Pin the Type on the New Guy

[silverchris9]

You know, its funny you both should say that, as the type that I most often get from tests is IEI, followed by EII and ESI. Granted, as I've said, self-reported tests are a rather bad indicator and I feel I can't actually trust them, but all the same, why do you think I'm not IEI? You know, other than vibes?

Well, you seem likable enough, and likable in that self-aware, "I'm saying something that will induce you to like me" way (I'm like that too, I promise I'm not trying to be negative nor to say that it's not working, you seem quite likable), which is why people are saying Fe-creative, because that's what Fe-creatives do.

But what I'm not seeing is the Ni or the "extremity" for like of a better phrase. Like, your rant about people going too damn slow in the fast lane (which is TRUTH TRUTH and nothing but TRUTH, but I digress) sort of reminded me more of a Fe-leading "emotional pressure" than a Se-leading "volitional pressure," but I guess that's covered in typing you IEI over SLE.

I guess the real thing, then, is that IEIs on this forum tend to open up more quickly and reveal how well adjusted we're not. Possibly you are either a) actually well adjusted, or b) spend less time pretending to be well-adjusted (and so are in less need of an internet forum to express your inner fuck--can I still say that?--up-edness).

Also you seem extroverted because you seem to be in control of your social environment. I've revised my opinion while writing this post. 1) You might be IEI (but I still see SO MUCH MORE Fe than Ni!), and 2) You're not gamma. Alpha and beta (and even delta) are better fits than those two. Have you considered IEE? Contra Ne evidence is that you handled b&d's Ni quite well, and very accurately demonstrated an understanding of how to deal with Ni "pidgeonholing" or the tendency to impose narratives on situations and the need for other people to prove that the narrative does not fit the situation. But that could be covered under "Ne-leading who has had positive relations with Ni egos frequently," perhaps an Ni-ego family member. But it could also be explained by you being beta. But you seem so... likable. I mean, betas are that way, that's how IEIs are, but I've grown accustomed to the interiorly difficult betas, and you seem, if nothing else, very in control of your social environment, which the average IEI is not, I'd imagine. But again this could result for growing up (or spending a lot of time) in an environment in which Fe, rather than Ni, was suppressed. So you "get out" your Fe on a messageboard rather than Ni... hmm... do you see me constructing a narrative around you as well? Does the narrative have anything to do with your self-perceptions?

[stevENTj]

agreed. i don't see IEI at all. why is this even a suggestion?

Anyway, it seems that I'm more than likely IEI

Granted I didn't get nearly through the whole thread, but a lot of little things said IEI to me. The massive amounts of text scream introverted irrational to me, because us INxp types seem to observe the world around us a whole lot more than any other type, which is where all of the text comes from. I really do have to try hard to not make super long posts like that because I know a lot of people won't get through it so I have to try hard to trim down to only what's essential. I typically observe a whole lot more than what I put in my posts and can usually expand on a lot of the points greatly, or add more points. This seems to be an "unfiltered" view here. There's also the sort of "angry at the world" vibe that I got from it, which I think is more of an ethical thing than a logical thing. The fact that he's on his thirteenth major screams IP temperament. What other type can be that indecisive and change their minds so many times? Even the choice of major at the moment, journalism, which is the story of people through time, their human condition, what they feel and how they react. And then not everything he posted about necessarily has to do with Socionics. Who doesn't get pissed off at traffic, for example? I can't think of anybody who doesn't. It's something that everybody has to deal with and get annoyed by, so that likely has nothing to do with Socionics.

The OP knows himself the best, but personally I think IEI is a pretty good guess, and that's the general vibe that I get.

[silverchris9]

Knights are IEIs.

Because we're secretly cruel, selfish and inbred?

[Sir Knight]

Because we're secretly cruel, selfish and inbred?

That, or its possible that IEI's are just as cruel selfish and inbred as everyone else but that they realize that and rail as hard as they can against it?

I guess a lot of the attraction towards knights is that externally they're majestic defenders of the realm who attain an almost mythical status for their deeds and their conquests, but all. underneath that plate mail and around those codes of chivalry is a man. Just a man. As susceptible to doubt and frustration as any other man. As easily broken or killed or disheartened as any other man.

But the fact that he tries to act nobly and justly in a world that rewards neither speaks volumes about the character and the determination of that man.

But again, we're talking idealized knights here, so, yeah.

