this failure, it was probably 2010, or somewhere near it. I was determined to have a job, and so I called up my father again that year... swallowed my pride, and went back to work for him in March. Despite how much I hated working for him, and living with him. I managed to hold out until January 2nd of this year, this time... but eventually the dogs got to me again. I'm really very nervous around dogs, and I freaked out and quit again.
In January of this year, I scheduled myself to go to a Job Fair, but it was canceled due to an ice storm. My mother was afraid for me to leave the house for a couple weeks, and so I really didn't get anything done in January. In February, I went to several temp agencies, and they all turned me away, giving me some lame excuse about not taking applications on Friday, but I saw that they were taking applications from other people on Friday... just not me. I tried coming back on Monday, like they told me, and they just said they weren't taking applications right now at all... but sure enough, they were taking them from other people. Just not me.
So finally, in March of this year... I've applied for a volunteer position at a hospital. And I had to go through a lot of screening, got a TB test, a background check, an interview, and even somehow talked my father into letting my co-workers provide good references. I'm due to appear at orientation on April 12th.
My father is actually proud of me, for once... chances are, he will be hinting that I should beg to come back to work for him after a few months of volunteering, if I haven't found any work. He always does... tells me he wouldn't want me back after how miserable I was, and then starts hinting around about it again. And then he pays me to sit in a corner and do little besides some occasional filing, copying, data entry, archiving, and fetching stuff... so intermittently that it's barely a real job. Maybe socialize a bit with my co-workers, almost all of whom I've known since I was little, and most of whom are family.
So, chances are... my volunteering will open up a position for me somewhere, probably at least back with my father if nowhere else. Although I really, really don't want to go back there. It sucks living with him. It really does.
Well, I know that it won't change my DNA or anything... I'm only going to look like a woman. But that's all I really need... because I already feel that I am a girl on the inside. I know you can't understand this, but I've tried to come to terms with my physical identity, and I can't do it.
I really don't want to commit suicide... in fact, I'd never really contemplated it before reading that laundry list of reasons why I should. I've never been told so bluntly so many reasons why people would be better off without me.
I can find plenty of reasons to stay alive even if I can't do anything about my gender situation. I will find things to do, much as I do now... but I won't be satisfied with having to live as a man. I'm not saying I won't live with it, but I will be extremely unhappy. I want to do better than that, if it's at all possible. I'm sick and tired of being told that "I can't" because of the times we live in.
I'm tired of being told that I'm not a priority because I don't have a family of my own, that I'm not a priority because I don't have enough money, that I'm not old enough, that I'm not experienced enough, that I'm not Extraverted or social enough, that I don't have enough connections, not smart enough, that I'm not competitive enough, don't have the right personality... that I'm just plain not GOOD enough for anyone. If I actually had any suicidal tendencies, and wasn't just a bit too selfish and paranoid on some level, I'm pretty sure I'd be dead by now. LOL.
mirrorsoul, I don't have an opinion on your type, but you seem like a very compassionate person, and I get the impression that you're more intelligent than you let on. Just stop taking shit from other people. A lot of people who don't understand the first thing about you will try to make you feel bad about yourself just so they can feel a little superior; they will project all their self-hatred onto you. That's life. Just tell them to fuck themselves and move on. You're obviously a unique person, and if you stay strong, you'll find your path in life. And when you do, you'll realize 1) that all the people who will try to shit on you to make themselves feel better aren't even worth thinking about, and 2) that socionics is interesting and all, but you don't really need it to be who you are because you are who you are and no system or idea or person can change that.
Yeah, you gota fight back when people just flat out fuck with you.
To hell with Jinxi. He's just a troll. Forget that list above. I'll tell you true bluntness: Your self-sacrificial nice behavior is bullshit. Your problem is that you're too nice. Make just one small, tiny bit of room in yourself to not give in and give leeway to an asshole, to the point that you'd give suicide a thought.
The reasons listed aren't that bad. A lot of people go through stagnating periods, not reaching potential, depression.. you name it. This whole site is full of fuckups. Welcome to the club. Sad but true.
