Idk..I've never met an IEE who comes off (and please don't take this the wrong way, i'll come back and edit when i think of a better word), as "needy" as you do. BUT, that could just be because a lot of times it seems like you ask people's opinions on your type in a lot of threads? the way you come off online, you do remind me of a few ESEs I know IRL; however I don't know you IRL so take it with a grain of salt.
maybe make another typing thread if you want to know how others type you?
I've done this at work functions-- I stay 45 minutes, say hi to a few of the people I genuinely like, talk to a few others, probably sit on my phone for a little bit, looking up e-mails/random shit. then leave. But I've gotten to the point that I've stopped going to these. I live 30 minutes from work anyways, it's always a hassle. I love deltas. I've made a few more friends at work and have the best days when this SLI person is there, and of course when the 4 or so SEEs are there too.
Um, you do realize that i'm not the one who brought up the issue of my type here... Rob did, and i just want to know what it is about me that makes him so "adamant" in saying i'm ESE. If someone can give me a good reason(s) and educate me as to what is ESE about me, I would love to learn.
Also, even though my type has been somewhat hotly contested by some, in some threads, you dont see me changing my type based on what people say though, do you? How is that "needy"? What I seek in such discussions is a good valid reason... and so far it's been really weak ones, like my username choice or me refusing to answer personal questions by an incognito creepy niffweed thinking the reason for my refusal was that he wasn't including himself in the "group" . Sorry, but those empty reasons aren't going to change my mind from a type that i identify with a great deal and my interpersonal interactions and strengths seem to support.
Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx
So everyone knows I'm not a huge fan of agreeing with Maritsa, however I agree with what she said in this thread. My husband will say little things that he knows will upset me, and then as soon as he feels that tension between us, it's like he's tested our bond to each other and he's happy and everything is great. I don't know if he's testing how I'll react, or how he'll feel when I get upset. I suspect the later - I think he knows I'll get upset and wants to feel that emotion when I'm angry at him.
I also agree with what Galen said. There are whole subjects that are off limits for us unless we are alone. They are things we only talk about within the bounds of our relationship, and are not to be discussed elsewhere. And I don't mean sex or anything like that. We just have some private area for us. And he is much more open and emotional when it's just us than when there are other people around. He is different with just me.
It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.-Mark Twain
You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.
Rob strikes again, cool.
I can't remember if Rob thinks I'm IEE or not.
It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.-Mark Twain
You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.
You're SEE, Slacker.
LOL. How's my Ne?
It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.-Mark Twain
You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.
oh i wasn't referring to you giving any reasons, i know you didn't... i was referring to reasons people gave in past discussions of my type.. that to be honest whenever I brought up that topic was simply to appease people who were insisting and/or to make sure it's not me just mis-understanding socionics... It wasn't me being "needy"
Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx
Good for you Jessica. You are so much better off with your own company than BAD company. When the right one comes along, who you know is right, you will be available and not involved and/or totally messed up from trying to make it with the wrong one. Plus, you won't have wasted years pining, "Why don't I have someone?".
I have never doubted you are IEE. I do not think you are ESE at all. And I can explain that but I won't on the forum in order not to be unfair to ESEs since I have had some distinctly negative ESEs in my life, and I am focusing on those negatives in my mind right now. I am just seeing your lack of those negative traits unique to ESEs.
Anyway I have no doubt you are IEE like me.
Oh, and I think the reason you want to know anyone's opinion on your type is not because you question your type but simply due to your hidden agenda - a desire "to know"...
Why would i post it in this thread if he wasn't?
that's exactly it... thank you for understanding. And the reason isn't to contest or insist that i'm IEE either as some people take my such statements, but simply to enhance my knowledge. It has to be good reasons though, not trivial ones.. and so far people have given me very trivial reasons that really arent type related or wrong because they misinterpreted or misjudged me and that's just not convincing enough.
Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx
SLI value friendships and close relationships in general much more than what they show.
[] | NP | 3[6w5]8 so/sp | Type thread | My typing of forum members | Johari (Strengths) | Nohari (Weaknesses)
You know what? You're an individual, and that makes people nervous. And it's gonna keep making people nervous for the rest of your life. - Ole Golly from Harriet, the spy.