I guess its why I admire people who join monastic orders. How can someone repress themselves sexually and creatively for decades? How can one find pleasure in copying manuscripts or meditating in floral gardens for hours? Hell, Silent Orders? Orders where you can't even speak?! How people can subject themselves to that for decades and not tire of it I'll never understand, but if you can do it then its a very powerful show of your faith.

likable in that self-aware, "I'm saying something that will induce you to like me" way

Yeah, I understand this all too well. One time, this girl asked me out on a date and I agreed, not because I really wanted to date her, but because, well, I was touched that she found me attractive enough to date and I didn't want to hurt her feelings since she'd obviously been working up the courage to say this for a while. Its not that she was unattractive or had a bad personality, I just wasn't... I dunno, wasn't looking for a relationship, I guess.

I met her at a local coffee-house anyway and while I was waiting for her there all I could think about was that I really just wanted to bail and get the hell out of there but then she showed up. We order our coffees and our little biscuits and we sat upstairs and talked. I laughed, she laughed, and then we went our seperate ways. I got in my car and started it up, and looked at the clock and saw that two hours had passed and all I could think was, "What the hell did we even talk about that entire time?"

I mean, I'd been talking for hours about nothing. If I concentrated really hard I could remember specific phrases or exchanges, but I couldn't remember much of anything about the conversation or her. It was like my brain had just tuned out and my mouth just took over for a while. And she liked me of course, since she wanted to keep going out with me, but I felt like I didn't know her at all, and I was certain she knew nothing about me.

But I get that though. I just talk and joke with people and then we like each other but we still don't know anything about one another. We're friendly with one another but not friends.

As for the girl, we never did go on another date. We kept trying to plan something but our schedules never really worked. I really wanted to just tell her how I felt and that I didn't want to be in a relationship with her, but I just didn't want to hurt her feelings and, by extension, have her not like me.

I guess I just really like being likable. I doubt there is a single person on the face of this earth who would say that I'm an asshole and that I deserve to die. Hell, I was the weirdest kid I knew in high school and practically the whole school liked me. Even though they'd say I was weird or creepy at first, I'd just keep responding to them with humour and good will and chipping away at their reservations until they finally just realized, "You know, Steven's not all that bad of a guy."

And even now I still run into people from high school who are excited to see me and want to know how I'm doing and want to share their lives with me but all I can think is, "Who is this person and why is he acting all chummy with me?" I know their name. I know we had some classes together. If I really concentrate I can remember some of the conversations we've had or things we've done together. But I still just don't understand why they think I'm memorable or why they seem so excited to see me.

Hell, even in college, which is supposed to be all faceless and cold and impersonal, my teachers seem to never have any trouble remembering my name or my face which is just odd. I'm just some skinny pale guy who plays computer games all day, what makes me so special?

I guess I'm really good at ingratiating myself with people, but at the same time I feel like, even though these people like me, I'm never really all that close to them. Hence why I only have two friends.

I guess the real thing, then, is that IEIs on this forum tend to open up more quickly and reveal how well adjusted we're not.

I am a man of contrasts, it seems. After two Orange Honey Wheat draughts, Friend #2 once described me as, "the most high-strung laid-back person he's ever met." In the same vein, I'm well-adjusted but I never really feel like it. Like, I guess I just come across as this really well-togther, stable sort of guy to other people when I am, in fact, riven by a deep kind of internal angst that I don't really feel entitled to feel, if that makes any sense.

I know people who are in far worse situations than I am. One girl I know is basically in an impossible situation where to continue living as she is is to keep herself in an environment where she has absolutely no potential for personal growth and if a really big crisis were to affect her she wouldn't have any legal means of dealing with it. At the same time, getting out of this situation would mean going someplace shes never been before, where she can barely speak the language, and where she knows no one and has nothing and would lose whatever little she has carved out for herself now.

She has a shitty situation. I'm a spoiled middle class brat who eats three square meals a day, has a steady job that pays pretty well, has all the room in the world for personal growth and has the freedom to be able to sit in his computer chair and post long walls of text in Socionics forums. I have a fucking awesome situation and I still get melancholy.

We were talking online once, and the conversation turned morose. We started talking about the last time each of us was depressed. Like, not melancholy, but true, deep, nihilistic depression. The ones that don't go away after a day or two.

Mine happened last year. It was a new semester and I had taken the introductory courses to five different majors. I thought that one of these five will be my career and By God I will figure out which one it is this time. This time I really will get out of college. And I didn't of course, but I soldiered on for half the semester, hoping that one of these classes would grab me and interest me and show me what I was to do for the rest of my life and they didn't.

