How is Ti PoLR manifested in ENFps and ESFps?

[Trevor]

I'm pretty sure we need to pay attention to difference between Absolute vs Relative weaknees of a function.

Well this is Te if it's Te vs Ti, no?

What's Te if it's Te vs Ti, Words?

[Galen]

rantedy rant rant wheeeeeeee

Things I've noticed about Ti-PoLRs are: a love of pointing out exceptions to the rule

Absolutely yes. I don't even really care for "the rule" to begin with, because no single rule I've come across has ever really encompassed everything it tries to do, no matter how hard people try to bend it. What really pisses me off is when people try to assert how their own self-made "rules" actually work in the real world, then when I point out the discrepancies between how the world works and what their rule stipulates they weasel their way out of it. People can become so painfully attached to the rules that they create about the world, and it's like they can't bear to give them up and instead have to force data into it, straining their spider web so hard until it rips apart although the person never knows that it's broken.

What else annoys me about Ti valuers is that they like to build their own world in their head from the ground up, affixing their own basic starting points and situations to create an argument. This works fine so long as the system stays inside the individual's head, but when you try to apply it to the real world, there's always some way in which it doesn't quite fit. The issue then becomes that they don't even see how it doesn't fit: they just go along with the bias they have for their own head.

That's essentially how it works for me to be Ti PoLR: rejection of "the rules," whatever they may be. That's not to say rejection of law in general, but rejection of the existence of externally static laws under which the world is subjugated. I've always been under the impression that the outer world is really just a giant playground of chaos where each infinitesimally small little part does what it does, and these small parts compound into larger parts and everything just grows out of an extrinsically unstructured environment. An ENFp friend of mine one said "truth is temporary," which I think is a good summary of everything here.

[tcaudilllg]

rantedy rant rant wheeeeeeee

Things I've noticed about Ti-PoLRs are: a love of pointing out exceptions to the rule

Absolutely yes. I don't even really care for "the rule" to begin with, because no single rule I've come across has ever really encompassed everything it tries to do, no matter how hard people try to bend it. What really pisses me off is when people try to assert how their own self-made "rules" actually work in the real world, then when I point out the discrepancies between how the world works and what their rule stipulates they weasel their way out of it. People can become so painfully attached to the rules that they create about the world, and it's like they can't bear to give them up and instead have to force data into it, straining their spider web so hard until it rips apart although the person never knows that it's broken.

What else annoys me about Ti valuers is that they like to build their own world in their head from the ground up, affixing their own basic starting points and situations to create an argument. This works fine so long as the system stays inside the individual's head, but when you try to apply it to the real world, there's always some way in which it doesn't quite fit. The issue then becomes that they don't even see how it doesn't fit: they just go along with the bias they have for their own head.

That's essentially how it works for me to be Ti PoLR: rejection of "the rules," whatever they may be. That's not to say rejection of law in general, but rejection of the existence of externally static laws under which the world is subjugated. I've always been under the impression that the outer world is really just a giant playground of chaos where each infinitesimally small little part does what it does, and these small parts compound into larger parts and everything just grows out of an extrinsically unstructured environment. An ENFp friend of mine one said "truth is temporary," which I think is a good summary of everything here.

The rule may be correct, but it is tied up with assumptions that require a lot of work to extinguish. Notably, most of these assumptions are untested Ti postulates offered by weak Ti people. Strong Ti people are driven to eliminate these assumptions, in part due to a sense or responsibility and in part, due to a sense of personal guilt for not knowing better. To be sure, the stronger your function, the more guilt you feel over its misuse.

[Blaze]

rantedy rant rant wheeeeeeee

Things I've noticed about Ti-PoLRs are: a love of pointing out exceptions to the rule

Absolutely yes. I don't even really care for "the rule" to begin with, because no single rule I've come across has ever really encompassed everything it tries to do, no matter how hard people try to bend it. What really pisses me off is when people try to assert how their own self-made "rules" actually work in the real world, then when I point out the discrepancies between how the world works and what their rule stipulates they weasel their way out of it. People can become so painfully attached to the rules that they create about the world, and it's like they can't bear to give them up and instead have to force data into it, straining their spider web so hard until it rips apart although the person never knows that it's broken.

