the delta NFs and foul language

[UDP]

You don't really like it, especially the ladies, eh?


I could write this in stereotypes but I wanted to talk about it in another thread. It's something I've noticed I can do fairly easily with beta NFs, including females. Male delta NFs can tolerate and even enjoy some trash talking, but a good chunk of the ladies noticeably find it unpleasant.

I can think of a few who've been on this forum that have said so.
Maybe it's also because I'm attracted to "prissy" girls who seem to have values like that. (One of my closest delta NF friends calls herself prissy sometimes).

[April]

Fuck you.

[EyeSeeCold]

[Simon Ssmall]

I have no problem with it unless it is used excessively which just seems dumb.

[stray]

I use profanity in a casual way if you know what I mean. "It's hot as shit outside.." I'm not trying to be particularly profane about it.

I guess I've always been uncomfortable with a lot of trash talking.. Unless I'm actually angry (and yes, I can do this ). That's another story. I've just never felt comfortable with playful trashtalk. It's not the kind of thing I like during good times.

[ashlesha]

ya, the stereotype thread would have been a great place for this. it fits perfectly alongside brownie making and martyrdom.

Fuck you.

laughing my fucking ass off.

[stray]

martyrdom.

The more I read the stereotypes, the more I get this odd notion to start flogging myself. It's all self-fulfilling prophecy, y'see.

[pianosinger]

I can't say whether it's type-related or not. For me, my aversion to vulgarity and swearing comes from my upbringing.

[Nevero]

a question for deltas: have you ever chided anyone for swearing?

[Nevero]

No, i just make them feel embarrassed because I dont swear back. Well, sometimes i will even laugh at the swear words; sometimes when it's done for effect, it is funny.

how would you proceed about making them feel embarrassed?

[Suz]

how would you proceed about making them feel embarrassed?

well i dont do anything. I just dont use the swear words.Some may not notice, but some will take the hint and not be so foul-mouthed around me

[Suz]

Fuck you.

laughing my fucking ass off.

(LOL btw)


But as Ryu said:

Male delta NFs can tolerate and even enjoy some trash talking, but a good chunk of the ladies noticeably find it unpleasant.

i.e. not ALL.

[ashlesha]

i.e. not ALL.

i understand, but thats not the point. i'm sure a "good chunk" of SLEs are opposed to vulgarity, as well. the thread is baseless, imo. frankly, i think the entire point is for ryu to further solidify his conception of delta NFs as ideal stepford wives, which is a characterization i resent, and since he is the most prominent self-typed LSE on this forum, his characterization of delta NFs holds some weight, which is unfortunate because it is so patronizing and wrong.

[Suz]

i understand, but thats not the point. i'm sure a "good chunk" of SLEs are opposed to vulgarity, as well. the thread is baseless, imo. frankly, i think the entire point is for ryu to further solidify his conception of delta NFs as ideal stepford wives, which is a characterization i resent, and since he is the most prominent self-typed LSE on this forum, his characterization of delta NFs holds some weight, which is unfortunate because it is so patronizing and wrong.

I never thought ryu thought of delta NFs as stepford wives. In fact, i dont think ryu would want a "stepford wife".

Oh and ime, betas enjoy foul language very much (this isn't about vulgarity). As do gammas. As per Ashton for example, he sees bad language as a mark of sincerity

though i do agree with pianosinger in that upbringing does influence this to an extent. My mom (ESE) always looked down upon others swearing. however she herself does swear (in russian) when she gets mad or annoyed or hurt at someone (the swearing is mild though). Something i've never had the desire to emulate, tbh.

[ashlesha]

I never thought ryu thought of delta NFs as stepford wives. In fact, i dont think ryu would want a "stepford wife".

Oh and ime, betas enjoy foul language very much (this isn't about vulgarity). As do gammas. As per Ashton for example, he sees bad language as a mark of sincerity

ok, then we have different insights into ryu's motivations (i'm sure he would say he doesn't want a stepford wife, even if his posting history tells a different story) and very different interpretations of how quadra values manifest. if you're satisfied with the stereotype of the submissive and "prissy" delta NF, then fine. i personally have a problem with it, and i'm especially bothered by it being perpetuated by someone who types LSE.

