Mindes type

[Creepy-Cyclops]

Do with it what you will, I don't even know if I feel like debating it, but I thought i'd post it here incase it got lost in some other discussion elsewhere.

http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...tml#post650666

This mainly part, Re Minde concerning her type:

"OK, i'll cut to something i've been thinking about recently.

[i]This sort of way of talking that you have, I see it a lot: guilt tripping and controlling those who you want silenced. I think what it comes down to is that I see you more and more as using Fi in a way that moves into creative Se. Of course that's not to say only ISFj's can behave like that, but they sure are better at it than other types. Compare with INXj's, they are much more naive and not as quick to play intricate power games. They give a sense of genuines as they don't have creative Se and the way it can 'play' things. I suppose as Gilly put it, you've got 'balls'. So, I personally can't be bothered someone who displays those qualities, I don't enjoy that sort of game, and if you don't think you should be moderator and don't become one then i'll be glad."

I think she's ISFj, maybe i'll debate it or not, or indeed elaborate further, maybe others will, but it's food for thought for others to at least consider, as unfortunately, from what I can tell, she's regarded in some circles as a 'textbook' INFj.

Edit: Well there it is, some obligatory type thread or other, I think second one i've created about someone in this sub forum, but I do think she is ISFj and maybe others would like to think about it themselves considering the overall perspective. Talking over, heh.

[Beautiful sky]

She's not INFj, that's for sure. She does not make any static comments; plays up Se uses lots of visual-spacial skills, god, I could go on; her relationship with Mariella is a situatation where she tells her "you Misundertood me " in a relationship of Look-A-Like donesn't one partner bring the other to missed details as involved with the dominent function of the other?

She does not loose herself in Trivialities as I can very easily because of Ne in my ego black; she is not IEE because unlike Mariella, she does not expand possibilities and then when specifics change she does not mention it like Mariella does.

[Airman]

have I gone retarded or are you high, Maritsa? I couldn´t understand a word.

[Beautiful sky]

have I gone retarded or are you high, Maritsa? I couldn´t understand a word.

Sorry honey. I am babbel writing.

Gilly noticed that along with a combination of things, like visual-spacial abilities that Minde could actually be ISFj not INFj.

[Gilly]

Gilly noticed that along with a combination of things, like visual-spacial abilities that Minde could actually be ISFj not INFj.

Don't fucking stand on me or drag me into your crap.

[UDP]

I believe Minde is EII.
I believe she is EII-Fi subtype in socionics, 9w1 ennagram.

I believe how Maritsa is going about things is indicative more of a mental/emotional fixation, rather than an earnest attempt to understand what reality is; she creates a lot of untruths and slights to support her arguments; it's not particularly convincing. I've said more elsewhere, if you're curious for more of my opinions.


General comment:
If you want to demonstrate that you don't take Maritsa seriously, I have a suggestion:
simply state such in a post here,

and then discontinue posting in this thread.




PS: ehhh, but I realize this is a "general thread" about Minde's type. So I suppose to that end, sure, do what you want. But I see it as futile to actively disagree with Marita in the sense of back and forth debating ; that hasn't yielded any results. I'm all for stating your piece, but am advocating for a reduction in entertaining 'discussion' - that was the nature of my 'general comment'

[Beautiful sky]

Don't fucking stand on me or drag me into your crap.

Fine, don't speak to me that way either.

[Airman]

"She does not make any static comments; plays up Se uses lots of visual-spacial skills, god, I could go on; her relationship with Mariella is a situatation where she tells her "you Misundertood me " in a relationship of Look-A-Like donesn't one partner bring the other to missed details as involved with the dominent function of the other?"

SITUATATION... TELL ME WHAT YOU´RE TAKING HONEY WE´LL TAKE IT TOGETHER LOOKING AT THE CALIFORNIA BLUE SKIES.

[Beautiful sky]

"She does not make any static comments; plays up Se uses lots of visual-spacial skills, god, I could go on; her relationship with Mariella is a situatation where she tells her "you Misundertood me " in a relationship of Look-A-Like donesn't one partner bring the other to missed details as involved with the dominent function of the other?"

SITUATATION... TELL ME WHAT YOU´RE TAKING HONEY WE´LL TAKE IT TOGETHER LOOKING AT THE CALIFORNIA BLUE SKIES.