What else annoys me about Ti valuers is that they like to build their own world in their head from the ground up, affixing their own basic starting points and situations to create an argument. This works fine so long as the system stays inside the individual's head, but when you try to apply it to the real world, there's always some way in which it doesn't quite fit. The issue then becomes that they don't even see how it doesn't fit: they just go along with the bias they have for their own head.

That's essentially how it works for me to be Ti PoLR: rejection of "the rules," whatever they may be. That's not to say rejection of law in general, but rejection of the existence of externally static laws under which the world is subjugated. I've always been under the impression that the outer world is really just a giant playground of chaos where each infinitesimally small little part does what it does, and these small parts compound into larger parts and everything just grows out of an extrinsically unstructured environment. An ENFp friend of mine one said "truth is temporary," which I think is a good summary of everything here.

^Ti polr in action.

seriously, this is what i notice about them. they totally overreact to Ti...this is the main characteristic of Ti polr. they claim that Ti is rigid....when really it's that they don't understand what Ti egos are talking about.

[Galen]

^Ti polr in action.

seriously, this is what i notice about them. they totally overreact to Ti...this is the main characteristic of Ti polr. they claim that Ti is rigid....when really it's that they don't understand what Ti egos are talking about.

Well to be fair, Ti is rigid lol. At least when compared to Fi. You're right though, if a Ti ego (well, Ti subtype really) and I agree on something there's not going to be much difficulty in communicating, and vice versa.

[Delilah]

^Ti polr in action.

seriously, this is what i notice about them. they totally overreact to Ti...this is the main characteristic of Ti polr. they claim that Ti is rigid....when really it's that they don't understand what Ti egos are talking about.

lol this made me smile, ime Ti polr gives both a commitment to the theory (in this case) and a commitment to exceptions to the rule by pointing them out so it comes down to a bit of a half-hearted commitment to things and people etc in general, imo

[niffer]

seriously, this is what i notice about them. they totally overreact to Ti...this is the main characteristic of Ti polr. they claim that Ti is rigid....when really it's that they don't understand what Ti egos are talking about.​

THIS x 10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 000000000000000

I find that a lot of Ti polrs instead just feel pre-emptively intimidated or put off by thinking I'm being patronizing to them or something like a dad who's about to beat them when that is NEVER my intention. They are not focused on trying to understand the CONTENT and focus way too much on tone and relationships. It's like they're worried that if they don't understand something, others will get upset at them (or that when others regulate their emotional expression in a way that's different from Fe polrs or other Ti polrs, it means that they're upset with them and they get alarmed and confused by their expressions). Or that too much emotional showiness from others will bowl them over--they think that only THEY can be emotionally showy or expressive because they have such perfect control over it with their Fe demo. WTF is this about I am seriously wondering. Did overemotional people beat you guys every time you answered a math question incorrectly or what?

[Myst]

rantedy rant rant wheeeeeeee

Absolutely yes. I don't even really care for "the rule" to begin with, because no single rule I've come across has ever really encompassed everything it tries to do, no matter how hard people try to bend it. What really pisses me off is when people try to assert how their own self-made "rules" actually work in the real world, then when I point out the discrepancies between how the world works and what their rule stipulates they weasel their way out of it. People can become so painfully attached to the rules that they create about the world, and it's like they can't bear to give them up and instead have to force data into it, straining their spider web so hard until it rips apart although the person never knows that it's broken.

What else annoys me about Ti valuers is that they like to build their own world in their head from the ground up, affixing their own basic starting points and situations to create an argument. This works fine so long as the system stays inside the individual's head, but when you try to apply it to the real world, there's always some way in which it doesn't quite fit. The issue then becomes that they don't even see how it doesn't fit: they just go along with the bias they have for their own head.

