Martisa and EII

[Suz]

And there goes Maritsa's random "oh look a bunny!" post.

[Suz]

lmaocopter

I am also considering EIE as well as IEI. I guess.

For Maritsa?

My final opinion on this matter is, she's currently untypeable by anyone here due to her state of mind reflecting untreated bipolar disorder. There are clear signs of manic behavior reflected in what she says, the kinds of posts she makes, the frequency of her posts, her reaction to others, her unwarranted overconfidence in her typings and belief that she is the master of typing and should not be questioned. That's all consistent with the manic phase of bipolar.

[DividedsGhost]

Since everyone has decided anyone other than Maritsa should determine her type (because she wouldn't know better than herself given the appropriate knowledge of socionics), let's have a type poll! Go democracy.

Get an LII to give their words of approval on the poll and Maritsa will finally have her type.

[Jarno]

You people know little about EII. Even a glance to her photo already confirms EII.

[Creepy-Cyclops]

You people know little about EII. Even a glance to her photo already confirms EII.

You sound like Maritsa, you keep saying she's EII, and that everyone else knows jack about EII, yet you seem to not realise that all you are doing is stating an opinion.

Your opinion is worth less than everyone else's because you are unable to provide any reasons to back it up, so I suggest you get off your high horse and stop (unreasonably) looking down on everyone else.

[Suz]

You sound like Maritsa, you keep saying she's EII, and that everyone else knows jack about EII, yet you seem to not realise that all you are doing is stating an opinion.

Your opinion is worth less than everyone else's because you are unable to provide any reasons to back it up, so I suggest you get off your high horse and stop (unreasonably) looking down on everyone else.

photo VI is not everything and should not solely be relied upon for typing.

[Jarno]

Your opinion is worth less than everyone else's because you are unable to provide any reasons to back it up,

If you want an explanation of her type using IM elements then I can't. She acts like someone who's on a mission, who has a cause. That kind of behaviour or life direction is quite stereotypical for an EII. Next to that I just can't find or see anything that points to IEI. She doesn't resemble any IEI on this forum. It's just the whole big picture. It's hard to explain, but that has a cause. Think about how hard it is to explain what exactly it is, that makes you conclude that someone is a female by just looking for example at her face. Everybody can recognize a woman, but when you have to pinpoint why you think it is a woman, you start stumbling a bit about jaw lines, hair volume, or shape of the lips. You cannot explain everything, so if my conclusion sounds more like just an opinion it might be wiser than giving some stumbling arguments.

[krieger]

This is where Jarno gets the idea that INFjs are people on a mission, which have a cause:

INFJ Profile

[Absurd]

Yes, that's right. She types using MBTI descriptions. Nothing new. Knew it since her first visit. That way she puts you into a different/opposing quadra. I'm not entirely sure whether she does it on purpose or from the lack of knowledge concerning socionics.

Either way, been typed SLI, SLE and IEI by her alone. If she keeps it up, she's going to do better than the forum in typing me. Of course, there still are people who typed me correctly - you know who you are.

EDIT: Nice avatar, labcoat. You enlightened yourself, I see.

[Jarno]

This is where Jarno gets the idea that INFjs are people on a mission, which have a cause:

INFJ Profile

no i didn't. I don't like that site. I just wanted to highlight some stereotypes to give somewhat of an explanation.

But again, when I don't use IM it doesn't count it seems...

[Creepy-cinq]

If you want an explanation of her type using IM elements then I can't. She acts like someone who's on a mission, who has a cause. That kind of behaviour or life direction is quite stereotypical for an EII. Next to that I just can't find or see anything that points to IEI. She doesn't resemble any IEI on this forum. It's just the whole big picture. It's hard to explain, but that has a cause.

Pinocchio is on a mission. Does this make him EII? I believed at first she was EII for the same reason. However, she has indicated in many instances, her motives are not strictly to set us straight on the right methods because she ethically cares - she would like to be recognized as 'the guru' with special knowledge to the point where she desires to submit members to what she thinks is right. In fact, her behaviour at times is aggressive. This agenda is more about power/territory, and also pride.

Also, see photos of ENFjs vs INFjs. I'm not entirely convinced of V.I. methods. Take what you will. However, in what photos Maritsa shares, she V.I.s more as ENFj. She does not appear to have the ascetic/taciturn expression on her face. Look at her eyes and her smile - it seems obvious IMO that she shares more expression. At minimum, I would not classify it as ascetic.