I am not on anything. I don't do drugs; I tried pot in college, but after one hit I went into anaphylactic shock and had to be administer CPR.

[Slacker]

So is this thread going to have Maritsa set up as the textbook EII to compare Minde to, because it looks like it's headed in that direction, and if it is the thread is useless.

I really only have a strong opinion on five or fewer people's types around here. I'm more about eliminating possible types than narrowing down to just one type. Like I feel strongly that Maritsa values Ti, so that makes me narrow down to a few types, but I don't have a strong opinion beyond that. I don't have a strong opinion about Minde's type either. The only people from the 16 types I have strong opinions on are Bionicgoat, myself, I can't even immediately think of anyone else. So if I'm in the group supposedly using Minde as a "textbook EII" then you're wrong about that group. I guess that I eliminate a few possibilities as I see them, and then if people self-type within what I see, I generally go with the self-typing, but keep an open mind about it. She seems very much rational and introvered. She seems like an Fi valuer. If she sees herself as EII, then I'm inclined to believe her. But that's why I stay out of a lot of typing therads. Too much Ne. "Well, I can see that, and on the other hand I can see that too . . .. "

She seems maybe like she bows out of debates more than ESIs generally do. ESIs generally like to keep arguments going more, from what I've seen. I know she and I have argued in the past, but I don't remember the specifics, what about and how it all went. I just remember that there have been some arguments. That's my spotty memory again.

[Beautiful sky]

Filatova on EII:

" The EII seeks true values in life and finds meaning in existence through harmony in her relations with other people. She particularly values high spirituality and high morals. As far back as youth the EII uses her imagination to form a certain moral ideal, which she then attempts to reach. At the foundation of this function frequently is found the development of a feeling of duty. Thus the smallest divergence in behaviour away from the ideal is dealt with severely, internally. This tendency towards self-perfection can itself become a tyrant. This tyranny of duty, in its extreme manifestations, can lead the EII to develop contempt for herself. It can also lead her to blame others when their behaviour fails to correspond with said representation of decency. This sort of maximization, which frequently characterizes itself in the EII’s youth can lead to confrontation with her contemporaries. Such confrontations are difficult tests, which weigh heavily upon her.

Since the moral norms she considers compulsory tend to be extremely high and difficult to live up to she may often respond by gradually increasing the permanent feeling of guilt, which stems from all her misdeeds. With difficulty she deposits herself towards these laws. She considers every failure in her life to be punishment for her inadvertence. This sense of guilt can accompany the EII throughout their entire life.

The accumulation of materials values and career success never supercede the EII’s goal of existence: to find their purpose, to make a life before it passes them by, to realize their talents. For their moral ideal they are willing to go to the “executioner’s bloc”. In the psychologically extreme situation they stick to their ideal. However, in ordinary situations EII prefers to leave states of conflict, assuming that kindness and decency are the best ways of deciding any misunderstandings.
"

She doesn't do this at all. I stick to my ideals like a gun to my head. I am so rigid with regards to my ideals it's not even funny and Minde herself has pointed out to several people that I am rigid and nonconforming, which is fine with me because that's how I am (EII).

[Creepy-Cyclops]

I'm going to make this post for the sake of objectivity, maybe others could contribute to it if they see something which may be relevant.

I think she is definitely introverted imo, seems quite focused on the 'subject' when she discusses her views. And I do feel 'Fi' from her, just tempered not with Ne (which doesn't mean i'm saying i'm SLI or anything, in this context it's probably irrelevant, just that I see introversion and a rationality of ethics which fits for dominant introverted function, ie Fi) but the second function is Se imo.

I suppose some might say it is strong Fi sub type which can 'make' her ISFj every so often, but sub type is more amibiguous than actual type.

She's not INFj, that's for sure. She does not make any static comments; plays up Se uses lots of visual-spacial skills, god, I could go on; her relationship with Mariella is a situatation where she tells her "you Misundertood me " in a relationship of Look-A-Like donesn't one partner bring the other to missed details as involved with the dominent function of the other?

I'm reluctant to bring inter-type relations in such a manner at least at this stage, i'll think about it.

She does not loose herself in Trivialities as I can very easily because of Ne in my ego black;

Possibly.

she is not IEE because unlike Mariella, she does not expand possibilities and then when specifics change she does not mention it like Mariella does.