That's essentially how it works for me to be Ti PoLR: rejection of "the rules," whatever they may be. That's not to say rejection of law in general, but rejection of the existence of externally static laws under which the world is subjugated. I've always been under the impression that the outer world is really just a giant playground of chaos where each infinitesimally small little part does what it does, and these small parts compound into larger parts and everything just grows out of an extrinsically unstructured environment. An ENFp friend of mine one said "truth is temporary," which I think is a good summary of everything here.

Best ever desc of Ti PoLR, thx

Where I really had a laugh was where you used the verb "weasel" for Ti explanations of how the discrepancies you seem to detect aren't actually discrepancies from their viewpoint using their own framework. Also when you think the Ti types don't see how a system doesn't fit the real world, you may be simply unaware that they actually do see the facts you see but they interpret them differently from you. I think that that framework is what you are really missing as PoLR Ti. You kinda just see some rules that seem standalone to you in the way how for you they don't really add up into a proper system that's logically "felt out" by the Ti types. That "spider web" isn't necessarily strained in the way you imagine it is, sounds like this is your own personal experience of Ti instead

Oh also interesting how you see the world in that chaotic way of everything magically "just growing out" of whatever environment and into whatever vague compounds. Very different from how I see the world (I basically just see the world via my senses but if I introvert a bit then I also have a very logical feel of it in addition to that.)

[HandiAce]

What does Ti-PoLR (Point of Least Resistance) look like in real life? If anyone has any videos showing something along the lines of it manifesting, I'd be highly interested to see.

[Codie]

What does Ti-PoLR (Point of Least Resistance) look like in real life? If anyone has any videos showing something along the lines of it manifesting, I'd be highly interested to see.

The one thing that immediately makes me suspect polr ( in -IEE's anyway ) are either huge walls of text, using lots of details and mentioning loads of other possibilites - when what they're saying could be summed up with 80% less writing. It's like some want to give ALLL the details in case they miss something. I don't really see their behaviour as "illogical" cause so is mine , but I apreciate logical structure and they seem to ignore it.

I was looking at an - IEE's work resume, and while seemingly impressive and very heavy, the amount of detail she gave was superfluous and headache inducing.

[HandiAce]

The one thing that immediately makes me suspect polr ( in -IEE's anyway ) are either huge walls of text, using lots of details and mentioning loads of other possibilites - when what they're saying could be summed up with 80% less writing. It's like some want to give ALLL the details in case they miss something. I don't really see their behaviour as "illogical" cause so is mine , but I apreciate logical structure and they seem to ignore it.

I was looking at an - IEE's work resume, and while seemingly impressive and very heavy, the amount of detail she gave was superfluous and headache inducing.

Sounds like something I would do.

[Codie]

In both SEEs and IEEs polr manifests basically as rationalization through categories instead of ones, so thats why they may seem to exhibit erratic/ illogical behaviour to egos.

[ambivalent existence]

Sounds like something I would do.

the IEE guy I know, he keeps saying things that shows he's very proud of Te use (I personally think it's somewhat inefficient Te, but it's usable), but when he's trying to understand a theory, he keeps mixing up definitions, and gets to rather weird conclusions this way. also I irritate him with Ti behaviour.

added: and yeah, his behaviour is illogical, but I don't mind, I'm ok with him

ps: he's ENFP in MBTI too

[Suz]

The one thing that immediately makes me suspect polr ( in -IEE's anyway ) are either huge walls of text, using lots of details and mentioning loads of other possibilites - when what they're saying could be summed up with 80% less writing. It's like some want to give ALLL the details in case they miss something. I don't really see their behaviour as "illogical" cause so is mine , but I apreciate logical structure and they seem to ignore it.

I was looking at an - IEE's work resume, and while seemingly impressive and very heavy, the amount of detail she gave was superfluous and headache inducing.

I've driven some people crazy with this very behavior... I guess they were Ti-seekers or Ti-doms.. I actually got yelled at by one supervisor for doing so. Meanwhile I'm like, why does he NOT want to know all this???