Really though.. Take care.
:
(i)NTFS
An ILI at rest tends to remain at rest
and an ILI in motion is probably not an ILI
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My work on Inert/Contact subtypes
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Hey, didn't see your post earlier... thanks, dude. At least if I am autistic, they can help me deal with it if I get tested.
And, that other thing means a lot coming from someone who should by all rights dislike me.
I don't know that I'll tell them do that to themselves, but I probably should just dismiss them and move on.
Oh, I know that I don't need Socionics to BE who I am, but I was hoping that it could me understand who I already am. I don't want it to change me so much as describe me.
I guess I just don't like thinking that another person has nothing worthwhile to say, so I'm inclined to think that maybe they've got a good reason for whatever they say.
Eh, to be honest, not only are they not that bad... most of them aren't true anymore, although they were at one point.To hell with Jinxi. He's just a troll. Forget that list above. I'll tell you true bluntness: Your self-sacrificial nice behavior is bullshit. Your problem is that you're too nice. Make just one small, tiny bit of room in yourself to not give in and give leeway to an asshole, to the point that you'd give suicide a thought.
The reasons listed aren't that bad. A lot of people go through stagnating periods, not reaching potential, depression.. you name it. This whole site is full of fuckups. Welcome to the club. Sad but true.
Really though.. Take care.
Well, I've never been told that other people (at least ones who aren't completely retarded) go through stagnating periods living with their parents like I have.
I guess that's how it is, though... the people who've "made it" in the world don't want to acknowledge the problems of the people who haven't, because they want to believe that it was only their own hard work, and not circumstances that brought them to a good place. That's why everyone is shouting at a bum on the street to "get a job," but how do you get a job if you have no money, smell horrible, don't own any nice clothes, and have no permanent address? People just don't consider that, because it would make them feel guilty... and they want to feel good about themselves for their achievements, not guilty about them.
Well, I wrote the long story because I wanted to explain to people why Jinxi was not technically correct on all accounts. And the thought about suicide was just a logical conclusion. Considering all the conditions listed, it seems as though the person described is incapable of growth or change and is nothing but a hated parasite. Thus, the only logical conclusion is that it would better for society as a whole if this person died. Of course, the "facts" presented are somewhat exaggerated and false, but giving them to the wrong person at the wrong time could easily make them lose their marbles.
Nor would I want you to ever do anything stupid like that either!
I am interested in whether you wrote the above due to becoming so full of feelings and actually were considering it or because you were trying to show/teach others in a more factual or consequential style of how people treating others like some are treating yourself could make people feel or react?
Like it has already been mentioned by Straytk this site is full of people with problems. What human doesn't have problems!
Eh... if you wanted to cheer me up, mentioning Divided wasn't the way to do it. Here's why:
Like if Mirrorsoul was on the track, I would definitely run her over, even if I didn't have to. But probably no one else I would be that ruthless with...interesting...interesting...
If you think he's wise... that's kind of unnerving. I'm sure he wouldn't like you using his words in my favor.
Well, I don't know about God. Like I said, I'm an Agnostic. But I do know that feeling of being an ant and getting squashed. And I definitely don't understand why the world has to be the way it is. Maybe that's why I'd rather believe it's an accident. I don't want to think that someone put us through this on purpose.
If there is a God, I hope that he's not omniscient, and is an innocent tinkerer who didn't foresee all the painful implications of creating the world as he did, but has come up with a solution nonetheless. You know, as in, perhaps a very advanced Ni (and all other functions) user, who is much better at foreseeing implications than any human, but still not perfect. I don't buy the idea that God is perfect. If that were true, it would logically follow that all his creations would also be perfect. But Satan and humanity are expressly stated to be imperfect. A perfect being does not create imperfection, by definition. Perhaps "perfect" was being used relative to us, rather than in absolute terms.