[Suz]

ok, then we have different insights into ryu's motivations (i'm sure he would say he doesn't want a stepford wife, even if his posting history tells a different story) and very different interpretations of how quadra values manifest. if you're satisfied with the stereotype of the submissive and "prissy" delta NF, then fine. i personally have a problem with it, and i'm especially bothered by it being perpetuated by someone who types LSE.

I dont know, i've chatted quite extensively with Ryu over AIM and i didn't get the impression that he's looking for someone who is submissive at all. In fact, he shared with me some things that make it clear he actually doesn't like it when someone is acting submissive. Also, prissy =/= submissive. Prissy on the contrary is a descriptor of snobbishness, which wouldnt' be out of character for a member of an aristocratic quadra. I admit, i can come across a bit snobby/prissy to certain people, especially if they feel inferior to me (probably for good reason).

I'm not really sure where you got the thoughts you expressed, but I dont think delta NFs represent submissiveness in the least, in fact ime we are the some of the least likely members of the socion to be ok with submissiveness (instant turn off to me). I never saw this stereotype as being a delta NF descriptor and i'm not sure where you got that association from. Instead, my stereotyping of submissiveness belongs to the "victim" types: IEI, ILI, EIE, LIE (the introverts> the extroverts). Of course my stereotype could be wrong, so please correct me, anyone, if so.

[Simon Ssmall]

There is no such thing as MILD swearing in russian.

[Suz]

There is no such thing as MILD swearing in russian.

LOL!!!

Well my mom was criticizing a friend of hers for using really bad BAD BAD words in her presence, and was saying that even though she swears, she would never use such words.

It's interesting the distinction between myself and her where I choose not to swear, but wont bother criticizing someone for swearing in my presence (not very bothered by it, and sometimes find it funny even), whereas she swears occasionally but is very vocal about voicing her disapproval of others swearing in her presence.

[stray]

i understand, but thats not the point. i'm sure a "good chunk" of SLEs are opposed to vulgarity, as well. the thread is baseless, imo. frankly, i think the entire point is for ryu to further solidify his conception of delta NFs as ideal stepford wives, which is a characterization i resent, and since he is the most prominent self-typed LSE on this forum, his characterization of delta NFs holds some weight, which is unfortunate because it is so patronizing and wrong.

Yeah, I'm not a female, but it is patronizing in an indirect way. Not sure what it has to do with his type though. From a distance, I can see that that other Te posters.. For example, DeAnte, had pretty well rounded perceptions and could make decent lists type of examples for Delta NFs (not that they were necessarily right.. but at least he tried). Same with Ashton. Same with INTps.

[Absurd]

Show me those lists, for I love lists and live by the code of lists.

[stray]

Show me those lists, for I love lists and live by the code of lists.

Not even sure if Ashton runs that socionix site (thought he did).

http://gallery.socionix.com/Delta/

I ran across DeAnte's list on wikisocion

http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.p...r:DeAnte#Delta


Now before somebody gets upset that some vulgar, ill mannered clown like Olivia Munn is ENFp (), all I'm saying is that at least those posters try. Try is a good thing. Better than being stuck in some boyhood fantasy of prissy housewives.

[UDP]

(LOL btw)


But as Ryu said:



i.e. not ALL.

What would the forum be if not for the people who get 'agitated' by stereotyping and then overly do something to prove it's not true?

Surely delta NFs wouldn't do that.

[Suz]

No, i just make them feel embarrassed because I dont swear back. Well, sometimes i will even laugh at the swear words; sometimes when it's done for effect, it is funny.

[SyrupDeGem]

I do actually swear sometimes, but not a great deal, dropping things for example and occasionally to emphasise something or in humour. I also definitely go through phases. Vulgar humour I find distasteful mostly, it's probably what I have most difficulty with. I find some swear words such as the C word still have their place though... I think par of the reason I dislike some swear words is because they are often insulting towards women, when a feminist uses the C word in a poetry piece though, that can have meaning and I understand it.

In an odd contradictory way I think swear words are given too much power by being slightly 'naughty' the same as other words i.e racial slurs, sometimes I almost want to overturn this and make the words themselves seem unimportant by wearing them out to take their power away. But I do realise then that other new 'offensive' words will take their place.