[Suz]

I've driven some people crazy with this very behavior... I guess they were Ti-seekers or Ti-doms.. I actually got yelled at by one supervisor for doing so. Meanwhile I'm like, why does he NOT want to know all this???

Looking back through this thread, now that i no longer self-type Ti-POLR.

Yeah i still resonate with what i said previously, however, as Codie mentioned about himself, I do have an appreciation for logical structure (although often, i've depended on others to provide it for me, or redirect me). I've also learned over time to structure my thoughts, from my many role model influences over the years. For me, its much easier to do so in writing than verbally, because i can move things around. What i've also learned over time is to cut out stuff that is irrelevant, to make a stronger case for whatever point it is i'm trying to make. Also easier to do in writing than by the spoken word.

Another thing i've noticed is that the people who get upset at my level of detail have a much less analytical thought process and work style compared to those who welcome it. It's almost like they dont want those details because it'll make them need to think harder. For whatever that's worth.

Apart from that, some people might get annoyed at seemingly "irrelevant" info coming from me, but it's often simply that they can't see the connection/importance, whereas I might. Then when i explain why i think it's important, they're like "ohh... ok yeah blah blah blah". OR they'll still be like insisting it doesn't matter (so they dont look the fool).

I've worked with sooo many characters...

[anndelise]

One thing I've noticed is that if you tell them a general trend, even if you clearly state that it's general and doesn't always apply, they keep bringing up exceptions and seem to think the rule is useless if any exceptions exist

Wouldn't that be more of an Ni vs Ne thing?

Edited to add: maybe it would depend on whether one is referring to a dynamic cause-effect trend or a static rule/reason

Really, the rule/trend would be as useless as there are exceptions: the more exceptions that exist, the less useful the supposed rule/trend.

Edited to add again, lol (what I'd said was bothering me in the shower): it might be a trend/rule that XeFi types have an easier time adapting their perceptions to accommodate exceptions, than other types. SeFi more so based on personal experiences, less so based on others' stories. While NeFi based on both. ?Maybe?

[Galen]

One thing I've noticed is that if you tell them a general trend, even if you clearly state that it's general and doesn't always apply, they keep bringing up exceptions and seem to think the rule is useless if any exceptions exist

I find myself doing this unless it's stated by the person saying that it doesn't always apply to every situation.

The one thing that immediately makes me suspect polr ( in -IEE's anyway ) are either huge walls of text, using lots of details and mentioning loads of other possibilites - when what they're saying could be summed up with 80% less writing. It's like some want to give ALLL the details in case they miss something. I don't really see their behaviour as "illogical" cause so is mine , but I apreciate logical structure and they seem to ignore it.

I don't think that I ignore logical structure as much as I can't follow logic that's never actually stated. What I find with types is that there's a seeming enveloping of connections embedded within whatever statement is made, and that the statement as it exists by itself isn't as important as the things hidden within it, or "implied" if you will. There's an implicit sense of something underneath the immediate surface of what's presented, whereas I'm much more wont to see the statement as a thing in and of itself and take it as it is.

This shouldn't be to say that I expect or appreciate massive walls of text in order to get every tiny detail down (anybody else remember n1cole?). I feel myself to have the mental capacity to connect the dots myself given what I've learned so far in life.

[Park]

What I find with types is that there's a seeming enveloping of connections embedded within whatever statement is made, and that the statement as it exists by itself isn't as important as the things hidden within it, or "implied" if you will. There's an implicit sense of something underneath the immediate surface of what's presented, whereas I'm much more wont to see the statement as a thing in and of itself and take it as it is.

I think the same analogy can be drawn for Fi types, as seen from a Ti POV. Fe valuers will tend to ignore any "implied" Fi meanings/messages, until things like subjective feelings, interpersonal dynamics, and ethical principles are clearly expressed and out in the open.