...and then the guilt hit. I realized that I'd wasted another semester of my time and my parent's money, and, simple as that, I just stopped going to class halfway through. I couldn't talk to anyone about it. Certainly not my parents. It didn't make any sense. Of course I wanted to do well and not waste money, but then what was the point when none of these courses were going to be worth any amount of effort in the end? Logically I should have just finished it and found something else to study next semester but I couldn't. I just couldn't make myself care, either about the classes or the truly shitty grades I was getting in them for not showing up.

I contemplated suicide a lot then. Well, I do that anyway when I'm in a melancholy but its only ever half-hearted: whenever I think about killing myself I think about all the time and the effort and the money and the teaching and, most of all, the love that's gotten me to where I am now and I really would just have to be the most callous, insensitive kind of asshole to throw all of that away, no matter how badly I wanted to die.

But then, I'm talking to this girl about all of this, and she's telling me about how, for eight months she went through exactly what I did, emotionally, and how bad it was for her and all I can think is, "What a pretentious asshole I am." Who was I to act all depressed when I had such a good situation? Here's someone with a real reason to be depressed and here I am sounding like a whiny little bitch because I had a hard time in college.

Which I know is bullshit. Just because someone has a good situation doesn't mean they're exempt from feeling depressed. Its also bullshit that I feel my problems are insignificant because you have to confront them to be able to deal with them and move beyond them. But I still felt guilty over telling her about my depression even though I knew I had no reason to.

I guess it just goes back to contrasts. For example, I'm charming, but I feel so awkward in conversation, like I need to keep the other person entertained and feeling good or something like that or else I've failed on some level. Friend #1 finds it odd that I can know, objectively, that I'm charming and then at the same time not realize it.

Its like I know what I am but I never really feel what I am. Like I knew that I was depressed and that I needed help but I felt like I shouldn't have been, that I needed to handle my problems myself.

Hell, maybe this is why I'm so hard to type: I don't even know how to be myself sometimes, since often I wonder just what my self is.

[Sir Knight]

Don't ask me. I've met other guys saying they were knights, and they were all IEIs. I kind of thought it was because they live in a fantasy world, where they are noble heroes. Also, they were all E9s, so maybe it's a freak result of the IEI and E9 combination?

For other freak combinations, if you see somebody wearing native american headdresses, he/she is probably IEE.

Edit: I ended up curious enough to read about 70% of SirKnight's posts in this thread, and found a bit of Ti-valuing, a bit of Fi-valuing, a bit of Si-valuing, possibly rationality, then possibly irrationality, possibly ethical..... Really, not much to go by. SirKnight, I think you are probably an introvert because your focus is on the introverted elements. Ethical introverts with decent Ti, Fi and Si are SEIs and EIIs. At the moment I think those types are more probable than IEI. You give very detailed information in a way that seems Si-valuing > Ni -valuing. I think that is what makes silverchris say "not IEI". Ni-valuers tend to look at the big picture. You seem to notice details.

If you work with somebody, how do you prefer to work? Describe.

Sorry, Ananke, I didn't see your edit before I posted. Now that you say SEI, though, I've read a lot of the profiles online about it. EII doesn't fit very well, but SEI seems to fit very well. I'm fairly certain I've narrowed it down to either SEI or IEI. I know I'm ethical, and fairly certain that I'm introverted and irrational. So now that leaves intuitive or sensing.

I think the reason that I considered myself intuitive so long is that I tend to spend a lot of time in my head and I worry about the future a lot. But then, that may not be because of intuition but rather because of sensing's tendency towards single-tasking. So, whenever I'm thinking, then I just focus on thinking to the exclusion of everything else, treating thinking as a single task. At any rate, I'm most certainly Process on the Process/Result dichotomy. I know Reinen dichotomies are considered logically sketchy, but of all of them, this one seems the least subjective to me. I always focus on finishing one thing at a time. Hell, whenever there's more than one thing on my dinner plate I always eat one thing after another.

As to your question though, I really just like working alone, if its possible. If it isn't then I prefer it when everyone in the group has one very clearly defined task to follow that no one else can interfere with.

When I have to work with someone else on something then they'll either be the person who knows more than I do, in which I case I almost totally defer to them since I don't want to drag them down and end up being The Guy Who Contributes Nothing Whatsoever To the Project and feel like a worthless scumbag, or on the other side of things I'll realize that I know more than my partner and will basically just try to phase them out of the project as much as possible and assign myself the lion's share of the workload and so become The Guy Who Does Everything All By Himself.

There's very little in between so its refreshing when I realize that I can trust someone to do their end of the job well and so can leave it all up to them. All the same though, I really just prefer having my own slice of project to work and do in my own way without anyone else feeling the need to contribute or to edit until after I have it at the point I feel its ready to be shared.

