Am I an unhealthy LII?

[Zed]

Two apologies, first, if I'm asking too many newbie questions, I am in the process of reading the linked articles. Secondly, I'm sorry for being so extraordinarily self-absorbed, but it is the sick who need doctors.

I'm trying to figure out what exactly is going on inside my head. I understand from reading other threads on this forum, that a function that is too strong, or too weak makes an "unhealthy" psyche.

The current situation: procrastination. I ignore very important tasks until the very last minute. I write essays for Varsity the morning they must be handed in. Usually, whenever I have a list of things to do on a particular day, I spend the entire day thinking about the best way to go about doing those things, and then I revise the plan, over and over, and never get to work. I guess this is the result of overused Ti killing off my Se .

Then there are the social aspects. Example : I usually don't greet people, because I don't know what the etiquette is, when to greet, and when not to? I've never spoken to this person before, so do I do it now or not? Even if I decide to greet, I then have to will myself to do it, and most often fail. Can I blame this on weak Fi and Se ? Or is it just because I need to seriously get out more?

I need to take more showers, and not forget to brush my teeth.

My room is an epic mess.

I was normal... well, almost normal a few years ago, though. Here is what I think happened, in light of the new ideas I've come across on this forum. I was quite heavily infatuated with an ESE girl. I was rejected by her, but I guess being the only Fe-ESE girl I've ever gotten to know I really found it hard to forget her. I would sit around for hours, trying to figure a way out of the situation, how to win her over, why I was different from the jocks she would date... argh! This was the aim of my life for a year and a half. Excessive use of Ti?

Perhaps my Se weakened way too much during this time?

My mother is an INFj. Could her strong Fi coupled with the fact that I have a rather large extended family, which meant a whole lot of having to be polite and mannered growing up, have anything to do with the fact that Fi causes me so much stress?

Lastly, I make use of excessive smileys on web forums. Does part of me think being a little ESE is going to help me socially?

If you can help me, I will be greatly indebted to you.

[OnePiece]

You're a healthy ILI.

[Zed]

You're a healthy ILI.

LOL, no. I can imagine why you would think so, but you are wrong.

[ArchonAlarion]

You can be an LII and also unhealthy, but socionics isn't a self-actualization theory imo.

I think you are likely LII though.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

Removed at User Request

[Zed]

Did you consider ILE so far?

Well done, you were the first to suspect Ne had some role to play in this. I read the ILE description, and I was quite stunned - I could relate to many of the quirks of the ILE, but after reading tuturututu's post, I now understand why I have all of a sudden begun to take on ILE-like behaviours. Reading the ILE description helped me understand how Ne manifests itself.

They cannot logically explain their ideas as they are always intuitive and vague.

A recent thing with me, been this way the last couple of years. I should have thought up a better thread title - I am certain I am an LII, my question was about my mental "health".

This is the result of overused Ne killing off your productivity. I can totally relate to this. The best cure to it is to just go out and do your thing. You might as well forget what you were thinking about the best way to go about doing those things and act on a whim instead. You'll surprise yourself and perhaps your surroundings by the produced results

You are awesome.

Do you really need to greet them? If you feel you do need to and don't do it after all then the feeling of guilt is inevitable. I can totally relate to not greeting people, however I feel no guilt because I don't feel that I'm supposed to greet them or something.
Do you need to seriously get out more? I think you know the answer. What's the worth of it? What's your goal?

You are awesome. I could probably recycle your reasoning concerning greeting and use it in other social situations. Sounds like a very sensible approach. I want to stay home and play video games, and read Aquinas' Summa. I do think I need some form of recreational interaction with other people, but I'll try and incorporate that without making too much of a compromise with who I really am.

I can totally relate to this. I guess we need to take more showers, and not forget to brush our teeth. Because when you're clean the other things kinda just fall into their place.

Agreed.

uses Ne excessively has a weak Se.

Ah... so Ne and Se are at opposition, not Ti and Se.

General advice: Get yourself some kind of a mission, a very personal war or something. This will also pull you more towards Ti (assuming you're Ne-LII who is kind of sick and tired of overthinking things (IJ-Ne tends to overthink things)).

You are awesome. Theoretical and practical. This is gold, thank you so much.

Even in bed.

Yeah it happened to me once to be turned down by a girl. <snip>.

Is this the Ne thing I mentioned earlier? I have no idea WTH you're trying to say.

From your post, it's evident to me that you value Fe > Fi... It's not just the use of emoticons that shows it, but the emotional force of the language you use.

Interesting, I've never thought about typing people this way.