[Park]

The one thing that immediately makes me suspect polr ( in -IEE's anyway ) are either huge walls of text, using lots of details and mentioning loads of other possibilites - when what they're saying could be summed up with 80% less writing. It's like some want to give ALLL the details in case they miss something. I don't really see their behaviour as "illogical" cause so is mine , but I apreciate logical structure and they seem to ignore it.

I was looking at an - IEE's work resume, and while seemingly impressive and very heavy, the amount of detail she gave was superfluous and headache inducing.

No, that's how ESFj's present information. They can't discern what is relevant and what irrelevant information, so they spew it all onto their Ti-IJ dual to give it structure and help make sense out of it.

[Suz]

No, that's how ESFj's present information. They can't discern what is relevant and what irrelevant information, so they spew it all onto their Ti-IJ dual to give it structure and help make sense out of it.

How does everyone feel about this hypothesis? I've been meeting some SLIs that are just lazy losers lately, so i'm starting to think maybe I really am ESE...

[The Exception]

The one thing that immediately makes me suspect polr ( in -IEE's anyway ) are either huge walls of text, using lots of details and mentioning loads of other possibilites - when what they're saying could be summed up with 80% less writing. It's like some want to give ALLL the details in case they miss something. I don't really see their behaviour as "illogical" cause so is mine , but I apreciate logical structure and they seem to ignore it.

I was looking at an - IEE's work resume, and while seemingly impressive and very heavy, the amount of detail she gave was superfluous and headache inducing.

I'm often guilty of doing that and I am a possible LII. I don't want to omit anything that could potentially be useful and potentially be valuable information towards ones understanding of something. I do try to logically organize that information in some way.

[MisterNi]

LII: Can you explain that symbolically? I'm having trouble understanding your wacky words.
IEE: EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK!!!!! I WANNA KILL YOUUUUUUUUU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Supervision via Ti-PoLR in a nutshell.

[squark]

I'm often guilty of doing that and I am a possible LII. I don't want to omit anything that could potentially be useful and potentially be valuable information towards ones understanding of something. I do try to logically organize that information in some way.

That sounds Ne related rather than Ti related perhaps.

I am guilty of the opposite. I leave out a lot of information assuming that it's understood, and then end up having to backtrack to spell everything out when I didn't communicate well.

The main thing is a general lack of organization in their thinking process and/or life.

This is the most accurate representation of Ti polr from my perspective. It doesn't look the same in one person to the next, but this seems to be the root of all of it. In one person it means that they will collect or go through huge volumes of information in order to sort something out, and their explanations are meandering. In another they will miss obvious contradictions. To me, it just seems like they have trouble following the connections between one thing and the next and seeing how they are related. That's why some of them can say one thing, and follow it up with something that completely negates what they just said, and not be aware of what they just did. Or why sometimes they won't see how a single word can change an entire concept, because the connections aren't there.

Since Ti is the external statics of fields (the concrete connections between ideas) it makes sense that Ti polr would have problems in this area. Those with Ti polr are instead relying on Fi which is not concrete, but is subjective and conditional, which means they don't have a solid structure or framework, and so have to take the long way around in sorting out thoughts and ideas.

[Raver]

What does Ti-PoLR (Point of Least Resistance) look like in real life? If anyone has any videos showing something along the lines of it manifesting, I'd be highly interested to see.

I already made this thread here: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin.../36597-Ti-PoLR

[Beautiful sky]

Not being able to follow or appreciate other people's analysis of things.

[Slacker]

Not being able to follow or appreciate other people's analysis of things.

Yeah, I can think of a lot of reasons other than Ti PoLR than that, mainly that the analysis is sucky beyond measure.

[Beautiful sky]

Getting confused when people analyze things; unable to follow other people's internal structure/system of thought. If the person is SEE, they overlook what the Ti analyst is doing to "exert their own will" on them.

[rat1]

I think SEEs Ti polr sees how the abstraction of Ti fails to adequately describe the specificity of an experience. IEEs see the analysis as pointless, describing how things are but doing nothing about it.