Read the descriptions ENFj vs INFj. Strictly based on her behaviour and motives here on 16types, I would say she leans towards ENFj. Granted, she is more than what she shares here.

Think about how hard it is to explain what exactly it is, that makes you conclude that someone is a female by just looking for example at her face. Everybody can recognize a woman, but when you have to pinpoint why you think it is a woman, you start stumbling a bit about jaw lines, hair volume, or shape of the lips. You cannot explain everything, so if my conclusion sounds more like just an opinion it might be wiser than giving some stumbling arguments.

You've stated several times your opinion, so, it's not surprising members are now asking for an explanation. I think it's justified. You might have been better off just stating your opinion once.

[Jarno]

You might have been better off just stating your opinion once.

Yes I think so too...

[Creepy-Cyclops]

Yes I think so too...

This is what I said to you from the start, state your opinion without insulting anyone.

Instead, not only this, but you then lied about having explained it (see one of your earlier posts), then when you do post an explanation, it happens to be one of the worst explanations of someones type i've ever seen.

Sorry to go on at you Jarno, I guess your arrogance got on my nerves, also perhaps you'll stop being so angry with people here when you see it in more perspective (maybe you do now).

[Creepy-Cyclops]

Oh really...
That is just your opinion. People have trouble picking my type by V.I. photos alone. A video gives away far more and as yet Maritsa has not posted one. She just leads us to links with photos like this:

Are they the eyes of Rasputin?

[Beautiful sky]

Oh really...
That is just your opinion. People have trouble picking my type by V.I. photos alone. A video gives away far more and as yet Maritsa has not posted one. She just leads us to links with photos like this:

Did you look at the photo of Penelope cruz's eyes and compare them to yours? I don't wish to be typed; I have been already, and I am INFj

[The Greeter]

... Jarno gets the idea that INFjs are people on a mission, which have a cause...

I find this strange. People on a mission seems more stereotypical of ENFjs and maybe ENTjs than INFjs. Not to say INFjs are not themselves driven, but it does not tend to manifest externally so explicitly as the aformentioned types.

Think about how hard it is to explain what exactly it is, that makes you conclude that someone is a female by just looking for example at her face. Everybody can recognize a woman, but when you have to pinpoint why you think it is a woman, you start stumbling a bit about jaw lines, hair volume, or shape of the lips. You cannot explain everything, so if my conclusion sounds more like just an opinion it might be wiser than giving some stumbling arguments.

I think this is a false analogy. The conceptual image of a "female human" is tied down to physical characteristics that we know to be true with exceptions in ambiguous cases. The conceptual image of a certain type is itself based on a conceptual idea, method, and construction that is yet to be determined empirically true.

[krieger]

People on a mission seems more stereotypical of ENFjs and maybe ENTjs than INFjs.

I agree. INFjs are focussed ideological "workers", but they operate in more of a private, local sphere. For a long time after my grandmother fell ill (heart problems), my INFj mother spent 50% of all her time during the evenings phoning members of my family about the situation around her illness. The theme of devotion is there, but it isn't something that manifests on a large scale societal scene. It's often restricted to family issues.

I can't bear the thought of the kind of confusion maritsa would spread in the same situation. The comparison just instantly and horribly fails.

[Jarno]

An EIE would have reacted way more fierce and emotional to attacks. Maritsa is more loyal to her cause and keeps seeing people as good. She's seems more of a loner too. The difference is obvious.

[Slacker]

An EIE would have reacted way more fierce and emotional to attacks. Maritsa is more loyal to her cause and keeps seeing people as good. She's seems more of a loner too. The difference is obvious.

She's been pretty darn fierce and emotional. Have you been following her threads? The Delta Lounge thread?

[Brilliand]

An EIE would have reacted way more fierce and emotional to attacks. Maritsa is more loyal to her cause and keeps seeing people as good. She's seems more of a loner too. The difference is obvious.

"Seeing people as good" happens to be an integral part of her cause. It isn't so much that she sees people as good as that she has to remain consistent with her claim that she sees people as good.

[Aiss]

"Seeing people as good" happens to be an integral part of her cause. It isn't so much that she sees people as good as that she has to remain consistent with her claim that she sees people as good.

Also, she forgets about that consistency at times.

[Slacker]

She's been pretty darn fierce and emotional. Have you been following her threads? The Delta Lounge thread?