What you wrote about Fi is interesting... I'm EIE and I flat-out don't understand the nuances of Fi to the point that when other people are using it it pisses me off... Could you elaborate more on that??

Doesn't being an ENFj automatically make you strong at Fi, even though it is not valued?

Having read over your post, I don't think you sound unhealthy. What you describe are just the normal LII responses to stress, heartbreak, and loneliness. Pretty much everything you've written is familiar to me and most other LIIs.

I'm not a freak then?

This is mostly Role Fi. Mainly, what you need here is an Fe-Ego type to give you an Fi "script" for your Role function to act out in these situations. Obviously, ESE would be ideal for this, but other Fe-Egos will suffice in a pinch. I don't know how well an Fi-Ego would work for this -- they might tend to take it too seriously and make you feel bad for sucking at it.

You too are awesome. This advice sounds incredibly useful.

it's not your responsibility to deal with that stuff. Your responsibility, as an LII, is to make sure everything is logical and makes sense.

This would be such great freedom. I am worried about the repercussions though.

Pining over an ESE for a year and a half?

I am still figuring this out, but I am quite impressed with the ideas I have. I will report back if anyone is interested.

About greeting people, who is the primary person in this interaction? You are the one who should decide that. Damn what you're supposed to do. It's like you're accommodating them before you even know them. Say hi or don't, it's your choice.

I like this attitude.

I take it you're not used to making your own decisions?

I often need a second opinion before committing to anything. Why?

I'm not sure if there was anything else I wanted to reply to - but I've exhausted myself, so I'll check back later.

[Trevor]

The current situation: procrastination. I ignore very important tasks until the very last minute. I write essays for Varsity the morning they must be handed in. Usually, whenever I have a list of things to do on a particular day, I spend the entire day thinking about the best way to go about doing those things, and then I revise the plan, over and over, and never get to work. I guess this is the result of overused Ti killing off my Se .

This is the result of overused Ne killing off your productivity. I can totally relate to this. The best cure to it is to just go out and do your thing. You might as well forget what you were thinking about the best way to go about doing those things and act on a whim instead. You'll surprise yourself and perhaps your surroundings by the produced results.

Then there are the social aspects. Example : I usually don't greet people, because I don't know what the etiquette is, when to greet, and when not to? I've never spoken to this person before, so do I do it now or not? Even if I decide to greet, I then have to will myself to do it, and most often fail. Can I blame this on weak Fi and Se ? Or is it just because I need to seriously get out more?

Do you really need to greet them? If you feel you do need to and don't do it after all then the feeling of guilt is inevitable. I can totally relate to not greeting people, however I feel no guilt because I don't feel that I'm supposed to greet them or something.
Do you need to seriously get out more? I think you know the answer. What's the worth of it? What's your goal?

I need to take more showers, and not forget to brush my teeth.

My room is an epic mess.

I can totally relate to this. I guess we need to take more showers, and not forget to brush our teeth. Because when you're clean the other things kinda just fall into their place.

I was normal... well, almost normal a few years ago, though. Here is what I think happened, in light of the new ideas I've come across on this forum. I was quite heavily infatuated with an ESE girl. I was rejected by her, but I guess being the only Fe-ESE girl I've ever gotten to know I really found it hard to forget her. I would sit around for hours, trying to figure a way out of the situation, how to win her over, why I was different from the jocks she would date... argh! This was the aim of my life for a year and a half. Excessive use of Ti?

If you indeed are LII, I'd say it's the excessive use of Ne. Advice for winning her over: emulating the behavior of jocks she would date because she apparently falls for that.

Perhaps my Se weakened way too much during this time?

Whoever uses Ne excessively has a weak Se.

My mother is an INFj.

I can totally relate to this.

Could her strong Fi coupled with the fact that I have a rather large extended family, which meant a whole lot of having to be polite and mannered growing up, have anything to do with the fact that Fi causes me so much stress?

Hm, I don't quite think so.

General advice: Get yourself some kind of a mission, a very personal war or something. This will also pull you more towards Ti (assuming you're Ne-LII who is kind of sick and tired of overthinking things (IJ-Ne tends to overthink things)).

[Absurd]

If you indeed are LII, I'd say it's the excessive use of Ne. Advice for winning her over: emulating the behavior of jocks she would date because she apparently falls for that.

Even in bed.

[Trevor]

Even in bed.

Who'd know.

[electric sheep]

lol you're just like me, down to the INFj mother and writing the essays as late as possible, though I always do them the night before they're due. I think the constantly thinking about them rather than doing them has something to do with performance anxiety and perfectionism. By the time you sit down and do it, you don't want to struggle, you just want to get it done.