[Olduvai]

I see PoLR when people say one thing now, then something that logically contradicts it some time later, and then get upset if you say, "but what you said just contradicts what you just said five minutes before".

This is a great example of Ti-PoLR.

ENFp is very inconsistent in the acts and reasonings. Listening to explanations, easily seizes the general, frequently only superficial sense. Sometimes at ENFp there is an insuperable interest to the analysis of insignificant particulars (and these particulars seem to him supersignificant and necessary for deep and momentary understanding of an essence).

Intuitively comprehending sense of many logic concepts and categories, ENFp often has about them superficial enough representation. Therefore sometimes puts himself in awkward position, stating obviously absurd things most self-assured tone.

Often tests difficulty in an explanation of any elementary concepts. But even more is at a loss to explain the complex phenomenon simple means.

sometimes ENFp begins the explanation too in detail and in details, but subsequently he loses in it interest

ENFp painfully perceive any accusation of illogicality and inconsistency. Take offence, when criticize their mental faculties. Often express in the form of sayings. Some of representatives of this type like to write down the sayings in a writing-book, to quote to their associates and to publish in the newspaper.

Most of this is pretty accurate. The two bolded sentences are ones I highly identify with. I absolutely hate being called stupid or any variant thereof, and oftentimes instead of attempting to express a viewpoint in my own words, I'll quote someone else ("Spinoza said this", "according to Wittgenstein, this", etc).

I think a better definition to use (and let's be realistic: We're simply deciding to use definitions for things; there is nothing intrinsic...it's a matter of choice) for Te is that it's the dynamic and extraverted aspect of thinking.

That is, Ti and Te are basically the same thing, but Ti is static (about a fixed timeless reality) and more concerned with the extent of systems and how everything relates, whereas Te is dynamic (about a progression, such a series of steps, ways to accomplish something, for example) and tends to relate more immediately to the specific external objects under discussion.

This is excellent.

All this talk about being anything about "the rules" is sickening (although I guess LSI's would prefer it to "laws").

Fully differentiated Filatova -PoLR Quotes: (May decide to revamp the other PoLR threads in the future)

IEE

Weak in administrative functions such as organization of work schedules, writing instructions, reports and the like.

Have trouble restraining themselves to certain boundaries.

Does not accept anything predetermined.

Difficulty in logical analysis.

Cannot sit and meticulously do what is necessary, instead preferring to bounce a multitude of ideas off those around them.

Inability to analyze things deeply

Pay attention to the many minute details while failing to grasp the big picture

YES! If you seek an adequate understanding of Ti-PoLR, look no further.

[Park]

I see PoLR when people say one thing now, then something that logically contradicts it some time later, and then get upset if you say, "but what you said just contradicts what you just said five minutes before".

This is a great example of Ti-PoLR.

That's a great example of something that gets on my nerves quite frequently. I'm easily pissed off by people who don't take themselves seriously and make me point out the inconsistencies in what they've said to me on a regular basis. I see them as unreliable. They, on the other hand, are usually surprised I remember and take what they say to me seriously.

[FDG]

Ti polr is a property of EP types in serious quadras.

In democratic quadras (well, Gamma): you don't obtain power by rising through a hierarchy or making people submit to you by force (as a Se-Ti would do), but by public acclaim of people liking you and thinking you are the king of the world. Of course, this may require you to contradict yourself and your party's/group ideals because you're trying to please everyone...

In aristocratic quadras (well, Delta): you don't realize your ideas by elaborating an organization where each person has a specific role and expectations, but rather you talk a group of "elected" friends / like minded people into helping you. Of course, this may require you to completely bypass the existing bureucratic structure of an organization...

[Kim]

In aristocratic quadras (well, Delta): you don't realize your ideas by elaborating an organization where each person has a specific role and expectations, but rather you talk a group of "elected" friends / like minded people into helping you. Of course, this may require you to completely bypass the existing bureucratic structure of an organization...