Yes, and sometimes what they show is quite opposite of how they want. It's strange but you have to see past their reactive moods and know that they do certain things because they love you, and because they feel comfortable being themselves around you, as awkward and unbecoming as this may seem; it's how they show that you're special and close enough to them for them to be that way around you and they are not so "aggressive" and awkward around strangers.
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Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
I'm not sure about Fi's hidden agenda, but I can describe what is like for me. It sort of starts with Fe. When someone I know and trust really well is hurt or upset and wants to talk, I'm all ears. I will listen and try to keep a calm atmosphere and see if there is anything I can do for that person. I am very sympathetic in those cases and try to soothe. Now if it is someone I don't know well or have known for only a short time I will try to lend an ear, but it is very difficult for me to really give a shit. I will try to be appropriate and offer some help, but not in the same sense as if it is one of my few close ones. I just can't give that kind of attention to someone I don't or hardly know. Now if it is something easily relatable or really awful,then maybe I will make a serious attempt to tune in and help; like the loss of a loved one or something similar. But if a stranger started talking to me about all their problems, I just couldn't care less. I would try to walk away at the right moment. It would probably take numerous encounters to develop trust and a familiarity with that person for me to feel comfortable enough to give them my time. I think it comes down to time. If my best friend needed to talk I would immediately set aside time for him. If I couldn't immediately, then as soon as I could. I would then be able to be there for my friend. With a stranger, it just becomes an inconvenience. I am most likely in the middle of something else, maybe a project, a thought, or just some relaxation. All that feeling will like pop whatever vibe I have going on at the time and make me feel uneasy.
Now Fi is similar in that I tend to view other people as having a field or a vibe too and I don't want to disrupt that. As a result, I rarely will try to talk to someone about my feelings. I don't want to inconvenience them. I'm sure they don't want to hear about my problems, so I usually try to ignore my feelings. Over time, if I don't talk about them they can come out at the wrong time and perhaps even to the wrong person; someone I normally wouldn't confide in. This can be extremely embarrassing to me and I almost always come to regret it. It just feels really wrong. Feelings, generally are hard for me to handle in huge quantities; small doses only.
Now I read earlier in the thread, it is an old one I see, that some SLI's can try to tease feelings out of someone. I do sometimes if I sense that someone is telling me one thing, but they seem to not want to share what they are really feeling, which makes me want to know even more. I guess I can pick up on visual cues and body language fairly easily. I can sort of sense that someone is not telling me something. But, I've come to learn as I've matured to just let things like that go, for the most part. Eventually, the person will talk about whatever it is when they're ready. I don't like forcing people into things.
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Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
I typed one of the billioniares that I sometimes guard as SLI. He is very honorable, gentle, and an anchor to the community. He gives hundreds of millions of dollars to charity. Now that is an Fi hidden agenda!
Socionics -
the16types.info
for a great example of Fi-HA, watch the drama Brain
Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx
@siuntal's whole old post #7 here is interesting and helpful to reread. I already "liked" it before and can't again.
This exactly happened with SLI and I yesterday on the phone. Somehow we touched on this topic, I think when I was telling her about my visit with my EII sis-in-law that day. He had asked me what we talked about, and then for some related reason he asked me, "What did you say to your ex when you found out about the affair? How did that go?"
Since we usually talk about the here and now and not ancient history, I jumped on this, forgetting that SLIs are "Askers" and frequently "ask" just to make conversation, not because they are dying to know the answer.
So that being a key time fraught with emotions for me, I retold the whole story beginning with how I found out and of course, including a full explanation of all the stuff about how I was feeling back then, leading up to the actual answer finally. Phew!
When I finished he said "Oh", or yawned or something. I laughed so hard at this inappropriate dud response, and said, "Am I boring you?" He quickly tried to cover himself saying, "Oh, I realized I already heard that." and I just giggled at his awkwardness (like he was wondering if there was something else he was supposed to say) and made sure he knew he wasn't in the hot seat over that. I know he loves me and his being disengaged when I was sharing something important (though ancient) doesn't change that or offend me...