I used to (and still do) fall really hard for girls, but being constantly let down by them has tempered it somewhat. Whatever girl you're obsessing over, even though I don't know her, I can probably tell she isn't a perfect human being in any way. Sure she fits all the criteria, and I'm sure you'd be willing to accommodate all of her imperfections, and I bet you think that if you do everything imaginable for her then that would compel her to stick around, but it doesn't work that way. She has a life to lead, and she will do what she thinks she must do to have a good life. You too have a life to lead, and you must not let some skank ruin that for you.

About greeting people, who is the primary person in this interaction? You are the one who should decide that. Damn what you're supposed to do. It's like you're accommodating them before you even know them. Say hi or don't, it's your choice. I take it you're not used to making your own decisions?

[electric sheep]

to answer your question, no I don't think you're an unhealthy LII--you're just having a mild identity crisis. It's really hard when the people you have worked so hard to please simply disappear from your life. What do I do now?

[JuJu]

Two apologies, first, if I'm asking too many newbie questions, I am in the process of reading the linked articles. Secondly, I'm sorry for being so extraordinarily self-absorbed, but it is the sick who need doctors.

I'm trying to figure out what exactly is going on inside my head. I understand from reading other threads on this forum, that a function that is too strong, or too weak makes an "unhealthy" psyche.

The current situation: procrastination. I ignore very important tasks until the very last minute. I write essays for Varsity the morning they must be handed in. Usually, whenever I have a list of things to do on a particular day, I spend the entire day thinking about the best way to go about doing those things, and then I revise the plan, over and over, and never get to work. I guess this is the result of overused Ti killing off my Se .

Then there are the social aspects. Example : I usually don't greet people, because I don't know what the etiquette is, when to greet, and when not to? I've never spoken to this person before, so do I do it now or not? Even if I decide to greet, I then have to will myself to do it, and most often fail. Can I blame this on weak Fi and Se ? Or is it just because I need to seriously get out more?

I need to take more showers, and not forget to brush my teeth.

My room is an epic mess.

I was normal... well, almost normal a few years ago, though. Here is what I think happened, in light of the new ideas I've come across on this forum. I was quite heavily infatuated with an ESE girl. I was rejected by her, but I guess being the only Fe-ESE girl I've ever gotten to know I really found it hard to forget her. I would sit around for hours, trying to figure a way out of the situation, how to win her over, why I was different from the jocks she would date... argh! This was the aim of my life for a year and a half. Excessive use of Ti?

Perhaps my Se weakened way too much during this time?

My mother is an INFj. Could her strong Fi coupled with the fact that I have a rather large extended family, which meant a whole lot of having to be polite and mannered growing up, have anything to do with the fact that Fi causes me so much stress?

Lastly, I make use of excessive smileys on web forums. Does part of me think being a little ESE is going to help me socially?

If you can help me, I will be greatly indebted to you.

I relate to what you wrote about the ESE girl... The first time I dated my dual I found it very hard to forget her... In fact, I still think of her sometimes, (among other LSIs I've dated since.)

From your post, it's evident to me that you value Fe > Fi... It's not just the use of emoticons that shows it, but the emotional force of the language you use.

If what you wrote is accurate, it sounds like you've just gotten into the habit of obsessing... And it's negatively impacting your life to a degree that it's difficult for you to get things done... I've done it before too. (I imagine that many people here have.)

Honestly, I'm not sure that your current difficulties are Socionics-related... I imagine that a lot of introverts (and logicals) can relate to what you write about social etiquette and appropriateness... I'm not sure that Ti is over-involved, (although if you're LII, I bet that it is involved in some way.)

What you wrote about Fi is interesting... I'm EIE and I flat-out don't understand the nuances of Fi to the point that when other people are using it it pisses me off... Could you elaborate more on that??

I'm interested, what do you like about being LII..? Studying this stuff, I've realized that every type has special capabilities... I'm wondering what you think the benefits are... I'm asking b/c this could help me understand the problem more.

Good luck man

[krieger]

The current situation: procrastination. I ignore very important tasks until the very last minute. I write essays for Varsity the morning they must be handed in. Usually, whenever I have a list of things to do on a particular day, I spend the entire day thinking about the best way to go about doing those things, and then I revise the plan, over and over, and never get to work. I guess this is the result of overused Ti killing off my Se .

My room is an epic mess.

I have the same symptoms.