Not necessarily. You might also try to figure out what is useful about the bureaucratic structure and what is not and tailor that to your ideas. That might impair the integrity of the structure, but who cares if they system works as a coherent unit when you need parts to work in your favor.

[Ainfigur]

I'm guilty of a lot of this hmm.

[FDG]

Not necessarily. You might also try to figure out what is useful about the bureaucratic structure and what is not and tailor that to your ideas. That might impair the integrity of the structure, but who cares if they system works as a coherent unit when you need parts to work in your favor.

Sure, but you can't really have your cake and eat it too, that kind of attitude is often bound to riffle some feathers (not always, of course).

[suedehead]

I get this bad taste in my mouth whenever I see someone get really touchy about the consistency of an abstract system, like Socionics.

I notice and often feel an urge to point out contradictions, and it doesn't bother me as much when most other types do it, but I get this automatic, toxic feeling when I see an LII doing it. Even if they have a point, which they usually do. It's kind of embarrassing how that happens.

[trifling nincompoop]

its manifested by their stupidity if someone hasnt already answered

[Beautiful sky]

Duality is a strange thing from the pov of polr. Even though I can be a bit willful and get stuff done like do choirs because I like a clear environment I am met with my dual who keeps me away from expansions of energy because knowing what needs to be done he often finds some tasks unnecessary. I like this because he creates Si "relaxing time" which I love and appreciate. So polr is a function in the conscious block and the person can do it but would rather be told not to as it distracts them from their purpose and the polr is not a natural place to be. And thus I don't mind being ordered, demanded, told, not to do something making me obay authority with pleasure

That sounds Ne related rather than Ti related perhaps.

I am guilty of the opposite. I leave out a lot of information assuming that it's understood, and then end up having to backtrack to spell everything out when I didn't communicate well.



This is the most accurate representation of Ti polr from my perspective. It doesn't look the same in one person to the next, but this seems to be the root of all of it. In one person it means that they will collect or go through huge volumes of information in order to sort something out, and their explanations are meandering. In another they will miss obvious contradictions. To me, it just seems like they have trouble following the connections between one thing and the next and seeing how they are related. That's why some of them can say one thing, and follow it up with something that completely negates what they just said, and not be aware of what they just did. Or why sometimes they won't see how a single word can change an entire concept, because the connections aren't there.

Since Ti is the external statics of fields (the concrete connections between ideas) it makes sense that Ti polr would have problems in this area. Those with Ti polr are instead relying on Fi which is not concrete, but is subjective and conditional, which means they don't have a solid structure or framework, and so have to take the long way around in sorting out thoughts and ideas.

I'm going to be EIE in my next life time

[MisterNi]

In my line of work I need to engage my -PoLR quite often to the point where using isn't painful. What is painful though is when needing to conform to a bunch of based rules that are very biased toward Alphas. I can eek by with Betas but I'm most comfortable working exclusively with Deltas of any type. True story.

[MisterNi]

LII: Teach me how to Parkour, I will pay you even!
SEE: No, you suck at it. I'm not interested in your money.
LII: Please teach me, see? I have all these wonderful Euros and Pounds and German Marks to prove to you that I can afford for you to teach me Parkour!!!
SEE: I'm going to enjoy murdering you one day.
LII: Make it quick and painless; now teach me how to Parkour!

Me: Am I hearing this right?

[MisterNi]

Talking to my physics tutor about philosophy and life.

LII: So what does life really mean to you?
IEE: Well... I don't really have a philosophy on life; I kind of just live knowing I'll grow older, have a family watch my kids grow up then die of old age.
LII: So you're an existentialist?
IEE: Sort of... I don't really like making myself conform to one ideal on life. Seems kind of stifling, you know?
LII: Yes, yes I know what you mean; but some of us need order and not chaos in our lives.
IEE: I understand; however what you consider to be chaos I consider to be the natural way of life. How humans like us have always lived.
LII: I see... yes, I understand.
IEE: Yeah, since the dawn of time.