Yeah, I don't think IEE for a few reasons anyway.

Re first part of post, introverted seems like it, also it seems it's easier to get second position confused than first position function, and even overall introversion, when one has at least some understanding of themselves and what introversion is.

I don't have a problem with Minde being EII, but I see the point you make here. Also, we have only one ESI, I'm sure we could use another. What do you want for her?

Yeah, except she uses creative Se. I suppose the 'games' being mentioned, Diana who's left, although ended up typing herself as LSI, there was a thread before she departed for a while where the sort of 'gaming' was called out, I think Minde has a lot more 'feeling' than Diana in terms of inter-personal relationship understanding, even ability to utilise, so defo stronger Fi than Diana.

I appreciate you seeing my point, I think you can have a tendency for objectivity which is good. We don't seem to have any other ESI's to compare to, so even although that can be flawed in itself - comparing in such a manner, i've put down some other thoughts on the matter for now, for better or worse.

[Creepy-Cyclops]

So is this thread going to have Maritsa set up as the textbook EII to compare Minde to, because it looks like it's headed in that direction, and if it is the thread is useless.

We don't seem to have any other ESI's to compare to, so even although that can be flawed in itself - comparing in such a manner

Although I made it later but it's relevant.

I don't expect that to be the direction of the thread at least from my perspective, dunno about others though.

She seems maybe like she bows out of debates more than ESIs generally do. ESIs generally like to keep arguments going more, from what I've seen. I know she and I have argued in the past, but I don't remember the specifics, what about and how it all went. I just remember that there have been some arguments. That's my spotty memory again.

No probs.

[Aiss]

I don't have a problem with Minde being EII, but I see the point you make here. Also, we have only one ESI, I'm sure we could use another. What do you want for her?

She's not INFj, that's for sure. She does not make any static comments; plays up Se uses lots of visual-spacial skills, god, I could go on; her relationship with Mariella is a situatation where she tells her "you Misundertood me " in a relationship of Look-A-Like donesn't one partner bring the other to missed details as involved with the dominent function of the other?

Se is static as well. You know, you don't have to try and memorize all these details. They would make sense if you knew the theory rather than just throwing mentions of random elements around.

[Beautiful sky]

I don't have a problem with Minde being EII, but I see the point you make here. Also, we have only one ESI, I'm sure we could use another. What do you want for her?



Se is static as well. You know, you don't have to try and memorize all these details. They would make sense if you knew the theory rather than just throwing mentions of random elements around.

Well, what reasoning can you provide for her being ESI?
Both Cyclops and I don't notice Ne in Minde.

[Marie84]

Firstly, you're reading motives into Mindes behavior based on nothing but your own presumptions of her, i.e "Minde is not naive/playing powergames/isn't genuine/ballsy, etc"
Second, Fi+Ne doesn't equate to not pointing out ethical and relational errors that people make, that's Fi in general. What Fi+Ne has difficulties doing is forcing someone to comply, make commands and state absolutists

Fi-> subjective relationships between objects: feelings of attraction and repulsion, like and dislike, need and antipathy; morals, subjective judgments

Fi or Ti dominant in conjunction with an Se PoLR:

Se PoLR:
"He is able to moralize and instruct others about what they should do and why, but he is not prepared for others' active resistance or refusal to do as he says. In his mind, this would require him to put aside reason and good feelings and simply make the other person do what is necessary. This is extremely difficult, if not impossible, for him to do."

And how this benefits LSE's:

"Controlling can't stand discussion on personal matter and furthermore discussing relationship problems. Due to this he is inclined to do hasty conclusions and frequently commits ethical slips which complicates his relationships with people surrounding him. Lack of patience and self-control sometimes makes him sharp and tactless, he doesn't have enough not only diplomacy but also self-criticism. Due to this he needs the patience and perseverance of the Humanist who will tactfully and consistently re-educates his dual. Humanist acts not only as an educator but constantly he acts on the conscience of Controlling who is sufficiently sensitive and high moral principles are not alien to him."
source

And how this works in opposition to SLE's. I won't post the whole article, too long, but here's the link to Fi in SLE-> Stratievskaya SLE - Wikisocion
For those who thought TLDR, it basically states that SLE's do not like having their behavior evaluated or/and their ethical errors pointed out (PoLR hit). Compare to the LSE description

[/]