[Krig the Viking]

Two apologies, first, if I'm asking too many newbie questions, I am in the process of reading the linked articles. Secondly, I'm sorry for being so extraordinarily self-absorbed, but it is the sick who need doctors.

I'm trying to figure out what exactly is going on inside my head. I understand from reading other threads on this forum, that a function that is too strong, or too weak makes an "unhealthy" psyche.

Having read over your post, I don't think you sound unhealthy. What you describe are just the normal LII responses to stress, heartbreak, and loneliness. Pretty much everything you've written is familiar to me and most other LIIs.

The current situation: procrastination. I ignore very important tasks until the very last minute. I write essays for Varsity the morning they must be handed in. Usually, whenever I have a list of things to do on a particular day, I spend the entire day thinking about the best way to go about doing those things, and then I revise the plan, over and over, and never get to work. I guess this is the result of overused Ti killing off my Se.

Yeah, that seems to be a common problem for Alpha NTs, it certainly is for me. The key is interest. If I'm not interested in something, I am almost incapable of doing it, especially if there's a deadline. On the other hand, if something really catches my interest, I can work for hours and days and even sometimes weeks on it, barely stopping for meals and sleep.

I also find that this can be due to a lack of Fe. If I haven't been around Fe-generating people in a while, I run down like a robot low on batteries -- I become listless and apathetic, and I find it difficult to take much of an interest in anything. And lacking interest in anything, I find it difficult to actually do anything, and wind up procrastinating and watching TV/surfing the Internet (i.e., passive entertainment).

The key is to find an Fe-generating person and spend some time with that person. An ESE if possible, but anyone with decent Fe will do. You'll come home feeling better and more capable of tackling projects, at least for a while. However, you do have to be careful to resist falling back into the old, listless thought-patterns.

Then there are the social aspects. Example : I usually don't greet people, because I don't know what the etiquette is, when to greet, and when not to? I've never spoken to this person before, so do I do it now or not? Even if I decide to greet, I then have to will myself to do it, and most often fail. Can I blame this on weak Fi and Se ? Or is it just because I need to seriously get out more?

This is mostly Role Fi. Mainly, what you need here is an Fe-Ego type to give you an Fi "script" for your Role function to act out in these situations. Obviously, ESE would be ideal for this, but other Fe-Egos will suffice in a pinch. I don't know how well an Fi-Ego would work for this -- they might tend to take it too seriously and make you feel bad for sucking at it.

Something to remember for things like this is that if it's a weak function, it's really not your responsibility. Every member of the socion has a role to play in society. Making first contact in social situations is not your "job", so to speak. With Role Fi, you can be expected to respond appropriately when someone makes contact with you, but you can't be expected to make first contact yourself, any more than a man in a wheelchair can be expected to be a quarterback in the NFL.

When you're at a party or social gathering or whatever, just remember that it's not your responsibility to get out there and initiate contact with people if you don't feel like it. You don't have to feel bad about hanging off to the side and observing things. If someone takes the initiative and comes over to talk, great! If not, no worries. Do vector calculus in your head, or something.

I need to take more showers, and not forget to brush my teeth.

My room is an epic mess.

Seriously, doing these things will make you feel surprisingly better. We LIIs are not super-great at taking care of Si matters, but with a little effort it can be done. Don't worry too much about holding yourself to standards of perfection, though -- Si is still a weak function, and you can't be expected to be perfect in that area. But yeah, shower, brush your teeth, and go out and face the world in a presentable manner, and life will suddenly start to seem not quite as insurmountable as it had.

I was normal... well, almost normal a few years ago, though. Here is what I think happened, in light of the new ideas I've come across on this forum. I was quite heavily infatuated with an ESE girl. I was rejected by her, but I guess being the only Fe-ESE girl I've ever gotten to know I really found it hard to forget her. I would sit around for hours, trying to figure a way out of the situation, how to win her over, why I was different from the jocks she would date... argh! This was the aim of my life for a year and a half. Excessive use of Ti?

Perhaps my Se weakened way too much during this time?

Pining over an ESE for a year and a half? Haha, try three years (as I've done)! This is a perfectly normal, if extremely unpleasant, aspect of being an LII. Being quiet and observant, we tend to recognize what socionics labels "Duality" way, way before ESEs typically do -- if they ever do.

However, I don't think "behaving like a jock" is the answer, as Tuturututu proposed. You're right, you are in fact far superior than the jocks (Beta STs?) she used to date, at least as far as compatibility with her goes. Her rejection of you is her mistake, not yours. You basically have to be patient and hope she grows up and realizes what she's really looking for, or move on and hope you meet someone else. Neither option is particularly pleasant. Unfortunately, there are no easy answers to this situation.