Park's old post:
So I went to a large, party-like gathering the other night. I spent most of my time watching immature (mostly younger) people getting drunk, dancing and acting like obnoxious fools. A few of my acquaintances were there so I talked to them briefly, trying to pretend I felt neutral about the atmosphere which I hated and felt somewhat uncomfortable in. I was kinda bored, observing what's going on around me and not finding anything to enjoy or a way to blend in. (Not that I care to fit in too much, it just sucks feeling so distant sometimes; especially when you're supposed to enjoy yourself and celebrate). Thankfully some food was given to me, so my time wasn't completely wasted. Then I met an older gentleman who was slightly intoxicated but in the mood for storytelling. One story led to another, and I practically spent the rest of the night talking to him (although mostly listening/asking) about a million different things. He took me on a journey through his life, career and so on, and even though his breath and tempo were getting worse and worse as he sipped on his alcohol, I retained my position of a friendly interlocutor because there was nothing else to do, the guy was good company and had some cool stories to tell. I would have left the place earlier (actually probably wouldn't have gone in the first place) but I was invited and kind of in a role of an escort, so I had to be there.
[/pointless post] :\
@Park, I totally relate to your party story. I could see my SLI brother and imagine his slight, mostly hidden discomfort and the aura/expressions about him where he would behave feeling exactly the same in such a situation. You talked to the old gentlemen because he offered a reasonable distraction/oasis from the discomfort of being at the party you woudl rather just leave (but you were willing to do the right thing, and just stay).
I totally get Applejack's response. We IEEs sense out psychological discomfort in others and since we don't have a need/interest to indulge in whatever Fe is happening at the gathering we prefer you. Its much more intriguing and interesting for us to go over to you and try to make that discomfort we sense in you all better. We would engage in any old conversation with you for the reward of seeing you relax and be yourself whole talking, seeing the discomfort melt away. Its like solving a mystery - what is interesting to this person? (We think: "Since this party is not that big a deal to me, and that guy is not interested in the party, either, so, he is also "above" this fray, so, he must other interesting things about him, so, let's find out.")
Other people like that old gentlemen that you talked to you seek you out because they are dying for a listener and scope you out as just that.
And Park, the most recent time I remember seeing my SLI brother feeling just as you described (my SLI brother and I never spoke of this) was when my Dad died. My three brothers were all here from their 3 different states where they live now, and my oldest and youngest brothers, LSI and/or LIE (I haven't figured out how to distinguish those yet; they might be the same type), were in their element taking care of all the funeral, reception, legal etc. details and even having everyone fed. It was a "new" kind of thing to see because those two are the furthest apart in age and had little in common while we were growing up, and now they were such a seamless team. And their efforts were a great relief to me because I was immobilized with emotional and physical exhaustion from being there with Dad in the last months. Those two were really thriving on these tasks; they were super animated and efficient and working as a real crack team talking back and forth to make sure all details were very efficiently and very well and very thoroughly taken care of. I certainly felt well-taken care of. My SLI brother was there and had this slightly awkward presence that I could feel. Like he did not know how to jump in and take part in what they were doing since really no one could have - they really didn't seem to need a hand from anyone, they had it all under control. Those two brothers maybe are Identical I guess.
Any insight on what SLI may have been feeling that day?
Too little info. The possibilities are endless... and personal. Sorrow, melancholy, tension, discomfort, are some general things that I could imagine. But it depends on circumstances and individuals involved. Whatever he was feeling, could've been much stronger or different than it appeared. Reading SLI's emotions can be very misleading, unless the SLI likes you and you're very patient. Then you can ask him/her and he/she will talk to you about it.
Last edited by Park; 07-08-2013 at 03:09 AM.
“Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”
Originally Posted by Gilly
And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and gone tomorrow, won't he more surely care for you?- Matthew 6:30
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Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
No one has spotted me, yet.
And I was just going to post another recent story, but decided to delete it after reading what I wrote a few times. Same plot, basically, only this time there wasn't an old man, but a huge LCD TV in an empty lounge of a hotel lobby, emitting some history channel documentary. Sucks to be me. I wish there was another person resenting the loud and boring gala full of intoxicated fools moving their drunk bodies and bumping into each other, so I can have a partner in crime and go do fun and crazy stuff with. Or just take a walk outside the hotel around midnight and laugh at people making fools of themselves at the party. We could have watched the stars, or count the rooms by counting the windows from outside the hotel, or talk about the absurdity of things while strolling or playing board games. But no, everyone there had to attend that stupid party and find their place inside this ridiculously dull and homogenous idea of "group-fun" they were presenting, dominated by forced exuberance and shallow merriment I couldn't even force myself to pretend to enjoy. So, as usual, I ended up amusing myself by myself.
Last edited by Park; 07-08-2013 at 08:50 PM.
“Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”
Originally Posted by Gilly
I've noticed something interesting I would like comments on. Similar to how Fe HA prods Fe egos for Fe by doing and saying things to get an emotional reaction out of people, I have observed what I believe to be Fi HA prodding to see if they can 'talk openly' with someone by throwing out a personal statement and seeing how that goes over - perhaps to see if the other person will grab on to it an expand and show interest (or to see if the other person will be comfortable talking personally)? I also notice that once you show them that you are interested in them and demonstrate a sense of emotional understanding, they do a 180 in terms of what they share. It's almost like you can see walls coming down, or sometimes even a dam breaking and and all these personal feelings/frustrations/etc come flooding out. In the intermediate stages of friendship it's particularly interesting because of the relationship not being firmly established, it can lead to what I see as them opening and closing up in a more obvious way than some other types would.
<Crispy> what subt doesnt understand is that a healthy reaction to "FUCK YOU" is and not
That interesting. In my SLI relationship, it took a long time (in my view) for SLI to open up about his feelings and other personal things making me wonder at the time how much woudl come out when it did (like if it wouldn't be much). But once he did feel safe sharing he really did a 180 and shares a lot. Yes, like a dam breaking. And its like precious gold to me since he doesn't share it with just anyone.
Ah! And an IEE would enjoy those things with you! And its a gift and a cross that you know what you want.
But there might have been an IEE in there but you won't know unless you find some SLI way to insert yourself in the fray, but not too much so its not unbearable. Maybe you need to occupy yourself with something to do? Like pour drinks for people at the punch table? Any way, just so you can be somehow present and just be your own self.
I pray you meet an IEE. Its not good for a man to be alone, IMHO. But I truly believe that your aloneness now is something to be thankful for because its a true gift to your future relationship. Both my SLI and I had much aloneness and loneliness before we got together - years, actually - and was a key foundation that created a gift of great richness we enjoy now. I am remembering what Kahlil Gibran said of your well of sorrow being the selfsame well that will contain your joy, and as deep as you well of sorrow is that is how deep your well of joy will be. Its true.
Even though an IEE can join into that party stuff, and does, its not where she loves to be. Your SLI-gift of being completely present with the one you are with is a true and precious gift, of particular value to an IEE, who doesn't know to go looking for it. Duals usually don't recognize each other at first and don't realize the fullness of the potential of their relationship but you have the inside info to know that you are in fact the best thing for her. IEEs often have a wide range of choices in dating, and don't have a clue how to prioritize. I remember thinking I didnt know what was best for me, but that any relationship could be made to work, so just pick one, practically any one. Maybe true that can all be made to work, but I do not now think that all have the same potential.
I was thinking I only dated E types in college (sometime back for me since I am older than a lot of others here) since I was one to wait for the guy to approach me, but lately, I am remembering there is one SLI I dated back in college, and it was very special while it lasted. A sweet and real connection, rather deep, like the comfort of "best friends" right after we met. I still have some of his letters somewhere. I remember much walking and talking around the college grounds, this was a community college and we went out a bit to find the pretty parts of this large remote new campus, and just completely enjoying his presence. We naturally sought time apart from everyone. Then at his home we'd drive to the nearby lake shore and walked and talked there. And such embraces! One in particular, one warm summer evening in his room at his family home, a the door to his room open and his sister down the hall, and the song, "You are my Shining Star" came on and he pulled me toward him and we danced slow. Magical. That song now, when I rarely hear it, brings up that warm remembrance.
This lovely comfortable relationship-start ended prematurely because of unusual timing circumstances and a bit of my stubborn pride. And of course both of our ignorance's as to what great potential we had, not knowing of Duality.
But I am telling you so you know how we met, a maybe useful story for a meeting of a SLI/IEE Dual. I met him in the student govt crowd, that socialized together a lot, many of them more raucous and Fe than me. I had just been elected and was a complete newbie, having never done anything like that before. He was finishing his year in that service and advised me so kindly and intelligently as I had many questions; that's how we met. I particularly remember in a room full of people, he would see me and look at me across the room like I was the only one there. Like only SLI can, and it drew me in. I felt so valued. So remember, as a SLI, you have that, and you can do that. Other types have their ways of grabbing her attention, and they do, but there is something about the subtle and deliberate way of a SLI that is more memorable than any other.
It's there.
That is all I am obliged to disclose at this moment in time.