Last edited by mirrorsoul; 03-29-2011 at 12:34 PM.
no system or other person can tell you who you are better than yourself, but i'm just saying this as a disclaimer because i'm sure you already know that. what you want is some clarity, or outside perspective to help give shape to what is there? i can tell you some of what i see, obviously colored by my own perspectives/biases/whatever. i've been persistent in saying EII for you in part because there are things about you that i see aligining with things in me...not necessarily that all these things are manifested in both of us at once, but just...latent Ne qualities, i guess? so this is one bias i have, because i could be objectively wrong about that.
i see someone who is skilled at recognizing the humanity in other people for better and worse - better in that it makes you very compassionate and willing to accept others and worse in that it provides skill in manipulation and because it leads you to be too reticent to shut out people who should be shut out for your own well-being. either way i think this is a very powerful and important skill that can do a lot of good if used correctly. i think you are very good at seeing context and different perspectives and this also has pluses and minuses. being able to contextualize things to the point that you end up avoiding strong actions to move forward is kind of the bane of Ne creative/Se polr and something i've always struggled with and can relate to. i don't know, at some point you have to stop thinking and just do? but i'm not the best person to give advice on this. but this ability to contextualize is also a strength because it leads you to be open minded and flows into that compassion. anyway these are the strongest qualities i see in you and i think they point pretty definitively to Fi+Ne.
and i don't know if i should post this because i know that to some degree i am projecting here and i don't know how useful this will be. but if you're here to get some outside perspective on who you are, well its my two cents fwiw.
Mirrorsoul
I like your style. The hospital thing sounds like good news, hope it goes well for you. My first impressions of your were intraverted NF and edging more towards IEI, I think EII is more likely now, however I haven't yet seen your video (no sound on this computer), so that might change my view of you.
You're clearly insightful about many things and you write well, it seems to me that you have many strengths and that as long as you can grow (no matter how slowly) and become more confident in yourself, your potential will manifest.
IEE-Ne
Way to go! I'm so glad to hear you found a good place to volunteer! Praying it helps open up some doors for you.
[/QUOTE]
My life's work (haha):
http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin/blog.php?b=709
Input, PLEASE
hey.you are a next generation human.you should be proud .heads up. i haven't really had the time to read thouroughly your typing thread (i havent even watched the video) but let me tell you this: types are for humans with an obsolete perception. seriously,you can't really be satisfied by some type when you have (almost) transcended the ego boundaries.
you say things that would consist a big concern for others,are of no importance to you.that is great.no need to mention suicide and other blasphemies ;0
furthermore,i don't think that you should get surgery to become "female" because it's all about the energy.you have been blessed with an equilibrium of the masculine and female energy.the majority of people do crazy/negative things trying to obtain and *sustain* it (because they are not connected to the S0URC3). this equilibrium can make people look asexual,or gay or lesbians.we must be happy in our natural physical vessels,so work your vessel because those who are meant to love you (in whatever way) will love you the way you are.
Don't throw him into the IEI bin, IEIs are not naive ninnies.
Umm... yeah, I'm not one of those New Age people. I don't believe in that stuff. I don't believe in destiny, and I don't believe that there are ways that people are "meant" to be that it's wrong to alter.
hey,New Age > Enlightenment anytime. ok so you were annoyed/creeped out (do not deny it) and that points towards IEI. it's ok you know.and of course it is not wrong wanting to alter in whatever way but most people do not understand where their real wants stop and the imposed ones start.
not neanderthalian, i believe
oh and you don't come across as female-like or aspergers-like at all. don't let american society fool you.
Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit
I'm wondering if you're a Te type, or at least logical... but I don't know. I think you can feel incompetent about travel mix-ups and feel like it's an ordeal and still be a logical type.
I find it interesting that you're sort of dryly going over everything that happened detail-by-detail and I don't know what to make of this.
American society? What about it might fool me?
Everything. Most if not all psychological problems are structurally built into the society in which you live.
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
Voice off - i don't have speakers here.
Strong Ethics. Temperament Ep/Ip.
I'm don't sure, but I think IEI.
Themes: Satisfied the work process.
Main goal: Achieving the required result.
Methods: Any, effective.
Pure logic is the ruin of the spirit
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