[silverchris9]

Don't ask me. I've met other guys saying they were knights, and they were all IEIs. I kind of thought it was because they live in a fantasy world, where they are noble heroes. Also, they were all E9s, so maybe it's a freak result of the IEI and E9 combination?

Huh. That's interesting.

As for worrying about the future, IEIs typically do NOT worry about the future, as Ni has a really wide scope.

True. I don't generally worry about "the future." I worry about specific events in my near future, but that's more anxiety (fear of future pain) than anything else.

[silverchris9]

Resurrecting dead thread. Glad you settled on IEI. Good example of an IEI 3, imo. Maybe I'm just saying that because I liked a lot of the things you said and want to impose your narrative on myself. Can really relate to the bits about being weird in high school and yet bizarrely loved. Deathly afraid of going out with a girl merely because she shows interest despite my lack thereof. SLEs are a good antidote to that problem, as far as theory would have you believe.

ARGH. Everything you said reminds me of myself. Now I'm wondering if I'm an SEI. Except I'm not. Shrug-sigh.

[Exodus]

That, or its possible that IEI's are just as cruel selfish and inbred as everyone else but that they realize that and rail as hard as they can against it?

I guess a lot of the attraction towards knights is that externally they're majestic defenders of the realm who attain an almost mythical status for their deeds and their conquests, but all. underneath that plate mail and around those codes of chivalry is a man. Just a man. As susceptible to doubt and frustration as any other man. As easily broken or killed or disheartened as any other man.

But the fact that he tries to act nobly and justly in a world that rewards neither speaks volumes about the character and the determination of that man.

But again, we're talking idealized knights here, so, yeah.

I guess its why I admire people who join monastic orders. How can someone repress themselves sexually and creatively for decades? How can one find pleasure in copying manuscripts or meditating in floral gardens for hours? Hell, Silent Orders? Orders where you can't even speak?! How people can subject themselves to that for decades and not tire of it I'll never understand, but if you can do it then its a very powerful show of your faith.

...

And even now I still run into people from high school who are excited to see me and want to know how I'm doing and want to share their lives with me but all I can think is, "Who is this person and why is he acting all chummy with me?" I know their name. I know we had some classes together. If I really concentrate I can remember some of the conversations we've had or things we've done together. But I still just don't understand why they think I'm memorable or why they seem so excited to see me.

Hell, even in college, which is supposed to be all faceless and cold and impersonal, my teachers seem to never have any trouble remembering my name or my face which is just odd. I'm just some skinny pale guy who plays computer games all day, what makes me so special?

I guess I'm really good at ingratiating myself with people, but at the same time I feel like, even though these people like me, I'm never really all that close to them. Hence why I only have two friends.


I am a man of contrasts, it seems. After two Orange Honey Wheat draughts, Friend #2 once described me as, "the most high-strung laid-back person he's ever met." In the same vein, I'm well-adjusted but I never really feel like it. Like, I guess I just come across as this really well-togther, stable sort of guy to other people when I am, in fact, riven by a deep kind of internal angst that I don't really feel entitled to feel, if that makes any sense.

...

I guess it just goes back to contrasts. For example, I'm charming, but I feel so awkward in conversation, like I need to keep the other person entertained and feeling good or something like that or else I've failed on some level. Friend #1 finds it odd that I can know, objectively, that I'm charming and then at the same time not realize it.

Its like I know what I am but I never really feel what I am. Like I knew that I was depressed and that I needed help but I felt like I shouldn't have been, that I needed to handle my problems myself.

Hell, maybe this is why I'm so hard to type: I don't even know how to be myself sometimes, since often I wonder just what my self is.

Dude sounds EIE...

[Sir Knight]

Dude sounds EIE...

Really? What gives you that impression?

Resurrecting dead thread. Glad you settled on IEI. Good example of an IEI 3, imo. Maybe I'm just saying that because I liked a lot of the things you said and want to impose your narrative on myself. Can really relate to the bits about being weird in high school and yet bizarrely loved. Deathly afraid of going out with a girl merely because she shows interest despite my lack thereof. SLEs are a good antidote to that problem, as far as theory would have you believe.

ARGH. Everything you said reminds me of myself. Now I'm wondering if I'm an SEI. Except I'm not. Shrug-sigh.

I figured I may as well just settle on the type I've been settled on for some time and eventually someone will say, "You're retarded, there's no way you're this type, you just HAVE to be this type..." Or something like that. I'm not sure if I really am IEI. SEI or EII could apply to me just as easily, but I figure I'll just roll with IEI for a time and see how I like it.

[Exodus]

Really? What gives you that impression?

I don't know...never mind, I'm confused now.