My mother is an INFj. Could her strong Fi coupled with the fact that I have a rather large extended family, which meant a whole lot of having to be polite and mannered growing up, have anything to do with the fact that Fi causes me so much stress?

Heh, my mom is EII as well, so I know what you're going through. I'm pretty sure your theory is correct. Like I said above, the key is to ignore your mother's insistance that you be all polite and Fi, and remember that you're not good at Fi, and it's not your responsibility to deal with that stuff. Your responsibility, as an LII, is to make sure everything is logical and makes sense.

Lastly, I make use of excessive smileys on web forums. Does part of me think being a little ESE is going to help me socially?

Haha, I do this too. Probably an Fi thing -- we don't want anyone to misread our emotional state and thereby accidentally damage our Fi relationships. Personally, though, I think everybody would be improved by being a little bit ESE.

[krieger]

Then there are the social aspects. Example : I usually don't greet people, because I don't know what the etiquette is, when to greet, and when not to? I've never spoken to this person before, so do I do it now or not? Even if I decide to greet, I then have to will myself to do it, and most often fail. Can I blame this on weak Fi and Se ? Or is it just because I need to seriously get out more?

This looks a little strange to me, coming from an INTj. I generally take INTjs to be quite polite people despite that they are so socially reserved. Greeting people in a natural way is not generally something I have a problem with either. I think this kind of social "problem" is more common among INTps than among INTjs. Of course, this does not instantly preclude you from being INTj.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

Removed at User Request

[JohnDo]

@Maritsa: He is obviously an LII. What else should he be?

Procrastination, not taking showers, not brushing teeth, not cleaning the room, problems in social situations...

IEEs are also slobs - but don't have many problems in social situations.
ILIs also have problems in social situation - but not many problems with showers, teeth, cleaning...

Most problems in life have something to do with role and vulnerable function.
Procrastination, not taking showers, not brushing teeth, not cleaning the room -> weak and unvalued
Problems in social situations -> weak and unvalued

[1981slater]

The current situation: procrastination. I ignore very important tasks until the very last minute. I write essays for Varsity the morning they must be handed in. Usually, whenever I have a list of things to do on a particular day, I spend the entire day thinking about the best way to go about doing those things, and then I revise the plan, over and over, and never get to work. I guess this is the result of overused Ti killing off my Se .

I think it is weak Se & strong Ne

Then there are the social aspects. Example : I usually don't greet people, because I don't know what the etiquette is, when to greet, and when not to? I've never spoken to this person before, so do I do it now or not? Even if I decide to greet, I then have to will myself to do it, and most often fail. Can I blame this on weak Fi and Se ? Or is it just because I need to seriously get out more?

Weak Fi, being very young

I need to take more showers, and not forget to brush my teeth.

My room is an epic mess.

Oink, oink

I was normal... well, almost normal a few years ago, though.

A radioactive spider bit you?

Here is what I think happened, in light of the new ideas I've come across on this forum. I was quite heavily infatuated with an ESE girl. I was rejected by her, but I guess being the only Fe-ESE girl I've ever gotten to know I really found it hard to forget her. I would sit around for hours, trying to figure a way out of the situation, how to win her over, why I was different from the jocks she would date... argh! This was the aim of my life for a year and a half. Excessive use of Ti?

Perhaps my Se weakened way too much during this time?

I guess most people have undergone a situation like this to some extent!

My mother is an INFj. Could her strong Fi coupled with the fact that I have a rather large extended family, which meant a whole lot of having to be polite and mannered growing up, have anything to do with the fact that Fi causes me so much stress?

EIIs can be a pain in the neck when giving advice

Lastly, I make use of excessive smileys on web forums. Does part of me think being a little ESE is going to help me socially?

Developing one's weak functions is great, so you don't blunder over and over. It is called self-dualization, I think: healthy people "become" their duals as they grow up.

If you can help me, I will be greatly indebted to you.

You sound LII? Maybe
Ne ego? sure!
Ti ego? probably
Introverted, rational? I think so
Extroverted, irrational? I think not

[youfloweryourfeast]

Yes, I’m not an LII but EII, how ever I had some of these struggles. I never had much issues with my relationships or as you said about getting along others. And I had a similar situation, I would not use my time wisely and basically sleepwalk through life. I also would put off doing basic things like school, cleaning, and taking care of myself. I don’t think your an ILI, though ILIs are also prone to self indulging in thingsthey don’t really ignore reality. It seems they are still able to get real life things done even if it they don’t give all their effort.