Hmm I'm not sure that's one of them. Where was she posting ARRRGGGGGH in a huge font size in bold type and that kind of thing? She was flipping out and going nutso on Minde. maybe Minde's type thread?

[Aiss]

Hmm I'm not sure that's one of them. Where was she posting ARRRGGGGGH in a huge font size in bold type and that kind of thing? She was flipping out and going nutso on Minde. maybe Minde's type thread?

Not sure where what you speak of happened, but if you're looking for a huge font size, this very thread is a way to go.

[crazedrat]

I think this is a false analogy. The conceptual image of a "female human" is tied down to physical characteristics that we know to be true with exceptions in ambiguous cases. The conceptual image of a certain type is itself based on a conceptual idea, method, and construction that is yet to be determined empirically true.

The analogy works fine.

[somavision]

"Seeing people as good" happens to be an integral part of her cause. It isn't so much that she sees people as good as that she has to remain consistent with her claim that she sees people as good.

This basically sums up why I think you are one of the more insightful members of this forum.

[Brilliand]

The analogy works fine.

Yes, but it doesn't support Jarno's point. Being more certain of whether a given human is female actually does come down to increasingly precise anatomical considerations - most of which would be socially unacceptable to test, but you can always ask the person whether he/she is female (which is rude, but marginally acceptable).

Jarno's view reminds me of Steve's gestalts... it's a valid way to look at things (nicely efficient), but doesn't override the more precise methods.

[The Greeter]

The analogy works fine.

The analogy works on a compounded level, but it is fundamentally flawed.

Edit: Of course, all analogies are technically fundamentally flawed, so for this case I mean it is fundamentally flawed with respect to analogy creation and its subsequent validity.

[krieger]

Jarno's view reminds me of Steve's gestalts... it's a valid way to look at things (nicely efficient), but doesn't override the more precise methods.

It's stopped dead in it's tracks when two persons both use it but get different results. This tends to be the rule rather than the exception.

[Beautiful sky]

Hmm I'm not sure that's one of them. Where was she posting ARRRGGGGGH in a huge font size in bold type and that kind of thing? She was flipping out and going nutso on Minde. maybe Minde's type thread?

Because Minde is dishonest and if you know or have read anything on Socioniko about INFj you can see that this is a big button for the INFj character.

[Slacker]

Because Minde is dishonest and if you know or have read anything on Socioniko about INFj you can see that this is a big button for the INFj character.

Minde is not dishonest. You are reading in motivations that don't exist. And you're going completely crazy over it.

[Suz]

Because Minde is dishonest and if you know or have read anything on Socioniko about INFj you can see that this is a big button for the INFj character.

Minde isn't dishonest!!

[Beautiful sky]

Minde isn't dishonest!!

By saying you are one thing when you are not is dishonesty. It's also very deceitful.

[somavision]

Because Minde is dishonest and if you know or have read anything on Socioniko about INFj you can see that this is a big button for the INFj character.

Do you recall that some time ago you dismissed Socioniko, as it contradicted your views on Filatova's supposed typing method?

Can you explain why you are now referencing it as a reliable source?

[Beautiful sky]

Do you recall that some time ago you dismissed Socioniko contradicted your views on filatova's typing method?

Can you explain now why you are referencing it as a reliable source?

I only like Filatova's method.

[somavision]

I only like Filatova's method.

Are you referring to a VI method?

[Beautiful sky]

Are you referring to a VI method?

Filatova is EII and I get her. I understand her view on types, VI and everything. I just get her.

[somavision]

Filatova is EII and I get her. I understand her view on types, VI and everything. I just get her.

Are you going to answer my questions Maritsa?

[Beautiful sky]

Are you going to answer my questions Maritsa?

I have never contradicted Filatova's typing method. I love it. I have always pointed to it as a reliable source; the only thing I don't like is that the translation can be modernized and improved; some words don't mean the same thing as they used to like Kinky.

[somavision]

I have never contradicted Filatova's typing method. I love it. I have always pointed to it as a reliable source; the only thing I don't like is that the translation can be modernized and improved; some words don't mean the same thing as they used to like Kinky.

Maritsa, I did not state that you contradicted Filatova's typing method. I am stating that Socioniko contradicts your views on Filatova's typing method.

So are you going to answer my questions?

[Beautiful sky]

Maritsa, I did not state that you contradicted Filatova's typing method. I am stating that Socioniko contradicts your views on Filatova's typing method.

So are you going to answer my questions?

I don't contradict her method;