So anyway, vulgar profanities are probably worse for me than some curse words. Corse or base language used lightly without meaning.

[Cuddly McFluffles]

*chuckles* I somewhat recently came across a video where this woman was talking about a man that she had typed ; one of the reasons for this is that among other things (such as attention to etiquette), he was not into swearing. And seriously, my kneejerk reaction was to stare at the screen and say, "What the fuck?!"

[Nevero]

*chuckles* I somewhat recently came across a video where this woman was talking about a man that she had typed ; one of the reasons for this is that among other things (such as attention to etiquette), he was not into swearing. And seriously, my kneejerk reaction was to stare at the screen and say, "What the fuck?!"

"what the fuck" would have been my reaction too to anyone saying that Fi blocks out words like "fuck" and "cunt" from his vision and lexicon. that's remarkably stupid.

gamma types don't have the same stereotypes, however, so does this stereotype come from Se rather than Fi?

[Slacker]

I don't swear very often, and if I do swear it's mainly just:

shit
damnit
Jesus Christ (which apple just autocorrected and made uppercase.)

[Suz]

I don't swear very often, and if I do swear it's mainly just:

shit
damnit
Jesus Christ (which apple just autocorrected and made uppercase.)

lol those dont count!

[Nevero]

lol those dont count!

ha, what would count?

[Suz]

ha, what would count?

wait, are you trying to get me to swear?

[Nevero]

wait, are you trying to get me to swear?

of course not, i'm only asking for some examples of what delta would consider to be swearing [innocent]

[Slacker]

I guess I say "ass" too, now that I think of it. As in, "Stop being an ass." Though very often I say, "You're being a butt" instead. They mean the same thing but people laugh instead of getting offended if you tell them not to be a butt, but they still hear that they're being an ass.

[Enters Laughing]

usually when I swear in anger I stutter...I guess it is fairly unnatural for me so in such instances it's a way of showing I'm particularly bothered. I might say things like "What the fuck did you do that for?" or "What the damn bloody hell do you think you are playing at?" (although I wouldn't consider that one swearing.

"shit" is a word I commonly use when talking with others colloquially...also the word "bastard", typically in the context of talking of "...the bastards".

"Christ!" has been a favourite while others are laughing at me while have a mild heart attack, which used to happen quite often, apparently due to anxiety. The character of Alan Statham in Green Wing was a great inspiration to me in regards swearing style: ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRZaaCypZqo )

[suedehead]

I curse, within the right context. Not overtly, but isn't something that I'd feel conscious need to repress out of some sense of altruistic duty - if it feels right, I'll say it. What I would find distasteful on my part would be talking about how I shoved my c down a b's throat, etc. or anything that get's too candid for no good reason and just seems like you're trying too hard or have some sort of napoleon complex. It's funny to watch other people do it though, if that's their natural way of communicating. If I do get offended, it's less about the cursing specifically and more about the fact that the person's a fucking idiot.

[Slacker]

I am neither prissy nor uptight. I just don't swear a whole lot. I'm not bothered by it or upset by it.

Edited to add that my sister actually is a prissy uptight delta NF though. LOL.

[Park]

[Slacker]

He looks a bit prissy and uptight.

[Park]

He does.

[Park]

[Radio]

i think i swear a lot, i'm not sure. i was going through a phase, after highschool ended, when i started swearing a lot on purpose so i could break out of everyone else's expectations but mostly just break out of my own. up until i graduated i had created so many rules for myself that didn't really benefit me in any way, except tie me in tighter and tighter into complacency; don't swear, don't wear sunglasses, don't roll up your sleeves, loosen your tie or unbutton your collar, don't smoke, don't laugh out loudly, don't have fun. i felt suffocated and somehow saying "FUCK YOU MOTHERFUCKER" felt really liberating (note: i didn't actually say this, it was more like gingerly whispering out one or two curse words every few days until i became comfortable with it). it was exciting to finally not be a stick in the mud, and feel normal for once. and so i learned a lot, in uni, and i broke out of a lot of the expectations of what I could be or had to be, and just became me engulfed in life and everything that is without judgment, without feeling shallow, superficial, guilty, immoral or selfish for accepting myself.

anyway, yeah. type descriptions often feel like they're cut-out specifically for teenagers, at least for EII.